we can’t - it would result in a 30m accounting loss, limiting our spending power drastically
Giving him away when he cost £70m only 2 years ago is a massive cost towards FFP. If the Club amortized his value over say 5 years, then there is still £42m on the book and the club still has to pay most of the £70m to Real Madrid still.
Or this.
Keep him if no one is interested in him but just don't make him a default first choice anymore. If he loses his starting place he will see the light and move on in January, hopefully by then Collyer is established as a bona fide first team regular. Scout and sign a DM urgently so that we can drop Casemiro if need be and it looks like we will have to.Do you think it’s a better idea to keep him in the squad and let him burn us on the pitch every week? Or just bench him and eat the 18 mil a year in wages? And if we do that, he walks in a few years anyway. At least if we give him away we solve the on the pitch problem and wages. It’s not ideal but nobody with eyes is giving us a decent fee for him at this point in his career.
See above reply.
Giving him away when he cost £70m only 2 years ago is a massive cost towards FFP. If the Club amortized his value over say 5 years, then there is still £42m on the book and the club still has to pay most of the £70m to Real Madrid still.
Or this.
Thats why everyone does the loan with obligation to buy……it allows you to frig the numbers and kick the can down the line and hope you can do something elsewhere to mitigate the issue as well as alllowing for depreciation of another year.we can’t - it would result in a 30m accounting loss, limiting our spending power drastically
To sell him. No way he should start the season with us if we take things seriouslyWhat?
I predicted all season we'd struggle to offload. Can't sell something nobody wants to buy.To sell him. No way he should start the season with us if we take things seriously
If I was a Saudi club I'd want Casemiro, yesI predicted all season we'd struggle to offload. Can't sell something nobody wants to buy.
If you were another club would you want to take him and his ridiculous wages on?
Why? Loads of better, younger, cheaper players available.If I was a Saudi club I'd want Casemiro, yes
Which younger, cheaper players that have star power?Why? Loads of better, younger, cheaper players available.
That just it though, clinging on to the slim hope they buy him because he's a 'name' rather than how good he actually is. If the Saudi league didn't exist there'd be no market for him whatsoever.Which younger, cheaper players that have star power?
Saudi have been after names in this stage of their process, he fits the bill and would still be able to perform at a good level in that league.
That just it though, clinging on to the slim hope they buy him because he's a 'name' rather than how good he actually is. If the Saudi league didn't exist there'd be no market for him whatsoever.
Do they pay £300k a week?MLS?
Do they pay £300k a week?
Hes an immense name, irrespective of passing his peak. They will gain from sheer branding of his status before they consider him as a player.Hasn’t he also been left out of his national team? If so, I am wondering if this is an attractive proposition even for Saudi clubs to pay a transfer fee on top of his wage…
You're not really comparing the pull of Casemiro with Messi's, right?Ain't Messi there?
Case got a cabinet of medals almost as huge too
Hes an immense name, irrespective of passing his peak. They will gain from sheer branding of his status before they consider him as a player.
Saudi why not?I predicted all season we'd struggle to offload. Can't sell something nobody wants to buy.
If you were another club would you want to take him and his ridiculous wages on?
Because if I was them I'd spend my money more wisely, just like when we bought him.Saudi why not?
You're not really comparing the pull of Casemiro with Messi's, right?
He is still a big name, the prefer that oftentimes above qualityBecause if I was them I'd spend my money more wisely, just like when we bought him.
No it wouldn't, you're ignoring the impact of wages and this year's amortization which would be incurred if we were to keep him.we can’t - it would result in a 30m accounting loss, limiting our spending power drastically
Accounting doesn’t work like that. P&L and Cash Flow are different thingsNo it wouldn't, you're ignoring the impact of wages and this year's amortization which would be incurred if we were to keep him.
I'm not referring to cash flow. I'm referring to the accounting costs we would incur this season if we were to keep him vs. the writedown of his book value if we were to get rid of him.Accounting doesn’t work like that. P&L and Cash Flow are different things
I'm not referring to cash flow. I'm referring to the accounting costs we would incur this season if we were to keep him vs. the writedown of his book value if we were to get rid of him.
Let me illustrate. Casemiro was signed for £70m on a four-year contract, earning £350,000 a week. That comes out to about £17.5m per season in wages. Two of the four years of his contract have elapsed, so his book value is currently £35m.
If we were to keep Casemiro, this season we would incur £17.5m in wage expense and £17.5m in amortization (70/4), for a total accounting expenditure of £35m.
If we were to get rid of him, we would write down his book value, representing a hit on our books this season of £35m.
As you can see, his breakeven transfer fee is zero. Any transfer fee, no matter how small, gives us an FFP/PSR accounting profit this season.
Not an accountant but we don't incur an expense on depreciation, amortization is purely a theoretical value. I don't know if there's installments on his transfers from Real but that's purely separate and it's spent money.
My understanding of FFP is that whatever resale fee we perceive would be weighted against his theoretical current value (let's say 35 as you calculated). Selling a player below value count negatively for the FFP formula, wages are a different issue entirely for that part of the calculations as far as I got the explanations. Can't speak for PSL.
I think we do need to get 35m in that example not to get downgraded within the FFP formula, wages notwithstanding.
My apologies if I'm wrong.
All that said we'll have to replace Casemiro if he leaves and while his replacement should be on lesser wages in real terms we're not freeing up 18m in wages, maybe half or a little more of that. And even if we let him leave for 5m there's money to shell for whoever is transferred in his place.
If we keep him two more seasons he'll cost us 35m in wages. If we can get a replacement that over the next two years will cost us less (Player X transfer fee + wages over two years - Casemiro out fee) we're in a better financial position.
Ammortization/depreciation is not a theoritical value. It has no cash flow implications as it will have been spent or committed already but it reflects cost in time, as the asset you acquire does not serve its purpose for only one year. Initial contract duration is used for players because it’s the best measure.
I'm not referring to cash flow. My understanding is that amortization does get counted as part of the player spending / squad cost that we get measured against. Otherwise we could just spend whatever transfer fees we wanted without worrying about the regulations.Not an accountant but we don't incur an expense on depreciation, amortization is purely a theoretical value. I don't know if there's installments on his transfers from Real but that's purely separate and it's spent money.
My understanding of FFP is that whatever resale fee we perceive would be weighted against his theoretical current value (let's say 35 as you calculated). Selling a player below value count negatively for the FFP formula, wages are a different issue entirely for that part of the calculations as far as I got the explanations. Can't speak for PSL.
I think we do need to get 35m in that example not to get downgraded within the FFP formula, wages notwithstanding.
My apologies if I'm wrong.
All that said we'll have to replace Casemiro if he leaves and while his replacement should be on lesser wages in real terms we're not freeing up 18m in wages, maybe half or a little more of that. And even if we let him leave for 5m there's money to shell for whoever is transferred in his place.
If we keep him two more seasons he'll cost us 35m in wages. If we can get a replacement that over the next two years will cost us less (Player X transfer fee + wages over two years - Casemiro out fee) we're in a better financial position.
Feels like we’re a season too late. I think Diaby is the only big transfer so far, right? I’m sure Joselu and Nacho are going/have gone, but I think they were either both frees or nominal figuresSaudi paid for Fabinho who was equally, if not more, washed up and didn't have half the name recognition. We are just plain unlucky.
I'm not referring to cash flow. My understanding is that amortization does get counted as part of the player spending / squad cost that we get measured against. Otherwise we could just spend whatever transfer fees we wanted without worrying about the regulations.
