City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches | Hearing begins 16th September 2024

Dave Smith said:
People have been saying for years that City won't be punished because 'UAE is so powerful/UK Govt will get down on their knees and swallow whatever UAE put in front of them'.

However, the problem is that everything we've seen does not support this - from a PL perspective. If this was the case, then this whole situation wouldn't have got here. The PL could've easily have said 'nothing to see' after the the UEFA case. For me, the question isn't whether City get a serious PL punishment. As the structure of the PL means that a serious punishment is required to keep the product 'real'. Rather it is how the EFL deal with them as there structure and profile means that they can be influenced more easily by UAE money or UK Govt pressure.

My stance has always been City get relegated as it benefits the PL. But the unknown is if the EFL will send them to the Champo or League Two/National League. The former provides a speed bump the latter a silver bullet, that for me is the question and will determine how much pressure the UK/UAE govt can apply.


Which City fans do you talk to? Online for sure they're like this. However, my Coty friends admit that they may be fecked and it'll be back to 'little City' for them if what has been 'hacked' is true and can be upheld.
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There’s a whole range of responses to it amongst the city fans I know, but hardly any of them seem bothered in the slightest. They have a very strange, cultish fan base.

One guy in particular doesn’t see why it’s a problem, and endlessly compares it to United becoming rich in the 80s/90s and buying all the best players, what’s the difference? This defence seems to be the rules aren't fair so it doesn’t matter that they broke them.

There’s also plenty who are of the opinion that it’s been a great ride and no punishment can take their memories of the last 15 years away.

I really hope they end up in the national league.
 
NLunited said:
A lot is at stake here. I just hope the PL realizes the sporting integrity of the PL needs to be fixed. If Cheaty get off lightly, I‘m not sure I‘ll bother watching the PL next season.
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I think a lot of people are in the same boat.

At least when United were dominating it didn't affect viewing figures because most oppo fans hate United and were desperate for anyone to beat United to the title. But with City very few give a feck about them one way or the other. Even becoming implicated in the biggest cheating scandal in English football history hasn't did much to move the needle for most football fans.
 
I can't see how they don't get the book thrown at them.

People often forget that the Premier League is just a group of the 20 clubs not some separate organisation like the FA/UEFA.

Is there literally any reason for any of those clubs to not want to feck them off into oblivion?

All of the major clubs in the league will want rid of them for one reason or another I suspect.
 
Berbaclass said:
I can't see how they don't get the book thrown at them.

People often forget that the Premier League is just a group of the 20 clubs not some separate organisation like the FA/UEFA.

Is there literally any reason for any of those clubs to not want to feck them off into oblivion?

All of the major clubs in the league will want rid of them for one reason or another I suspect.
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The counts will be heard by a three-person independent commission
 
NLunited said:
A lot is at stake here. I just hope the PL realizes the sporting integrity of the PL needs to be fixed. If Cheaty get off lightly, I‘m not sure I‘ll bother watching the PL next season.
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It’s difficult to see how PL can avvoid relegating City as part of the consequences, given the punishments Everton and Nottingham Forest got for a minor fraction if the offences.
 
apparently they’ve sat guardiola by the window so the sunlight bounces off his head and into the eyes of the judge.
 
Grande said:
It’s difficult to see how PL can avvoid relegating City as part of the consequences, given the punishments Everton and Nottingham Forest got for a minor fraction if the offences.
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Can the Premier League even relegate them?

They can effectively relegate them by ejecting them from the Premier League, but they surely can't force the Football League to actually accept them into the Championship, given the reason for their ejection will be a decade of cheating.

It's actually part of the reason I can't see anything significant happening. Why would any of the other league organisations take them on?

Being found guilty of it all should effectively end the club.
 
Berbaclass said:
They should just let ChatGPT decide. Let the machines deal with them.
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I asked ChatGPT and it reckons they'll probably get away with most of it.

If I had to make a best guess, I'd lean toward no—Manchester City will likely avoid a full guilty verdict, as they have a strong legal defense and past success in similar cases (like with UEFA). However, some minor infractions or a partial finding of guilt could still be possible.
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Alex99 said:
Can the Premier League even relegate them?

