From what I've seen, a lot of Bayern fans are unhappy that De Ligt may be sold, so that's promising.
De Ligt | €45+5m agreement reached pending medical | Signed!
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss three 1-1 draws.
The first got us knocked out of the FA Cup, the next puts us in a good position in our Round of 16 Europa League game, and the latest was an actual decent performance against Arsenal at Old Trafford.
All hopes for the season now rest on the Europa League - does Amorim have the squad to win it?
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Skepticism is warranted for all the reasons already discussed and this deal has all the hallmarks of the same mistakes we’ve made in the past. However, I was among those who wanted De Ligt when he rejected us in the past. But United do have to risks if we are to leap back into top four contention.
If only football works that way. I think its a big risk to bring him in, very high wages, on a long contract with injury concerns. Hasn't exactly set the world alight at Bayern otherwise they'd have no intention of selling him. It's a concern for me because this is another signing that fits the same pattern of the last few seasons. Feels like another example of us not learning our lessons. Varane was considered a sick note last season and yet he played more minutes than De Ligt. Honestly think this will be a big feck up of a transfer and we'll struggle to offload him in a few years due to his high wages.
I've been pretty upbeat by the names we've been linked too, this is one that deeply concerns me. I am probably a little biased mind you as I feel like we're making all the wrong decisions at the moment. Hopefully Ineos will prove to me that i'm an idiot.
I have no strong feeling either way for signings this season, became a passive reader.
The bold part was just a general point, we signed few players whom we targeted years ago, like Cavani, Butland and few others.
There is some context to this. Varane for the last 3 seasons missed 14, 15 and 19 games. De Ligt the last 3 years, 14*, 4**, 2.
Varane consistenly misses games to various injuries. De Ligt doesn't consistenly miss time because he's injury plagued. Varane will get a knock to the knee and miss 5 games, come back play 2 and get a hamstring injury and miss 6 games. De Ligt gets an injury that makes him miss extended time or he isn't injured.
*He technically missed 20 games but 6 of them were for the Netherlands so it inflates the number. Just illustrates the timing of the injury
**he only missed 4 games for Bayern the 5th match that season was him missing a Netherlands friendly because he was sick
why would BM want to sell him if he is a good performer and not injury prone? top clubs never let go of their top players, especially when they are as young as De Ligt.
I am not against the club signing him if the fee is not beyond 50m euros, but I just do not feel comfortable with getting him.
I am not against the club signing him if the fee is not beyond 50m euros, but I just do not feel comfortable with getting him.
I think both would if they wanted to reunite with an old manager where they played their best football and if United told they were free to leave.
If only football works that way. I think its a big risk to bring him in, very high wages, on a long contract with injury concerns. Hasn't exactly set the world alight at Bayern otherwise they'd have no intention of selling him. It's a concern for me because this is another signing that fits the same pattern of the last few seasons. Feels like another example of us not learning our lessons. Varane was considered a sick note last season and yet he played more minutes than De Ligt. Honestly think this will be a big feck up of a transfer and we'll struggle to offload him in a few years due to his high wages.
I've been pretty upbeat by the names we've been linked too, this is one that deeply concerns me. I am probably a little biased mind you as I feel like we're making all the wrong decisions at the moment. Hopefully Ineos will prove to me that i'm an idiot.
I believe we are getting a bit too excited since we haven't signed anyone yet, so we have rose-tinted glasses on. The cold facts are that he doesn't start for his club, he doesn't start for his country. 2 huge clubs wanted to sell him within 2 years, after paying huge amounts for transfer. He lost his position to Eric Dier, who is a makeshift CB, original position was DM. Bayern NEVER sells a player unless they want to sell him, minus the Kross case, where his contract was expiring, and they made the mistake of not giving him the salary he deserved. They rectified it after and wowed to never repeat that mistake again.
Back to De Ligt, even when he is fit, he is not a sure thing when it comes to defending, he often gets pulled out of position, or he is turned easily. He is also often injured. He will also be on a high salary as well.
This does not seem, at the moment, like a low-risk/high-reward scenario. If he comes, I will support the hell out of him, as I want him to do good for us. However, I'm pessimistic about him. The signs are not great.
Because he’s good, but not great, while getting paid like a great player. And we’re looking to shed some salaries.
That's kinda puts context on his injuries, thanks for the summary.
But i am still concerned why Bayern are willing to let go of him? was he really out of form and benched by Kim, Upamecano & Dier?
Robben, Sneijder, Jaap Stam, KDB, Salah, Palmer.
Not really. He played most important games.
where would he rank among other CBs in Bayern (Kim, Upamecano, Dier, as well as the new ones signed this summer)?
His injury record is a concern for me. Also what his pace like? Will he allow us to play an high line?
