Antony under investigation by Brazilian authorities for domestic abuse | Inquiries ended | Back in the squad

jeepers said:
One would assume that every major club already do this and perform thorough background checks before signing any player. Apparently United doesn’t give a feck.
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Pretty rich to assume that the club runs like a normal one.
 
UnofficialDevil said:
Yes, haha, you're very funny.
"A police report from May 2022 also describes violent behaviour from Antony."
This was before ETH signed him for us, when he was still an Ajax player, again for ETH.
How could he not know about this.
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Well you are just guessing that ETH would have known. There is nothing suggesting ETH would have known anything. Also, if ETH knew why couldn't the club do their due diligence as well. If eth is to be blamed then so should the club. But blaming both for something that most likely neither knew is stupid.
 
AshRK said:
Well you are just guessing that ETH would have known. There is nothing suggesting ETH would have known anything. Also, if ETH knew why couldn't the club do their due diligence as well. If eth is to be blamed then so should the club. But blaming both for something that most likely neither knew is stupid.
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Club is also to blame in my opinion. I would have thought that one of the things the club should do before signing any player is to check their criminal records.
 
pocco said:
Fecking hell.

So this was an issue before he even signed for us? ETH has a growing list of questionable decisions when it comes to these people. I saw a post on reddit that mentioned about 3 cases where he backed players at previous clubs that committed crimes etc. He backed Overmars when he got outed. He wanted to sign Arnautovic until fans pushed back. He wanted Greenwood back. And now he's signed a guy that could be the worst of the lot, even though he'd already been accused of some of this before hand. And to make matters worse, he had already spent a year or two with him at Ajax.

You couldn't write this really.
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Erik ten Gulag
 
UnofficialDevil said:
Club is also to blame in my opinion. I would have thought that one of the things the club should do before signing any player is to check their criminal records.
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Hardly worth doing any background checks, he only cost €95,000,000….
 
Mickeza said:
We had numerous players under Ferguson who had issues with the law when playing or have had issues with the law since. Evans, RVP, Keane, Ronaldo, Rooney, Giggs, Butt, Anderson…and that’s just the ones that have made the public arena.
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Yeah, but we seemed to link with the likes of Alonso, Rabiot, Evans, the guy who made some racial/homophobic comments (?), etc. I don't know how exactly solid those links were for us. But it is a bit weird and concerning that it seems to happen under ETH and new management in about one year.
 
AshRK said:
Well you are just guessing that ETH would have known. There is nothing suggesting ETH would have known anything. Also, if ETH knew why couldn't the club do their due diligence as well. If eth is to be blamed then so should the club. But blaming both for something that most likely neither knew is stupid.
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If there is a police report about one of ETH's first team players and he didn't know about it... well, that's even worse for ETH!
 
The way this is heading, it will be very difficult for him to continue as a United player. No issue with that happening but it’s really depressing to see how our attempts at squad building are. So much money wasted, so far behind and players turning out to be absolute pricks.

Andersonson said:
If he aint finished ETH will be gone by December
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So the club will take a decision and then sack ETH based on the decision they make?
 
It would require a lot of mental gymnastics to come up with reasons why multiple seemingly unrelated women would speak up against Antony's behaviour at a time when the veracity of one alleged victim is questioned. I would still defer to the results of the investigation in case this is indeed some far fetched concocted scheme to profit off a potential payout, but I highly highly doubt that's the case anymore. Statistically speaking, multiple alleged victims speaking up is far more likely to indicate the uncomfortably obvious conclusion that Antony is indeed such a person - and that this behaviour is a pattern. It is difficult to stay neutral and not lean towards believing the accusers.

It's a horrible, sinking, feeling. Given the Greenwood situation, the Geoff Konopka invitation and now Antony, the whole club feels like one soulless, grotesque entity that makes me uneasy by association.
 
The silver lining to all this chaos is that the Glazers might be forced to sell if we end up having a bad season.
 
If we are going to loss Antony and Sancho, we can always play Diallo and Pellistri, or even Bruno or Mount on the right. I don't think we would be seriously weaken.
 
I like him fighting for us on the field, but on the other hand, he seems to be a bit nuts, seemingly more interested in fighting with other players than playing his game last season. Does it mean he committed these? Probably not. But he is exactly not a cool head.
 
