Comments like this are a bit daft.
Danny Welbeck | Arsenal player
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Comments like this are a bit daft.
Not trying to be a knob here Pogue, I know we both have very different opinions of Rooney, but what exactly makes Rooney such a clearly better player? As of right now, the only thing I'd say Rooney has on Welbeck (bar experience obviously) is his finishing abilty and long range passing.
Fully agree with you.
It's enough to convince me that he deserved more of a chance to prove it.
I wanted to see us play a 4-3-3 with Welbeck, Falcao and Di Maria. It was never to be
Wilson looks like turning into a very particular kind of striker, which means he has to be absolutely world class at about 4 or 5 things in order to get to the top of the game. That's not an easy thing to achieve. How many poachers are actually there at the moment? Relatively few, I'd hazard.
Welbeck, on the other hand, has a few more strings to his bow. His path to the top should, in theory, be a little smoother. Still a long way to go, mind you.
Two games. Two bloody games.
Macheda scored 2 in 2 for us in the league once upon a time.
And that's now enough basis to declare him potentially WC when Welbeck that has shown wayy more on bigger and more important stages is apparently worthy of being demoted behind him in people's eyes
If he was good enough he would have been given a proper chance at it, which leads me to believe he isn't.
I know it's two bloody games, I'm just rubbishing your opinion that people are basing their claims solely on reserve football.
So he deserves to oust seasoned pros who perform year in year out just because he had one run in the side where he scored a few goals?
No, I never said it was enough, just pointing that out.
Yeah that's kinda where my thoughts are - I think Wilson could most definitely develop into into a top class poacher... but where is the place for that kind of player in the modern game? At best you're Klose or Hernandez (and we've not found place for him anymore...) at medium your Jermain Defoe or Darren Bent, and at worst your Ross McCormack...
It'll be interesting to see how his career develops, and obviously I hope I'm wrong... as I said, loads of variables right now to make any prediction with the utmost conviction.
Welbeck was told he was going to be 5th choice this season, which basically means no game time given our reduced games, what was he, and United suppose to do, it just wasn't healthy keeping him here.
Sorry, reserve team football + 97 minutes of first team football. Makes all the difference, apparently.
Best striker on the planet.
The knee jerk in this thread is at a new high, people claiming he's better than Rooney now? Jesus.
The knee jerk in this thread is at a new high, people claiming he's better than Rooney now? Jesus.
No, LVG's trust in him makes the difference for me personally.
Wilson's game isnt just a poacher either, and certainly not as limited as a Chicharito type or similar, just Dannys all round technical ability and overal game is very, very good.
So rather then form an opinion of your own, you just follow everything the manager says/does?
Tbf the lone striker thing is a fair point but it's very debatable if we'll play it long term. Van Gaal's main formation has usually been a 4-3-3, we now have 1 world class and one potentially world class winger, and we got rid of 2 strikers and only brought in 1, on loan. We haven't had the players to really go for a 1 up front formation, but with RvP declining as he's 31 now, it remains to be seen if Van Gaal sees Rooney as a striker long term or further back. I think we'll definitely see a lone striker formation this season, or at least either Rooney behind Falcao/RVP or Mata behind one of them. Don't think we'll stick with 3 of them 4 playing consistently. Who knows though. Personally I think we'd be best off with a 4-3-3 long term, with Falcao the lone striker, Januzaj and Di Maria on the wings, and Herrera, Mata and Carrick/Blind/Strootman in midfield. Or something like that.
I agree with this. I think Wilson though has just the right balance to be a top striker. He isn't just reliant on his finishing and off the ball movement. He can drag defenders around with the ball at his feet, which is important if you have a striker partner or wide forwards/AM trying to work around you. Hernandez relied on his movement off the ball too much. Welbeck is very good at most things, just needs to be more lethal.
"We will rue the day that we sold Danny van Basten!
We're doomed! Dooooomed! PS Carthage must be destroyed, lost identity etc etc."
It's a feck load better than prancing around worshiping a now Arsenal player don't you think? sorry for praising a promising young player that wants to score goals for United and having faith in our manager. I almost get the feeling that some posters want Welbeck to bite us in the arse so they can say they were right all along. Like Rio is doing already.
