Not really, Dias is a better defender than Maguire. Not sure how "funny" that is
De Ligt | €45+5m agreement reached pending medical | Signed!
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Not really, Dias is a better defender than Maguire. Not sure how "funny" that is
I mean all of them are quick. Of course no one is as fast as Walker, he's one of that fastest footballers in recent history. But there's a reason Pep has no issues playing them that high and wide, they can all deal with defending those spaces very well because they are all pretty quick bar Dias.
Yes you have to control games as well, but acting like none of those City CB's are athletic or comparing them to Maguire is daft.
From midnight tomorrow… it does.
And obviously, by “pot”, I mean what the spending rules allow.
And we’ve got plenty of cash. £97m per last set of accounts.
We won't be spending to the cap of the rules.
We'll spend an amount in line with making us profitable again instead of continuing to make losses.
Over 4 years. Not twice in 2 years. That’s a big difference. One was a shoulder injury which shouldn’t really affect him going forward.
Cheers mate,
I have to admit I was a bit hard on the bloke.
I am just disappointed that we didn't get him over Brentford, the kid is going places.
The latest one was knee though…..
That’s my only concern with him - fitness. He’s clearly a VERY good player. He’s played for Ajax, Juve and Bayern. If you look at his passing stats they are right up there with Van Dijk and physically he’s got all the attributes you need. He’s also good in the air which we have to have next to Martinez. For those talking about pace I’ve never considered him slow. He’d probably get done by an absolute speedster like Mbappe but he doesn’t usually have any problems there.
good age, good pedigree, knows our manager and goalkeeper. It’s just injurys
I would've liked us to sign Gray too.
So in half of the seasons. That is a lot. Plus I have doubts with regards to his pace. We dont need another Lindelof
I don't think this is the guy to partner well with Martinez. We need a pacey CB partner to cover his lack thereof. I hope I am wrong if we do get him.
So due diligence with De Ligt would be asking.. why would we spend ~£50m and upwards of £300k a week on someone who hasn't even played close to as many minutes of football as Varane did last season.
Why are Bayern happy to sell him? Knowing he had a knee ligament tear early in the season that worryingly reoccurred or flared up again later and kept him out again.
Also, why was he dropped by two different coaches for the Netherlands.
And finally, when you look at the profile of CBs the club have been linked with and heavily scouted (Branthwaite, Guehi, Tapsoba, Todibo etc), does it make sense to pivot to De Ligt?
Got a bad feeling about this.
You are making up numbers and getting angry about them, you do know that right? I don't think anyone wants De Ligt at £50m and 300k a week. If we bought him those won't be the numbers.
There's no point being obsessed with getting in a pacy defender. They aren't durable. Van der Ven is wicked but always does his hamstrings
He's on that kind of wage at Bayern
I’ve seen games from us even this season few times we’ve played a high line with the current crop of defenders we have (vs Chelsea, vs Aston villa, vs Barca for example) and we defended well and under Ole as well.
Strange you’re calling these defenders unfit. They weren’t unfit under Ole
We defend poorly against Villa and Chelsea
. If youre referring to the 2-1 win over Villa, only Maguire played that game, he had Licha, Shaw and Dalot around him which helped navigate the high line, but we still got lucky to win.Barca was last season and it was Varane-Licha, who are the only two players who can play a high line.
I'm calling the unfit defenders unfit, because theyr'e getting on in age and needed surgery. And when they did play a higher line they weren't great. Maguire was terrible in Ole's final season. Lindelof's best phase for us was under Jose Mourinho, who plays a low block.
So yes, they can't play a high line.
Quality control
Alright mate. You’re right. They are incapable of playing a high line. I’m not about to engage in a back and forth with an ETH sexualWe defend poorly against Villa and Chelsea
Barca was last season and it was Varane-Licha, who are the only two players who can play a high line.
I'm calling the unfit defenders unfit, because theyr'e getting on in age and needed surgery. And when they did play a higher line they weren't great. Maguire was terrible in Ole's final season. Lindelof's best phase for us was under Jose Mourinho, who plays a low block.
So yes, they can't play a high line.
I don't think he's on £300k. Closer to 250k.
I also don't see us buying him for £50m. If the concern with De Ligt is 1) wages and 2) injury record then I'd not have any issues. My gripe is more with posters who claim he isn't very good, that he wasnt very good for Bayern or that he's not suited to playing proactive football.
My view on 2 crocks and 1 guy who can't dribble past a lamp post being ill suited to a high line last season has feck all to do with the manager.
You've referenced games we actually defended very badly in, or games that these players never even played in to drive a made-up narrative that they play well in a high line. Then you tried to make it about the manager, which sums your post quality up. Good work.
Literally all of those CBs are completely different profiles, prices and have their own issues. So yeah, it does makes sense to pivot to De Ligt when he's clearly available, at a price we can afford and of high quality.
