Danny Welbeck | Arsenal player

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Pogue Mahone said:
SS is a number 10. CF is a number 9.

RvP's a better player than Welbeck. Nobody would deny that. Those stats are from last season alone, though. In that season - playing as a number 9 - Welbeck was probably the pick of the bunch. I think RvP had a poor season, disguised by a haul of goals that was inflated by set-pieces and penalty-kicks.

One season could be an aberration, of course. I'm just worried that they're trending in opposite direction, because of their respective ages. Tiime will tell if I'm right to be worried.
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We don't play the system that allows a number 10 be a number 10, in the way Totti or Baggio played it for me, I've heard it said that we played with two 9 1/2s and that sums it up better for me. I barely trust 'untreated' stats, I'm running from those that have that level of subjectivity.

I added to the ppst above saying that if Welbeck's effectiveness was in such a limited area our attack, then he is not good enough for the fluidity required in my opinion. It's Kagawa all over again, if they are that good they must show some positional flexibility and it's up to them to fit in, not vice versa based on potential.

RVP is worringly crocked in my opinion, but the post above that said Wilson was ahead of Welbeck is more telling.
 
Did he even thank/acknowledge the fans? Not really fussed about it but I know some people like that sort of thing and it's the least he could do.
 
Señor said:
Did he even thank/acknowledge the fans? Not really fussed about it but I know some people like that sort of thing and it's the least he could do.
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Not from the quotes that I've seen, just wittering on about how great Arsenal are and how well he is going to for them.
 
Didn't even have the decency to write a letter to the fans who supported him through bad times. It sounds like he was made redundant after we got Falcao. I know who I would choose if I was given a choice between him and Falcao and it wouldn't be Welbeck.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Oh come on. This is getting silly now. He scores more goals because he drops deep to get on the ball then (presumably) marauds back upfield, dribbling past all the defenders and smacks it in the net. Must be some player.



This is important. Last season might just be an aberration.
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MJJ said:
Because he spends more time on the ball? Kinda hard to score if you are dont have the ball.

He has twice as many touches as RVP and takes 25% shots more per game. Kinda obvious why he scores more goals/game.

Edit- Not to mention last year was probably RVP's worse season in ages, thats why I wanted stats for the last two seasons instead.
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He drops deep compared to RVP but he would still be in the number ten position most of the time. And his shots stats prove that when he does drop deep he looks to score as well as provide so it doesnt hamper him that much.

Rooney and dribbling past defenders? :lol: Maybe When he was 18, what a player that was though.
 
moses said:
We don't play the system that allows a number 10 be a number 10, in the way Totti or Baggio played it for me, I've heard it said that we played with two 9 1/2s and that sums it up better for me. I barely trust 'untreated' stats, I'm running from those that have that level of subjectivity.

I added to the ppst above saying that if Welbeck's effectiveness was in such a limited area our attack, then he is not good enough for the fluidity required in my opinion. It's Kagawa all over again, if they are that good they must show some positional flexibility and it's up to them to fit in, not vice versa based on potential.

RVP is worringly crocked in my opinion, but the post above that said Wilson was ahead of Welbeck is more telling.
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This and it keeps getting overlooked. It's all good screaming 'Oh, but he scored when played through the center', but he's not going to play through the center in the current system and that makes him a misfit. Ironically, the same posters are happy to see Kagawa leave.
 
Who gives a feck what he says in an Arsenal shirt? He's an Arsenal player now. Couldn't care less what any Arsenal player says or thinks about United fans.

Ironic that some of the same people telling everyone to "get over it" are now acting like jilted lovers because you didn't get an open letter telling you that still have a special place in his heart. Bless.
 
MJJ said:
He drops deep compared to RVP but he would still be in the number ten position most of the time. And his shots stats prove that when he does drop deep he looks to score as well as provide so it doesnt hamper him that much.

Rooney and dribbling past defenders? :lol: Maybe When he was 18, what a player that was though.
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You don't shoot, you don't score. There's a reason Ronaldo has a shots/game stat higher than any other player on the planet.

Anyway, this is getting silly now. Back to Welbeck...
 
Pogue Mahone said:
You don't shoot, you don't score. There's a reason Ronaldo has a shots/game stat higher than any other player on the planet.

