Arsenal - 2024/25

TheBigLewandowski said:
This may sound like im a jealous United fan because of their rise to title contenders level recently but i genuienly believe that Arteta is a bang average manager.

He is very lucky to have Edu because almost like Ten Hag, he picks deadwood from his ex club as a copy & paste method of rebuilding his ex club. Zinchenko,Gabriel Jesus & now Sterling.

He is also very lucky to have Pep because he copies & pastes his tactics.

Pep plays almost 4 cbs which allows them to have 3 widely spread CAM &a CEntral cm to provide creativity for Haaland.

Arteta has copied peps back 4, but is playing with inverted forwards so nearly all their creativity has to come from nearly one central area of the pitch with Havertz, Rice & Odegaard which becomes both predictable & also effects their defense if Rice & the cb fullbacks are/is up top as a creative outlet for them.

Honestly, they might scrape a Pl win depending on how much Rodri effects City, but i wouldnt be too surprised if they didnt.

Being set piece specialists can only take you so far, inverted forwards with 4CBs in defense will catch them out. I think Citys creativity trumps Arsenals but we can see when both De Bruyne & Odegaard are back.
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I mean. Almost every manager brings in former players to their new clubs. Great way to establish a culture you want. Moyes did it with Fellaini. Van Gaal with Blind. Ten Haag brought in Martinez and De Ligt. The list goes on and on. That's not some pep copy and pasting. It was literally that Arsenal needed a striker and a LB and city were discarding two decent ones.

As far as playing 4 center backs. I don't understand that one. Zinchenko was the preferred LB for the past two seasons. He's a midfielder. And then htis season, we'll see if Arteta starts Calafiori with Ben white. It hasn't happened yet. And I don't classify Timber as CB even if he's played there.

I don't think he's a pep clone tactically. He's not very experimental and he doesn't rotate for different matchups the way that pep does. I think the way he's most similar to pep is that he's incredibly demanding and lives, breathes, and drinks football.
 
ArtetasHair said:
The poor performances being playing against Spurs (and winning 3 times away in a row first time in 50 years which even Wengers team couldnt do aaginst dire Spurs sides) while missing our entire midifled and without them actually doing anything with the ball then playing 10 men against the most dominant team in Europe for 45 mins, defending.

We also won at Villa playing okay, but I don't remember anyone feeling sorry for us last year when we lost at Villa despite missing countless chances.

Last year the only teams we played defensively against away were City (where you had one shot on target) and United. That's it.

I get your point but "poor performances" have been massively overblown where we had to play park the bus when severely comprised.



@TheBigLewandowski Arteta used CBs as full backs before Pep did (happy to be corrected on this). We also conceded the least amount of goals last year and scored the most depite not having a what you call out and out striker. So not sure how the 4 CBs thing will catch us out regarding creating chances. Yesterday as well it was Timber who made our first goal.

As for him copying Pep, every other manager is also free to do so. This is how football has evolved. Managers taking inspiration with their own imprint. We don't play like City at all.




@croadyman I have never seen AFTV, I feel like opposition fans watch it more than we do. I find them a cringefest.
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Thanks for clearing up the general consensus
 
Mogget said:
Because Newcastle beat us last year using the same "cowardly, negative football" we used at City. I don't remember hearing any of their fans criticising that style of play then so it's a bit rich to be doing it now.
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The mental gymnastics about the cowardly negative football is laughable anyway. It's like the 30+ other games of the season are wiped out because there's tough away games we sometimes change tactics in, never mind the context of games in terms of difficulty, going down to 10 men etc.

Then the stuff about copying Pep etc. Talking about signing ex players to help build the team, no mention of the fact that none are really first choice players any more and that we are already moving on from them.

At least if your having a go, make them make sense.
 
FootballHQ said:
That's one of those decisions as a visiting team that gets waved away if you don't get 30-40k shouting at the ref. See it endlessly, Vardy would've got the foul if that was a home game.

Calafiori also very lucky, that's a standard yellow stopping a counter so to me the ref just didn't want to send another Arsenal player off after all the moaning in the media about the last two reds. That's how a manager can get in a ref's mind pre match.
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It's funny how opposition fans only tend to mention anything that goes for us. What about all the decisions that went against us in the same match?

a lot of posts in here mentioned Calafiori should have got a second yellow (would have been very soft, especially considering his first yellow was soft too) yet Skipp raking his studs on Martinelli's heel which easily could have been red on his own and then committing numerous other fouls won't be mentioned.

