He is so hopelessly ignorant. He understands f*** all.
7 years ago we told you this. Ffs.
As the original shorter video seems to have been taken down - too embarassing? This could be more embarrassing
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Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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He is so hopelessly ignorant. He understands f*** all.
7 years ago we told you this. Ffs.
As the original shorter video seems to have been taken down - too embarassing? This could be more embarrassing
Now is like the period after the date when a cult leader said the world will end. It is becoming harder and harder to hide truth, even from the zealots.Jim McMahon. Labour's shadow environment secretary on Sky News.
The first 2m45s is about Brexit.
You can laugh and cry about the Brexiters in Clacton who have been brainwashed and will never change.
This is far more depressing. This is what part of the country will be hoping for and to get the Tories out of power for this.
A few gems - shouldn't need going over yet again and again and again and again and again and explaining but...
Quotes:
We can remove barriers to trade
It was for the government to make sure that Brexit could be made to work.
Britain hasn't made the progress it should have made and we want to make brexit work for working people.
He (Starmer) says the agreement is a framework and a starting point.
Veterinary agreements - the reason why farmers in Northern Ireland struggle to trade with Great Britain is because the veterinary agreement isn't in place
Businesses want simplicity and for that red tape to be taken away.
Jesus wept.
I just saw that on Twitter and came here to post it
Every time I see one of these it cracks me up for about 10 seconds, and then I remember how much these individuals have fecked the country.
Brexit has been a catastrophically stupid act of self harm (I described it as such in front of the BBC Look North cameras the day after the referendum in 2016 and that opinion has only intensified over time), and has resulted in us imposing completely unncecessary economic sanctions on ourselves.
However, I fully understand why Labour cannot say that at this moment in time, pledge for England, Scotland and Wales to rejoin the single market, talking about rejoining the EU etc.
That will basically be an electoral gift (or at least welcome respite) for the Tories, and will result in Brexit once again being a major issue at the next GE, which would terrible for Labour.
When general (or Scottish) elections are heavily dominated by 'emotive', divisive constitutional issues, namely Brexit and Scottish independence, Labour are well and truly f*cked, as highlighted by the 60 seats they lost in Northern England, the Midlands and Wales, and 40 seats that they lost in Scotland.
The second largest party in Westminster, that wants to become the largest party and enter government, has to 'play politics' and think strategically - there's no way around that. It's significantly easier for smaller parties that have absolutely no prospect of forming / leading Westminster governments, and includes the SNP MPs in Westminster who are separate the the governing MSPs in Hoylrood, to 'remain' pure, because ultimately there's a strong chance that without holding the levers of power they will never be judged against their comments.
It's like when people say that Caroline Lucas is the 'voice of reason' in Westminster. While I have a lot of respect for her (apart from when during the Brexit chaos in 2019 she said that a cabinet only consisting of white women was required), and think that she is excellent at succintly highlighting where the government are failing, ultimately she has one of the easiest jobs out of any MP in parliament. As she will always remain an opposition MP, that will never even be part of a confidence and supply deal, let alone a coalition, let alone being a government minister with responsibility over a departmental budget, she can say exactly what she wants, promise and pledge exactly what she wants, without ever having to worry about being held to account for delivering those promises, balancing costs, her record being judged etc. It's also of course far easier for politicians to cultivate and maintain a loyal fanbase if they never enter, or especially never come close to entering, government. If the Tories had won a majority in 2010, Clegg would have remained incredibly popular for at least quite a while longer.
However, I fully understand why Labour cannot say that at this moment in time, pledge for England, Scotland and Wales to rejoin the single market, talking about rejoining the EU etc.
That will basically be an electoral gift (or at least welcome respite) for the Tories, and will result in Brexit once again being a major issue at the next GE, which would terrible for Labour.
When general (or Scottish) elections are heavily dominated by 'emotive', divisive constitutional issues, namely Brexit and Scottish independence, Labour are well and truly f*cked, as highlighted by the 60 seats they lost in Northern England, the Midlands and Wales, and 40 seats that they lost in Scotland.
The second largest party in Westminster, that wants to become the largest party and enter government, has to 'play politics' and think strategically - there's no way around that. It's significantly easier for smaller parties that have absolutely no prospect of forming / leading Westminster governments, and includes the SNP MPs in Westminster who are separate the the governing MSPs in Hoylrood, to 'remain' pure, because ultimately there's a strong chance that without holding the levers of power they will never be judged against their comments.
