[Kirk lazarus]

I thought he was good in the first half . This will either be a defining tournament for him , or it won't .

This is only my opinion , I don't mean it sound harsh , cos there's no doubting his creativity . I am just not sure what level he actually is . I know he's good , I want him to be great , I just struggle to put him there .

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Martinez going to predictably feck Portugal over with his setup it seems. I don't think Ronaldo was bad (thought he actually looked sharp today), but he's not a field stretcher anymore so playing 5 defenders and Bernardo on the right means there's only one outlet in Leao. Think they'd be far better off dropping Cancelo or Mendes and putting Neto out on the right as another take on threat.

 

[#07]

 

[NZT-One]

The question in this forum is rarely if we can be prime tiki-taka-Barcelona but if we play a dominant, active way or just counter attacking way of football.

Not sure if I merely misunderstand your point but there is definitely not a question whether we do actually play a dominant way. We don't. It wasn't there last season, it certainly wasn't there this season. But guess you meant the question is whether Bruno would be suited to the different approaches.

He obviously can. I think he could as well flourish, when he has a competent set of defenders and midfielders to build the play around him. Maybe not beeing that much on the focus but provide the team with sparkles when needed.

Well lets face it, your opinion is as good as anybodies on here. But there isn't much to bring more substance to either side - whether he would flourish in a possession heavier style or not. At this point, this isn't as much on Bruno himself, its on us - we haven't played or even attempted to play like that, so we simply don't know. International football isn't the greatest indicator though I agree, he looks a little more measured there as he did for us on a lot of occasions.
I maintain my doubts - possession heavy would mean forcing possession even in areas that are contested by the opponent. So not like Van Gaals United who were happy to play passes from one CB to the other but almost never move the ball in tighter areas. When it gets more tight, Bruno will have to find a way to deal with it, I wouldn't call him nimble or as having quick feet, he definitely doesn't have the upper body strength to make it work this way. Lets see, how things will go down. I guess, ETH certainly isn't the one to take us to some tiki-taka level, so his sort of dominance will probably always be pressing, forcing turnovers and situationally luring opposition teams onto us so we can create artificial counters. I certainly wouldn't say Bruno is unsuited to that.

 

[lost7]

Thought they hated each other

 

[MancunianAngels]

Adore the man.

If he can ever drag us to a title, he gets into legend/icon territory.

 

[Captain Dangernoodle]

Adore the man.

If he can ever drag us to a title, he gets into legend/icon territory.

With all respect to Bruno Fernandes as I love that he plays for us, but he is not a player that can drag us to a title. In my opinion he can definitely be part of a title winning team, but he wont take us there himself. His numbers in the Premier League - if you take away penalties - are average, especially for someone who plays every minute of every game. If he is going to drag us to a title, he needs to seriously improve his goal scoring ability, because it is mediocre for an attacking midfielder. 6 goals in the PL in his last two seasons penalties excluded is not good enough to be carrying any team to a title.

 

[jesperjaap]

Out come the stats again to show how world class he is and people hoping he an inspire us to the title after a good last couple of monthsof the season.

Short term memories, do people forget he was pretty awful for most of the season. An inform Fernandes is obviously a great asset but bar hos first 15months here, Fernandes over a season needs a rest at best and certainly more competition if not performing, hopefullymount can stay fit this year and give that

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

His numbers in the Premier League - if you take away penalties - are average,

I don't mind this, the most important thing is that his chance creation numbers are way up there which is his most important attribute. The forward line really let him down last season - Rasmus did feck all until Christmas, Rashford was very poor and Antony was Antony.

We are a shell of a team without him and if he has better players around him he will obviously benefit. He's been playing next to some utter shit like Fred and McTominay in the last couple seasons and expected to create miracles in midfield.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

His numbers in the Premier League - if you take away penalties - are average,

76 goals & assists in 159 games as an AM in a team only resembling an absolute clusterfeck is average?

Ødegaard average too then is he?
And Foden I guess as he has similar stars despite playing in a free scoring side that absolutely boss 95% of games.

 

[Captain Dangernoodle]

76 goals & assists in 159 games as an AM in a team only resembling an absolute clusterfeck is average?

Ødegaard average too then is he?
And Foden I guess as he has similar stars despite playing in a free scoring side that absolutely boss 95% of games.

Look, I've been a long time reader on this forum and I've noticed you've got some weird fetish for Bruno. It is seriously strange as you have literally never criticised him even once. There is really no point going into a debate with you when it comes to Bruno.