They can effectively relegate them by ejecting them from the Premier League, but they surely can't force the Football League to actually accept them into the Championship, given the reason for their ejection will be a decade of cheating.

It's actually part of the reason I can't see anything significant happening. Why would any of the other league organisations take them on?

Being found guilty of it all should effectively end the club.
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I think if they relegate them through a points deduction then surely the EFL can't do anything about it?
 
Bluemoon :lol:
When this is all over and all the smoke has cleared, Masters & the red shirts will have to look us in the eyes. It will be like ‘Battle of the Bastards’ in Game of Thrones where Ramsey Bolton comes face to face with Jon Snow.
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They still think they are the good guys...
 
Berbaclass said:
I think if they relegate them through a points deduction then surely the EFL can't do anything about it?
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The problems with deducting them points within one season is that it is the same as them avoiding punishment.

For starters, you're genuinely looking at having to give them a 70+ point deduction to guarantee relegation. If they are given that points deduction, at worst they're facing one season out of the PL and two out of the CL, but they'll obviously just concentrate on the CL and the cups and could well not be out of Europe at all.
 
Dave Smith said:
People have been saying for years that City won't be punished because 'UAE is so powerful/UK Govt will get down on their knees and swallow whatever UAE put in front of them'.

However, the problem is that everything we've seen does not support this - from a PL perspective. If this was the case, then this whole situation wouldn't have got here. The PL could've easily have said 'nothing to see' after the the UEFA case. For me, the question isn't whether City get a serious PL punishment. As the structure of the PL means that a serious punishment is required to keep the product 'real'. Rather it is how the EFL deal with them as there structure and profile means that they can be influenced more easily by UAE money or UK Govt pressure.

My stance has always been City get relegated as it benefits the PL. But the unknown is if the EFL will send them to the Champo or League Two/National League. The former provides a speed bump the latter a silver bullet, that for me is the question and will determine how much pressure the UK/UAE govt can apply.


Which City fans do you talk to? Online for sure they're like this. However, my Coty friends admit that they may be fecked and it'll be back to 'little City' for them if what has been 'hacked' is true and can be upheld.
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I’ve not followed this as much as I probably should do, but is the hacked evidence not going to cause the same issues it caused UEFA in that it’ll be struck out at some level of appeal in the future? I just can’t envision a resolution that is built on legally inadmissible evidence?
 
BuzzKillington said:
I’ve not followed this as much as I probably should do, but is the hacked evidence not going to cause the same issues it caused UEFA in that it’ll be struck out at some level of appeal in the future? I just can’t envision a resolution that is built on legally inadmissible evidence?
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I dont think it is legally inadmissable, it was only struck off by UEFA because it was time barred
 
Berbaclass said:
Bluemoon :lol:

When this is all over and all the smoke has cleared, Masters & the red shirts will have to look us in the eyes. It will be like ‘Battle of the Bastards’ in Game of Thrones where Ramsey Bolton comes face to face with Jon Snow.
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Berbaclass said:
They still think they are the good guys...
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Well, when you think about it; Ramsey came from nothing to build a dynasty, loved his dogs, and inspires others to follow his cause. Jon Snow is a silver spooned, personality vacuum who is into incest and does the same move in attack every damn time.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Well, when you think about it; Ramsey came from nothing to build a dynasty, loved his dogs, and inspires others to follow his cause. Jon Snow is a silver spooned, personality vacuum who is into incest and does the same move in attack every damn time.
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Good point.
 
Just pretend for a second, that probably the biggest case against cheating in the history of english football was about to start, but it was against Manchester United.

Don't even pretend there would be such utter silence. I say this understanding that things cant be said or alleged, but it barely even makes a headline on some football sites
 
Interesting snippet from Delaney's article in the Independent
As regards the facts of the dates that CAS ruled on, those time limits do not apply to the Premier League case. The English competition’s investigation also had access to a second tranche of Football Leaks emails that were released after the CAS decision, and essentially represented the documents that Uefa had been asking for throughout their case.
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Alex99 said:
Can the Premier League even relegate them?

They can effectively relegate them by ejecting them from the Premier League, but they surely can't force the Football League to actually accept them into the Championship, given the reason for their ejection will be a decade of cheating.

