I agree with everything you have said there. For me I'm looking at McTominay in awful form and thinking that DVB should be given a run of games in the first team to see if he is a current better option. Even though I like Fred I do ultimately believe that we need 2 midfield signings to complete the team. And as you said a RB unless Dalot or Laird can fulfill their obvious potential.
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I agree with everything you have said there. For me I'm looking at McTominay in awful form and thinking that DVB should be given a run of games in the first team to see if he is a current better option. Even though I like Fred I do ultimately believe that we need 2 midfield signings to complete the team. And as you said a RB unless Dalot or Laird can fulfill their obvious potential.
It's really not though because then he'd be vindicated for not playing him and the blame would be placed on Woodward for buying him. I agree, I think this whole argument is pointless now. Seems the Ole fan club is desperate for VDB to fail so they can feel justified in their support for Ole. There were even some comments with absurd criticism towards Rangnick that we didn't play any better than under Ole in the last match... Donny is the easiest target because he became something of a symbol for Ole's ineptness as a manager.
This is literally crazy talk.
I am not talking about his performance in last match. His level is just not there for us. yet.
I mean if he was obviously that talented, he would have not been in this situation in the first place.
I am not sure about that, a lot of noise about how after CL game is clear why he wasnt getting chances under Ole, hell even his discussion with RR during a game was turned into a sign of his imaginery bad attitude by at least one poster.
I was Ole out for a long time....and I want VDB to make it here but he's not good enough for central midfield I don't know how people cannot see that. He can pass and defend yes but lacks the street smarts and courage on the ball to succeed there. His pass there yesterday is a little insight into one of the issues Ole saw with him. The other was positioning as he frequently vacates his position and always I remember seeing him on the wing a few times in the past. Good no 10 though. Maybe he can improve and if anybody can fix it it's Ralf.
He passed back to WB needlessly 1st half against YB (a smart midfielder would find every way to pass less to WB) Matic for instance dances with the ball right and left and back to left just to find Bruno when opposition have fenced him off to force us to send the ball to the right hand side. That VDB pass to WB caused him to lunge at the ball thereby stamping on their player and getting Red-Carded.
He passed back to WB needlessly 1st half against YB (a smart midfielder would find every way to pass less to WB) Matic for instance dances with the ball right and left and back to left just to find Bruno when opposition have fenced him off to force us to send the ball to the right hand side. That VDB pass to WB caused him to lunge at the ball thereby stamping on their player and getting Red-Carded.
Please.. No one want anyone of our players to fail. VDB has been a stick to beat Ole with, and if you can’t admit that, it is on you. We all know he hasn’t been given a run of games, like every player need to be at their best. And on the other side of that coin, he didn’t take his chances. And for thinking he is the answer for McFred. It isn’t his bloody position!
And if you think 45 minutes of training has anything to do with Rangnick, and even thinking things have picked up once he joined, you are further out there than I thought. And I label you as one of the worst posters on here.. Hope he gets us champions league football. But please guys! Have some self respect and a minimum of logical sense.
I would just like to see Donny paired with either Fred on McTominay in CM with the rest of the A Team. If he fails, he fails. No complaints from me. Then he will have to take his chances when Bruno is out.
It would likely have to be Fred as neither Donny nor McTominay can play as the 6. It would be pretty telling if Ralf avoided playing him there like Solskjaer.
Eh, this seems a lot like confirmation bias.
There are going to be questions about VDB until he's performing well. He didn't play well or do anything to seize the opportunity. He deserves his chance under Ralf but I think people are hoping rather than believing that the only issue with VDB was Ole. There's still a lot of questions as to where he fits in this side under Rangnick.
I would like to see him with the two with Bruno and Ronnie and Sancho up.
His game honestly wasn't remotely as bad as some people are making out.
1. Had the 2nd highest number of presses in that game (22).
2. Registered four successful tackles (joint-first).
3. Had 86.8% pass success rate. Was better than Mata who 82.0%. Donny attempted 26 more passes than Juan.
4. Joint-second (2) in terms of progressive passes made.
5. Most carries made. Registered 3 progressive carries from deepest position, equal to Mason and only one less than all our other forwards, except Diallo (6!).
He paid for a dear mistake in playing the short pass to the first line of pressure (as Ralf pointed out), but by the numbers and in terms of contributions, he wasn't nearly anything resembling poor.
1. Had the 2nd highest number of presses in that game (22).
2. Registered four successful tackles (joint-first).
3. Had 86.8% pass success rate. Was better than Mata who 82.0%. Donny attempted 26 more passes than Juan.
4. Joint-second (2) in terms of progressive passes made.
5. Most carries made. Registered 3 progressive carries from deepest position, equal to Mason and only one less than all our other forwards, except Diallo (6!).
He paid for a dear mistake in playing the short pass to the first line of pressure (as Ralf pointed out), but by the numbers and in terms of contributions, he wasn't nearly anything resembling poor.
You'd be surprised.
Oh wow, is this Ole's CAF account? Literally all of your posts are in defense of Ole. Thank you for actually proving my point for me.
haha, I sincerely hope you're an oppo fan trolling otherwise this would be quite sad. The difference in the team''s play against Palace in the first half compared to what we played under Ole is quite evident even to a blind man.