Anyway, this is getting silly now. Back to Welbeck...
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That wasnt a criticism of him btw, more an explanation as to why he has a better goals/game ratio.

But yeah, definitely the wrong thread for it.
 
I'd care if he did say something negative, but I really don't care what players don't say. That way maddness lies.
 
He also failed to condemn the atrocities in Syria. Does he have no social conscience? Pfft, footballers these days.
 
some people really behave like some teenagers, who just got rejected from their lovers for the first time. You support United, not Welbeck. He could write a letter or whatever, would have been nice. He hasnt, so who cares, should be easier to forget him. It just means that he pretty much decided months ago that he would leave and doesnt care for his fans. Seems like Welbeck was bigger than the club for some people. Perfect time to get rid. Never thought people would question everything now because of Welbeck leaving. Get a grip.

Didnt care much from the beginning, the only thing i care is that our players come back injury free from the international break and i cant wait to see our team against QPR.
 
Sammyjunn said:
So after 14 years Welbz didnt thank the United fans, prick.
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Daley Blind was at Ajax for 17 years and his father is an Ajax legend. He didn't mention the Ajax fans in his interview with MUTV. Welbeck's doing an interview with the Arsenal website and he's smart enough to know that other than a small comment on enjoying his time at the club the Arsenal fans won't appreciate him fawning over us.
 
Kill 'em all said:
Didn't even have the decency to write a letter to the fans who supported him through bad times. It sounds like he was made redundant after we got Falcao. I know who I would choose if I was given a choice between him and Falcao and it wouldn't be Welbeck.
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No footballer has written a letter since George Best's many letters of apology to the club in the early 70's.
 
This letter thing will become like the Ice Bucket challenge. A few high profile people do it for a genuinely good reason, and it then just becomes a completely meaningless but expected phenomena.
 
KiD MoYeS said:
Nah, it's not as if it's obligatory for player's to issue farewell statements. He owes the club nothing now as he's already earned the club £16 million. He has chosen to join our direct rivals, he can do what he wants.
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I know, but of all the players surely he would do it.
 
moses said:
Henry played out wide for France with Guivarch up front and was the main threat. I'm just trying to say that playing on the wing doesn't mitigate the poor return for me, and it's 1 in 4 over 142 games, it's a good spread. I'm really only using the stats because they totally reflect what I saw with my own eyes. I really only saw him as a potential top player in that one game against Bayern, and that has the caveat of him missing a chance, which he really shouldn't have with the amount of quality involvement he had in that game. Yes everyone misses chances when not in form, but that was the best I've seen him play. I don't wish the lad anything but luck, but for me, 16m for a lad who in my eyes will be our 3rd striker at best is not a disaster.

Those stats say he is better than RVP which is not true. SS is second striker? That's a centre forward? When we play 2 up top they dovetail? Also when he plays up front RVP plays a lot in the inside right and wider channel. The bottom line for me is that Welbeck always played in attack. If he is hamstrung outside the CF channel then that means he's not good enough for the level of fluidity we need in attack.
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How do you feel then about Giggs' one in six(considering you are judging Welbeck just through goals)?
 
Conrad said:
Daley Blind was at Ajax for 17 years and his father is an Ajax legend. He didn't mention the Ajax fans in his interview with MUTV. Welbeck's doing an interview with the Arsenal website and he's smart enough to know that other than a small comment on enjoying his time at the club the Arsenal fans won't appreciate him fawning over us.
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Please check your sources, he has thanked the Ajax fans in his interview with ajax tv, with tweets and when he was at the airport in Amsterdam. So please dont.
 
Amar__ said:
How do you feel then about Giggs' one in six(considering you are judging Welbeck just through goals)?
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I love Giggs, and anyone who thinks Giggs was anything other than one of the best wingers ever is a fool.

Are you trying to say Welbeck was as good a winger as Giggs? If you are then you are wrong, if you are not then you are confused.
 