Yes, it's average. Look how many of his goals are penalties
Foden? He scored 19 open play goals in the league. Bruno scored 8 ffs. Give your head a wobble.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Look, I've been a long time reader on this forum and I've noticed you've got some weird fetish for Bruno. It is seriously strange as you have literally never criticised him even once. There is really no point going into a debate with you when it comes to Bruno.

Yes, it's average. Look how many of his goals are penalties
Foden? He scored 19 open play goals in the league. Bruno scored 8 ffs. Give your head a wobble.

I discounted penalties so you don’t even know the fecking stats you’re talking about.

He has better stats per PL game, without pens, than Ødegaard and Foden… so I’ll ask you again without you getting all weird, are they average too?

 

[Kirk lazarus]

I agree that penalties inflate a players output , I also think this tendency to combine goals and assists into 1 stat is misleading .

I'll just use the prem as that is readily available and it forms the bulk of the games. Bruno has 35 goals in 159 games.
He scores once every 4.5 games from open play .

He has 41 assists from 159 games . Which , without getting the calculator out , is an assist every 4 games .

A goal every 4.5 games an assist every 4 games is decent , but is it outstanding ?

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

Look, I've been a long time reader on this forum and I've noticed you've got some weird fetish for Bruno.

Imagine that. A United fan backing one of his own players. Only on the caf would that be seen as a weird fetish.

 

[mu4c_20le]

He has 41 assists from 159 games . Which , without getting the calculator out , is an assist every 4 games .

A goal every 4.5 games an assist every 4 games is decent , but is it outstanding ?

It's very good, considering the shitshow he played with. It's also why its better to look at xA for a more accurate analysis on individual performance. He is still amongst the league's best despite the season.

 

[Captain Dangernoodle]

I discounted penalties so you don’t even know the fecking stats you’re talking about.

He has better stats per PL game, without pens, than Ødegaard and Foden… so I’ll ask you again without you getting all weird, are they average too?

Bruno is doing fine. I don't understand why you're acting like Bruno is doing as good as Foden, though. He literally just finished the season with 19 open play goals and 8 assists.

Ødegaard is literally the conductor in Arsenal's midfield. It's not his job to just create.

Imagine that. A United fan backing one of his own players. Only on the caf would that be seen as a weird fetish.

Mate, I like Bruno. He's one of our best players. I just think this poster has a seriously weird thing for him. It's as if they're Bruno fans and not United fans. I've never seen someone so reluctant to criticise one of our own players, but I imagine it is a psychological thing where it has got to the point where he despises anyone that has anything negative to say about Bruno. It is very clear he has major flaws despite being our best player.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Bruno is doing fine. I don't understand why you're acting like Bruno is doing as good as Foden, though. He literally just finished the season with 19 open play goals and 8 assists.

Ødegaard is literally the conductor in Arsenal's midfield. It's not his job to just create.

There’s a sidestep

Can I ask again, are his stats as a 10 average? considering he averages more none penalty G&A per game than Foden and Ødegaard? What stats do these number 10’s require to have “good” stats in your opinion?

Mate, I like Bruno. He's one of our best players. I just think this poster has a seriously weird thing for him. It's as if they're Bruno fans and not United fans.

Joined on 4th June, acts like he’s been around for years

I’ve been on here since 5 years before Bruno joined United, and I’ve been a ST holder since 2008, so imagine what a fecking stupid thing the bolded is to say.

In the past 10 years, the by far standout players for United have been Zlatan (for his short period), DDG until he went seriously poor in the final years and Bruno.
I support Bruno, because through all the shite, he’s often the only one in the past 4 years that manages to rise above it, winning 3 player of the years in the process, whilst even super talents like Pogba crumble. If you find supporting your best player weird, you don’t know what supporting a club is.

 

[Pickle85]

There’s a sidestep

Can I ask again, are his stats as a 10 average? considering he averages more none penalty G&A per game than Foden and Ødegaard? What stats do these number 10’s require to have “good” stats in your opinion?



Joined on 4th June, acts like he’s been around for years

I’ve been on here since 5 years before Bruno joined United, and I’ve been a ST holder since 2008, so imagine what a fecking stupid thing the bolded is to say.

In the past 10 years, the by far standout players for United have been Zlatan (for his short period), DDG until he went seriously poor in the final years and Bruno.
I support Bruno, because through all the shite, he’s often the only one in the past 4 years that manages to rise above it, winning 3 player of the years in the process, whilst even super talents like Pogba crumble. If you find supporting your best player weird, you don’t know what supporting a club is.