Incredibly difficult to say. Upamecano looks done with us, to me. Think he’d be last. Kim might get another opportunity, but is seen critical. Dier has great standing, because he’s been reliable and cheap. I expect Ito to be our first choice at lcb and the rest are fighting for the other spot.
Good enough, but not special.
From the figures that were stated games wise in this thread earlier I would say he’s had two bad injuries rather than being injury prone or out regularly. I’d say it’s more if the injuries he has suffered have have taken anything away from his game. I’d say this is where Varane really shady issues rather than being always unavailable.
De ligt is worth the risk though if we can get him for a reasonable fee and one of either Maguire or lindelof leaves. He would bring experience and composure in areas we need it.
De ligt is worth the risk though if we can get him for a reasonable fee and one of either Maguire or lindelof leaves. He would bring experience and composure in areas we need it.
Fair enough
He only was on the bench after injuries, Tuchel didn't rush him back. When fit he played most games together with Dier (after he arrived). de Ligt was never an issue, he was either good or injured, but Kim and Upa being unreliable was the big issue. That got more or less fixed by Dier being boringly reliable.
Barcelona said bye bye to Cancelo, BM has a new manager with particular wishes, BM just lost their first title in what? more than a decade?
I think it's more about being open to a sell, with Kompany's preferred CB coming in (and not super expensive) in Ito, while Kim and Upamecano (and Dier) are also there.
Upamecano can be super shaky at times but is still rather high profile, as is Kim.
So you have to make the balance for FFP, rebalancing the squad dynamic in general, and by finding out who you can sell for decent money to a team outside of the league.
Except for a period in the middle of this season, De Ligt was still a starter for most of the campaigns he was there.
If they sold him while they didn't just get Ito and already had at least Kim and Upamecano, this would be a red flag. But now it's at most a slight caution, but also not too crazy of a caution as his injury and skill record hasn't been so bad at all.
We won't know how he'll adapt to the PL and how he'll fit in with the team, but it's not a bad signing, in my opinion. Seems to carry more foundation than Branthwaite if the choice is between those two, to me.
From scanning, part of the reason BM are keen to sell is they feel they are stacked at CB and he is one of the highest paid, I think.
Robben and Sneijder were sold to fund CR7 and Kaka, Fergie intentionally let go of Stam & RVN, not because they were not great, KdB & Salah did not show yet how good they were, and they were younger (22 & 23 respectively), Palmer is 21 yo who left an all-dominant City for playing time.
Would City sell Dias or Stones, would Liverpool sell VdV 3-5 years ago, why would Bayern for example not sell Kim, or Upamecano?
again, I know top players leave top teams, even at their prime, Di Maria left Madrid, Neymar left Barca, but it is not that simple and there are reasons for it to happen.
Wow, I am surprised then to see Bayern selling a good defender like De Ligt (as you said) if Upamecano is done and Kim is still not a sure thing
I think part of the reason is that Bayern have 3 starting quality CB's and he wants to find a place willing to give him a starting spot which we can offer. ETH will obviously be another thing in our favour as well as the chance to play with Onana and Martinez in defence again.
Stanisic returns from his loan to Leverkusen, they already signed Ito from Stuttgart and try to sign Tah from Leverkusen as well. Lot of activity in that area this summer.
I don't think they ever played together
Time to move on or negotiate that down to 35m.
I see, this is a great post that kinda explains that De Ligt was not benched, except when returning from injury, and if the sale is to balance FFP, perhaps that would give United a stronger position to negotiate a cheaper fee (30-50m euros).
Yeah i saw the news on Tah & Stanisic signing a new long-term contract.
Bayern can demand what they like, they’ll get what we’re willing to offer. A compromise will be made.
Kroos? The one that got away and Bayern didn't really want to sell
They want to sell yet they demand? Yeah Bayern go do one 
Can't say it enough. If we had De Ligt on those wages and wanted to offload him, we'd sell for next to nothing or have to loan him out.
For once the shoe is on the other foot, it would be hilarious if we paid over 30mil.
Yeah because he wanted to go to Madrid. De Ligt isn't coming here to fullfil a personal dream.
Not terrible negotiation starting point I guess.. 35 + some add-ons depending on team success should do it.
Yes my mistake. Would have sworn it was but I think I'm thinking of the season where they beat Sporting, Dortmund etc and moved Blind out to LB as I think he played DM initially then moved him back.
No, because he demanded to be treated (=paid) like their top players, while the club leadership (Uli Hoeneß particularly) didn't rate him on that level. Don't forget Moyes had him lined up to come to United, hadn't he been fired. Real stepped in when that happened.
If we get him for 35 mill would be a very good bit of business.
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