Such an immature response. That poster has presented their argument on why they don't think those players cannot play in a high line all the while you just 'claim' they can without providing any of your own arguments on why.
You're having a mare here.
Oh the mythical ETH meltdown is being carried into all our future prospective signings threads as well. Same posters moaning about same issue in every thread.
Again that’s not the definition of injury prone. Varane missed double digit games in like 3-4 consecutive seasons. That’s injury prone. Missing 6 games due a knee injury and 3 games due to a knock isn’t injury prone.
Do you know what mythical means?
You're literally making things up and winding yourself up about it.
It would be a purposefully dense to not see why there's obvious worries and parallels between this target and ones of the past. I can totally get peoples doubts.
Yeah it’s a lazy response. But I like what I saw when we won against Chelsea and Villa this season and the first leg against Barca. It was high pressing and we went toe to toe with these quality teams using these current defenders
Such an immature response. That poster has presented their argument on why they don't think those players cannot play in a high line all the while you just 'claim' they can without providing any of your own arguments on why.
You're having a mare here.
Players don't move to make themselves poorer.
It seems like people have forgot what the purpose is of playing in a higher defensive line or just think it's cool to talk about wanting to play in a higher defensive line.
I think it's perfectly reasonable to have reservations about de Ligt. But for me those reservations are more to do with his injury record, and if Jason Wilcox is fine with that, then I'd like to see us sign the player because he is a fit from a footballing pov.
M. de Ligt has always played in teams who implement high defensive lines with the exception of Juventus. And the purpose of a higher defensive line is to squeeze the pitch by playing in a compact high block with the last line (CBs) closer to the half way line backing up the midfield and forwards who are active in applying a well coordinated high press. And it can only be a well coordinated high press if you're compact as a unit from back to front. So the CBs will have to step into the vacated space and go 1v1 in the channels but they will have support from either the DM or both the DM and a 3rd CB. From what I've seen of de Ligt he doesn't struggle at all in a higher defensive line and imo that's due to him being quick over the first few yards and also him being strong at winning duels. And then when you factor in his ability on the ball, it does make sense to sign him from a pov of developing the team to play a more proactive brand of football.
If you have a backline that consists of de Ligt and Martinez, then that is a backline that can play the type of football that has been w missing with us for a long time. We also have capable fullbacks in-possession with Shaw and Dalot, so the first line looks geared up for possession football including the GK which looks like a big turn around from the options we had a few years ago as far as implementing more control in possession.
I think if they also got Branthwaite on top of that, then there's real potential and flexibility as far as what can be developed. I think if we signed both de Ligt and Branthwaite, the potential of seeing all three of de Ligt, Martinez and Branthwaite is a real possibility in games. And then if they can also sign a midfielder who is dominant both in the air and on the ground where he can eat up ground quickly, it will take us to another level. The team will then have the qualities to progress the play from all across the deeper areas of the pitch and will be backed up by strong duel winning capability.
I think it's perfectly reasonable to have reservations about de Ligt. But for me those reservations are more to do with his injury record, and if Jason Wilcox is fine with that, then I'd like to see us sign the player because he is a fit from a footballing pov.
M. de Ligt has always played in teams who implement high defensive lines with the exception of Juventus. And the purpose of a higher defensive line is to squeeze the pitch by playing in a compact high block with the last line (CBs) closer to the half way line backing up the midfield and forwards who are active in applying a well coordinated high press. And it can only be a well coordinated high press if you're compact as a unit from back to front. So the CBs will have to step into the vacated space and go 1v1 in the channels but they will have support from either the DM or both the DM and a 3rd CB. From what I've seen of de Ligt he doesn't struggle at all in a higher defensive line and imo that's due to him being quick over the first few yards and also him being strong at winning duels. And then when you factor in his ability on the ball, it does make sense to sign him from a pov of developing the team to play a more proactive brand of football.
If you have a backline that consists of de Ligt and Martinez, then that is a backline that can play the type of football that has been w missing with us for a long time. We also have capable fullbacks in-possession with Shaw and Dalot, so the first line looks geared up for possession football including the GK which looks like a big turn around from the options we had a few years ago as far as implementing more control in possession.
I think if they also got Branthwaite on top of that, then there's real potential and flexibility as far as what can be developed. I think if we signed both de Ligt and Branthwaite, the potential of seeing all three of de Ligt, Martinez and Branthwaite is a real possibility in games. And then if they can also sign a midfielder who is dominant both in the air and on the ground where he can eat up ground quickly, it will take us to another level. The team will then have the qualities to progress the play from all across the deeper areas of the pitch and will be backed up by strong duel winning capability.
I'd be flabbergasted if we didn't give him a raise on his current wage, but Germany has a really high tax bracket so I do wonder how bad the damage will be.
I think he's a very good player, and fits this manager like a glove. His injury record is a concern as we could really do with a few robust players for a couple seasons!
The rules for carried losses are just so stupid and fingers crossed they get binned soon.
