who are these media people (lot of them) supporting moyes?
Confirmed: Moyes sacked.
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I've heard so many people mention Liverpool giving time to Rodgers when talking about United and Moyes as though the two situations are in anyway alike. If you want to compare two situations surely the common one would be Liverpool sacking Hodgson. Hodgson clearly didn't fit in with Liverpool and was never going to, it was a bad appointment so they god rid quickly and brought a man in with better ideas and now they will win the league because of that decision.
Should they have stuck with Hodgson for another season or two because that's what good clubs do?
Should they have stuck with Hodgson for another season or two because that's what good clubs do?
I'll defend Hodgson here. He took over the club after the free-fall that clown Benitez had left it in and was able to spend virtually nothing to turn it around. I think Hodgson was made the scapegoat of that period unfairly. All Hodgson could do was manage the decline the club was undoubtedly in.
And Hicks and Gilett were still in control. I do not think many managers could have succeeded during the end of their reign.
Sorry I don't have the time to indulge you on this but if you haven't seen or read such suggestive articles then fair enough .
I guarantee you, some (many) pundits will pipe up saying "why couldn't they put that effort in when Moyes was there?". Guaranteed. They have the analytical ability of tree sap.
He completely lost me after the whole "Even Fergie would struggle with this squad" bullshit
a. No, you idiot, he won the league running away with this squad.
b. How can you knock the man who handed you the job, when NO OTHER TOP SIDE would have gone anywhere near you?
That was the point I began to realise that we weren't going to turn the corner and that we needed to move beyond Moyes.
a. No, you idiot, he won the league running away with this squad.
b. How can you knock the man who handed you the job, when NO OTHER TOP SIDE would have gone anywhere near you?
That was the point I began to realise that we weren't going to turn the corner and that we needed to move beyond Moyes.
"The club" this, "the Glazers" that & the fans are naive believing the "propaganda that the Glazers were selling".
Moyes was Fergie's idea - not the friggin Glazers!
And leave the fans alone - we've done feck all wrong with tryin to support the new manager as best we could.
You're right - everyone's wrong. Case closed - you're totally awesome dude!!
And half of them will have done exactly the same in their careers to get a manager sacked. So hypocrites as well.
I lost faith in him after New Year, but I was surprised more wasn't made of this comment at the time. It was so obvious he was the problem. Maybe he thought he was playing mind games with the squad!
I don't think they will do that. They don't want to go to battle against Man United for too long. David Moyes would not be worth it for them. United would have no problem banning their asses from the press room.
Van Gaal will eat them alive if he is hired.
Alright fair enough and he did have (the publicly interested in the job) Dalglish looking down from the stands to keep the Liverpool fans from being too patient with him. Maybe it was a bad time to be manager at Liverpool but he was still the wrong man for the job and they had to get rid. Let's just hope we don't hire a Dalglish next
Couldn't agree more mate in the last few days we've had to listen to the opinion of every mediocre or failed manager they can round up on the big bad evil Manchester United sacking of Moyes, how dare they he needed more time.
All spouting the same old guff when truth be told they probably don't give a solitary feck about Moyes and are just trying to change the climate so failing managers can ride out big fat contracts while generally being shit at their job.
Its all just part of the continuing effort to change the 'sacking culture' that these people think is isolated to football somehow or a new thing, under perform like Moyes in any industry and you will quickly get the boot. If he was running a factory into the ground and after a year things are only getting worse, do you think the owners would sit about deliberating if he needs more time to implement ideas, would they feck.
And managers have been getting the sack since the 60's maybe even sooner, was McGuinness or O'Farrell a victim of this modern sack culture, we have been sacking managers for decades and will be sacking them for decades more just like every other club.
I respected Zola for that, with the stuff being leaked form the club in the last few days it must have been clear even to Moyes that he was out of his depth and not turning this one round.
Would have respected him a lot more if he had held his hands up in february or march and said look its not working out and resigned. Giving us the chance to get someone with a clue who could have salvaged something from this season.
But he wasn't that honest it seems when £5 million is at stake.
Moyes has been slated big time in the media since he got the job. Google it. But then again Moyes probably has Google fighting his corner aswell - that aul Moyesy propaganda machine is sure hard at work?!
