Danny Welbeck | Arsenal player

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The problem with Welbeck always was that eh thought he was better than he actually was, just like some posters here. He is a good player ad has his uses in a squad, but he never had the quality required to be a starter for United and I doubt he ever will.

United pretty much always had top strikers and I am convinced that even if we wouldn't have had Rooney and RvP we would have bought a top striker instead of making Welbeck the first choice.
 
Gopher Brown said:
It was Welbeck's choice to leave. If I recall correctly, van Gaal tells players what role they will be expected to play in the squad and lets them decide. Welbeck would have been told he is behind van Persie, Falcao and Rooney in the pecking order, and rightly so, and Welbeck didn't want that, which is fair enough.
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Not true.

Everything that's come out of Welbeck's camp since has been clear he was pushed, rather than walked. Plus Van Gaal was clearly on the defensive in this latest interview so would - of course - have told the press if his hand was forced by Welbeck.
 
Compared to van Persie and Falcao (who is rumoured to have chopped a couple of years off his age) he's a spring chicken.
 
MDFC Manager said:
Yea when you look at it properly in context, it makes no sense at all. The only thing you could perhaps say is our 3 strikers are aging and hence keeping him would have been better but the counter argument is that these few chances are better off being given to Wilson.

Oh and the other argument could be that we helped out a direct rival. Fair enough, for this season but I hope we don't see them as rivals in the future.
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If we don't the club is being run by idiots. With their income, stature and relatively low debt they will always be rivals. All the more so now FFP is kicking in. As we've seen with them signing players as expensive as Ozil and Sanchez. That's the shape of things to come, as far as Arsenal are concerned.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
If we don't the club is being run by idiots. With their income, stature and relatively low debt they will always be rivals. All the more so now FFP is kicking in. As we've seen with them signing players as expensive as Ozil and Sanchez. That's the shape of things to come, as far as Arsenal are concerned.
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I understand your point on Welbeck. He suits Arsenal's style (they have more goal scoring midfield players than United so a link up striker rather than a poacher suits them). Selling to Arsenal definitely helped them but I don't think it's a bad move long term.

He just isn't clinical or consistent enough to play regularly for a top team. As for Arsenal being rivals, I honestly don't think they will win either a league or champions league while Wenger is in charge. When it comes to a really big game, you just know they will lose. If United are at a level where they are worried about Arsenal they won't be competing for titles either.
 
Feed Me said:
What's pathetic about that?
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Because that is probably not the reason.Earlier he said Welbeck did not have the standards of RVP or Rooney as a striker. For what ever reason he just did not fancy Welbeck.
 
Drifter said:
Because that is probably not the reason.Earlier he said Welbeck did not have the standards of RVP or Rooney as a striker. For what ever reason he just did not fancy Welbeck.
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The two things he said are essentially the same thing. He isn't as good as our main strikers and the few remaining opportunities are better off being given to Wilson.
 
POF said:
I understand your point on Welbeck. He suits Arsenal's style (they have more goal scoring midfield players than United so a link up striker rather than a poacher suits them). Selling to Arsenal definitely helped them but I don't think it's a bad move long term.

He just isn't clinical or consistent enough to play regularly for a top team. As for Arsenal being rivals, I honestly don't think they will win either a league or champions league while Wenger is in charge. When it comes to a really big game, you just know they will lose. If United are at a level where they are worried about Arsenal they won't be competing for titles either.
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Agree with your reservations re Wenger. Not sur how much longer he'll be round though. Also have my doubts how quickly we'll improve to a point where scrapping for fourth is somehow beneath us. It looks a long way off right now, that's for sure.
 
Even if he doesn't score he's going to run around like mad pressing and nicking the ball today. He happens to be pretty good at it.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Agree with your reservations re Wenger. Not sur how much longer he'll be round though. Also have my doubts how quickly we'll improve to a point where scrapping for fourth is somehow beneath us. It looks a long way off right now, that's for sure.
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I expect United to end the season very strongly and finish a comfortable 3rd. I'm not sure if that's just blind faith or belief from listening to a manager who seems to have some idea what he's doing. Time will tell I suppose.
 
Drifter said:
Because that is probably not the reason.Earlier he said Welbeck did not have the standards of RVP or Rooney as a striker. For what ever reason he just did not fancy Welbeck.
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He didn't think he was good enough to usurp van Persie, Rooney or Falcao - seems fair enough. The fourth choice striker would be a junior player - van Gaal favoured Wilson.

