Conspiracy! Suarez reopens Evra race row with attack on Manchester United

The Guardian have another extract from Suarez's book


http://www.theguardian.com/football...-i-a-racist-no-absolutely-not-i-was-horrified
It's long, this is the second half of it...
I was banned for eight games and, much worse, got labelled a racist for life. You can call me “big-mouth”, “biter”, “diver”. There is proof. But to call me a racist – that hurts a lot. It’s a serious accusation. It hurts because of how it affects me, it hurts because my wife had to suffer too through the hearing, watching me getting accused of being someone she knows I’m not, and it hurts because in the future the stain will still be there when my children grow up. It’s a slur on my name that no one can take away.

I never asked for Evra’s forgiveness because I felt I had done him no wrong. If there was ever a chance of reconciliation, what happened pre‑match when I next played against Manchester United in February 2012 put paid to it. I had every intention of shaking Evra’s hand in the team line-up before the match. I had spoken to my wife about it before the game and said that I would. As I was walking down the line, Evra was shaking everybody’s hand, but he lowered his hand when I reached him. He shook Jordan Henderson’s hand before me, and his hand moved downwards, away from mine. The images are there for everyone to see. My hand stayed outstretched at the same level but once he’d lowered his, I thought: “Okay, he’s not going shake my hand,” and I continued along the line.

Once I had passed him he started with the show of grabbing my arm and protesting that I hadn’t shaken his hand. And he looked towards Sir Alex Ferguson to see if Daddy was watching. If it was a trap, I fell into it.

The headlines were written: “Unrepentant Suárez refuses to shake hands.”

Kenny was too worried about the game to worry about whether we had shaken hands or not anyway. He defended me throughout. He said to me: “Every time I go into a press conference I have to take a shield to bat off all the Luis questions: ‘Luis this; Luis that.’” He reached the point where he had to say: “Are we here to talk about football or Luis?” It was difficult for him. But he knows how grateful I am for all that he did for me.

The hearing left me with a stain on my character and I don’t ever plan to speak to Evra again in my life. He came out of it as the innocent victim and I came out of it with my character tarnished for ever.

People at the time said: “They [Liverpool] are defending him because he is a good player and they can’t afford not to.” No. They defended me because they knew me.

They knew what kind of person I was inside the dressing room. They knew how I was with my family. They knew what I’m like off the pitch.

They know me. They know I’m not a racist.
 
Suarez after the handshake incident:
"I have not only let [Dalglish] down but also the club and what it stands for and I'm sorry. I made a mistake and I regret what happened.I should have shaken Patrice Evra's hand before the game and I want to apologise for my actions. I would like to put this whole issue behind me and concentrate on playing football."

He is totally contradicting himself now which makes the whole "I'm no racist" claim difficult to believe. The guy is a serial bullshitter and the whole world saw it after he bit Chellini and claimed he fell into his shoulder.
 
Apologies if previously posted

BrB51iyCMAAGqjQ.jpg:large
 
It's like he wakes up every morning and thinks to himself:

"How can I try to be more of a dickhead than I have been in the past."
 
The Guardian have another extract from Suarez's book


http://www.theguardian.com/football...-i-a-racist-no-absolutely-not-i-was-horrified
It's long, this is the second half of it...
I was banned for eight games and, much worse, got labelled a racist for life. You can call me “big-mouth”, “biter”, “diver”. There is proof. But to call me a racist – that hurts a lot. It’s a serious accusation. It hurts because of how it affects me, it hurts because my wife had to suffer too through the hearing, watching me getting accused of being someone she knows I’m not, and it hurts because in the future the stain will still be there when my children grow up. It’s a slur on my name that no one can take away.

I never asked for Evra’s forgiveness because I felt I had done him no wrong. If there was ever a chance of reconciliation, what happened pre‑match when I next played against Manchester United in February 2012 put paid to it. I had every intention of shaking Evra’s hand in the team line-up before the match. I had spoken to my wife about it before the game and said that I would. As I was walking down the line, Evra was shaking everybody’s hand, but he lowered his hand when I reached him. He shook Jordan Henderson’s hand before me, and his hand moved downwards, away from mine. The images are there for everyone to see. My hand stayed outstretched at the same level but once he’d lowered his, I thought: “Okay, he’s not going shake my hand,” and I continued along the line.