The difference isn’t evident at all. We did exactly the same thing against Tottenham, and didn’t the next game. Your take is absolutely horseshit.. Same against young boys this time around.. All fans want our players to play good. And all fans want our manager to succeed. But you are right, there are a few on here who isn’t fans.
A lot of that going around these days.
This particular concept is unusually convoluted too: the idea has to be that DVB was signed against Ole's will - and that Ole refused to play him because he never wanted him in the first place, not recognizing his supreme talent (idiot and physical education teacher that he is). The problem - or one of them - is that there is zero evidence that Ole didn't want him.
In order to discredit Ole to the fullest, it would probably be safer to just conclude that DVB is a shit player whom the idiot physical education guy actively wanted to sign.
It has to be him alongside fred. Both press (fred is just the best at this anyway) and vdb knows how to pass forward unlike scot who slows down play. It has to be fred-vdb
Not even remotely the same. Against Tottenham it was the typical Oleball - no pressing, slow and cumbersome in possession, no real aim. Of course, we were firmly in control in that game, but it was more so because Tottenham couldn't be bothered to play football. I believe I also said that back then. Our football in the first half against Crystal Palace was totally different from that. They legitimately couldn't get the ball out of their own half even though they tried hard to do it. We had a higher tempo than we have ever had under Ole and we looked comfortable in everything we did. There was also a clear aim in our play. You can go rewatch those two games to see that they have almost nothing in common (well, the second half against Crystal Palace not included)
Against Young Boys it was typical Ole football, I agree. But then again it was a second string of players that aren't very good nor have they played with each other. Yes, all fans of this football club want the players and manager to succeed, but certainly not opposition fans. And as far as the Ole fans go, such as yourself, I'm sure you do not want Rangnick to fail, but I'm also sure there's that trace in you that are... let's say... relieved when a bad result comes because you probably feel vindicated. "See, Ole's not at fault, this football club and players are simply not good". And as far as who brought those players, well, It's Woodward's fault. We've seen that after Young Boys when some posters have already made some ridiculous claims how there's nothing new with Rangnick.
The good thing is that eventually the dark cloud called Ole over the club would dissapate and people would move on. I've witnessed this during the Moyesy days. It was the same exact behavior back then from his supporters who blamed everyone under the sun for Moyesy's troubles but not him.
There's no reason whatsoever for Ralf not to give Fred and Donny a chance together, especially against Norwich. Completely absurd and reprehensible what Ole did to Donny.
This sort of overblown emotional language is why the fervent anti-Ole crowd come off just as weird as the fervent pro-Ole crowd to me.
Has a weird way of showing it.
I still have no real idea what Donny's best position is after 18 months and games in various positions. He's needs a run of games in the team to get his sharpness and confidence back but does the team need Donny for a run of games is the question.
You can say all you want about lack of opportunities over the last 2 seasons but in almost 50 appearances now he's blown lukewarm and room temperature, never particularly bad but rarely good either.
You can say all you want about lack of opportunities over the last 2 seasons but in almost 50 appearances now he's blown lukewarm and room temperature, never particularly bad but rarely good either.
On the bench.
Timewasting sub.
Great bate post once again… I’m not even going to respond to that.. I think most people see through your motives. And it’s not in the interest of our club or players..
watford game was a sample of what he can do. Playing as a sub in the 85th minute will never help. He needs to get a proper run
Nobody will give VDB a clear run in midfield and end up costing us points if the coaches can tell he isn't good enough. He can't do what Fred does and can't do Mc-Tominay's role either and I personally want McT upgraded upon.
Another misuse/weakness of these kind of stats, imho. It was obvious that Mata's passing was feasibly better than DVB in that game.
I actually thought Van de Beek’s passing was crisper than Mata’s, more often keeping the tempo up and playing vertically even while under pressure.
Only at the start of the game then it changed.
DVB is an allrounder and to see him with the A team can give better judgement.
He can’t pass backwards?
Good post @Sviken
I would like to see him tried with Bruno. Ronnie and Sancho forward of these two with McFred behind them. I feel their movements would be great.
He will come off the bench today and score.
Norwich 0:1 Man Utd
Only needs 5 minutes 
not gonna happen in those limited minutes.
It think he'll be gone by the end of January. Ragnick rather uses McFred even against the weakest team in the PL. McFred played well, but they never ever should be on the pitch together against a team like Norwich.
Only needs 5 minutes
seems he’s guaranteed these 5 minutes now. Must be impressing the manager in training.
seriously now, i feel for him. I really think he can offer more than mctominay in midfield
It was a bold prediction. Imma disappear from this thread 'till we announce his loan/sale.
Let's go for a brunette next time we shop in Holland.
Let's go for a brunette next time we shop in Holland.
At some point the reality of what he is, a squad player, might hit some of the zealots. He isn't on the bench because of an agenda or conspiracy, it is because outside of the Ajax system he is rather limited.
Can't believe the ref blew for that unbelievable dive from the Norwich player, didn't even touch him.
Give the man at least 30 minutes.
Bruno and Rashford were stinking up the place you could have put my sorry ass out there and i would have improved us let alone Donny.
Give the man at least 30 minutes.
Bruno and Rashford were stinking up the place you could have put my sorry ass out there and i would have improved us let alone Donny.
Agree.
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