Their records are pretty similar so I don't see how you can argue otherwise. I do think Welbeck deserves to keep his place but he isn't 'much better'. Sturridge has been annoyingly good for Liverpool and I don't think he has been in any way bad for the NT.
Danny Welbeck | Arsenal player
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Their records are pretty similar so I don't see how you can argue otherwise. I do think Welbeck deserves to keep his place but he isn't 'much better'. Sturridge has been annoyingly good for Liverpool and I don't think he has been in any way bad for the NT.
Sturridge has been largely awful for England, but his goals record isn't too bad and on form he's a goal machine. As was often the case with United, England look a better side with Welbeck in the side as opposed to strikers with better goals records.
For those happy to see Arsenal with Welbeck up top, that's utterly bizarre. Rather than having the donkey that is Sanogo, Arsenal will have an in form England international who we developed and let them have for a low fee. I still think it was a terrible decision from us and it'd be typical if it came back to bite us next week end.
For those happy to see Arsenal with Welbeck up top, that's utterly bizarre. Rather than having the donkey that is Sanogo, Arsenal will have an in form England international who we developed and let them have for a low fee. I still think it was a terrible decision from us and it'd be typical if it came back to bite us next week end.
Rooney's the one who should be dropped
For England, Welbeck's performances and contribution has been much better.
Welbeck has double the amount of caps, so naturally his contribution is greater. I'm sure with a run of games, Sturridge will have similar stats.
Sturridge's performances for England have been largely below par and forgettable. Welbeck on the other hand, even when not pulling up trees for us, was regularly quite influential in an England shirt.
Sturridges international career hasn't really kicked off as he hasn't had a consistent run of games as a starter. I can only imagine he would have a very similar record if he had the same amount of caps as Welbeck. Welbeck has done well lately, not really for Arsenal, but definitely for the NT. As I said, it would be unfair to shunt him out wide upon Sturridges return.
That's probably something else in Welbeck's favour. A lot of his minutes for England have come out wide. Hodgson even referred to it once as 'the Welbeck role'. He hasn't had the luxury of most of his games coming as a central striker yet he's still been more influential for England. Also Welbeck hasn't just done well for England lately, he has for a long while now. No point going round in circles but I think he's been better for England. Welbeck's 1 goal every 162 minutes compared to Sturridge's 1 every 214 minutes for England reflects this also.
There are posters here who formed their opinions on Welbeck 3 years ago, and they'll be damned if they ever change them.
Welbeck used to score for England all the time when he was at United, because he now plays for Arsenal he's lauded as the new Henry rather than the inconsistent Welbeck, what a joke.
Welbeck tends to score more when he plays CF, funny that.
When you have Rooney, Falcao, RVP (you know about him pete) and Wilson - you're not doing too bad 
To be fair he did go on a year long drought with England before recently which is how Sturridge was seen as the main CF in the England side.
His recent record for England is great, and the one he has for Arsenal isn't too shabby though it is funny that he has scored more goals and in more games for England than he has for Arsenal so far.
12 games 5 goals which 3 were scored in one game, yes it is funny.
Between 2012-13 he scored 8 in 17 not to to dissimilar to what he's doing since he joined the Arse.
I honestly can't understand why we keep on debating this.
Welbeck always showed potential. Such potential need time to develop something we couldn't provide because we already have Falcao, RVP and Rooney. We tried to give him time by playing him on the flanks but for one reason or another it didn't work.
Danny did the right thing to leave and there's no better team to develop such potential then Arsenal. Arsenal not only have a good reputation in developing kids (nearly as much as we do) but they also lack from a quality striker. They have also a certain experience in taking rough diamonds or players who had struggled elsewhere and developed them in stars such as Bergkamp and Henry. When we consider that Danny wanted more first team football and we couldn't give it to him then this was a good deal for us all.
Welbeck always showed potential. Such potential need time to develop something we couldn't provide because we already have Falcao, RVP and Rooney. We tried to give him time by playing him on the flanks but for one reason or another it didn't work.
Danny did the right thing to leave and there's no better team to develop such potential then Arsenal. Arsenal not only have a good reputation in developing kids (nearly as much as we do) but they also lack from a quality striker. They have also a certain experience in taking rough diamonds or players who had struggled elsewhere and developed them in stars such as Bergkamp and Henry. When we consider that Danny wanted more first team football and we couldn't give it to him then this was a good deal for us all.