Once I had passed him he started with the show of grabbing my arm and protesting that I hadn’t shaken his hand. And he looked towards Sir Alex Ferguson to see if Daddy was watching. If it was a trap, I fell into it.

The headlines were written: “Unrepentant Suárez refuses to shake hands.”

Kenny was too worried about the game to worry about whether we had shaken hands or not anyway. He defended me throughout. He said to me: “Every time I go into a press conference I have to take a shield to bat off all the Luis questions: ‘Luis this; Luis that.’” He reached the point where he had to say: “Are we here to talk about football or Luis?” It was difficult for him. But he knows how grateful I am for all that he did for me.

The hearing left me with a stain on my character and I don’t ever plan to speak to Evra again in my life. He came out of it as the innocent victim and I came out of it with my character tarnished for ever.

People at the time said: “They [Liverpool] are defending him because he is a good player and they can’t afford not to.” No. They defended me because they knew me.

They knew what kind of person I was inside the dressing room. They knew how I was with my family. They knew what I’m like off the pitch.

They know me. They know I’m not a racist.

'Daddy' and all that shit. Jesus, seems like rabies has done his head in to the point there's no going back. Like a proper animal he is, he should be put down.
 
As a person who speaks spanish and is close to the latinamerican culture I can confidently say Suarez is right, in that context "negro" is not a racist slur, he was certanly not being friendly with Evra, but the word was not intented to be an insult, all was a huge cultural misunderstanding. Truth is, he should have known better and recognize the cultura differencies between Uruguay and England.

Now, to think Suarez, because of this incident, is actually a racist person is just ridiculous, naive, and says a lot about the hysterical vibe in which the english press and the english football fans are getting into, always trying to impose this surreal moral standar into others. We are very confused as a society and we don't know how racism functions in real life.

This whole episode is embarassing for both clubs and brought out the worst of both Manchester United and Liverpool fans.
 
the word was not intented to be an insult, all was a huge cultural misunderstanding

That's always struck me as the most plausible explanation for what transpired. The subsequent furore being down to Suarez and Liverpool's decision to go down the 'complete denial/siege mentality route', rather than simply apologising for the misunderstanding and any offence caused, signalling that the player now understands how these things go down in England, and ensuring that it won't happen again.
 
That's always struck me as the most plausible explanation for what transpired. The subsequent furore being down to Suarez and Liverpool's decision to go down the 'complete denial/siege mentality route', rather than simply apologising for the misunderstanding and any offence caused, signalling that the player now understands how these things go down in England, and ensuring that it won't happen again.

Completely agree with you, this is what should have been done from the beggining.
 
As a person who speaks spanish and is close to the latinamerican culture I can confidently say Suarez is right, in that context "negro" is not a racist slur, he was certanly not being friendly with Evra, but the word was not intented to be an insult, all was a huge cultural misunderstanding. Truth is, he should have known better and recognize the cultura differencies between Uruguay and England.

Now, to think Suarez, because of this incident, is actually a racist person is just ridiculous, naive, and says a lot about the hysterical vibe in which the english press and the english football fans are getting into, always trying to impose this surreal moral standar into others. We are very confused as a society and we don't know how racism functions in real life.

This whole episode is embarassing for both clubs and brought out the worst of both Manchester United and Liverpool fans.
Well, experts on language disagree, they said in that context, that is in a hostile situation, calling a stranger a "negro" and saying you don't speak to "blacks" in front of the ref no less, you're being derogatory. Even in Uruguay, that bastion of tolerance.

I'm sure you mean well but you're wrong. He may have only said it to rile up Evra, not because he really feels that way, but he said it.
 
As a person who speaks spanish and is close to the latinamerican culture I can confidently say Suarez is right, in that context "negro" is not a racist slur, he was certanly not being friendly with Evra, but the word was not intented to be an insult, all was a huge cultural misunderstanding. Truth is, he should have known better and recognize the cultura differencies between Uruguay and England.

Now, to think Suarez, because of this incident, is actually a racist person is just ridiculous, naive, and says a lot about the hysterical vibe in which the english press and the english football fans are getting into, always trying to impose this surreal moral standar into others. We are very confused as a society and we don't know how racism functions in real life.