Well said

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

A goal every 4.5 games an assist every 4 games is decent , but is it outstanding ?

You know that means that for every 2nd game he’s either scored a goal, or assisted a goal right?

So yes, it’s outstanding, especially so in a side as shite as ours. Can you disprove this maybe by showing me an AM in the Prem that has a better rate?

We can use Foden & Ødegaard again in your strange stats usage:

Foden: a goal every 3 games, an asisst every 6.3 games.

Ødegaard: a goal every 4.2 games, an assist every 5.3.

So another poster I have to ask, what counts as “not average”? What counts as excellent or outstanding and who are the attacking midfielders putting up these stats?

 

[Kirk lazarus]

It's very good, considering the shitshow he played with. It's also why its better to look at xA for a more accurate analysis on individual performance. He is still amongst the league's best despite the season.

I think playing position plays it's part . What do we think Bruno is for us ? A midfielder , which would make the statistics very impressive , or a hard working part of the attack ? A latter era Rooney type , not the centre forward , sometimes played in midfield , but generally still classed as attacker .

That's the bit I struggle with , latter day Rooney was always classed as a forward , in his last 173 prem games , starting from rvp signing , Safs last year , rooney scored 54 non penalty goals , 1 every 3.2 games , and assisted 38 goals , which is an assist every 4.55 games .

Those stats saw Rooney deemed not good enough as an attacker , but I feel ( you may disagree , it's only my opinion ) that if Rooney was deemed a midfielder , which Bruno is classed as , the stats would be deemed much better .

If you class both as 10,s in the period we are talking , ( even taking into account the fact that Rooney is classed as striker 10 , Bruno midfield 10 ) does the midfield function better with striker 10 or midfielder 10 ?

I guess what I'm saying , for us , I don't think Bruno has played as a midfielder , but the stats are more impressive because he's classed as such .

He definitely does not play the same role as odegard who he is measured against .

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

.

He definitely does not play the same role as odegard who he is measured against .

Amusing argument considering you spent the majority of the post measuring him against Rooney, who he absolutely doesn’t play the same role as.

Prove me wrong though, in 2022-23 here’s Brunos heat map:

Here’s Ødegaard, who appears to spend a feck tonne of time at number 10, for someone who isn’t playing at 10.

Maybe something drastically changed this season? I can’t find heat maps for that.

 

[Bullsick]

There’s a sidestep

Can I ask again, are his stats as a 10 average? considering he averages more none penalty G&A per game than Foden and Ødegaard? What stats do these number 10’s require to have “good” stats in your opinion?



Joined on 4th June, acts like he’s been around for years

I’ve been on here since 5 years before Bruno joined United, and I’ve been a ST holder since 2008, so imagine what a fecking stupid thing the bolded is to say.

In the past 10 years, the by far standout players for United have been Zlatan (for his short period), DDG until he went seriously poor in the final years and Bruno.
I support Bruno, because through all the shite, he’s often the only one in the past 4 years that manages to rise above it, winning 3 player of the years in the process, whilst even super talents like Pogba crumble. If you find supporting your best player weird, you don’t know what supporting a club is.

Mainoo's better than Fernandes......

 

[Witchking]

Look, I've been a long time reader on this forum and I've noticed you've got some weird fetish for Bruno. It is seriously strange as you have literally never criticised him even once. There is really no point going into a debate with you when it comes to Bruno.

Yes, it's average. Look how many of his goals are penalties
Foden? He scored 19 open play goals in the league. Bruno scored 8 ffs. Give your head a wobble.

With such takes and fans, we do not deserve Bruno. Get Foden to play in this B grade United team and you would see the difference what Bruno brings in to this team.

He is the talisman for United. It's his bad luck and United's good luck that he is at Old Trafford.

He is an attacking mid fielder who creates and is the main creator for the team. If course he is going to give the ball away.

Foden plays for a team who is quality all round, a team that keeps the ball 60-70% of the match so when De Bruyne gives the ball away, they win it back

When Bruno gives the ball away, we are sitting ducks due to players like Rashford, Martial not doing enough to win it back and having a porous mid field and defense due to Mctominay, Casemiro, AWB, Dalot, Shaw, Maguire having nightmares at different stages of the matches and seasons.

Bruno is the best player at United and if he played for City, Arsenal or Liverpool, his stats and output would be amazing.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

With such takes and fans, we do not deserve Bruno. Get Foden to play in this B grade United team and you would see the difference what Bruno brings in to this team.

Or just look at the difference between City Foden and England Foden.