It's actually part of the reason I can't see anything significant happening. Why would any of the other league organisations take them on?

Being found guilty of it all should effectively end the club.
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They can certainly both give them a 200pts deduction, and expell them outright. What would happen City in relations to the Nationwide would be a result of the deals in place between PL and the EFL, and wether EFL would take some separate action towards City outside of that. Given the cost and scope of the PL’s action against City, I somehow find it hard to believe the EFL would be able to do something similar.

Either way, this shouldn’t be relevant to the PL, who are not responsible for their member clubs’ dealings with other organizations like the EFL. They need to have consequences within their organization to at all stay organized.
 
SER19 said:
Just pretend for a second, that probably the biggest case against cheating in the history of english football was about to start, but it was against Manchester United.

Don't even pretend there would be such utter silence. I say this understanding that things cant be said or alleged, but it barely even makes a headline on some football sites
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For me it's the 35 charges of failure to cooperate with an investigation that is the most damming of all the charges. It's one thing to fudge some rules or financial statements, you can hide behind all sorts of excuses for them. But once you are found out you just have to fess up rather than aggressively hinder an investigation - in any sort of other situation each one would surely be a relegation offence.

I honestly think they should face a lengthy ban from the premier league - as in decades if all 35 charges of failure to cooperate are proven.
 
Also in the Independent
City’s legal justification for refusing to co-operate with the Uefa case was the legal principle that information was “hacked or stolen”. That stance has further enraged some other executives, though. That is because the Premier League is actually nothing more than a members’ club, with the 20 partners merely signing up to its rules. This, in part, is why expulsion is being talked about.
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Mr Pigeon said:
Well, when you think about it; Ramsey came from nothing to build a dynasty, loved his dogs, and inspires others to follow his cause. Jon Snow is a silver spooned, personality vacuum who is into incest and does the same move in attack every damn time.
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Ramsey is himself a silver-spooned numpty. The show made a huge error killing off the ice-cold Roos Boulton, and having Joffrey 2 carry the can.

Not the last mistake they made, either.

Berbaclass said:
Interesting snippet from Delaney's article in the Independent
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Aye, certainly true.
 
buchansleftleg said:
For me it's the 35 charges of failure to cooperate with an investigation that is the most damming of all the charges. It's one thing to fudge some rules or financial statements, you can hide behind all sorts of excuses for them. But once you are found out you just have to fess up rather than aggressively hinder an investigation - in any sort of other situation each one would surely be a relegation offence.

I honestly think they should face a lengthy ban from the premier league - as in decades if all 35 charges of failure to cooperate are proven.
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I think they should get a points deduction that ends with relegation. Their story has been one of cumulative gains, and without the intial cheating that led to mancini, toure, aguero etc, you dont get de bruyne, you dont get guardiola, you simply cant have a decade of dominance that ends with the PL looking like to SPL, without that initial cheating. titles should be stripped, but wont be.
 
buchansleftleg said:
For me it's the 35 charges of failure to cooperate with an investigation that is the most damming of all the charges. It's one thing to fudge some rules or financial statements, you can hide behind all sorts of excuses for them. But once you are found out you just have to fess up rather than aggressively hinder an investigation - in any sort of other situation each one would surely be a relegation offence.

I honestly think they should face a lengthy ban from the premier league - as in decades if all 35 charges of failure to cooperate are proven.
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Yeah, I don't know how this will translate into punishment but the failure to cooperate charges seem both pretty open-and-shut (they simply refused to comply with requests for documents for years) and difficult for the PL to let slide with a slap on the wrist. If the precedent is set that clubs can just refuse to cooperate with any investigation without fear of meaningful sanction, who is going to cooperate in the future?
 
SER19 said:
Just pretend for a second, that probably the biggest case against cheating in the history of english football was about to start, but it was against Manchester United.

Don't even pretend there would be such utter silence. I say this understanding that things cant be said or alleged, but it barely even makes a headline on some football sites
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The leaking roof at OT has practically been a bigger story in the media over the last 2 years.
 
Rojofiam said:
Their fans are hyping up their lawyers on Twitter :lol: :lol: The fecking state of that
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