UnofficialDevil said:
Club is also to blame in my opinion. I would have thought that one of the things the club should do before signing any player is to check their criminal records.
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He doesn't have a record does he? Sounds like the May 2022 complaint didn't go anywhere and is only resurfacing now given the recent allegation. Not even sure clubs can do CRB checks on players. When I had to go to court about something years back I sure as hell didn't tell my employer and they never found out.

The case against Antony already looked pretty ominous before these fresh allegations, but arguably only better player recruitment, ie not ridiculously overpaying for him and buying a superior player, would've enabled us to avoid this scenario. Not sure it was a due diligence fail per se.
 
AshRK said:
Yes antony would have video called eth first and said hey boss I am going to beat this women and eth would have given a go ahead.
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Stack said:
So there was a report to the police of violence against a woman back in May of 2022 before we bought him.
We really are digging ourselves into a deep hole with our lack of vetting.
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simple background check would have uncover this
 
Jippy said:
He doesn't have a record does he? Sounds like the May 2022 complaint didn't go anywhere and is only resurfacing now given the recent allegation. Not even sure clubs can do CRB checks on players. When I had to go to court about something years back I sure as hell didn't tell my employer and they never found out.

The case against Antony already looked pretty ominous before these fresh allegations, but arguably only better player recruitment, ie not ridiculously overpaying for him and buying a superior player, would've enabled us to avoid this scenario. Not sure it was a due diligence fail per se.
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I find it hard to believe that a billion dollar business like United does not have the resources to find out if a prospective player have a complaint against him or not. I mean, these journalists can uncovered it, so I'm pretty sure United can do it too if they put time and effort into it.
 
reelworld said:
I find it hard to believe that a billion dollar business like United does not have the resources to find out if a prospective player have a complaint against him or not. I mean, these journalists can uncovered it, so I'm pretty sure United can do it too if they put time and effort into it.
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It is hard to believe that his own manager (ETH) does not know about this, either. Nobody in Ajax knew anything about this?
 
frostbite said:
It is hard to believe that his own manager (ETH) does not know about this, either. Nobody in Ajax knew anything about this?
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Managers don’t spend 24 h every day with players. Also some people are slightly or even completely different in private than at work. So if the allegations are true it is entirely possible that ETH didn’t know about this.
 
united_99 said:
Managers don’t spend 24 h every day with players. Also some people are slightly or even completely different in private than at work. So if the allegations are true it is entirely possible that ETH didn’t know about this.
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Of course not. But they eat together, they travel together, they spend a lot of time together, they try to bond. And it is hard to believe that nobody, absolutely nobody in Ajax knew anything about this. And it is even harder to believe that someone in Ajax knew about it but they did not tell the manager.

Edit: On second thought, if I was the manager, I'd be very upset if the player himself did not come and tell me about it. It's better for the player to inform the manager, than the manager to find out about it from the press. If the player does not do that, then the manager cannot trust this player.
 
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reelworld said:
I find it hard to believe that a billion dollar business like United does not have the resources to find out if a prospective player have a complaint against him or not. I mean, these journalists can uncovered it, so I'm pretty sure United can do it too if they put time and effort into it.
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I've no idea, but not sure a two year old claim in Brazil that hasn't resulted in charges would flag up. I highly doubt they can do Interpol or FBI level checks on players.
 
RedRonaldo said:
If we are going to loss Antony and Sancho, we can always play Diallo and Pellistri, or even Bruno or Mount on the right. I don't think we would be seriously weaken.
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Either way, it's symbolic of how much money we've wasted post-SAF.

Antony and Sancho may not be at the club next season and we've got 140m+ spent in outlay on them both.

And we wonder why we're toiling away from winning the league. We are simply wasting far too much money even with the constraints of the Glazers.
 
united_99 said:
Managers don’t spend 24 h every day with players. Also some people are slightly or even completely different in private than at work. So if the allegations are true it is entirely possible that ETH didn’t know about this.
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He'd have been his manager at the time or perhaps it happened just before the player signed for Ajax, It's very hard to believe he wouldn't know about this IMO. He's aware and either believes the player is innocent or is more focused on what they contribute on the pitch. I reckon he's culpable.
 
Given Antony was signed after the Greenwood incident had happened, the club should take the blame of not being thorough with due diligence and process.

Can’t repeat mistakes again and again.