It's like when people say that Caroline Lucas is the 'voice of reason' in Westminster. While I have a lot of respect for her (apart from when during the Brexit chaos in 2019 she said that a cabinet only consisting of white women was required), and think that she is excellent at succintly highlighting where the government are failing, ultimately she has one of the easiest jobs out of any MP in parliament. As she will always remain an opposition MP, that will never even be part of a confidence and supply deal, let alone a coalition, let alone being a government minister with responsibility over a departmental budget, she can say exactly what she wants, promise and pledge exactly what she wants, without ever having to worry about being held to account for delivering those promises, balancing costs, her record being judged etc. It's also of course far easier for politicians to cultivate and maintain a loyal fanbase if they never enter, or especially never come close to entering, government. If the Tories had won a majority in 2010, Clegg would have remained incredibly popular for at least quite a while longer.
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The problem with Starmer is that he has learnt absolutely nothing since he was appointed by Corbyn in September 2016 as shadow Brexit whatever.
A rough timetable of Labour's position on Brexit;
Corbyn (anti-EU and let's not pretend otherwise) makes half-hearted speeches with Thornberry in tow before the referendum.
Corbyn appoints Starmer (inexperienced wet behind the ears)
Corbyn says Starmer had a season-ticket to Brussels - Barnier mentions one meeting with Starmer.
Corbyn and Starmer rush to trigger Article 50 with the Tories despite no plan behind put forward.
Lots of abstaining, loads of incoherent rubbish about Swiss deals and so forth, in out shake it all about where not one single person in the HoC had the first idea of what was to come and what Brexit actually meant.
Deadline is extended past the two years to get the deal over the line. Bearing in mind that the EU were throughly sick of the Uk's approach and the time wasting.
Johnson finally agrees to something which MPs's voted for and accepted.
Labour propose some kind of unspecified referendum if they get in and renegotiate the deal if they get in. This is probably one of the more laughable suggestions. the Eu were really in need of another session of renegotiating unicorns and cake.
British people and the EU are throughly sick of the whole thing. They vote for Johnson hoping that would be the end of it. Unfortunately for them it is only the start.
Starmer sets his 6 tests, Starmer wants the same benefits, inside and outside of the EU. He gets his chinese takeaway menu out to decide which unicorn he would like.
To cut out all the bits in between, Starmer still doesn't understand about the EU, he doesn't understand about Custom's Unions, he doesn't understand about the Single Market and doesn't understand what the implications of Brexit are.
The Starmer you see today is still the same wet behind the ears naïve innocent whom Corbyn appointed 7 years ago. He's still got his takeaway menu in his hand and still thinks he can have the same benefits in and out of the EU.
He even got hoodwinked by the DUP regarding the ability of NI to trade with GB. He still believes it.
He thinks he's going to be able to reopen negotiations with the EU.
How can anyone be this out of touch?
The other point still being missed is. No it's obvious the UK cannot rejoin the CU or the SM or the EU for many years to come and that's if the EU ever let them back in.
The first step towards that though is to stop pulling further away.
That means what is Starmer doing about the Freeports (disastrous move for the UK - probably lose even more access to the SM and possibly the trade agreement) leaving the ECHR/Rwanda policy (ditto); Bonfire of EU regulations (ditto).
Then he's going to rely on people being highly trained and highly paid in the skills sector to cover the jobs that are no longer being done by the EU workers who the Uk have told they're not welcome.
So when he's trained the highly skilled cleaners, waiters, fruit pickers, and all the other menial jobs the British don't want to do and paying them £100k per year. - what's his next brilliant idea after the manufacturing industry in the UK has completely collapsed? If only he had some kind of vision.
He was probably thinking of wine.
Do you enjoy making things up about people that you don’t know? All of that is invention and fantasy.
Which part of that is invention? I can find it all if I could be bothered.
What I really want to know is what is the vision of Starmer for the UK from now on. Because according to his spokesman, video above, he has no clue.
I probably wouldn't bother to be honest.
This is great comedy. People having no idea. The most knowledgeable person being Gina Miller.
The Tory guy is unbelievably thick.
The Labour guy looked lost.
Iain Dale was surprised Vauxhall now owned Fiat, nearly spat out my coffee.
The lack of knowledge is astounding.
If I was asked to guess the percentage, I would have put it at higher than 9%. Just shows how loud that vocal minority is.
I saw an article in an other british paper that also seemed to not undertand what Stellantis was. But Vauxhall owning Fiat is a new low.
I saw an article in an other british paper that also seemed to not undertand what Stellantis was. But Vauxhall owning Fiat is a new low.
Bet he didn't know Vauxhall were taking over by General Motors nearly 100 years ago in 1925 either. We're British don't you know!