Can't be arsed checking but I'll warrant that every single poster getting all misty-eyed abut the bruised emotions this non-existent letter is provoking was firmly in the "who cares? we're better off rid" camp. As I said above, this is an exquisite irony.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Can't be arsed checking but I'll warrant that every single poster getting all misty-eyed abut the bruised emotions this non-existent letter is provoking was firmly in the "who cares? we're better off rid" camp. As I said above, this is an exquisite irony.
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Yeah feck that, I can handle, but disagree with, arguments about how this sale reflects club policy and youth etc, but the cult of the individual should be used more sparingly. Letters me hole.
 
moses said:
I love Giggs, and anyone who thinks Giggs was anything other than one of the best wingers ever is a fool.

Are you trying to say Welbeck was as good a winger as Giggs? If you are then you are wrong, if you are not then you are confused.
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I am just asking you how do you feel about his goalscoring record considering you are the one criticiseing Welbeck just for the lack of goals from the wing and ignoring his all around play? What about Iniesta, he spent majority of his Barcelona career on the wing(and playing in 433 on the "wing" is more attacking position than Welbeck played for us while on the wing) and yet roughly he scores one goal in ten games. You are the one talking just about goals, you even admitted it.
 
Conrad said:
Daley Blind was at Ajax for 17 years and his father is an Ajax legend. He didn't mention the Ajax fans in his interview with MUTV. Welbeck's doing an interview with the Arsenal website and he's smart enough to know that other than a small comment on enjoying his time at the club the Arsenal fans won't appreciate him fawning over us.
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Sammyjunn said:
Please check your sources, he has thanked the Ajax fans in his interview with ajax tv, with tweets and when he was at the airport in Amsterdam. So please dont.
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Please don't? You sound hysterical. Here are my sources, http://www.manutd.com/en/NewSigning...ming-a-manchester-united-player.aspx?pageNo=2, consider them checked. Welbeck didn't have an interview with MUTV, he isn't on twitter and he isn't joining a club in Holland where none of the fans give a shit if he praises his former club.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Can't be arsed checking but I'll warrant that every single poster getting all misty-eyed abut the bruised emotions this non-existent letter is provoking was firmly in the "who cares? we're better off rid" camp. As I said above, this is an exquisite irony.
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Tbf, a ton of posters has also been borderline hypocrites in their assessments of Welbeck and Kagawa.
 
I like Welbeck as a player and a person. I thought we often looked much better when he played and am disappointed he was sold.

I also understand his reasons for wanting to leave and hope he does well at Arsenal, but not at our expense. I don't care if he thanks us or not. Unless you're a spastic you would know he wouldn't have wanted to leave in ideal circumstances.

Not sure how people can veer so wildly to different sides of the argument. Some people saying he's potential top few strikers in the world and our club is falling to pieces, while others call him a useless bambi prick who didn't write a letter. What is wrong with you nutters?
 
Amar__ said:
I am just asking you how do you feel about his goalscoring record considering you are the one criticiseing Welbeck just for the lack of goals from the wing and ignoring his all around play? What about Iniesta, he spent majority of his Barcelona career on the wing(and playing in 433 on the "wing" is more attacking position than Welbeck played for us while on the wing) and yet roughly he scores one goal in ten games.
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Em, I'm not only criticising him for his lack of goals. I'm judging someone with ambitions to be a CF on what I see to be a poor finisher and also what the the goals per game stats say to back up what I see. If Giggs and Iniesta claimed to be CFs I would argue that they are not, but they are amazing midfielders and should play there, pretty much like they did in fact.

Goals apart, do you think he contributes as much as Giggs or Iniesta? Because I don't.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Can't be arsed checking but I'll warrant that every single poster getting all misty-eyed abut the bruised emotions this non-existent letter is provoking was firmly in the "who cares? we're better off rid" camp. As I said above, this is an exquisite irony.
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And by that same token, we've got posters on here throwing their toys out of the pram for a player who doesn't even acknowledge them despite the fact they've been supporting him for the last 4-5 years. No one's asking for a letter, that'd be ridiculous to ask for nor complain about, but an acknowledgement or nod to the fans is not uncalled for.

For all this talk about losing the United identity and all that blah blah blah bullshit, he doesn't even talk about the fans nor give us a passing mention. Lesser players with lesser affiliations to clubs have done more.

As I've said, I myself don't care too much about it but I know some people do take that stuff into consideration, and I don't think they deserve flak for thinking that way.
 
Steven Seagull said:
I like Welbeck as a player and a person. I thought we often looked much better when he played and am disappointed he was sold.