Year long drought for England I meant from 2013 to 14. The media has short memories as well which has an impact
I agree, except that we directly strengthened a rival.
INT record.
2011 3 appearances 0 goals
2012 11 appearances 5 goals
2013 6 appearances 3 goals
2014 10 appearances 3 goals
Considering hes been used on the flanks quite a bit too, thats pretty good.
2011 3 appearances 0 goals
2012 11 appearances 5 goals
2013 6 appearances 3 goals
2014 10 appearances 3 goals
Considering hes been used on the flanks quite a bit too, thats pretty good.
I know for 1 thing that I am betting on Welbeck to score anytime on Sat 
Is that really that terrible?
I remember SAF talking about the youth academy a few years back. He highlighted the ability to guarantee a football job to every single youth player as an important achievement in the United academy recent history. It may sound trivial at first but its pretty significant. Youths know that the chances of making it at a top club are pretty lean. Having said that they would probably trust the club with their future if they know that if things get bad, the club will do its very best to give them the best chances to make it in football.
Selling Welbeck to Arsenal is not that different from that of selling P Neville to Everton or OShea to Sunderland for pocket money. On many aspects it doesn't make sense. However when you see the bigger picture its not as terrible as you think.
He's always been good for England a lot better than at club level, it's a strange one. That was my original point he's always been scoring for England even when he was at United just weird how his image has been changed since he joined Arsenal.
We were never competing for a position with those clubs you mentioned. Seems we'll be competing with Arsenal for 3rd/4th this season, at the start of the season that was also obvious. Anyway I'm happy for Danny but thats my only gripe.
The league table suggests we are doing pretty bad. Yes we have a superstar forward line but they're not producing atm.When you have Rooney, Falcao, RVP (you know about him pete) and Wilson - you're not doing too bad
Its not the point. In both cases we gave the players the biggest chance to succeed in football. That contributes to our reputation in putting the players career first and foremost, which further improve the trust youth talent have in us. By turning Arsenal's offer down we would not only have an unhappy player in our midst but we would also give the message that we only care about our interests something a youth talent whose thinking of joining United wouldn't want to hear.
Something else to add to the long list of irritations about this transfer is that I had my doubts about Welbeck's knees when he was at United, as he seemed to be our most injury prone striker. As soon as he leaves the club, hey presto, hasn't missed a game since - for club or country. Further evidence that supporting United in the post-Fergie era is basically bearing the brunt of some sort of prolonged cosmic piss-take.
But Arsenal hardly have the best injury records.
Exactly!
You ain't seen nothing yet... think post-Busby.
Won the FA cup next year, if my memory serves me well.
An undeserved victory that kicked off a painfully long barren run. No wonder it's etched in your memory.
We did, indeed. But looking at it from another perspective, we also we let the lad move to his choice of club instead of stifling his growth further.
I'm sure we're all delighted about that. Will be really enjoyable watching an Arsenal player develop into a top player without his growth being stifled.
Meh. Won't bother me when he grows into the player I believe he's capable of, which is going to be a level below what I want to see leading the line for United. He may surpass my expectations, I doubt it though.
Nice of you to help us develop our Britcore (Chezza*, Jenkinson, Chambers, Gibbs, Ramsey, Wilshere, Ox, Walcott, Walcott, Welbeck). Could do with a CB if you want to ditch Smalling and then we'd just need a left-sided player to field an all-Brit outfield.
*honorary
*honorary
You forgot to include Walcott
All I know is I'm putting money on him scoring against us. This will only accentuate the feeling among the masses that we sold a home grown talent and replaced him with an expensive Colombian superstar with a dodgy knee blah blah blah.
I'm not bothered we sold him and good luck to him, we just need to get our own house in order once our injury crisis has hopefully died down and make sure we finish in that top four. I do not think it will be at the expense of Arsenal either so selling to a direct rival is irrelevant since our priorities have gone from winning leagues to just making the top four - we finish above Liverpool, Spurs and Everton (no disrespect to Southampton) and we will make it.
I'm not bothered we sold him and good luck to him, we just need to get our own house in order once our injury crisis has hopefully died down and make sure we finish in that top four. I do not think it will be at the expense of Arsenal either so selling to a direct rival is irrelevant since our priorities have gone from winning leagues to just making the top four - we finish above Liverpool, Spurs and Everton (no disrespect to Southampton) and we will make it.
Still dont think he will be all that. And that he'll score 20+ goals this season.
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