Well, we'll need to agree to differ. To me, this thread is the thing running rampant with paranoid conspiracies and cod psychology. You just have to be able to read to see that broadsheets spin stories to suit the editorial opinions and political persuasions of their owners. Just because tabloids are more obvious in their bias and inconsistency does not mean that the broadsheets are paragons of virtue. The press being able to base stories on uncredited sources, people close to the club etc leaves readers relying entirely on the integrity of journalists and their editors for veracity. While I don't doubt some are totally honest, I can't say they are a breed who fill me with confidence. Do I believe they would make shit up to sell papers in a cut throat market? Hell, yeah.
ok no prob.
one thing i don't particularly like in forums (not only football) is how information is used to suit a particular agenda. So in this case, those jounos whose reports put moyes in bad light are serious and do not invent stories. Conversely any reports portraying moyes in good light are authored by ppl under the influence of moyes..(which can be interpreted as being manipulated) ..... hardly convincing isn't it..
(btw sorry for the mistakes but i m still getting grips with touchscreen typing)
I still cannot help but feel tremendous relief at his dismissal. I feel like a battered wife who's finally made it to the refuge. It's tangible the sense of "thank god" almost. Incredible, incredible feeling. All this week now I've had that buzz that you only tend to get through a big result; thrashing City, knocking Liverpool out of the FA Cup or making a big marque signing. I'm actually looking forward to and excited for next season.
Only few days ago I just wanted football to go away and curl up somewhere and die for a few months. Now I'm looking forward to the summer and the next season like a kid looking forward to going to Disney world....or Butlins, if you're working lass.
Only few days ago I just wanted football to go away and curl up somewhere and die for a few months. Now I'm looking forward to the summer and the next season like a kid looking forward to going to Disney world....or Butlins, if you're working lass.
I bet you don't really feel like a battered wife.
In other words, this is what it feels to be a scouser.
Maybe you weren't logged in when we started this discussion with @stevoc because I even stated that the club is now fighting back through using ''sources'' that are claiming all sorts of things from Moyes slating players for missing pks and how he ordered that training youth in ball skills be limited in favour of athleticism and physique . The way I see it is that the respective camps are planting stories to justify their actions or excuse themselves for failure . It's a publicity battle being waged through leaks which can be deniable and obviously the truth is somewhere in between .
Yep. That's an absolute certainty IF we go out and batter Norwich, Sunderland and Hull playing good football and just generally looking a different team. Not just the pundits, fans on here who are outraged at the players not giving 100%.
Just think there are loads of people who don't realise the effect a totally inept leader has on a successful group. Do people genuinely believe they weren't trying and were happy to be embarrassed by shit results? They are winners and are used to winning. Your performance levels will drop when there's an overwhelming sense of uncertainty and lack of belief in your manager. Not only was he tactically inept, his man management and just general social skills have been incredibly poor by all accounts.
Strange everyone goes on about how nice a man he is. Everybody at United seemingly thinks he's a dick.
That was the final nail. I was fuming over that. I've given up on him in December but there were things just pushing and pushing it further, like the 'You need football intelligence to understand that' over that 81 cross game. And them this thing with Fergie struggling... deary me.
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It only took me about two David Moyes interviews/press conferences to come to this conclusion. Some people just suck at "reading" other people or are easily fooled.
It only took me about two David Moyes interviews/press conferences to come to this conclusion. Some people just suck at "reading" other people or are easily fooled.
The players didn't buy into a weak and unachieved leader who had the cheek to tell the press that those champions were inept and not fit for purpose.
Moyes and his team leaked stories to the press detailing a shoddy setup that he had inherited. A shoddy setup that was one of the most successful in the world.
I don't care about the way that he was sacked or stories in the press about his own shoddy setup. All I care about is that David Moyes is no longer United manager.
Another good thing about all this is that it has totally buried talk of Liverpool's title run in. Not only from Redcafe but also in the national press.
This episode served to remind us again the gargantuan size of this club.
Moyes and his team leaked stories to the press detailing a shoddy setup that he had inherited. A shoddy setup that was one of the most successful in the world.
I don't care about the way that he was sacked or stories in the press about his own shoddy setup. All I care about is that David Moyes is no longer United manager.
Another good thing about all this is that it has totally buried talk of Liverpool's title run in. Not only from Redcafe but also in the national press.