What's pathetic about that?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Well, that interviews cleared up the misconception that Danny forced a move. We let him go because Van Gaal felt we needed all three of Rooney, RvP and Falcao and Wilson was obviously rated the better prospect. That last bit I can buy into, the rest not so much.
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You seem to have decided that Welbeck didn't force a move even though there is nothing in the Lvg interview which says that United pushed him out. It was basically a situation in which Lvg told him that he would be third choice (Falcao wasn't even in the picture) and Welbz felt that at 24 he needed better so both parties moved on .
 
Feed Me said:
I don't think I've ever seen such revisionism about a player as with Danny Welbeck after joining Arsenal.

The BBC are running a story this morning with Paul Ince the latest person to say United have made a mistake.

He's scored two fecking league goals! In context, an out of sorts van Persie has scored more, as has Rooney, who has been playing in midfield and had a three game suspension. Falcao has only scored one less, and he's been pretty much crocked ever since arriving.
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And you think that's a good reason for selling Welbeck? You'd rather have an injured 28 year old than a 23 year old academy graduate?
 
Mogget said:
And you think that's a good reason for selling Welbeck? You'd rather have an injured 28 year old than a 23 year old academy graduate?
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When did I say anything of the sort?

I was merely pointing out that Welbeck, widely considered to have had a very good start at Arsenal, has scored one whole league goal more than a crock.
 
Feed Me said:
When did I say anything of the sort?

I was merely pointing out that Welbeck, widely considered to have had a very good start at Arsenal, has scored one whole league goal more than a crock.
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Well, people have been saying it's no loss to sell Welbeck as you have Falcao. Your post seemed to imply that too, imo. But I'm saying that if I was a United fan I'd rather the club have kept Welbeck instead of signing Falcao.
 
Mogget said:
Well, people have been saying it's no loss to sell Welbeck as you have Falcao. Your post seemed to imply that too, imo. But I'm saying that if I was a United fan I'd rather the club have kept Welbeck instead of signing Falcao.
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Clearly, I'd rather have Welbeck than a crocked Falcao. But if Falcao can get himself fit, then I'm totally comfortable with the club's decision to get rid of Welbeck.

I'm personally happy that Arsenal plugged the centre forward gap in their squad with a striker who's barely an upgrade on Giroud. It's not a signing that makes you title challengers, which is why you're still pissing around 3rd / 4th place.
 
Mogget said:
And you think that's a good reason for selling Welbeck? You'd rather have an injured 28 year old than a 23 year old academy graduate?
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I think theres far too much of that sentiment going around. At United we are at a point where we can no longer rely on sentiment to get us through seasons, we need players who deliver and will help take us to the next level. Players like Kagawa, Welbeck, Cleverley, Anderson, Nani (good but inconsistent), etc... were never going to take us to our 07/08 level.

It was a hard decision but if people look at it a little objectively, we had a player who the manager didnt feel he could rely on getting enough goals over the course of the season so he got rid. Just like Kagawa who he didnt know where to fit him. At the end of the day i didnt like moving Welbeck on but understood its about getting proven players in and not sticking with a guy who came through our academy. If we want to get back to the top there is no room, at least at this stage, for sentiment.
 
Feed Me said:
Clearly, I'd rather have Welbeck than a crocked Falcao. But if Falcao can get himself fit, then I'm totally comfortable with the club's decision to get rid of Welbeck.

I'm personally happy that Arsenal plugged the centre forward gap in their squad with a striker who's barely an upgrade on Giroud. It's not a signing that makes you title challengers, which is why you're still pissing around 3rd / 4th place.
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If you think the reason we're pissing around 3rd/4th this season is because of Welbeck then I've got nothing else to say.
 
Feed Me said:
Clearly, I'd rather have Welbeck than a crocked Falcao. But if Falcao can get himself fit, then I'm totally comfortable with the club's decision to get rid of Welbeck.

I'm personally happy that Arsenal plugged the centre forward gap in their squad with a striker who's barely an upgrade on Giroud. It's not a signing that makes you title challengers, which is why you're still pissing around 3rd / 4th place.
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It's not scoring goals that holds arsenal back
 
Mogget said:
If you think the reason we're pissing around 3rd/4th this season is because of Welbeck then I've got nothing else to say.
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It's one of multiple reasons - Wenger's lunacy when it comes to failing to strengthen the entire spine of your team is the reason you're miles behind the challengers. Best thing you could do is get rid.
 