A net loss of £100m for United is not equivalent to a £100m loss for, let's say, Sheffield United, for example.
Same goes for all businesses. Larger companies routinely book billions in impairment / one off charges yet are still incredibly cash rich, whereas highly leveraged companies can default on debt after a 10% drop in revenue.
I really don't know, nobody springs to mind. We need a Carrick type of deep lying midfielder capable of both dictating play and being defensively sound. These days, they are a rare commodity so maybe we just have to make do.
I just fear that Ugarte is more akin to another Fred. Tenacious, aggressive and all that good stuff, but very limited on the ball. Granted, I've only seen him play a few times in the CL, but thought he was pretty average looking, and not all that surprised he lost his place for PSG.
Joao Neves could become that player, but it's a tall ask for an 18 year old to hit the ground running in the PL, and the asking price is insane.
Joao Gomes at Wolves is a better player and has more to his game than Ugarte from what I have seen, for example.
As for CB, I think De Ligt is good enough on the ball to not be an issue beside Martinez. Branthwaite I haven't seen enough but I think he looks fundamentally sound. I'm not overly stressed about our CB's not being as good as Hummels on the ball, or whoever, but we're very reliant on Martinez and Shaw at playing out from the back so we do need someone who has at least the base qualities needed for a top club that want to chase trophies.
Kim did struggle to settle into Bayerns system, but I don’t think his career is comparable to De Ligt.
Kim had a very late rise while De Ligts talent has been obvious since he was 16 and in the first team.
Juve only sold him because De Ligt wanted to leave. Juve were on a rapid decline and were looking to sell any of their top players. De Ligt was the only player they were able to fetch good money for and his price only decreased because of his contract situation.
Please don’t be so misinformed.
How good is he on the ball?
He’s good in the air which is paramount for anyone paired with Martinez. Assuming we’ve moved on from the suicidal midfield and Mainoo/Ugarte or whoever else gives our back line more protection I think the pace in our CB pairing will be adequate.
It’s perfectly reasonable for people to not like or want a player, but the issue we have repeatedly on this forum is once someone makes a comment regarding a players trait, people who have not watched the player often will piggy back of it and then we end up with a thread of people making incorrect judgements.
There are also your football manager fans who want us to bring in a random centre back from a mid table French club because he has decent stats on FM24 or they’ll check out Whoscored website.
Some of the names I frequently hear mentioned here are Yoro and Diomande. Well the club is actively pursing Yoro, but it seems like his head is with Madrid. We can’t change that. And Diomande is not good enough to be our starting RCB at his current ability. He is a very good talent, but he is probably 24 months away from starting at a challenging PL club.
I have seen people on here moan about Branthwaite being Maguire 2.0 and now De Ligt being Maguire 2.0, the club simply cannot win.
We need a leader, we need a player who is about to enter his prime, we need an experienced winner at the highest levels, we need someone who is very strong in tackles and very good in the air. That is De Ligt.
There are also your football manager fans who want us to bring in a random centre back from a mid table French club because he has decent stats on FM24 or they’ll check out Whoscored website.
Some of the names I frequently hear mentioned here are Yoro and Diomande. Well the club is actively pursing Yoro, but it seems like his head is with Madrid. We can’t change that. And Diomande is not good enough to be our starting RCB at his current ability. He is a very good talent, but he is probably 24 months away from starting at a challenging PL club.
I have seen people on here moan about Branthwaite being Maguire 2.0 and now De Ligt being Maguire 2.0, the club simply cannot win.
We need a leader, we need a player who is about to enter his prime, we need an experienced winner at the highest levels, we need someone who is very strong in tackles and very good in the air. That is De Ligt.
There's so many red flags about this signing.
Top clubs tend not to let elite players go by choice, Bayern deeming him surplus to requirements would be red flag 1. Another giant salary player being the second issue, bringing in another £250k, £300k per week salary player seems like a Woodward era type move. Thirdly we're yet again going back to Ten Hag's list of former players/Dutch players/Eredivisie players, which hasn't exactly worked out great for us so far. Lastly, we really need a fast centre back to partner Martinez. Martinez/De Ligt pairing is painfully slow.
Of course there's some positives in terms of technical quality and age profile.
But overall, I've seen enough of slow centre backs over the last few years to last me a life time.
Top clubs tend not to let elite players go by choice, Bayern deeming him surplus to requirements would be red flag 1. Another giant salary player being the second issue, bringing in another £250k, £300k per week salary player seems like a Woodward era type move. Thirdly we're yet again going back to Ten Hag's list of former players/Dutch players/Eredivisie players, which hasn't exactly worked out great for us so far. Lastly, we really need a fast centre back to partner Martinez. Martinez/De Ligt pairing is painfully slow.
Of course there's some positives in terms of technical quality and age profile.
But overall, I've seen enough of slow centre backs over the last few years to last me a life time.
I don’t see why we would pay so much to someone who didn’t make the grade at Bayern
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