I'm dying to know what they all expect the EU to do. Rub their hands with glee as the last remnants of the British motor industry is transferred to mainland Europe?
That's not the key point Paul. Vauxhall is owned by PSA(Peugeot Family) who is the second largest shareholder of an holding company named Stellantis which has for largest shareholder Exor, the owners of Fiat.
Ian Dale has no business being aired on LBC or anywhere supposed to inform people.
Yes I know that. Also some of the brands of the group are Dodge Chrysler Alfa Romeo, Maserati etc.
My sarcasm doesn't always come across.
Iain Dale is just the presenter as far as I know. Think he was a Brexiteer.
I don't think he is. Starmer knows the moment has passed for everyone, the BREXIT egg has been broken, the yoke spilled, there is no going back.
He is wisely kicking it into the long grass, because he knows there is no going back, so does everyone else in the UK and in the EU, there is only the future. Starmer knows he will win not one single solitary extra vote, by wringing his hands and saying "were doomed, doomed I tell yer".
He has to say we look to the future, Brexit has been done with and we have to now make the best of it, he is accepting reality.
He also, most importantly, recognises that Sunak (a former Brexiteer) also recognises the need to find a way forward with our neighbors, hence the plan to revoke European law in many areas within the UK has been shelved, probably for good. Just as Starmer is effectively trying to win back some if not all of his red wall, Sunak is trying to save his 'blue wall' by trying to allay remainer concerns.
The fallout from Brexit will still play a role in the next GE.... "but not in the way we know it Jim".
The moment has not passed though. Yes the UK has left the EU, it's left the CU and the SM. There's no going back in the near future as I've said countless times on here.
But... and the big but is what happens next. If Starmer gets in, what happens next. there are so many lists of pledges and plans which have been conveniently forgotten
I presume this is Starmer's current plan:
1. Sort out the Northern Ireland Protocol;
2. Tear down unnecessary trade barriers;
3. Support our world leading services and scientists;
4. Keep Britain safe;
5. Invest in Britain.
1. He doesn't seem to have noticed that the Windsor Framework has been agreed and that the DUP were lying about NI not being able to trade with GB- just a couple of days ago in the video posted above his spokesman seemed unaware.
2. Unnecessary trade barriers are caused by not being in the SM and CU. If you're not in the same CU the red tape is not going to stop. In the video about Vauxhall he starts talking as if the Uk can still produce cars the same way as before they left the EU. You can't now. Someone should tell him.
The other three parts of the plan are so vague and meaningless.
So is he going to undo all the harm the Tories have done and are still going to do before they leave office (if they leave office) or will this upset the Brexiters?
So as the economy and industry, manufacturing and services continue to decline over the coming years, at what point does he say, "actually I can't make Brexit work"
Even now Farage knows Brexit is a disaster, Johnson knows Brexit is a disaster, most of the country knows Brexit is a disaster; the rest of the world knows Brexit is a disaster.
But good old Starmer is going to plod on, make brexit work , pull further away from the EU and delay for many more years the start of the way back, which will have to come at some point.
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ted-status-in-japan-despite-liz-truss-promise
British foods awaiting protected status in Japan despite Liz Truss promise
Exclusive: three years after Truss boasted of securing status in trade deal, products such as Cornish pasties can still be copied
British foods awaiting protected status in Japan despite Liz Truss promise
Exclusive: three years after Truss boasted of securing status in trade deal, products such as Cornish pasties can still be copied
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ted-status-in-japan-despite-liz-truss-promise
British foods awaiting protected status in Japan despite Liz Truss promise
Exclusive: three years after Truss boasted of securing status in trade deal, products such as Cornish pasties can still be copied
Factories springing up all over Japan just to produce Cornish Pasties.
Jesus fecking Christ. There you go again. Posting your thoughts as actual facts. There IS a going back. The moment hasn't passed. We have a route back in. How.do you make it that we don't?;
The big problem is if we do go begging and admit we made a mistake, then if we get back In it will be on the EU's terms. It's highly fecking unlikely we could keep the pound, and we would be bent over during negotiations so ggg
The sad thing is we had our cake and we're eating it. No other country had their own currency, not did anyone else have the control we had. We dictated to Europe and they tolerated us because of how powerful and influential we are.
Now we have left and want back in they are going to milk it as much as they can. Rightly so too!
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...u-have-dropped-by-more-than-half-since-brexit
UK fruit exports to EU have dropped by more than half since Brexit
Exports of fruit fell from £248.5m in year to March 2021 to £113.8m in 12 months to March 2023
Nothing to do with Brexit, must be the weather, yes that's it.