OneUnited24 said:
I think theres far too much of that sentiment going around. At United we are at a point where we can no longer rely on sentiment to get us through seasons, we need players who deliver and will help take us to the next level. Players like Kagawa, Welbeck, Cleverley, Anderson, Nani (good but inconsistent), etc... were never going to take us to our 07/08 level.

It was a hard decision but if people look at it a little objectively, we had a player who the manager didnt feel he could rely on getting enough goals over the course of the season so he got rid. Just like Kagawa who he didnt know where to fit him. At the end of the day i didnt like moving Welbeck on but understood its about getting proven players in and not sticking with a guy who came through our academy. If we want to get back to the top there is no room, at least at this stage, for sentiment.
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I absolutely understand that, but you signed Falcao who has struggled to play more than 2 games in a row. I suppose we won't be able to tell until the end of the season, if Falcao gets fit and finds his form then selling Welbeck will definitely be the right decision.
 
golden_blunder said:
It's not scoring goals that holds arsenal back
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They generally beat the also-rans in the league with ease, but when they play the top sides, they barely lay a glove on them - having players like Giroud and Welbeck doesn't help in that regard.

As I've said in post #5346, obviously Wenger's failure to strengthen the entire spine of his side over a number of years is a massive problem for Arsenal - the centre forward position is part of this.
 
Mogget said:
I absolutely understand that, but you signed Falcao who has struggled to play more than 2 games in a row. I suppose we won't be able to tell until the end of the season, if Falcao gets fit and finds his form then selling Welbeck will definitely be the right decision.
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Even if Falcao completely flops, it won't make the decision to sell Welbeck a mistake - he's a one in three player.
 
Mogget said:
I absolutely understand that, but you signed Falcao who has struggled to play more than 2 games in a row. I suppose we won't be able to tell until the end of the season, if Falcao gets fit and finds his form then selling Welbeck will definitely be the right decision.
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After the type of injury Falcao suffered i think most here felt it was a gamble BUT even if Falcao only plays a handful of times this season i still think he'll outscore Welbeck - now some think thats a bit of a stretch but all the games i've seen Falcao play i've been impressed. Hes looked a little rusty in front of goal but in less minutes (far less) has only scored 1 less goal than Welbeck.
 
Feed Me said:
See what happens if Welbeck continues to score at his current rate in the league. It won't end well for you.
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Why are you acting as if Welbeck is the only player at the club who is capable of scoring? Scoring goals is not our problem, Welbeck scoring at his current rate is not our biggest problem by a long shot. By the way van Persie, has a 1 in 3 record this season too.
 
Mogget said:
Why are you acting as if Welbeck is the only player at the club who is capable of scoring? Scoring goals is not our problem, Welbeck scoring at his current rate is not our biggest problem by a long shot. By the way van Persie, has a 1 in 3 record this season too.
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Yeah, but no one is running around saying RvP is having a great season - in fact, it's widely accepted he's in pretty terrible form.
 
Mogget said:
Why are you acting as if Welbeck is the only player at the club who is capable of scoring? Scoring goals is not our problem, Welbeck scoring at his current rate is not our biggest problem by a long shot. By the way van Persie, has a 1 in 3 record this season too.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/teams/arsenal/top-scorers

Looking at that, you better pray that a) Sanchez stays fit and in form or b) that someone can step up and properly support him.
 
Welbeck will score today, the media will love it and go hysterical, but at the end of the season both teams will be trophy-less and finish around the same place.

United have bigger problems than Danny Welbeck!
 
Mogget said:
Why are you acting as if Welbeck is the only player at the club who is capable of scoring? Scoring goals is not our problem, Welbeck scoring at his current rate is not our biggest problem by a long shot. By the way van Persie, has a 1 in 3 record this season too.
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But the goals have to come from somewhere...and you would expect a large number of them to come from your main striker. If Welbeck fails to do so, he is either not suited to be a striker in the first place, or he is simply being a passenger.

And these comparisons to RVP are really just...one is a player who has never had a great season as a professional, and the other has been a world class top scorer for years. Wheras we know RVPs potential to carry entire teams, Welbeck has shown nothing in his 5 or so years in the first team to indicate that he will become a world class player. And I bet most gunners would trade Welbz for RVP in a heartbeat if they could.
 
Mogget said:
Why are you acting as if Welbeck is the only player at the club who is capable of scoring? Scoring goals is not our problem, Welbeck scoring at his current rate is not our biggest problem by a long shot. By the way van Persie, has a 1 in 3 record this season too.
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I agree with you to an extent, arsenal are built up as a side who play off the centre forward not a side who plays into the centre forward. It helps that your midfielders are all capable of scoring goals
 
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