This episode served to remind us again the gargantuan size of this club.
Maybe propaganda is too strong a word, but hey English being my second/third language I have a ready excuse . My point is that our players' quality and attitude has been slated from the first poor result and to me it sounds like someone was deliberately feeding them that info . How else would they know about Moyes being shocked by the averageness of our squad or that he had a sleepless night on Monday night ? I think if you followed the Rooney saga in the summer you'll have noticed how easy it is for a well paid individual, in this case a millionaire, to have influential journalists fighting his spin battle . Do you think that a journalist made up the ''angry and confused'' line ?
Moyes has been slated big time in the media since he got the job. Google it. But then again Moyes probably has Google fighting his corner aswell - that aul Moyesy propaganda machine is sure hard at work?!
Besides if you want to see a manager tha was absolutely slated in the media think AVB and even then he hadn't failed like Moyes has . Why didn't we hear of players sneering at him ? Because it didn't happen or that maybe because he is the exact foreigner denying the honest, dignified British manager a shot at the big time ? Just as there was an attempt to amplify AVB's failure there was also one to deflect from Moyes' and he was a willing participant since it is he that was initially blaming his players for poor results . I hope I've made it clear why I suspect his camp to be behind some bizzare yet unfortunate, if true, stories about how our players cost him his job .
Very good points man. The most important one i feel, is that managers shouldnt get a pay off if they've fecked over a club - the same as in any industry. There should be some kind of panel who decides if there's a deserved pay-off - it shouldnt be automatic. No chance!
Moyes broke every gut-wrenching record imaginable at our beloved, so why should he get a golden handshake?! The fecker should be doin time ffs!
If i were Moyes & i walked into United on the 1st day of pre-season training & after a while i noticed a serious lack of respect towards me, i'd gather the players & ask them to be open with me & calmly ask whats on their minds. I'd deal with the responses & try to gain their respect as quickly as possible. Thats the settin stone!
Moyes obviously didnt consult the players as to what input they might have to retain their individual levels of skill & improve on also. Instead he came in with a arrogant mid-table mantra that his philosophy at Everton was so shit hot, that he felt no need to retain any of the methods that made us Champions the season before.
He offered Rene an Academy role. A bloody demotion for Christ sake. He was with us for nearly 12 years & was brilliant with the players. They all loved him. If rumours are to believed - he was instrumental in gettin RVP to sign for us also. His training session were always fresh & fun, then Moyes comes in & makes everyone have that sickening flashback to their hatin school days or in my case - having to go to Mass!
Rene's a better coach than Moyes will ever be & the sooner we get him back the better & put an end to this Keano return shite thats been spouted. Thats a disaster all day every day in anyone's book. Van Gaal has to bring Rene with him - it makes perfect sense to most of us!
I think the media are quick to take shots at United, as others have discussed. When he was manager, they took shots at him because he represented United. Now that he's gone, they will defend him in order to take shots at United. Not organized propaganda, but the media are still taking up his side.
Moyes has been slated big time in the media since he got the job. Google it. But then again Moyes probably has Google fighting his corner aswell - that aul Moyesy propaganda machine is sure hard at work?!
It's interesting because it seemed like the vast majority of articles on Monday when the story started to break and early Tuesday after it was official, were more positive about the decision. Yesterday and today more of the pro-Moyes sentiment has been coming out.
Because our robust succession management procedures that were in place unanimously pointed towards him as being the only person on the planet who is "cut from the same cloth" as SAF and can take this club forward? You have to pay for making bad decisions. Thankfully the board learned from it and this time they have it written in stone that "inexperience" is a factor that won't be overlooked.
Now that you put it this way, I suppose it makes sense. I was firmly in the category of people who believe that managers should be given time. It's really not that simple. Maybe it's all about employing the right kind of manager in the first place. The right person for the job will do better in the long term, regardless of how badly things look to be going in the short term, I suppose.
http://www.theguardian.com/football...manchester-united-rene-meulensteen?CMP=twt_gu
Rene not speaking highly of Moyes and blaming him for the bad season it seems.
Quick to take shots? The idea of the British media slating Moyes from the start is hilarious. They did not treat him overly harshly. Infact they went easy on him for a long time because he is British (compare his treatment with the one of AVB).