Also how come we are the only team to have players sent off (twice) for delaying restarts when no one seems to get booked for it. Yet all you hear is how we have been lucky with ref decisions.


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MalBot said:
It's funny how opposition fans only tend to mention anything that goes for us. What about all the decisions that went against us in the same match?

a lot of posts in here mentioned Calafiori should have got a second yellow (would have been very soft, especially considering his first yellow was soft too) yet Skipp raking his studs on Martinelli's heel which easily could have been red on his own and then committing numerous other fouls won't be mentioned.

Also how come we are the only team to have players sent off (twice) for delaying restarts when no one seems to get booked for it. Yet all you hear is how we have been lucky with ref decisions.


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You're right, Martinelli and Arteta should have been carded for trying to influence the ref.
 
The tackle on Saka was a clear second yellow...it was enough to be in consideration for a straight red. They talk about a questionable second yellow and ignore the brutally obvious one.
 
Some good quality refereeing in champions league, it's a shame that standards are so poor in PL and we will see more of Kavanagh and Oliver blunders throughout the season.
 
Crimson Hunter said:
Top notch performance tonight. Could've easily been 4-0.
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Weird thing was, I think we could have easily scored 4, but as a performance I don't even think it was that great.

A big part of the 2nd half seemed to drift. Not really concerned by that as we seemed content to let PSG have the ball and hit them on the break, but I think there's still another gear to go up, which I suppose is a good thing.
 
GoonerBear said:
Weird thing was, I think we could have easily scored 4, but as a performance I don't even think it was that great.

A big part of the 2nd half seemed to drift. Not really concerned by that as we seemed content to let PSG have the ball and hit them on the break, but I think there's still another gear to go up, which I suppose is a good thing.
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PSG were also particularly shit, after a decent start to the season. Apart from Hakimi, none of them seemed up for it, and the less said about Donnarumma, the better.
 
Donaldo said:
Yep nothing to do with how we played or managed them.
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Yeah of course the way you set up had an effect on their game, obviously. Donnarumma's blunders, Vitinha's unusual technical poorness and other elements were more mishaps of the night rather than Arsenal genius gameplan. Both of those things can coexist. PSG were genuinely shit, and you guys were good, but nothing special. It was a poor game overall, with not much on display in terms of quality.
 
Rooney in Paris said:
PSG were also particularly shit, after a decent start to the season. Apart from Hakimi, none of them seemed up for it, and the less said about Donnarumma, the better.
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Think it's a sign where PSG are right now, some nice technicians in midfield, Neves, Vitinha and Zaire-Emery all good ball players, all can keep the ball well.

However the attacking 3 are very much a work in progress, they were obviously missing Dembele but i find him frustrating anyway, and a Barcola, Lee, Doue front 3 is an obvious drop off from the Messi, Neymar Mbappe days.
 
Best club in Europe no doubt! Love to see it. Need to get that trophy this season though. Let's go.
 
Greyfog said:
Best club in Europe no doubt! Love to see it. Need to get that trophy this season though. Let's go.
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Every time Arsenal win a few games this ridiculous rhetoric surfaces.

Real Madrid are currently the best team in Europe. The best team at the end of this season will be whoever wins the CL. Currently Arsenal are not the best team in England.

Anything else is subjective opinion which when it comes to football fans is a vast majority of the time proven to be completely wrong.
 
noodlehair said:
Every time Arsenal win a few games this ridiculous rhetoric surfaces.

Real Madrid are currently the best team in Europe. The best team at the end of this season will be whoever wins the CL. Currently Arsenal are not the best team in England.

Anything else is subjective opinion which when it comes to football fans is a vast majority of the time proven to be completely wrong.
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Arsenal will knock Madrid out this season. The most complete team in Europe. Can play different styles. Arteta is doing a fantastico job. Lovely fans as well.
 
noodlehair said:
Every time Arsenal win a few games this ridiculous rhetoric surfaces.

Real Madrid are currently the best team in Europe. The best team at the end of this season will be whoever wins the CL. Currently Arsenal are not the best team in England.

Anything else is subjective opinion which when it comes to football fans is a vast majority of the time proven to be completely wrong.
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Think there might have been a hint of sarcasm with the post you quoted.
 