This whole episode is embarassing for both clubs and brought out the worst of both Manchester United and Liverpool fans.

This game was played in Liverpool, In England where that kind of cultural slur is unacceptable - that kind of term is unacceptable in France also - Suarez had been in Europe for years and I don't accept this was a simple misunderstanding - knowing the nature of Suarez it was a deliberate and calculating attempt to get a reaction from Evra by using racist terms

I understand the tribal support of Liverpool fans being really disappointing with the issue of using racist terms taking a back seat to undivided support for Suarez

Not sure what you mean about bringing the worst out in United fans - generally we reacted in a reasonable way? What do you mean by that
 
As a person who speaks spanish and is close to the latinamerican culture I can confidently say Suarez is right, in that context "negro" is not a racist slur, he was certanly not being friendly with Evra, but the word was not intented to be an insult, all was a huge cultural misunderstanding. Truth is, he should have known better and recognize the cultura differencies between Uruguay and England.

Now, to think Suarez, because of this incident, is actually a racist person is just ridiculous, naive, and says a lot about the hysterical vibe in which the english press and the english football fans are getting into, always trying to impose this surreal moral standar into others. We are very confused as a society and we don't know how racism functions in real life.

This whole episode is embarassing for both clubs and brought out the worst of both Manchester United and Liverpool fans.

A decent stab at impartiality yet you're still giving the benefit of the doubt to Suarez, regarding the intent of what he said i.e. how he hoped Evra would react. As for each club's - and fans' - conduct, there's light years of difference in how they responded. Never mind club partisanship - it's sheer common sense to believe that Suarez sought to provoke Evra into a potential sending-off; bias doesn't enter the equation into what is likely to have been the intent of Suarez's behaviour.
 
As a person who speaks spanish and is close to the latinamerican culture I can confidently say Suarez is right, in that context "negro" is not a racist slur, he was certanly not being friendly with Evra, but the word was not intented to be an insult, all was a huge cultural misunderstanding. Truth is, he should have known better and recognize the cultura differencies between Uruguay and England.

Now, to think Suarez, because of this incident, is actually a racist person is just ridiculous, naive, and says a lot about the hysterical vibe in which the english press and the english football fans are getting into, always trying to impose this surreal moral standar into others. We are very confused as a society and we don't know how racism functions in real life.

This whole episode is embarassing for both clubs and brought out the worst of both Manchester United and Liverpool fans.

And how did you work that masterpiece out. I also live within latino american culture. All my staff are south americans. When they use the negro reference when they are angry they DO mean it in an insulting manner. They don't have an argument and say nice words, they are very emotional. They are also all women, so the scorned woman stuff is quite real. They are viscous.

As for the brought out the worst in the fans, or embarrassing the clubs, you must have re-invented history. Maybe you are a closet scouser. United as a club, made exactly zilch comment other than make the initial complaint to the FA. Liverpool on the other hand, were ridiculous in their actions like the T-shirt and Daglish stupid PR. Fans will be fans and there is always a nasty side to United/Liverpool debate. However, even when Suarez was found guilty and punished, to ignore this and create an agenda against Evra was something only Liverpool fans could do. I don't recall Chelsea fans giving Anton Ferdinand the level treatment Evra got because of accusations against Terry.
 
Well, experts on language disagree, they said in that context, that is in a hostile situation, calling a stranger a "negro" and saying you don't speak to "blacks" on front of the ref no less, you're being derogatory. Even in Uruguay, that bastion of tolerance.

I'm sure you mean well but you're wrong.

Uruguay is far from being the bastion of tolerance, is a country as racist as the UK, the US or the rest of South America. I don't know exactly what happened, I have not followed the case completely but according to Suarez he said "Why Negro?", "Por qué Negro?", that's hardly an offense even in that context. I don't know if I'm missing other points of view from the case, but according to that what Suarez did is hardly an offense.

Now, calling him a "racist" because of this issue is a huge exaggeration.
 
Doesnt really matter.

We dont use that word in Europe as a friendly matter of fact term when debating or addressing people at work.

Ignorance of the law or culture is no defense.
 
In a British cultural context, we're being asked to believe this: when two blokes square up for a fight, they're really being friendly when they use words like 'mate' or 'pal'. Pfft...
 