In any case when Starmer's renegotiated the Oven Ready Deal - otherwise known as the Withdrawal Agreement, those Europeans won't ask for any documentation or checks, they'll be no queues and we'll all live happily ever after in Unicorn Land.
UK fruit exports to EU have dropped by more than half since Brexit
Exports of fruit fell from £248.5m in year to March 2021 to £113.8m in 12 months to March 2023
Nothing to do with Brexit, must be the weather, yes that's it.
In any case when Starmer's renegotiated the Oven Ready Deal - otherwise known as the Withdrawal Agreement, those Europeans won't ask for any documentation or checks, they'll be no queues and we'll all live happily ever after in Unicorn Land.
No, its not making Brexit work, that Starmer's after, its making the aftermath of Brexit work. He has to do that, no Party Leader is going to win the next election saying, "lets pretend we cannot exist, that we are all going to hell in a hand cart, lets all go and jump into the sea. etc" whatever the aftermath of Brexit the UK and the world has to go on and anyone wanting to lead the country has to acknowledge that fact and be as upbeat as possible. With remainers still crying in their milk he is doing the best thing possible and effectively kicking into the long grass, with vague promises along the lines of "I'll take at look at that again later".
I don't, its posters on here that make it sound like we should all go and cut our throats!
That was one of the problems going forward, if we really did want to be part of the EU we should have been fully in with the Euro, which we were not, for all sorts of reasons and we had lots of 'bye's on specific issues, this is what remainers should have made more of. Most of the people I know who voted for Brexit did not consider the economic advantages, because lots of them did not perceive they had any special economic advantages that worked for them, or special privileges.
As for going back, that is debatable on a number of levels, as you say joining the Euro will be compulsory, special dispensations will not exist, sovereignty, now in truth, will be totally gone.
His only objective is to become PM. It's completely obvious that he has no idea at all what is involved. Until he understands what has happened the Uk is completely and utterly ****ed between him and the Tories
You can't make the aftermath of Brexit work. It's not possible. Any one with an ounce of intelligence knew that Brexit or the aftermath could never ever work, it doesn't matter who's running the country. That's why the country was warned before the referendum but not enough people took any notice
Farage says the Tories have done it wrong, Starmer says they've done it wrong.
There is only one Brexit and you've got it.
How you get out of it is another matter but keep pretending or thinking it's going to work helps nobody.
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Saying that Labour are as bad as the Tory lot because they will have to deal with the reality of Brexit, and find a way to make it work, is ignoring the fact that Labour aren't the idiots that pushed for Brexit in the first place.
I can tell you not to fill the house we share with mountains of dogshit. You still go and buy the dogshit. No matter what, we all have to deal with the dogshit. An election comes up for everyone else in the house to decide who will be responsible for the house from now on. Nobody is going to say "Well, don't vote for Pidgy because he says we'll need to deal with the dogshit somehow. Let's vote again for rimaldo, he did great work bringing all those wheelbarrows of dogshit in here and cackling mischievously as he shoved the silverware in his fat elitist pockets."
I can tell you not to fill the house we share with mountains of dogshit. You still go and buy the dogshit. No matter what, we all have to deal with the dogshit. An election comes up for everyone else in the house to decide who will be responsible for the house from now on. Nobody is going to say "Well, don't vote for Pidgy because he says we'll need to deal with the dogshit somehow. Let's vote again for rimaldo, he did great work bringing all those wheelbarrows of dogshit in here and cackling mischievously as he shoved the silverware in his fat elitist pockets."
I'll reply to your other reply.
Nobody says you should cut your throats. You should try to find a way back.
If you don't want to find a way back then you have had a small taster of what the future holds, the next few years are going to be worse.
You can't reverse history, you're out. You now have another decision. Pretend everything's going to be fine. Your Brexit friends, will they be happy with a worsening economy? or try to find a way back.
So because France and Germany and all the other countries have the Euro, they've lost their sovereignty? It's still the same nonsense; All the Brexit nonsense. It hasn't stopped it's still going on. When will it stop? How far down does the UK have to go?
I believe that Starmer (along with most of his front bench) does want to find a way back (or at least start on that path). But Labour is traumatised by losing the red wall marginal seats in 2019, and, as those seats are still Brexit supporting and the UK electoral results are decided by such marginals, Labour has to at least pretend to accommodate the knuckle draggers in order not to give the Tory/Ukip press ammo and jeopardise its chances.
Good post.I understand that reasoning. But - you can go along with that reasoning until the point that the Red Wall Brexiters change their mind and say 'oh yes, we've made a mistake, silly us' - don't see that happening.