GoonerBear said:
The mental gymnastics about the cowardly negative football is laughable anyway. It's like the 30+ other games of the season are wiped out because there's tough away games we sometimes change tactics in, never mind the context of games in terms of difficulty, going down to 10 men etc.
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It's just these forums, look over at the Big Ange thread, he gets bollocked regularly for not adapting his approach and being fleible when the need arises. Then you have a coach who can be adaptable, play on the defensive if the state of the game demands it and he gets slated as well for be negative.
 
Scroto Baggins said:
It's just these forums, look over at the Big Ange thread, he gets bollocked regularly for not adapting his approach and being fleible when the need arises. Then you have a coach who can be adaptable, play on the defensive if the state of the game demands it and he gets slated as well for be negative.
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Not even just the forums mate, the flip flopping of the modern fan in general just to try and find ammunition for banter is all too common, and it's also fuelled by the media as well, they aren't much better.
 
noodlehair said:
Every time Arsenal win a few games this ridiculous rhetoric surfaces.

Real Madrid are currently the best team in Europe. The best team at the end of this season will be whoever wins the CL. Currently Arsenal are not the best team in England.

Anything else is subjective opinion which when it comes to football fans is a vast majority of the time proven to be completely wrong.
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I believe Greyfog is on a WUM.
 
GoonerBear said:
Think it's a sign where PSG are right now, some nice technicians in midfield, Neves, Vitinha and Zaire-Emery all good ball players, all can keep the ball well.

However the attacking 3 are very much a work in progress, they were obviously missing Dembele but i find him frustrating anyway, and a Barcola, Lee, Doue front 3 is an obvious drop off from the Messi, Neymar Mbappe days.
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Not really - Vitinha usuallty has a much bigger influence on games for them, Barcola has been a delight so far this season (and also had an off night, which was the case for most players apart from Hakimi I thought), and we haven't mentioned they were missing Dembélé who, as inconsistent as he can be, is definitely more of a known entity than Désiré Doué and would have created other issues for Arsenal. Not sure about the mention of Neymar/Messi/Mbappé trio, who are obviously incredible players but never really delivered as a frontline in big games for PSG (and posed massive issues in terms of off the ball play for the team).
 
Rooney in Paris said:
Not really - Vitinha usuallty has a much bigger influence on games for them, Barcola has been a delight so far this season (and also had an off night, which was the case for most players apart from Hakimi I thought), and we haven't mentioned they were missing Dembélé who, as inconsistent as he can be, is definitely more of a known entity than Désiré Doué and would have created other issues for Arsenal. Not sure about the mention of Neymar/Messi/Mbappé trio, who are obviously incredible players but never really delivered as a frontline in big games for PSG (and posed massive issues in terms of off the ball play for the team).
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I don't think we are disagreeing. I think PSG have a good batch of young players, i rate the likes of Vitinha, Neves and Barcola highly. I still think they will be good, but i think they are a work in progress, in terms of having cutting edge in the final 3rd, and that's what players like Mbappe could give them. I agree about the problems having the 3 big forward stars gave them, so for them it's about trying to find the right balance in terms of having really good personnel, but that personnel more importantly feeding into the overall team play and not detracting from it, and they are still to get to that stage.
 
GoonerBear said:
Think there might have been a hint of sarcasm with the post you quoted.
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Rooney in Paris said:
I believe Greyfog is on a WUM.
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It's hard to tell with Arsenal. Even their players prematurely mouth off or over celebrate like idiots.

I think they have a good chance in the league this year but then Saka starts giving it large about how they will win it and it makes me much less sure.

If you exaggerate every high then every low and bit of pressure gets exaggerated with it, which doesn't tend to go so well when it's the business end of the season and City are chasing you down or you have to try and win away to Bayern.
 
noodlehair said:
It's hard to tell with Arsenal. Even their players prematurely mouth off or over celebrate like idiots.

I think they have a good chance in the league this year but then Saka starts giving it large about how they will win it and it makes me much less sure.

If you exaggerate every high then every low and bit of pressure gets exaggerated with it, which doesn't tend to go so well when it's the business end of the season and City are chasing you down or you have to try and win away to Bayern.
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Did he actually do that though? Or is this an exaggeration of your own?
 
noodlehair said:
It's hard to tell with Arsenal. Even their players prematurely mouth off or over celebrate like idiots.