And how did you work that masterpiece out. I also live within latino american culture. All my staff are south americans. When they use the negro reference when they are angry they DO mean it in an insulting manner. They don't have an argument and say nice words, they are very emotional. They are also all women, so the scorned woman stuff is quite real. They are viscous.

Different classes, different backgrounds and different social circles could have a different use of the word in different context. What I'm saying is that in that particual context the word doesn't seem offensive. "Por qué negro?" is hardly attacking someone. I work that masterpiece out of the fact that I'm live in this continent.

As for the brought out the worst in the fans, or embarrassing the clubs, you must have re-invented history. Maybe you are a closet scouser. United as a club, made exactly zilch comment other than make the initial complaint to the FA. Liverpool on the other hand, were ridiculous in their actions like the T-shirt and Daglish stupid PR. Fans will be fans and there is always a nasty side to United/Liverpool debate. However, even when Suarez was found guilty and punished, to ignore this and create an agenda against Evra was something only Liverpool fans could do. I don't recall Chelsea fans giving Anton Ferdinand the level treatment Evra got because of accusations against Terry.

So if I don't take an irrational position in order to attack Suarez it means I'm a Liverpool supporter, that totally makes sense.




This game was played in Liverpool, In England where that kind of cultural slur is unacceptable - that kind of term is unacceptable in France also - Suarez had been in Europe for years and I don't accept this was a simple misunderstanding - knowing the nature of Suarez it was a deliberate and calculating attempt to get a reaction from Evra by using racist terms

I understand the tribal support of Liverpool fans being really disappointing with the issue of using racist terms taking a back seat to undivided support for Suarez

Not sure what you mean about bringing the worst out in United fans - generally we reacted in a reasonable way? What do you mean by that


You are drawing a huge conclusion out of just a few facts. Suarez was wrong for the same reasons you expose, he should have known better but puting him as a malicious racist person because of that particular reaction is just too far and that's what Manchester United fans have done during the whole episode.

I think the tribal support of Liverpool as you call it is completely ridiculous and childish, just as ridiculous and childish as seeing Manchester United fans in blogs or twitter accounts trying to convince people that Suarez is the worst human being ever and a racist because of this episode.
 
As a person who speaks spanish and is close to the latinamerican culture I can confidently say Suarez is right, in that context "negro" is not a racist slur, he was certanly not being friendly with Evra, but the word was not intented to be an insult, all was a huge cultural misunderstanding. Truth is, he should have known better and recognize the cultura differencies between Uruguay and England.
I don't care a single bit whether it's not racist "where he comes from" - he chose to play football in Europe, and played here for some years before this incident. As you say yourself, he should know better. The fact that he seemingly doesn't tells me that he's either a gigantic moron or a racist. If it was all a big misunderstanding, why is he still trying to portrait himself as the innocent party (and repeatedly changing his story) instead of just saying "yeah, I fecked up". The only reason this is still being talked about as much as it is is because of Suarez.

Now, to think Suarez, because of this incident, is actually a racist person is just ridiculous, naive, and says a lot about the hysterical vibe in which the english press and the english football fans are getting into, always trying to impose this surreal moral standar into others. We are very confused as a society and we don't know how racism functions in real life.
Suarez played football in England. If he didn't want to be judged by moral standards of other countries he should've stayed in Uruguay. But yeah, expecting others not to be racist is a "surreal moral standard" - not sure how anyone can live by those strict codes.

This whole episode is embarassing for both clubs and brought out the worst of both Manchester United and Liverpool fans.
What? :lol: United reported racism because one of their players was a target of racist comments. They went through proper channels and didn't do much about it apart from that (there was no t-shirts!). How exactly did United embarrass themselves?
 
So if I don't take an irrational position in order to attack Suarez it means I'm a Liverpool supporter, that totally makes sense.
Not all all.
You have admitted that you don't know the full story, but are quite happy to put United's behavior as a club on the same level as Liverpool's.

Read the press and you will see what happened.
 
Uruguay is far from being the bastion of tolerance, is a country as racist as the UK, the US or the rest of South America. I don't know exactly what happened, I have not followed the case completely but according to Suarez he said "Why Negro?", "Por qué Negro?", that's hardly an offense even in that context. I don't know if I'm missing other points of view from the case, but according to that what Suarez did is hardly an offense.