The reality is that this point that Welbeck is gone and unless we can invent a time machine to stop the transfer from ever happening, it is done and dusted. He is going to get more playing time for Arsenal this season then h e would have for United that alone will make his output look better. It is a good move for him. When we see how the team LvG is buidling does over the next few seasons then we will know how this transfer turns out for us , Danny and Arsenal.
But we will repeat the past with beating the same discussions into the ground everytime he does something good or bad. It will be Berbatov, Tosic (remember hot start when we loaned, then sold him), and Pogba all over again.
End of the day he is gone, that's that. What ever will be will be.
But we will repeat the past with beating the same discussions into the ground everytime he does something good or bad. It will be Berbatov, Tosic (remember hot start when we loaned, then sold him), and Pogba all over again.
End of the day he is gone, that's that. What ever will be will be.
I hope Welbeck comes back to United one day, Fabregas-style (only as a much better fit to the way the team plays). That's my main reason for wanting him to do well.
Wahey!
Yes, I think a few on here will be pleasntly surprised at Wilsons overal game when he starts to break into the team over the next 18months, the only players who've looked quite as complete in the youth in the last decade have been Januzaj and Morisson, (ok Ravels not made it, but its not due to talent, rather having the mental age of a pre-pubescent chimpanzee).
It's annoying that Danny has gone to the perfect fit for him, and in the short term the media and rival fans will have another stick to beat us with as we rebuild our side, but longterm I'm (personally) less worried due to just how much faith we have in Wilson, (love the kids attitude as well, spot on)
I am afraid the Welbeck decision was a poor one for the many reasons:
1. Apart from the unproven Wilson was our youngest forward with a great injury record
2. His goals to minuets ratio are good considering the tracking back he does and his overall contribution
3. We have spent huge chunk of his transfer fee on player who is here only on loan.
4. Danny had passion and love for Man Utd (as opposed to players here predominantly for monetary reasons)
5. Never gave less than 110%
6. He has not peaked unlike others in our forward line
7. His pace on the break is vital and the PL suits this type of player
8. He is great with the ball at feet in tight areas of the pitch
I am afraid LVG, having only been in post for a very short period of time has made a huge call on a player he cannot of known that well.
Wenger, the most experienced manager in the PL who has seen much more of Welbeck than LVG did not waste any time in making a bid. Is this telling?
Of course we have to look forward but if our hired "big name" from Monaco and RVP get injuries we could quickly look lightweight up top.
This could all end up with the headstrong LVG not looking like the untouchable genius many on here think he is.
1. Apart from the unproven Wilson was our youngest forward with a great injury record
2. His goals to minuets ratio are good considering the tracking back he does and his overall contribution
3. We have spent huge chunk of his transfer fee on player who is here only on loan.
4. Danny had passion and love for Man Utd (as opposed to players here predominantly for monetary reasons)
5. Never gave less than 110%
6. He has not peaked unlike others in our forward line
7. His pace on the break is vital and the PL suits this type of player
8. He is great with the ball at feet in tight areas of the pitch
I am afraid LVG, having only been in post for a very short period of time has made a huge call on a player he cannot of known that well.
Wenger, the most experienced manager in the PL who has seen much more of Welbeck than LVG did not waste any time in making a bid. Is this telling?
Of course we have to look forward but if our hired "big name" from Monaco and RVP get injuries we could quickly look lightweight up top.
This could all end up with the headstrong LVG not looking like the untouchable genius many on here think he is.
I dont think people want that to happen Shark we support Man Utd. Many are just justifiably worried we have made a major mistake.
We have sold a player who loved this club and replaced him with a player on huge money, who in one season will cost us over half of Welbeck's transfer fee alone!!
If you see that as good business fine but I can 100% see why this is being questioned.
To be fair, Robbie Keane has a shit goal-scoring record for England.
Best striker in Europe. 
Can't get a spot in the first 11 at United but he's definitely better than Rooney, Van Persie and Falcao. Fact is, Welbeck's played all over our front line for years now and he's consistently failed to give any of the managers he's been under the impression that he should be first choice.
It's like Shinji Kagawa on steroids. We've signed Di Maria and Falcao, but bad window because we sold our 5th choice striker, Danny Welbeck. Who, incidentally, makes way not for Falcao but for Wilson. The same Wilson who showed more in a few minutes against MK Dons than Welbeck did the entire game.