I wrote it once here before, but if Moyes would have worked for the Italian, German or Spanish counterparts of United, the hard questions would have come out way sooner and his general treatment would make look the articles by the British press like childs play. I just need to look at the gigantic difference in treatment of Klinsmann´s similar unsuccessful tenure at Bayern and Klinsmann was a crowd favourite in Germany. Hell, Jürgen Klopp was treated worse, when his bloody young team failed to survive the CL group stages in 2011 and they dubbed Dortmund as "the shame of German football". Even when he was successful they tried to paint him as a lunatic and horrible role model for the youth because of his antics on the side line. Don´t even get me started about the workings of the Spanish sports press, because they are even more ridiculous.
Spot on mate. To be fair, loads of people actually agree with this. He got a remarkably easy ride.
Oh God - I am so pleased someone has said this. I think so too.
Rodgers is the best example of someone qualified to do an eventual great job & had the boards backin throughout. There was no real pressure because they were coming from a long way off. Next season will be the real test of Rodgers & Liverpool, when they have the 2-3 games a week scenario like we're accustomed to!
Moyes was a mistake & we found out the hard way. He should never been allowed to strip the backroom staff either. It should have been Moyes only - not his mid-table jokes comin with him & that includes Phil. Fergie must be livid by Moyes shaftin him, when they had an agreement he keeps the same staff. Then once he signed on - he went rogue & brought his yes men in!
He's the architect of his own downfall & has set us back in our hunt for more glory. He can go feck himself as far as i'm concerned. £5m golden handshake for costing us 10 times that.. He should be payin us ffs!
I still feel a huge portion of the British media is ABU, Fergie made them that way no doubt with his control of them and as they could see moyes was failing, it wasn't in their interest to criticise moyes personally. All of their criticism was directed at SAF and Manchester United as a club, but not moyes. During his troubled reign, these people were blaming Fergie for appointing him and the utter bollox that he left him a shit squad and after the sacking it was everyone's fault bar moyes, hence the "shocking handling of his sacking" etc... He was given a ridiculous amount of time by the club to turn things around, imo he should have gone after the defeat at home to Newcastle, that game made it abundantly clear he was a disaster and the players had no direction or respect for him, had we got rid then, we may have made the top four, that is the only criticism I have of the club in the handling of it, not being ruthless enough when the obvious was staring them in the face in order to preserve our CL status, but you can understand their loyalty to give him time, if anything the club is to be commended for taking such a hit, regardless of what a bunch of abu's come out with.
Only mildly!
What he said was both logical and truthful. Any reasonable (and sensible) person would agree with his assessment. I like Rene (he's been under Sir Alex for 5 years and I would trust him to be among the coaching staff without doubting his integrity and ability. What he said is also proof he's being forced out by Moyes (bringing in his own men and introducing his own system which was inconsistent with a successful regime which lasted for over two decades.)
What a stupid man Moyes is. If he had listened and use the valuable experience of United staff/players, we would have been among top 4 or there about. When an idiot complains about bad treatment, he needs to look at what he is doing first. The cruise liner is way way beyond him
Not just that, the £27m wasted on the Lampshade (plus the money for Mata, though he's a good asset we didn't really need him), value wiped off the stock market this season, loss of revenue from finishing 7th and early exits from cups, Rooney's contract.
If it's true what a first class effin clown Moyes is. What could he ever hope to achieve by dismantling the champions from within and bringing in his mediocre, clueless backroom staff? The more that comes out about it, the more I dislike him. Bet he turns up as a pundit on some World Cup show as well.
We did need a player like Mata, he injects instant quality into our starting 11. Rather he suits our current system is irrelevant, as we'll surely be changing things anyway if we're considering appointing Van Haal or Anceolotti. No disrespect to SAF, but even he didn't have much experience with that type of player, but we need to move forward now and start adopting a brand of football that's not overly reliant on wingers. Mata will be a success here under the right manager, that's for certain.
So we couldn't get Kagawa, Rooney or even Januzaj playing in that role instead? The point being, we're pretty much overloaded in those positions. Don't get me wrong I like Mata in that role but getting deeper lying more defensive midfielders was more of a priority. And we shouldn't discard wingers either, since everyone is trying to play 4-2-3-1 now.
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