Now, calling him a "racist" because of this issue is a huge exaggeration.
You might want to read the FA report, or a summary of it, before going on like this.
 
Suarez played football in England. If he didn't want to be judged by moral standards of other countries he should've stayed in Uruguay. But yeah, expecting others not to be racist is a "surreal moral standard" - not sure how anyone can live by those strict codes.

You completely missed the point, what I mean by "surreal moral standar" is to think a person is racist because of this incident. The world is not as black or white as the european or angloxason moral standars try to make it seem. Suarez is not defined as a racist person because of this issue.

The other point about "If he didn't want to be judged by moral standards of other countries he should've stayed in Uruguay" has a lot of cultural and political implications, Suarez goes to the money goes, Europe is richer than South America in result of a huge colonization and capitalistic history, I have a strong formed opinion about it but I don't think this is the place to discuss it, just think twice about the implication it has to make a claim like that.
 
What? :lol: United reported racism because one of their players was a target of racist comments. They went through proper channels and didn't do much about it apart from that (there was no t-shirts!). How exactly did United embarrass themselves?

Was thinking the same thing...
 
You completely missed the point, what I mean by "surreal moral standar" is to think a person is racist because of this incident. The world is not as black or white as the european or angloxason moral standars try to make it seem. Suarez is not defined as a racist person because of this issue.

The other point about "If he didn't want to be judged by moral standards of other countries he should've stayed in Uruguay" has a lot of cultural and political implications, Suarez goes to the money goes, Europe is richer than South America in result of a huge colonization and capitalistic history, I have a strong formed opinion about it but I don't think this is the place to discuss it, just think twice about the implication it has to make a claim like that.

Why am i tagged here?
 
You might want to read the FA report, or a summary of it, before going on like this.

The official report would not change my mind. I give Suarez the benefit of doubt, I know he did wrong and he paid for it, I'm sure the whole incident was a cultural misunderstanding in the context of a heated football match, where hatred words are exchanged all the time. It should have ended with a small apology by Luis Suarez and his club.

The ammount of animosity this player gets on the internet by United fans and the british media in general is just ridiculous and out of order. British football has had far more disturbed characters who later get into movies or get a job in the media, but somehow this boy Suarez is unforgivable, god knows why.
 
Uruguay is far from being the bastion of tolerance, is a country as racist as the UK, the US or the rest of South America. I don't know exactly what happened, I have not followed the case completely but according to Suarez he said "Why Negro?", "Por qué Negro?", that's hardly an offense even in that context. I don't know if I'm missing other points of view from the case, but according to that what Suarez did is hardly an offense.

Now, calling him a "racist" because of this issue is a huge exaggeration.

According to Evra he said 'because you are black?' and the commission sided with Pat because of how many times Suarez flipped on his story. Suarez tried to exploit the similarity between 'because' and 'why' ('porque' and 'Por qué') to get off. Its all there in the commission report. Read it.
 
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The official report would not change my mind. I give Suarez the benefit of doubt, I know he did wrong and he paid for it, I'm sure the whole incident was a cultural misunderstanding in the context of a heated football match, where hatred words are exchanged all the time. It should have ended with a small apology by Luis Suarez and his club.

The ammount of animosity this player gets on the internet by United fans and the british media in general is just ridiculous and out of order. British football has had far more disturbed characters who later get into movies or get a job in the media, but somehow this boy Suarez is unforgivable, god knows why.

So were we blinkered as a country when he was voted in England as player of the year. Surely, we as a country, would have looked at his poor unsporting behavior and ignored him as a good footballer. Then there would be evidence of a campaign against Suarez in England. There is no campaign and has not been a campaign against him. He is treated the same as anyone else in England that acts like him.

You are right in that if Suarez on understanding the impact of what he said had been big enough to say "I am sorry', he would not have put Liverpool as a club through the mire and they would not have acted as they did, and he would probably have gained some respect from many opposing fans. He made no effort to apologies and still goes on to this day to try and make out it is some sort of injustice.

You seem to deliberately taking his words, as fact, and out of context. The report will show that he changed on various occasions the wording and number of times of what he said. Even the use of 'negro' versus 'negrito' words. Saying, the report would not change your mind is just supporting the view you are on a WUM, and will fight to the end that he only said that one phrase and that in itself is not offensive. What you forget is that you didn't receive the words, Evra did, and as a spanish speaker, if he found it offensive, then that is what needs to be addressed.
 