Can't get a spot in the first 11 at United but he's definitely better than Rooney, Van Persie and Falcao. Fact is, Welbeck's played all over our front line for years now and he's consistently failed to give any of the managers he's been under the impression that he should be first choice.
It's like Shinji Kagawa on steroids. We've signed Di Maria and Falcao, but bad window because we sold our 5th choice striker, Danny Welbeck. Who, incidentally, makes way not for Falcao but for Wilson. The same Wilson who showed more in a few minutes against MK Dons than Welbeck did the entire game.
He does it all the time and people fall for it every time. I don't understand how people fail to see it. Has to be the greatest WUM artist of this generation if you ask me
More likely it's that the generation is full of idiots.
Not sure why some scoffed at the first goal, it doesn't matter that it wasn't a clean finish, what matters is he got himself in the position to make the connection. The second was very well taken with the keeper coming out and the defender rushing at him from his right.
I haven't got any interest in crying over spilled milk, I would have sold Rooney or RvP before him with Falcao coming in, but LvG went his way and United hopefully will benefit rather than regret. As an Englishmen it's great to see a young striker delivering in an important game.
I haven't got any interest in crying over spilled milk, I would have sold Rooney or RvP before him with Falcao coming in, but LvG went his way and United hopefully will benefit rather than regret. As an Englishmen it's great to see a young striker delivering in an important game.
Best striker in Europe.
Can't get a spot in the first 11 at United but he's definitely better than Rooney, Van Persie and Falcao. Fact is, Welbeck's played all over our front line for years now and he's consistently failed to give any of the managers he's been under the impression that he should be first choice.
It's like Shinji Kagawa on steroids. We've signed Di Maria and Falcao, but bad window because we sold our 5th choice striker, Danny Welbeck. Who, incidentally, makes way not for Falcao but for Wilson. The same Wilson who showed more in a few minutes against MK Dons than Welbeck did the entire game.
And the same Welbeck who's shown more than Wilson has done in bigger and more important games. What a useless point.
If only having local lads scoring in Madrid amounted to anything other that still being knocked out anyway. If fact the lad we sold to Madrid although not local did exactly that, knocked us out. That's the difference, its scoring when it really matters.
His injury record was quite shit actually. Picked up loads of muscle injuries.
Rooney's goal to minutes record is brilliant considering the work he puts in. Welbecks goals to minutes ratio is shit whichever was you look at it, unless you look at only the 2 month spell he had last season and ignore everything else.
We spent 6m, and will probably buy him for 40m next year as long as he's not a crock and didn't turn shit. Welbeck probably won't get anywhere near Falcao's level anyways.
Sorry but the first one doesn't mean much to players these days, Sterling was apparently a United fan when he was young. The second point applies to pretty much most players who are at this level. Just sometimes they don't play as well. Doesn't mean they don't try.
Not really. The only telling point is that we have Van persie, Rooney and Falcao as strikers, while Arsenal had Olivier Giroud. Welbeck is arguably better then Giroud, though he hasn't really proven to be so (he is though IMO), but he's nowhere near the level of our 3 at their best and so was never going to be first choice, or at least not in the next 3 years.
As for the first point. Falcao and Rooney are both 28, which is right in the middle of their peaks. They have like 3 years left at their peak, which is higher then what Welbeck will probably ever be.
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Always liked Danny wish he would have stayed. but a few points
It is silly to say we used the Welbeck fee to fund Falcao because it really does not work like that. It is like the old debate about the Ronaldo money, there is no seperate shoe box or account with Danny's money in it. Plus it seems all our summers Transfer business was done within the oft quoted 200mil budget, so that sort of throws this arguement out the window also. Yes one striker came in and one left that doesn't mean ones fee was used to pay for the other.
As far as LvG only seeing a bit of Danny, well that can probably be said for all the players we let go this summer and of course for most of the players we signed also. SO are we not supposed to conduct business unless the manager has seen every player X amount of time?
Everytime SAF did something someone did not like it was "stubborn Fergie" now it will be "headstrong LvG' and yes as manager he will ultimately bear responsibility for his decisions. That is how professional sports works. Funny that. Of course by this logic if Danny blows out his knee this season and RvP and Falcao stay healthy then "headstrong" LvG is a genious right?
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United fans are a superstitious bunch that's for sure.
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