I also understand his reasons for wanting to leave and hope he does well at Arsenal, but not at our expense. I don't care if he thanks us or not. Unless you're a spastic you would know he wouldn't have wanted to leave in ideal circumstances.

Not sure how people can veer so wildly to different sides of the argument. Some people saying he's potential top few strikers in the world and our club is falling to pieces, while others call him a useless bambi prick who didn't write a letter. What is wrong with you nutters?
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That's just the way people get entrenched to make a point I'd say. He's a good lad and a good footballer, and I personally would happily have kept him as a back up striker or happily taken 16m for him.
 
Señor said:
And by that same token, we've got posters on here throwing their toys out of the pram for a player who doesn't even acknowledge them despite the fact they've been supporting him for the last 4-5 years. No one's asking for a letter, that'd be ridiculous to ask for nor complain about, but an acknowledgement or nod to the fans is not uncalled for.

For all this talk about losing the United identity and all that blah blah blah bullshit, he doesn't even talk about the fans nor give us a passing mention. Lesser players with lesser affiliations have done more.
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Can't speak for everyone else but I reckon most people who are unhappy about his departure are concerned about losing his potential contribution as a footballer to Manchester United. Now he plays for Arsenal, why on earth should any of care what he's thinking?

Why are you so concerned about not being thanked, out of interest?
 
Conrad said:
Please don't? You sound hysterical. Here are my sources, http://www.manutd.com/en/NewSigning...ming-a-manchester-united-player.aspx?pageNo=2, consider them checked. Welbeck didn't have an interview with MUTV, he isn't on twitter and he isn't joining a club in Holland where none of the fans give a shit if he praises his former club.
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of course he wont say anything it in the clubs official interview, for the same reasons as Welbeck. But Welbeck could have thanked the fans through Uniteds website or social media accounts if he really wanted, or some journalist like Mitten. There are a lot of possibilities. Like he said, Blind thanked the fans through the Ajax Tv and instagram etc...Welbeck doesnt have to thank anyone. It is a nice gesture and the Ajax fans will remember that.
 
Manucho the boss said:
A great man once said-

The manager said the use of Welbeck in a variety of roles, including shutting down Xabi Alonso in the Champions League against Real Madrid, has not helped the 22-year-old's goal tally.

"Maybe he doesn't appreciate us moving him around in various positions and we've maybe overused that because he is young," Ferguson said. "But his value to the club is there because I know he can do a job for me in any of those positions.

"It's a fantastic asset when you have a player who is as adaptable as that."

How quickly we've forgotten everything this clubs success has been built on.
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I think Danny has forgotten it is a squad game and other players get moved around the team. Does he not think Phil Jones would have enjoyed playing at CB, but has been shunted all over the place when needed? Is Danny going to get upset it Arsene has to move him into another position if needed? Danny wanted more football, I can understand that, but I wouldn't want to just keep him because he is one of ours and then if Rooney or RVP are injured trust him to get the goals. If he had scored more goals when he got the chance we wouldn't be discussing this as he would still be here.
 
Conrad said:
Please don't? You sound hysterical. Here are my sources, http://www.manutd.com/en/NewSigning...ming-a-manchester-united-player.aspx?pageNo=2, consider them checked. Welbeck didn't have an interview with MUTV, he isn't on twitter and he isn't joining a club in Holland where none of the fans give a shit if he praises his former club.
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You want Blind to thank them thrice? With all the media available its not a hard task to thank the United fans if he'd want to, he clearly doesnt.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Can't speak for everyone else but I reckon most people who are unhappy about his departure are concerned about losing his ability as a footballer.

Why are you so concerned about not being thanked, out of interest?
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Because it's a nice gesture, one most players do, and he's been at this club for a long time, his fans supporting him through thick and thin, through good and bad, not to mention them paying his wages. I myself don't care whether he has or hasn't but I don't see why you're giving flak out to people that do. It's not at all unreasonable.
 
Señor said:
Because it's a nice gesture, one most players do, and he's been at this club for a long time, his fans supporting him through thick and thin, through good and bad, not to mention them paying his wages. I myself don't care whether he has or hasn't but I don't see why you're giving flak out to people that do. It's not at all unreasonable.
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You and me both. Not sure why we're arguing?
 
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