But you gotta have a brand to damage first
City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches | Hearing begins 16th September 2024
- Thread starter VanGaalEra
- Start date
Absolutely shameless
The killer blow for City would be relegation to League 1 or below. Relegation to the Championship doesn't hurt that much, bc they will be likely to bounce back up right away. But relegation to league 1 means that pretty much all of their players will want to be transferred to another club, bc they don't want to play in League 1, then (in theory,) the Championship the following season.
If the owners get banned and City is in league 1, then that really decreases the value of the club if they are forced to sell. No one is paying 3-4 billion for City if they are in League 1. They would lose a ton of money if they were forced to sell City and City was in League 1 or below.
IDK what will happen, bc people are corrupt and no one would be surprised if City gets off with a slap of the wrist. But the offenses, especially compared to Juve means that at a minimum if City are found guilty, means it's relegation, titles are vacated with no new winner announced and a transfer ban and the owners are banned for a period of time. This is a decade of breaking the rules--- City should be punished harshly. If not, what was the point of the rules to begin with? EVeryone will flaunt them even more if City gets off lightly.
Yeah I understand your point, I just disagree.
I don’t know. Which is why I asked.
Kaveh from Sky doesn't have a clue.
Going to the Championship would still ruin them and I wouldn’t fancy them to go up. Think about it;
- Pep will walk
- The majority of their best players will leave
- They’ll have less legitimate revenue streams
- Their brand will be shot in terms of attractiveness
No one is staying to play in the Championship on a heavily reduced wage and without European football. Perhaps Foden and Rico Lewis.
Let's hope not. Because that would be sickening and free reign for everyone else to do the same in future
It should be a big penalty.
But its City and a joke that they've got away with it for all this time, so most likely they'll get a fine, a transfer window ban and a token gesture of a 1 point deduction.
But its City and a joke that they've got away with it for all this time, so most likely they'll get a fine, a transfer window ban and a token gesture of a 1 point deduction.
If it took four years to investigate , how long will it take to prosecute with every item being contested by accountants & lawyers ?
Oh please, you can’t even sell out the Etihad
It would be funny if they tried to drag it out and got handed individual fines for each of their crime over the next 10 years and each year they got promoted they were instantly relegated.
What even is the City Brand? This new version of the club has always been thought of as dodgy and crooked. This is all just confirming it.
It's definitely not a unique economic market. Every market is a complex environment that involves tree-like structures of dependent participants.
FFP is definitely in place to protect the interests of incumbents. The narrative about "careless owners" only flies because football is a media highlight and gets a lot of attention. Businesses fail all the time. People lose their jobs, local economies are devastated, debts are left unpaid and so on.
Football also has a community aspect that plays into the narrative. But if you think rationally, this is neither unique, nor special. And FFP is definitely not there to protect the little guys from incompetent marauders.
If you get charged with specific charges and have to defend them in court, and then proceed to win the case you get cleared for these charges, no? Hopefully that is true for all of us
Well it doesn’t really does it? There are countless examples of small teams being taken over, abiding by the rules and becoming successful. You do not need to breach rules to do so. As a supporter of a German club you should know better. Look at how RBL have ran themselves over the last decade.
They seem to have displaced your Leverkusen quite soundly as the third team in Germany.
We’ve seen the likes of Leicester, Napoli, Atletico Madrid win major trophies and compete with the elite without cheating. Manchester United haven’t won a league title since 2013 and Liverpool have won one in 32 years, before even citys takeover. Yet I keep seeing people say ffp was brought in to keep Liverpool successful. what fecking success??
Nobody is saying you cannot invest, just don’t fecking cheat, it’s simple.
Newcastle have already spent 250 million pounds since their takeover. They’re not breaching but they’re already in the top four and in a cup final which surpasses anything they’ve done for two decades.
Your argument is very disingenuous. FFP does not and never has stopped clubs from heavy investment thus bridging a gap to the elite clubs. It just draws a line on things and it potentially can prevent clubs going bust.
Leeds, Portsmouth, Bury, Derby, You may not know of what happened to the following clubs but they all had owners who decided to spend beyond sense and plunged those clubs into serious debt and dark times. Leeds and Portsmouth can never happen again with ffp.