I think they have a good chance in the league this year but then Saka starts giving it large about how they will win it and it makes me much less sure.

If you exaggerate every high then every low and bit of pressure gets exaggerated with it, which doesn't tend to go so well when it's the business end of the season and City are chasing you down or you have to try and win away to Bayern.
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I've seen the Saka thing mentioned in a couple of different places now.

You always need to be careful when websites create headlines and articles from interviews without any context.

Saka was asked on CBS by Henry if it's important they win the title this year, and he replied saying he doesn't want to put too much pressure on us, but he thinks that this could be the year, they've been getting closer the last couple of years so yeah, hopefully this will be the year.

I don't think that's an overly arrogant answer to say hopefully this will be the year they finally win it?
 
3-1 victory, but the performance does not fill me with confidence. I don't understand how the club simply decided to overlook the squad's glaring need for a striker. Worse, they went and brought in another Chelsea dud.
 
Hopefully everyone is fully fit after the international break. Only question mark would still be odegaard but it sounds like he could be fit for the next pl match.

Be interesting to see how quickly Merino works his way into the starting 11. Who starts at the fullback positions. And who ultimately wins the starting nod at LW
 
Gene Loblaw said:
The run from matinelli was superb but Saka spotting him and hitting that peach was special.
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That used to be Messi’s specialty. The timing of both the run and the cross was perfect.
 
WeePat said:
That used to be Messi’s specialty. The timing of both the run and the cross was perfect.
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Noticed that Lemine Yamal was very good at it in the Euros.

Think I even commented at the time that Saka needed to get more consistent at that type of ball in, with the likes of Havertz and Merino to aim for.
 
Gene Loblaw said:
Hopefully everyone is fully fit after the international break. Only question mark would still be odegaard but it sounds like he could be fit for the next pl match.

Be interesting to see how quickly Merino works his way into the starting 11. Who starts at the fullback positions. And who ultimately wins the starting nod at LW
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For me, it’s got to be…

Havertz
Martinelli Odegaard Saka
Merino Rice
Califiori Gabriel Saliba Timber
Raya

Martinelli is different player when he has Califiori and Merino to combine with.
 
Daydreamer said:
For me, it’s got to be…

Havertz
Martinelli Odegaard Saka
Merino Rice
Califiori Gabriel Saliba Timber
Raya

Martinelli is different player when he has Califiori and Merino to combine with.
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Partey Should start every game. Easily the best number 6 in the league now that Rodri is injured. Rice Does not have the technical requirements to play there, at least not in competitive games, that was proven last season.
 
Congrats Arsenal. No way they don’t win the league this year.
 
bgoodall said:
Congrats Arsenal. No way they don’t win the league this year.
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There's a looonnng season ahead still, I wouldn't be drawing any conclusions on who's challenging for the league title, nevermind winning it at this point.
 
Arsenal are still trying to find their rhythm this season, we arent playing at our true level yet. This is why I think we look like a combination of 23/24 and 22/23 at the moment, namely able to defend strongly, but also able to attack directly and quickly at the same time.

Arteta is looking to change our system, to keep us unpredictable, and I think that comes in with the fullbacks Calafiori and Timber. These two will operate like pistons in how they attack, with one going forward while the other creates the 3 or 2 in our rest defence.

But its the fluidity in attack that interests me the most, how Arsenal players now take up different positions instinctively. This I feel will be the X factor for the team this season, and what will keep them at the top. Not forgetting the bedding in of Merino, Nwaneri and Odegaard again.

Still some work to do for Arteta, but as long as Arsenal have built up some rhythm and momentum by January, we should be good to go for the business end of the season.
 
I've been saying Arteta is easily one of the best managers in Europe since their breakout season, he's got the footballing intelligibility and it's something that very few managers have at a competitive level in world football.

I understand some of their own fans criticism about the approach but it's yielding results. One thing it proves is that he's not one dimensional so it's a guarantee his relative successes with Arsenal won't be periodic they will continue to challenge in the foreseeable future.

Important to realize that he's still an inexperienced manager, it's even more impressive for me subjectively than Alonso because the league is a tougher environment with even Pep attesting to this fact being he's managed in Bundesliga / La Liga.
 
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