[InfiniteBoredom]

He only scored 4 in the league last season. Zlatan's (lack of) movement was a hindrance to the people who were around him. With Lukaku, he has more space. But coming from wide left, he doesn't have the nous to make a chance from out of nothing. When the game is stretched, it's a lot easier for the lad.

And Rashford 5. Martial also had 6 assists to his 1

Their respective minutes is 1558 vs 1703, Martial only played in 25 games (18 starts, 7 subs) compared to Marcus's 32 (16 starts, 16 subs).

I don't know how this can be used to illuminate whatever point you are trying to make. Our attackers behind Zlatan were collectively shite last season, and statistically Martial was still the best of a bad bunch.

 

[Adisa]

So...

You're telling me Martial doesn't have the intelligence to have good games when he's not afforded space and I'm telling you that's bullshit.

 

[Dante]

And Rashford 5. Martial also had 6 assists to his 1

Their respective minutes is 1558 vs 1703, Martial only played in 25 games (18 starts, 7 subs) compared to Marcus's 32 (16 starts, 16 subs).

I don't know how this can be used to illuminate whatever point you are trying to make. Our attackers behind Zlatan were collectively shite last season, and statistically Martial was still the best of a bad bunch.

Why have you brought up Rashford? I'm discussing Martial.

 

[Dante]

You're telling me Martial doesn't have the intelligence to have good games when he's not afforded space and I'm telling you that's bullshit.

But you've just said otherwise.

 

[Soski]

I'm not sure if this is the Martial thread or the anti-Rashford thread.

Both are potential worldies. Be happy we have them.

It's really not. I'm pretty sure everybody in here rates Rashford and is happy to have him in the the squad. Some (like myself), do believe that Martial has a higher ceiling than Rashford, but in no way does that mean we dont think Rashford is a very good player, and are happy we have him and hope he succeeds. If the positions were reversed over the last 2 games (and Martial had made poor decisions and Rashford come on and been a part of 3 goals) I would be saying Rashford has earned his start, and lets see give Martial the last 20 to see if he can benefit. It's about showing the squad players that they can work their way into the first team with consistent good performances, and that favouritism isn't given to players who are not playing so well.

Also, the 'lets not change a winning formula' people....just aren't using there heads. If we won 4-0, but for the first 60 minutes we were getting chance after chance against us because Jones played awful, was out of position, gave them several dangerous free kicks because he mistimed tackles......then Smalling came on for the last 30 played great and they never got near our goal.....would we say 'hmmmm..lets not change a winning formula, lets leave jones on to play poorly, give the opposition false hope that we cant defend, pull them towards us .....then Bam, bring on Smalling to close them out and finish them off'. Same goes for any position on the pitch. Regardless of the result...if you can try and improve an area of the pitch for the next game, you obviously do so.

 

[InfiniteBoredom]

Why have you brought up Rashford? I'm discussing Martial.

Because he is in contention with the position Mourinho uses Martial in, so when you brought up Martial's low productivity, it's inevitable that we put them next to each other.

In the same breadth, Mkhitaryan got 4 goals and 1 assist in 1352 minutes, Mata got 6 goals 3 assists in 1628 minutes, Lingard got 1 goal 2 assist in 1369 minutes. So what is your conclusion about their ability to break through packed defence?

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Why did he only score 4 last season?

Barely any consistency in starts? I think after the first 5 or 6 games (in all comps), he rarely ever started in more than 2 games in a row.

 

[Dante]

Because he is in contention with the position Mourinho uses Martial in, so when you brought up Martial's low productivity, it's inevitable that we put them next to each other.

In the same breadth, Mkhitaryan got 4 goals and 1 assist in 1352 minutes, Mata got 6 goals 3 assists in 1628 minutes, Lingard got 1 goal 2 assist in 1369 minutes. So what is your conclusion about their ability to break through packed defence?

They didn't.



40 seconds in. Mourinho understands football.

 

[InfiniteBoredom]

They didn't.



40 seconds in. Mourinho understands football.

He talked about one specific match, you are making a blanket statement about Martial's ability to play through a tightly packed defense, which is refuted by his performances in 15/16 when he more than once got us the opener in a game.

Second season syndrome is nothing new, using his low goal return in a season where he came back from a morale shattering Euro, got no proper season, was in personal life turbulence and never afforded extended game time to play through his bad patch isn't very persuasive, especially when his peers performed just as badly or even worse.

 

[Gbenger]

Because he is in contention with the position Mourinho uses Martial in, so when you brought up Martial's low productivity, it's inevitable that we put them next to each other.