You simply cannot allow owners to take over football clubs and do whatever the feck they want.
And for all your talk of fairness, equality etc. Look at what PSG and City have done in their countries since being taken over. Are these leagues more open? Are they more competitive ? It’s actually an insane argument. Encouraging limitless spending to improve competitiveness and bring new teams to the top and then by virtue of that becoming so dominant that you literally reduce competitiveness and the likelihood of other teams ascending to the top.
Now I get it. But no. There’s no clearing your name. It’s stained. It will remain so until you get rid of your owners and stop being a tool for sportswashing.
You mean: already once proven guilty of the exact same thing, but escaped the consequences through completely underhanded and crooked use of lawyers to stall and obstruct the case until it had to be dismissed due to time limitations. And then proclaimed that they will do that again if it happens again. Absolutely disgusting farce of a club, and nobody should feel obligated to give City any sort of leniency. It's a filthy organization, the sporting equivalent of the mafia.
You could argue they are yeah, compared to the decade prior to the takeover. Lyon won 8 in a row in France. After the takeover, Montpellier, Monaco and Lille all won one. In England there were 3 league winners between 98-08. Between 08-18 there were 5, including Leicester
Asterisk The Gaunt
That is another chapter, but not what we are going to court for
You aren’t going to court
it’s hilarious people thinking city are untouchable and how many people can’t understand a verdict, they were never found completely innocent.
Imagine legitimate leaked email trails and contracts pointed to clear cheating, you would be a joke to claim innocence, not city fans.
imagine your own managers contract was leaked with third party payments and you still claimed innocence, yep city fans.
Imagine you went to court got off on a time barred technicality but there was clear evidence mentioned in the verdict that they wouldn’t cooperate with the authorities and evidence to cheating the system but was too old and you still claimed innocence.
Then imagine you get the biggest amount of charges the league has ever seen and are still refusing to provide the account information for a number of years, still innocent right.
Not only that you would rather gleefully say we will throw all the money at it and get out of it and clearly means the premier league is null and void as competitive integrity has gon to pot with such an outcome.
Be nice if city fans could see the bigger picture then a few titles they have won in the last few years which most people write off as illegitimately gained anyway.
We are eventually yeah
Been sports washing for years.
You literally can’t. You sign a contract at the start of every season saying you agree not to take PL judgments to outside courts.
It’s why CAS is off the table.
I dont think it needs to go to court - pretty sure that because its a private sporting league with membership criteria and rules that clubs agree to adhere to, clubs can be removed a members vote.
I’d also be surprised if a court case can force the League to readmit a club either if they are expelled as again its a private membership.
The adjudicators can recommend punishment for these specific charges which is one thing, but if the members that make up the leagues governing body vote City out (and I believe its made up of the owners of the other clubs in the league) Id be surprised if that can be overturned by any amount of litigation. It would also be an embarrassment on the level of forcing the other kids in the playground to let you join in when they dont want to play with you
I’d also be surprised if a court case can force the League to readmit a club either if they are expelled as again its a private membership.
The adjudicators can recommend punishment for these specific charges which is one thing, but if the members that make up the leagues governing body vote City out (and I believe its made up of the owners of the other clubs in the league) Id be surprised if that can be overturned by any amount of litigation. It would also be an embarrassment on the level of forcing the other kids in the playground to let you join in when they dont want to play with you
well they’re not are they. It’s just one different club . It hasn’t made anything more competitive, it’s just made two oil clubs win more and lots more. It’s hardly an influx of different challengers which is my point. And I’m not sure on what planet you could argue french football has become more competitive. A team winning 20/28 available competitions in a single nation is definitely not more ‘competitive’ then what went before. Only a fecking Man City fan could present that as an argument with a straight face.
Depends on what you get charged with. From my brief reading around it appears you do not have a option to go to CAS which usually deals with sporting regulations; I am sure there is an appeals process but I am not sure there is a legal one. The PL has clear rules saying they can pretty much do what they want and you signed these willingly. Hence, you're hamstrung a little here as, this is a little like some bloke getting kicked out of the local golf club for using juiced up clubs in tournaments.