Update: 45 minutes later. feck me he’s shite when he’s not in an all star super dominant side. Can’t even imagine how hopeless he’d be in this United side.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Mainoo's better than Fernandes......

Mainoo’s made 25 Premier League appearances, won 11, lost 8. He’s currently averaging 35 passes per match.

He’s class, he’s a massive talent, but calm down pal. Though for what it’s worth, I’d defend him to the hilt also, another that since Christmas has really risen above the shite.

 

[Captain Dangernoodle]

here’s a sidestep

Can I ask again, are his stats as a 10 average? considering he averages more none penalty G&A per game than Foden and Ødegaard? What stats do these number 10’s require to have “good” stats in your opinion?

Why are you saying he averages more non-penalty G+A per game than Foden and Ødegaard when he clearly doesn't? The stats are literally there for everyone to see, so why bother saying shit like that?

I think his stats in the league are fine, nothing special in particular, but for someone with a limited skill set like he does, he should be scoring way more goals to make up for it. Declan Rice and Rodri are scoring as many goals as him from open play ffs.

Joined on 4th June, acts like he’s been around for years

I’ve been on here since 5 years before Bruno joined United, and I’ve been a ST holder since 2008, so imagine what a fecking stupid thing the bolded is to say.

In the past 10 years, the by far standout players for United have been Zlatan (for his short period), DDG until he went seriously poor in the final years and Bruno.
I support Bruno, because through all the shite, he’s often the only one in the past 4 years that manages to rise above it, winning 3 player of the years in the process, whilst even super talents like Pogba crumble. If you find supporting your best player weird, you don’t know what supporting a club is.

In the past 10 years we have been a nothing club who barely compete in Champions League. I don't really care who our best player is if they don't perform throughout the season. Bruno was fantastic from March to the end of the season, but let's not forget some of his performances in the league that had some of his most stalwart defenders on here wanting him benched.

And I have been around for years, like I said I have been reading this forum for many years.

Pogba was played as a deep-lying playmaker for the majority of his team here in a double-pivot and yet has similar stats to Bruno in three of his seasons here. His talent was wasted here, but to suggest he "crumbled" is hilarious.

 

[Captain Dangernoodle]

Or just look at the difference between City Foden and England Foden.

Update: 45 minutes later. feck me he’s shite when he’s not in an all star super dominant side. Can’t even imagine how hopeless he’d be in this United side.

Great argument. Look at Bellingham for England. What a shit player!

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Great argument. Look at Bellingham for England. What a shit player!

The argument is that it’s harder to play for a lesser side than it is for a dominant one.

Bizarre that needed explaining.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Why are you saying he averages more non-penalty G+A per game than Foden and Ødegaard when he clearly doesn't? The stats are literally there for everyone to see, so why bother saying shit like that?

feck me you’re doing some dancing around what was a fairly simply question to your declaration that Brunos (and therefore Foden & Ødegaards stats) are average.
I mean, just read my orginal post again fella. (See below)

And actually he’s better than Ødegaard so you’re even wrong there, but do please keep laughing. And there’s barely a difference between he and Foden as I said in my first reply to you:

76 goals & assists in 159 games as an AM in a team only resembling an absolute clusterfeck is average?

Ødegaard average too then is he?
And Foden I guess as he has similar stars despite playing in a free scoring side that absolutely boss 95% of games.

Bruno games: 159
Non pen goals: 35
Assists: 41
159 / 76 = 2.09

Foden games: 164
Non pen goals: 54
Assists: 26
164 / 80 = 2.05

Ødegaard games: 122
Non pen goals: 29
Assists: 23
122 / 52 = 2.34

So stop dancing around the original fecking question. You declared his goals and assists as average, yet as I replied, both Ødegaard and Foden have similar stats, despite playing in much better sides (in Foden’s case a treble winning side)… so are they also average?

Or.. what stats do Foden, Ødegaard & Bruno need to get to in order for you to declare their stats “not average”? My personal opinion is that any attacking midfielder like them, averaging a goal or assist almost every other game is doing a cracking job in those statistics. But prove me wrong and show me the AM that have blown these 3 away?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Declan Rice and Rodri are scoring as many goals as him from open play ffs.

Declan Rice has 16 non pen goals in 242 PL games man, what is this stupid shit?

Rodri 21 in 172.