In the same breadth, Mkhitaryan got 4 goals and 1 assist in 1352 minutes, Mata got 6 goals 3 assists in 1628 minutes, Lingard got 1 goal 2 assist in 1369 minutes. So what is your conclusion about their ability to break through packed defence?

I think Rashford goal tally only increased after he played as CF.
I don't think he scored more than a goal when playing on the wings and he went 2 months or how months was it not scoring a goal?

He was easily hideous on the wings last season. People just have short memories here or simply say false things to suit their agenda.

 

[Dante]

I think Rashford goal tally only increased after he played as CF.
I don't think he scored more than a goal when playing on the wings and he went 2 months or how months was it not scoring a goal?

He was easily hideous on the wings last season. People just have short memories here or simply say false things to suit their agenda.

Says the bloke bad-mouthing a player in somebody else's performance thread, just because Rashford is a local lad.

 

[Damien]

Because he is in contention with the position Mourinho uses Martial in, so when you brought up Martial's low productivity, it's inevitable that we put them next to each other.

Plus Dante actually brought up Rashford originally.

Martial doesn't have the intelligence to do that against organised defences. But he can do it when it becomes the easy option. That's why he needs to play more centrally. The more initiative you ask of him, the trickier he finds it to get into the game. Play him on the "left" with Shaw behind him and he'll be amazing. Ahead of Blind, Rashford is the better option, at the moment.

 

[Dante]

Plus Dante actually brought up Rashford originally.

Not originally. Plenty of Rashford mentions prior to that. My post was a direct response to them, rather than a reference out-of-the-blue.

I'm actually very positive about both. As opposed to people to denigrate one or the other to big-up their personal favourite.

 

[Gbenger]

Says the bloke bad-mouthing a player in somebody else's performance thread, just because Rashford is a local lad.

I'm glad saying the truth has become bad-mouthing according to you. It's evidence of how petty you are.

Are you not the same bloke that stated Martial wouldn't have had the chances Rashford did yesterday in the latter's thread?

It seems you are now avoiding that thread since I called you out on it and rightly so.

 

[Dante]

I'm glad saying the truth has become bad-mouthing according to you. It's evidence of how petty you are.

Are you not the same bloke that stated Martial wouldn't have had the chances Rashford did yesterday in the latter's thread?

I'm the guy who spent the Summer picking Martial as a first XI player and Rashford as a sub.

It seems you are now avoiding that thread since I called you out on it and rightly so.

Wow.

 

[Minimalist]

I don't think Rashford did much wrong aside from typical traits of an inexperienced young player. Martial is definitely creating a problem for Mourinho and that's a very good thing.

I would think there's a good chance Martial may replace Rashford in the starting line-up for the next match but I wouldn't lose my shit if he doesn't put him in.

 

[Adisa]

I don't think Rashford did much wrong aside from typical traits of an inexperienced young player. Martial is definitely creating a problem for Mourinho and that's a very good thing.

I would think there's a good chance Martial may replace Rashford in the starting line-up for the next match but I wouldn't lose my shit if he doesn't put him in.

Personally, I don't want to see martial replacing Rashford.
I want both playing.
The Madrid game was the only preseason game I watched but others have said Rashford played on the right.
If we sign a wing back, I'd like to see a 343.

 

[Full bodied red]

If only we could encourage / coach Martial to have Rashford's work rate and Rashford to have Martial's coolness in fron of goal, then we'd have two phenomenal strikers.

 

[redIndianDevil]

To all the people who post here that Rashford showed a little bit inexperience yesterday and he should be given start regardless of his performance yesterday, I just hope that you give Martial the same leeway when he inevitably starts a match and doesn't score a goal or pick up an assist in it.

 

[Ubermensch]

Yep, forgot martial was completely useless as a starter in his first season and needed tired legs to be effective. Oh wait... Some of you eat your breakfast out of rashford and mourinho's asses. 'Yeah, messi should, like, totally come on as a sub, like, after Roberto has ran them, like, ragged bro'.
*Yes I exaggerate.

 

[AltiUn]

Rashford was superb last season and is playing well but let's not turn this season into a Rash v Tony debate. The TEAM won last two games, neither Rashford or Martial were the single reason for this so don't see why it needs to be changed. Why change a winning side especially when the performance was great too. Martial will get his chance but sorry not at the expense of any other player 2 games in.

Scoring 5 goals regardless of age in 32 appearances in the league is horrendous. Rashford was marginally better than Martial last season.