You completely missed the point, what I mean by "surreal moral standar" is to think a person is racist because of this incident. The world is not as black or white as the european or angloxason moral standars try to make it seem. Suarez is not defined as a racist person because of this issue.

The other point about "If he didn't want to be judged by moral standards of other countries he should've stayed in Uruguay" has a lot of cultural and political implications, Suarez goes to the money goes, Europe is richer than South America in result of a huge colonization and capitalistic history, I have a strong formed opinion about it but I don't think this is the place to discuss it, just think twice about the implication it has to make a claim like that.

Suarez was not found guilty of being racist - rather he used racist language. I think most of us accept he is not racist but he did overstep the mark with his attempts to wind up Evra that day and then dug himself into a deeper hole by lying. As for colonialism, I'm not sure the River Plate area is the best example given the people there are almost all descendants of European settlers.
 
The official report would not change my mind. I give Suarez the benefit of doubt, I know he did wrong and he paid for it, I'm sure the whole incident was a cultural misunderstanding in the context of a heated football match, where hatred words are exchanged all the time. It should have ended with a small apology by Luis Suarez and his club.

Statements like this is why you are being questioned about being a closet scouser or at the very least, a Suarez fan.

I don't think Luis Suarez is a racist person, or at least the kind where he goes out of his way to avoid interacting with black people in his private life. However, i do believe that even good people are susceptible to saying nasty things in the heat of the moment, and that is what I think happened. He said some racist things in a racist context in the heat of the moment, but that does not necessarily make him a bad person. What truly dragged his name through the mud was because of his own handling of the situation, fuelled by blind support from his club and manager. If he had just accepted his mistake and apologized for causing offence, I don't think the media nor the fans would have continued to crucify him. IMO the denial was much, much worse and more damaging to his reputation than the incident itself. It actually convinced people that he really was racist because he was defending and denying his racist actions.

As for the handshake, that is a pathetically hilarious analysis from his book. It gave me the impression that he felt he was 100% right, and that Evra should have made the effort to shake his hand when it should clearly have been the other way around. If Evra pulled his hand away then the headlines would have been reversed, but obviously that was never going to happen since Suarez still felt he was completely right and he probably still had a grudge with Evra, and perhaps his pride would not allow him to make that extra effort to extend his hand 2 inches to shake Pat's hand. He only has himself to blame, everything else are excuses.
 

:lol:

Very, very few things are black and white in life as in football, but this is one.

"Racist" doesn't mean you secretly wear white hoods and burn crosses in yards, or even that you privately but sincerely hold the belief that another racial group is inferior to your own. It means you use racially loaded language on other racial groups to insult or annoy them. QED.
 
Statements like this is why you are being questioned about being a closet scouser or at the very least, a Suarez fan.

I don't think Luis Suarez is a racist person, or at least the kind where he goes out of his way to avoid interacting with black people in his private life. However, i do believe that even good people are susceptible to saying nasty things in the heat of the moment, and that is what I think happened. He said some racist things in a racist context in the heat of the moment, but that does not necessarily make him a bad person. What truly dragged his name through the mud was because of his own handling of the situation, fuelled by blind support from his club and manager. If he had just accepted his mistake and apologized for causing offence, I don't think the media nor the fans would have continued to crucify him. IMO the denial was much, much worse and more damaging to his reputation than the incident itself. It actually convinced people that he really was racist because he was defending and denying his racist actions.

As for the handshake, that is a pathetically hilarious analysis from his book. It gave me the impression that he felt he was 100% right, and that Evra should have made the effort to shake his hand when it should clearly have been the other way around. If Evra pulled his hand away then the headlines would have been reversed, but obviously that was never going to happen since Suarez still felt he was completely right and he probably still had a grudge with Evra, and perhaps his pride would not allow him to make that extra effort to extend his hand 2 inches to shake Pat's hand. He only has himself to blame, everything else are excuses.

Agree with this well summed up, Rio pretty much said the same thing about the Terry racism incident too. Both cases handled badly by both Suarez and Terry.

Suarez did the same thing again on the Chiellini biting incident too, claiming he fell into him... yeah right he does himself no favours.