Then you listen to Starmer talk, which we have done for years , no change at all, he thinks he can renegotiate the Withdrawal agreement and the Trade Agreement and remove the barriers which are not going away while the UK stays outside the CU and SM. When he acknowledges and understands those problems then he may command more respect.
Then if he is elected next year, he's going to be in charge when the full effect of Brexit starts to happen. The Tory/UKIP press are going to eat him alive.
So cut out the middle man and get straight to the point. There's nothing to lose because either way he's going to get roasted.
It's me just hoping there's one politician in Britain who has got the character and knowledge to call Brexit out for what it is.
The other point is that he's expecting other people to vote for him while saying he's going to renegotiate brexit, make it work and all the other nonsense.
Treating vast numbers of the British electorate as gullible idiots, like the Red Wallers, is insulting.
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To be fair the Greens, Lib Dems and SNP (although for purely selfish reasons on their part) have been calling it out. Labour as mentioned above seem to be pandering to these red wall voters both on Brexit and migration.
Yes but they have no power in Westminster at the moment.
Only the red wall voters matter to Labour.
Scots, Remainers throughout the whole country who could vote for Labour if they weren't treated as fools. Or is it Stevenage woman who voted for Brexit? Really Labour are just appealing to Brexit voters, the same as the Tories.
What a surprise it would be if those who know Brexit will never work did actually vote for the other parties instead of Labour or the Tories.
Lord Buckethead seems a more sensible option at the moment.
Then we had all better jump in the sea with a stone collar on?
Really Paul you know better than that, whatever mistakes this country makes and there have been plenty, (e.g. even that stalwart of the left Tony Benn warned against joining the common market!!) It will find a way and has been doing so for thousands of years, or at least since 1066. 'Out of the frying pan into the fire' quite often, but then putting the fire out, sometimes more by good luck than good judgement, then off to make other mistakes!
My predictions are; though most people in the UK don't know it yet, or even recognized its potential yet, immigration will be the answer for the future, once the illegality of people trafficking is smashed (cue the Home Secretary) and a proper system is devised that works effectively. Things will get sorted on the island of Ireland, as much for their own sake as anything to do the rest of the UK, the change in voting we have seen might be the tip of the final 'iceberg' to be navigated in Ireland, who knows future historians may be writing about how ...Brexit was the cataylst for the final unification of Eire.
Life has to go on and it will.
It was self-destructive idiocy of epic proportions. The only solution is to beg to rejoin ASAP.
Of course life will go on , but why do you want to be poorer? Brexit was without doubt the most calamitous mistake in our lifetimes. And it's not easy to rectify. There's only one way. Can't think of a more catastrophic mistake in history. Maybe ignoring Hitler in the 30s - Daily Mail liked Hitler too.
I see you've also bought into the 'illegal immigration and trafficking' nonsense from Braverman. Even Labour have joined in. The brainwashing media still works in the UK. The people in boats is a tiny tiny percentage of the immigration figures and was almost non-existent before Brexit. Illegal immigration is from visa overstayers not refugees and asylum seekers. Most of the trafficking could be stopped if the Uk had a proper safe route system; they won't do it because they want to blame the refugees.
PS Braverman now seems to be blaming overseas students instead
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In terms of ever getting a proper system in place that would benefit both immigrants as well as the country as a whole, getting rid of this illegal entry system is not a nonsense, its essential. No forward (post Brexit) looking safe and legal system can be entered into with the support of the mass population until this 'dragon is slayed'. Braverman and the Tories know this and are working the strings to their advantage. Starmer has to be very careful on this matter.
He has to circumvent Tory propaganda, until the Dragon is slain, or he is elected PM. Then start to build a consensus on immigration to last the next fifty years.
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While there is money to be made out of people trafficking, you are never going to stop it. Just like the drug trade. No amount of legislation or trying to frighten people not to want to try. The people traffickers will always find a way to refine their trade.
And more importantly satisfy the demand.
To them, it is just business. Identify the demand and find a way to satisfy it in a way that keeps the risk to them low.
Starmer and Labour say to Braverman, why haven't you stopped the boats? The boats aren't the problem. The problem is that there's no safe legal route.
Amazingly they pulled out all the stops for Ukranian refugees or for anyone that makes them look good. The propaganda machine who convinced people of Clacton that the Uk are taking all the refugees and other countries should help. Anything to do with Ukraine the the government tells the people they are leading the way. Good publicity. They believe it all.
Refugees and asylum seekers are entitled to make the claim in the country of their choice. The Uk government don't want them. Because they are geographically perched on the edge of Europe they think they should go to other countries.
Understand the immigration figures about to be released will be around 700k (44k of which will be boat people).