 

[Litch]

Scoring 5 goals regardless of age in 32 appearances in the league is horrendous. Rashford was marginally better than Martial last season.

Horrendous is your definition and not mine. He starts for one of the biggest teams in the world at 19....where did it all go wrong given his horrendous ability to score goals? People can turn it into a Rashford v Martial but I'm not as the only thing they have in common is their gender and colour. Can you imagine if they had the same attitude towards each other as those on here? Thank godness they don't...

 

[VeevaVee]

Martial is better suited to break up packed defenses than Rashford is.

Yeah but he's struggled with that for an entire season as well. I'm happy to stick with what works for a little while and really build his confidence

 

[VeevaVee]

Yep, forgot martial was completely useless as a starter in his first season and needed tired legs to be effective. Oh wait... Some of you eat your breakfast out of rashford and mourinho's asses. 'Yeah, messi should, like, totally come on as a sub, like, after Roberto has ran them, like, ragged bro'.
*Yes I exaggerate.

You can't just ignore an entire season either. Why change what's working for now? Awful post tbf

 

[Reiver]

He's made a great start to the season, the complete opposite to the last one. I don't know if his head wasn't right last season with all that nonsense with his ex. Whatever, if he continues like this then it's going to be hard to deny him a starting spot.

 

[Kevin]

Wow @Dante trying to sell bs as lemon cakes and noone buying. Lovely.

 

[Silas]

Yeah but he's struggled with that for an entire season as well. I'm happy to stick with what works for a little while and really build his confidence

Where did you get the idea he's lacking confidence? The only thing that would knock his confidence is being kept on the bench for another game after putting in great displays in the little time he's had to show what he can do.

 

[Dante]

Wow @Dante trying to sell bs as lemon cakes and noone buying. Lovely.

I'm curious to see what you think I'm saying. I want Martial in the starting lineup, but I'm responding to people badmouthing Rashford as a means of hyping up AM.

 

[ti vu]

Personally, I don't want to see martial replacing Rashford.
I want both playing.
The Madrid game was the only preseason game I watched but others have said Rashford played on the right.
If we sign a wing back, I'd like to see a 343.

The problems with that is at their current development phase, they're not there for the team to take this gamble. "They" here I will include Lukaku as he is still not proactively seek for the ball and win more 50/50 ball outside of the final third.

I meant let's say we field Martial Lukaku Rashford in the same starting line up. It would mean Pogba would have to do more defensive work, less freedom in final third when he's starting to be productive with solid stats. The team would need a third midfielder than a no 10 in Micky. Herrera may replace Micky to do the dirty work to allow Pogba a more freedom role. Remember Micky has been raking in assists despite not really imposing himself much the whole game. In case Micky hit the top form, it would be more beneficial for the team. Bench him may be counter productive.

In the end it would mean sideways gamble to replace the productivity of Micky, and Pogba for a tweak in tactic. And last but not least, and very good LB to help Martial out .This goes hand in hand with Pogba need to be more defensively point since the left back will have to do a lot of work providing width offensively to allow Martial freedom to keep cutting inside.

 

[VeevaVee]

Where did you get the idea he's lacking confidence? The only thing that would knock his confidence is being kept on the bench for another game after putting in great displays in the little time he's had to show what he can do.

The entirety of last season?
Maybe we should stick with what works eh?

 

[Mercurial]

He seem a bit naive and somewhat mentally weak and with misdirected priorities, it feels like losing shirt #9 did a massive number on him (pun intended). He created a whole brand around the number 9 as if he is the second coming for Ronaldo featuring AM9 instagram, AM9 homepage, AM9 underwear and assorted peripheral crap around 'AM9' brand. Now I might be getting a bit older but to me it's football & club first, 'side shit' discretely on the side. If he can speak with his feet on the pitch the side projects will sell no matter what number he has. He unfollowed the club like a butthurt baby, doing silent and passive aggressive protests and sulking. Posting online of #9 on social media and stitchings on shoes. The focus need to be back 100% on the 'day job' and he need to stop with all that teenage emo crap and let the balling do the speaking. In an old school locker room he would be eaten alive by the likes of Rio and Scholes. He need to assert himself and learn a bit from PRO players like Matic Carrick and so on.

