Confirmed: Moyes sacked.
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If I had a terrible manager in whatever profession, I'd still put 100% into the job.
At the end of the day, not a single person can deny that Moyes was a really decent man, but he was too decent for his own good for a job like this. Never did he show us any signs that he was pissed off when we put in a never ending stream of pathetic performances. You got the impression that he was patting the players on the back after a defeat. It was ridiculous.
I'm not necessarily praising them, I'm saying that it sounds like they all grew increasingly bitter and frustrated at the circumstances they found themselves in. And in most cases, couldn't do a whole lot to change those circumstances. If Moyes insists on playing Young or telling Kagawa to stay on the touchline, there's not a whole lot the player can do about it. I'm saying that I fully understand why the players resorted to snide remarks as an outlet for their exasperation with Moyes.
Especially in a job where you get paid rediculously well to do a job billions of people across the world would love to do. If you take pride in your work, you wouldn't be able to hold back while playing in front of a passionate crowd at Old Trafford.
Even for the greedy, unmotivated slobs they have their own world cup spot to worry about. Raises lots of questions about our squad for me.
lol. it's complete nonsense.
I'm not sure what you do, but most of us don't have anything close to what players have in terms of power and control of their own futures. My employers didn't have to pay 20m+ to attain my services and they can relatively easily replace me if I don't put a 100%. There also isn't huge marketing potential based on my presence at the company.
Players have a lot of say these days, rightly or wrongly. It is not a unique thing to United. They know that and act accordingly. I don't support it and it is very poor indeed but one has to be realistic about it.
The book he was reading was fine, im sure its a good book that many professionals have read and found useful.
The problem for him was where & when he chose to read the fecking thing. Context is everything.
He undermined himself, that is why it was mentioned in the article as an example of why the players lost respect for him.
And people need to stop with the analogies to other jobs or professions. Unless that person is a professional athlete or some sort of performing artist their job is nothing like a professional Footballers. There is a reason why we all grow up wanting to be professional Footballers. And whatever jobs and careers psters on this site has they do not have 80,000 people watching them live and millions watching on television around the World.
You know, I wasn't putting it forward for 'Post of the Year' or anything.
Utterly bizarre you're so offended by it, by the way.
Weirdo.
I'm sure you'd square yourself, hold your head high and do the best job you could under the circumstances. I'd like to think most people would do the best they could to knuckle under and get on with their work.
I don't think the players stopped playing or giving their all, except perhaps this last Everton game. They certainly gave their all against Munich and to come back against Olympiakos. They certainly gave their all during that now infamous Fulham game where we went from 1-0 down to 2-1, only to concede in stoppage time. Go back and watch when Carrick scored to give us the lead, I think the players reactions showed that they cared.
The problem is their efforts were undermined by feck off Steve and the rest of the Moyes brigade. These are the best in the world at what they do, imagine taking the best chef in the world and telling them to prepare Happy Meals. Not exactly a recipe (pardon the pun) for motivation. I think people are being too quick to label our players as lazy, greedy, disloyal etc without first viewing the season from their perspective.
I'll need to borrow Moyesie's book. He won't be needing it for a while anyway...
That and just a modicum of truth, or even need. What's the point of this list anyway? Do the naughty players get toys and treats while the naughty ones are forced to wear a scarlet letter on their shirts the rest of the season?I'm not happy about this, it's not the United way. Are we really going to turn into some tinpot club looking at short term results rather than longer term ones? Did anyone really believe that anyone could take on that job with the shell that Ferguson left them with? What if the next one fails as well, feck him off in 10 months, then the next one.......
Joke!
Joke!
You really good point.
Calm down precious, I ain't offended in the least. Quite amused actually.
And through Giggs' mouth
Geez, Weaste has posted on Football Forums. This should be at-least as big news as Moyes getting sacked.
No kidding. Has Jack Tretton made the shortlist or something?
I am not saying any of those things. I am just saying regardless of who the manager was their performances were unacceptable based on how much they, to their reputations in Football and mostly to people who paid to watch them play. Not one player can look in the mirror and say that they played to the best of their abilities.
De Gea can, but your point stands. I say to make De Gea president.
I think it's also possible that due to Moyes system (using that term as loose as I can here) the players were hamstrung from playing to the best of their ability.
Was the players poor attitude a result of Moyes poor management, or, was Moyes poor management a result of the players poor attitudes?
Was the players poor attitude a result of Moyes poor management, or, was Moyes poor management a result of the players poor attitudes?
But how are they supposed to play to their abilities with a manager telling them to play like Jagielka? They train for hours each day, having the manager's methods drilled into their heads. When they aren't training, they're watching DVDs of how the manager wants them to play. If they were just being downright lazy that would be one thing, but I personally feel they played to less than their abilities because the manager was making them play in a way that didn't cater to their strengths. Management has a massive effect on how a player performs, especially over the course of 8-9 months being trained in that manager's methods.
Exactly. And you're right, its possible we have a chicken/egg situation here and people are naturally going to have a different opinion of which comes first. Personally, I've seen the players in this squad perform markedly better than they did under Moyes. I've very seldom seen Moyes manage players like Kagawa for instance, and thus infer that he suffered from inexperience in how to make such a player excel. I've seen how Moyes' Everton played, how Moyes' United played, and concluded that his methods didn't drastically change between the two clubs. This resulted in a United squad playing like Moyes' Everton, but worse because the United players aren't remotely suited to playing in that style. Thus, I blame Moyes' poor management rather than the players.
I never got the impression the players weren't trying. They just had no clue what to do, where they were suppose to run, drop deep or press. They looked clueless and I don't think it was a lack of effort.
The chicken and the egg argument. People will decide on this based on do they like Moyes or players more, and whom do they rate more. Likely both camps will come with different versions.
Personally I think that it was a combination. Moyes was a bit shit, players saw that immediately and rebelled agains him, which in turn make the results worse than they would have been if they were fully behind him. Which in the end is probably better rather than spending 3-4 years with him, with things being bad but not that bad as to sack him. He looked destined to fail from day one.
I'd also assumed that the players that Utd has currently (Kagawa etc) are ones that Moyes wasn't used to and who also weren't his type. That if he had gotten the chance to bring in "his" team, they'd look more like Everton and would play better for him.
And we'd have hated it.
All those reports don't make a good reading at all. We have players who act like little kids and a manager who should have never been there in the first place. Get LvG to sort them out I say. Going by what the times and the Telegraph are reporting then some players are already scared of him.
Anyone else think he should have got rid of one of our senior players he arrived to make a statement to the players? Rio being the most likely candidate.
That's quite a nice analogy. Makes sense.
In retrospect that might have been necessary.
At least two players went to see Moyes to complain about a lacking of playing time. They were told if they didn’t like it he would not stand in their way this summer. Others felt he was unable to restore their confidence or ensure those on the periphery felt included.
I'm assuming these two players were Kagawa and Welbeck? Welbeck has played a fair bit, but not up top.
Hernandez.
Why always the good guys?
It's weird this. I'd decided that I greatly disliked the man but now that he's gone all of that dislike seems to have disappeared. I don't mind him now.
Moyes for new manager?
Moyes for new manager?
It's apparent he's off in the summer, so it'd make sense he'd gone to Moyes and been told he can leave. Moyes stated Welbeck was an important player for him.
Yeah, it's just that Welbeck apparently said he wanted to leave.
The Mirror are claiming that Moyes was working on deals for Kroos and Shaw on the day the rumors came out about him being sacked. It's only the Mirror but there you go.
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