As for Antony, given this situation doesn’t settle out of court, even if he’s not guilty, he’ll be tried in the public court week in week out. United has left no stone unturned to become an easy target for the media who can paint the club as a shambolic mess and a group of degenerates. The narrative is all out there.

Feel for ETH, Ronaldo saga, Greenwood departure, sancho scuffle and now this, how bad can it get for him.

I cannot see this ending positively for Antony. Misery has become so commonplace at this club that news like this fails to generate to generate any surprise.
 
reelworld said:
I find it hard to believe that a billion dollar business like United does not have the resources to find out if a prospective player have a complaint against him or not. I mean, these journalists can uncovered it, so I'm pretty sure United can do it too if they put time and effort into it.
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I think if there is no arrest or charge/conviction, then nothing will turn up in a background check, in the matter related to the Banker (Ingrid Lana) she did a TV interview and spoke about the incident and there is no police report made here, as for the case from Rayssa de Freitas, there is only a police report in Brazil, nothing else as in arrest or charge/conviction so the club would not have known about this, and no journalist uncovered this since it is Rayssa herself who went public, as is with Ingrid.

The case from the GF (Gabriela Cavallin), it only emerged after the club signed Antony, I think the first mention of the abuse was in Jan this year and then again in July this year and now.

So it is unreasonable to expect the club to have prior knowledge of this, unless you want the club to assume it is the case with any new player they want to sign and dig around to see if there is issues with the said player.
 
OmarUnited4ever said:
So it is unreasonable to expect the club to have prior knowledge of this, unless you want the club to assume it is the case with any new player they want to sign and dig around to see if there is issues with the said player.
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Considering the amount of money being invested in these players, I always thought this is standard procedure!
 
We are at the stage now, where a mere accusation is accepted by the social media torch and pitchfork mob as indisputable evidence of guilt. There’s no such thing as a presumption of innocence any more, it’s now a presumption of guilt - whether the accused is later subject to legal proceedings or not. And that social media presumption of guilt stays.

Thus a life can be ruined by pure implication.
 
laughtersassassin said:
Has to be binned like Greenwood. A similar amount of evidence is coming out.

Anyway this club is an absolute house on fire.
It's completely fecked.

Clearly the people running it have no idea what they are doing. Wonder how much ETH knew about his anger problems.....
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It’s not “evidence”, it’s accusations. There’s a big difference.
 
OmarUnited4ever said:
So it is unreasonable to expect the club to have prior knowledge of this, unless you want the club to assume it is the case with any new player they want to sign and dig around to see if there is issues with the said player.
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Complete agree it’s unreasonable for the club to have any prior knowledge of anything that’s not been reported.

The latter part though, I’d say that’s due diligence for any club to do some digging around / character references to see how the player lives his life etc. There’s always stories if you dig deep enough should someone be an utter ****.

A club can’t be held accountable though when signing someone if they have done all their due diligence, the player has no history of violence, lives their life like a complete role model etc and something like this pops up.

whether the accusations are true or not is another matter and I’m sitting in the fence on this. Innocent until proven guilty and not ‘guilty by social media’
 
RedRonaldo said:
If we are going to loss Antony and Sancho, we can always play Diallo and Pellistri, or even Bruno or Mount on the right. I don't think we would be seriously weaken.
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Just goes to show how poorly run we are. £160m worth of wingers will hardly be missed just tells you everything you need to know about our recruitment

Anyway I’ve read there will be a tv interview over the weekend with one of the alleged victims…this story will explode in the coming days

Will be amazed if he’s in the United squad for our next game
 
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frostbite said:
Of course not. But they eat together, they travel together, they spend a lot of time together, they try to bond. And it is hard to believe that nobody, absolutely nobody in Ajax knew anything about this. And it is even harder to believe that someone in Ajax knew about it but they did not tell the manager.

Edit: On second thought, if I was the manager, I'd be very upset if the player himself did not come and tell me about it. It's better for the player to inform the manager, than the manager to find out about it from the press. If the player does not do that, then the manager cannot trust this player.
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The complaint happened in May 2022, is it... The very tail end of that season and both ten Hag and Antony were within a few months at MUFC. If what you say is true (and I see how in a football team dynamics, it might), it's much more likely it might have happened here than there, all the more so since the alleged incidents didn't stop.
 
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