 

[Captain Dangernoodle]

feck me you’re doing some dancing around what was a fairly simply question to your declaration that Brunos (and therefore Foden & Ødegaards stats) are average.
I mean, just read my orginal post again fella. (See below)

And actually he’s better than Ødegaard so you’re even wrong there, but do please keep laughing. And there’s barely a difference between he and Foden as I said in my first reply to you:




Bruno games: 159
Non pen goals: 35
Assists: 41
159 / 76 = 2.09

Foden games: 164
Non pen goals: 54
Assists: 26
164 / 80 = 2.05

Ødegaard games: 122
Non pen goals: 29
Assists: 23
122 / 52 = 2.34

So stop dancing around the original fecking question. You declared his goals and assists as average, yet as I replied, both Ødegaard and Foden have similar stats, despite playing in much better sides (in Foden’s case a treble winning side)… so are they also average?

Or.. what stats do Foden, Ødegaard & Bruno need to get to in order for you to declare their stats “not average”? My personal opinion is that any attacking midfielder like them, averaging a goal or assist almost every other game is doing a cracking job in those statistics. But prove me wrong and show me the AM that have blown these 3 away?

Declan Rice has 16 non pen goals in 242 PL games man, what is this stupid shit?

Rodri 21 in 172.

Why do you keep listing the players' entire career stats? As if what they did 5 years ago is relevant now.

Rice scored 7 open play goals and 8 assists as a defensive midfielder.

Rodri scored 8 open play goals and 9 assists.

It's hilarious how upset you're getting whenever any poster criticise Bruno for anything. Why is this so personal for you? The lengths you're willing to go to discredit any other player if they're performing better than Bruno is seriously bizarre.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Why do you keep listing the players' entire career stats? As if what they did 5 years ago is relevant now.

Rice scored 7 open play goals and 8 assists as a defensive midfielder.

Rodri scored 8 open play goals and 9 assists.

It's hilarious how upset you're getting whenever any poster criticise Bruno for anything. Why is this so personal for you? The lengths you're willing to go to discredit any other player if they're performing better than Bruno is seriously bizarre.

ah so you sidestepped again?

Nice.

I list a Premier League career because comparing Kevin Phillips with Alan Shearer or Eric Cantona after one good season would be moronic.

Regarding Rice, he had exactly the same stats this season for non penalty G&A as Ødegaard (16 vs 16), so if we’re saying Bruno is average because of Rice & Rodri, what does that make the Norwegian when a guy in his own well performing team playing much much deeper than him is matching him?

Ødegaard in a well functioning side, playing as an AM managed 6 non penalty PL goals, and 10 assists. Bruno in our shit team managed to match those goals (6) and had 8 assists.

 

[Rossa]

ah so you sidestepped again?

Nice.

I list a Premier League career because comparing Kevin Phillips with Alan Shearer or Eric Cantona after one good season would be moronic.

Regarding Rice, he had exactly the same stats this season for non penalty G&A as Ødegaard (16 vs 16), so if we’re saying Bruno is average because of Rice & Rodri, what does that make the Norwegian when a guy in his own well performing team playing much much deeper than him is matching him?

Ødegaard in a well functioning side, playing as an AM managed 6 non penalty PL goals, and 10 assists. Bruno in our shit team managed to match those goals (6) and had 8 assists.

You are of course right, but some people don’t care for the opportunity to think again and admit being wrong. Also, clearly one needs to look further than one season.

 

[roonster09]

Imagine that. A United fan backing one of his own players. Only on the caf would that be seen as a weird fetish.

Didn't recognise your friend?

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

Didn't recognise your friend?

Eh?

 

[roonster09]

Eh?

Zaafi

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

Zaafi

Surely he's not set up a 3rd account has he? I'm no IT expert but if that's the case then can't the mods block his IP address or something?

 

[dan1509]

Once again awful today in the knockout game against Slovenia, and has been for the entire Euro.

Just isn't a big game player and is incapable of playing anything other than counter attacking football. Its absolutely wild that he is demanding a pay rise and that he has fooled so many on here into thinking he is a world class talent.

Cant wait to see the new made up stat that proves he was incredible today. The "most involvements in shots during open" was pretty funny.

 

[Eplel]

Once again awful today in the knockout game against Slovenia, and has been for the entire Euro.

Just isn't a big game player and is incapable of playing anything other than counter attacking football. Its absolutely wild that he is demanding a pay rise and that he has fooled so many on here into thinking he is a world class talent.

Cant wait to see the new made up stat that proves he was incredible today. The "most involvements in shots during open" was pretty funny.

He's been awful for the entire Euro? That's news to me.

Can you break that down per game please? Cause I really think you pulled this out of your hat.

 

[Dyslexic Untied]

I thought he just looked tired yesterday. Which is natural given that he plays every game all year round.