 

[el3mel]

He seem a bit naive and somewhat mentally weak and with misdirected priorities, it feels like losing shirt #9 did a massive number on him (pun intended). He created a whole brand around the number 9 as if he is the second coming for Ronaldo featuring AM9 instagram, AM9 homepage, AM9 underwear and assorted peripheral crap around 'AM9' brand. Now I might be getting a bit older but to me it's football & club first, 'side shit' discretely on the side. If he can speak with his feet on the pitch the side projects will sell no matter what number he has. He unfollowed the club like a butthurt baby, doing silent and passive aggressive protests and sulking. Posting online of #9 on social media and stitchings on shoes. The focus need to be back 100% on the 'day job' and he need to stop with all that teenage emo crap and let the balling do the speaking. In an old school locker room he would be eaten alive by the likes of Rio and Scholes. He need to assert himself and learn a bit from PRO players like Matic Carrick and so on.

You're overreacting. I don't think he cared about losing the shirt the way you described. He may felt annoyed losing it but definitely not to this extent and he sure forgot it later on.

 

[TsuWave]

At a specific time. The flood of goals has coincided with his introduction after the opposition has been run ragged for 60+ mins.

you think swansea got ran ragged?

 

[Mercurial]

You're overreacting. I don't think he cared about losing the shirt the way you described. He may felt annoyed losing it but definitely not to this extent and he sure forgot it later on.

That whole AM9 thing to me was cringeworthy, hopefully this season he did a lot of growing up and will get his act together. The sublime talent is there for everyone to see. I put him as starter next game unless we change systems, he has shown better composure as of late.

 

[Handré1990]

He seem a bit naive and somewhat mentally weak and with misdirected priorities, it feels like losing shirt #9 did a massive number on him (pun intended). He created a whole brand around the number 9 as if he is the second coming for Ronaldo featuring AM9 instagram, AM9 homepage, AM9 underwear and assorted peripheral crap around 'AM9' brand. Now I might be getting a bit older but to me it's football & club first, 'side shit' discretely on the side. If he can speak with his feet on the pitch the side projects will sell no matter what number he has. He unfollowed the club like a butthurt baby, doing silent and passive aggressive protests and sulking. Posting online of #9 on social media and stitchings on shoes. The focus need to be back 100% on the 'day job' and he need to stop with all that teenage emo crap and let the balling do the speaking. In an old school locker room he would be eaten alive by the likes of Rio and Scholes. He need to assert himself and learn a bit from PRO players like Matic Carrick and so on.

I'm pretty sure he didn't do any of that himself, his agent commented that it was bad form from the club not to consult him wrt the numbers, which I find fair. The rest of your post is also all over the place, do you know Martial well enough personally to describe him essentially as a massive narcissist?

 

[Santoryo]

you think swansea got ran ragged?

Let's just ignore Martial clinical finishing or threat going forward and attribute all that to Swansea apparently having been ran ragged despite them having us pinned back for a good 5-10 minutes before changes were made.

This place can be an absolute nuthouse at times

 

[Silas]

The entirety of last season?
Maybe we should stick with what works eh?

He's more likely to come into a new season fired up with something to prove (which he has) than down about last season. I'm sick of seeing this "don't fix what isn't broken". The team playing well as a whole doesn't mean we can't improve individual areas. If Real go on to win the series of matches they have without Ronaldo due to his ban, do you think Zidane will think, "Why fix what isn't broken?" We haven't even played particularly good teams so this reasoning has even less validity.

 

[Kylar Stern]

you think swansea got ran ragged?

In fairness, we had over 60% possession and they didnt even manage a decent shot on target, im not sure how much more dominant we could have been away from home...

 

[Dobbs]

In fairness, we had over 60% possession and they didnt even manage a decent shot on target, im not sure how much more dominant we could have been away from home...

We could have been more than one goal up.

It definitely wasn't a dominant performance before we made the subs.

 

[AXVnee7]

He seem a bit naive and somewhat mentally weak and with misdirected priorities, it feels like losing shirt #9 did a massive number on him (pun intended). He created a whole brand around the number 9 as if he is the second coming for Ronaldo featuring AM9 instagram, AM9 homepage, AM9 underwear and assorted peripheral crap around 'AM9' brand. Now I might be getting a bit older but to me it's football & club first, 'side shit' discretely on the side. If he can speak with his feet on the pitch the side projects will sell no matter what number he has. He unfollowed the club like a butthurt baby, doing silent and passive aggressive protests and sulking. Posting online of #9 on social media and stitchings on shoes. The focus need to be back 100% on the 'day job' and he need to stop with all that teenage emo crap and let the balling do the speaking. In an old school locker room he would be eaten alive by the likes of Rio and Scholes. He need to assert himself and learn a bit from PRO players like Matic Carrick and so on.

Pretty sure his agent came out and said he got over it in 2 days.

The rest is just rambling with no real substance to it.