So, I am not sure a court will save you if you can get it there, unless of course, the main cause for punishment is owing to something more to do with taxes which is a HMRC issue.
Talk of them getting kicked out the PL is laughable.
20 years ago perhaps, but the money in football today, no chance, football is corrupt beyond comprehension, money really does talk in this industry. How many 100’s of millions will it cost City if they were thrown out? I’m sure City would pay a fraction of that potential cost to the right people to ensure they remain in the EPL, a fraction is still astronomical by the way, and if needs be, they’d pay more.
It’s also a shambles on the Premier Leagues part for not seeing things sooner……12 plus years this has been going on, well done dummies, who’s the idiot!
20 years ago perhaps, but the money in football today, no chance, football is corrupt beyond comprehension, money really does talk in this industry. How many 100’s of millions will it cost City if they were thrown out? I’m sure City would pay a fraction of that potential cost to the right people to ensure they remain in the EPL, a fraction is still astronomical by the way, and if needs be, they’d pay more.
It’s also a shambles on the Premier Leagues part for not seeing things sooner……12 plus years this has been going on, well done dummies, who’s the idiot!
Haha, fair enough. You could discuss this to death and never get anywhere, so maybe you're better off to cut the string.In 19/20 Brighton was at €147M revenue, United at €651M. Even if United stopped growing and Brighton growed by 10% per year, they would need 16 years to get to United's level. The problem for Brighton is that the top clubs are actually growing faster than the runner ups.
Let's be real, it is literally impossible to organically grow into a top club. You need capital injections for that to happen.
And now, that really my last post in here
I think what irks fans, and probably especially United fans, is the notion that we've always been on top, and want to keep the status quo.
The fact is that United have been on the brink many times in their history, from near dissolution and multiple relegations in the 1900's, from having a ruined stadium from WW2, the Munich Tragedy and etc etc etc. Even post the Busby Babes in the 70s, it was a lean period for the club and we watched on as others were much more successful.
Our title in 1993 was the first since 1967. Our dominance was a product of the appointment and backing of SAF, proper recruitment and sound running of the football club, some luck along the way and the Class of 92 being something truly astonishing when you look back at it.
We were trailblazers over the following decades, building on the merchandising and commercial side of the club, something that nobody else was doing at the time.
I guess I'm lucky to support United in this period that I grew up in, but others had to live through some truly dark days.
To be honest, I don't feel any sympathy for those that point to the so called "top clubs" and whinge about FFP and the unfairness of it all. What gives any club some "divine right" to have a shot at being the best in the league? What has happened is that everyone has seen Chelsea and City win the lottery, and it's like "well, why can't I have that?" It's such a BS argument.
Why aren't the likes of Derby County, Nottingham Forest, Everton, Leeds and whoever else was successful in the 70's and 80's still sitting at the top table and winning titles? Clubs like Liverpool, Arsenal and Man United stood the test of time because they were run better than others and who have fallen to the wayside.
Just my opinion tbh. I can totally see where you're coming from, I really can. But there are the winners and losers in all walks of life unfortunately. But like, nobody is out there clamouring for the government to dish out a few million to each lower and middle class household to give them a shot at accumulating wealth and being rich like the elite in society.
But imagine your neighbour was given a few million, and nobody else was. How would you feel? Probably pretty peeved, but it doesn't mean you are entitled to free money and a shot at the top too.
That neighbour is City.
Juve bounced back pretty quickly, and these scum bags have built up a “brand” on the back of winning stuff based on their alleged cheating, so they’ll still make enough money to come back strong. This is why they need to be put into non league football, 14 years of unfairly gained advantaged can’t be undone with just one demotion. Not to mention I hope every team that lost out on a title, top 4 and survival in the league, sues them for the billions of damages they’ve caused them.
Lord Panick......my god
Long long way
Nobody is paying 10k an hour. Absolute nonsense
Edit if true is this included in FFP?
Don't Pannick, Mr Mainwaring! They don't like it up 'em!
If City did get relegated then whats the chances of signing haaland like ronaldo from barca to madrid? Its much more likely he replaced benzema but would only have spent 6 months in the pl.
Ronaldo went from Barca to Madrid?
Think he meant Figo.
Ah, makes sense