It's been unbalanced for a number of years now. So worse case scenario we continue as we are.
9
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It's been unbalanced for a number of years now. So worse case scenario we continue as we are.
The team was doing fine until Pogba's injury. We broke teams down and then after the 1-0 killed games off by either defending or going for the kill.
I just think in the games he hasn't been good in, he's possibly been worse than the rest of the team. Either ineffective or invisible. Not calling him out as such, it's just retaliation to the 'woah, look how amazing he is. Jose is a joke for not starting him' kinda stuff we keep seeing when he takes on a man and succeeds.
My issue is with those that act oblivious to why he hasn't started every game though. If anything...now may be the time to start doing so, as we've hit a bit of a wall and need a change (don't know he'll offer it based on past performance but it's as good a time as any to find out). When we were playing better though, people have literally said they'd rather Mourinho leave if he's not going to play him, then he would and he wouldn't be seen all game.
It's the above that I have issue with more. I don't think it's been right to start him that much so far based on what we'd seen, but now may be the right time.
When you're capable of discussing it without sounding like you're in an argument 1 post deep, I'll respond better mate
I disagree. Don see how anybody can think this team is balanced between right and left.
Even if we were doing great let's assume your worst case scenario is true and playing both Rashford and Martial disrupts the balance. All you have to do is switch back right? No harm done.
I think Mata on the right is more balanced than having Rashford on the right, especially with Valencia also on that side.
I guess, but I have a feeling people will then ask for Rashford to be dropped, or ask for Martial to play at AM.
West ham, swansea, leicester, basel, everton, burton albion, CSKA and Crystal palace... None of those are very tough games. Of course we had an impressive start to the season, but you can't say because it worked then with Pogba that it's the way to go. Also using an argument like "it worked for a brief time at the beginning of the season therefore never needs to be changed" is one of the worst arguments. If our whole form depends on Pogba being on the pitch, then it's not exactly a working system, it's more just 1 brilliant players elevating those around him.
Also I don't understand this at all. What do you mean what then? What, then you don't have the option of potentially trying this in the future because it wouldn't have worked the one time (as if it's working right now)? What we know is that right now, our main threat is always either Martial or Rashford. Whichever of the 2 is on the pitch, we pretty much always look to them (and just them) for any cutting edge. Our #10's do nothing, our right winger does nothing. Lukaku does alright but isn't someone who can create for himself or others. Are they both probably better on the left wing then the right? Yeah, could be. Especially martial. Doesn't mean we can't try to play Rashford on the right. He sure as feck won't do worse then Mata or Mkhitaryan's non existent performances out there. And it's not like either of those 2 are good defensively, so in the end, it's only positive for us. Mourinho has his reason for why he has it the way it is, but whatever they are, I don't see the logic in them at all. Rashford and Martial can play together on the wings and you can bet your ass that if we had a more attacking manager, that he'd play them both together from the start instead of going so conservative and worrying about keeping a solid defensive set up every game.
Who cares what they ask? You keep changing things to look for the best system and selection. No point settling on shit that isn't working anyway. Mkhitaryan and Mata pretty much never perform well. Lingard is just average. So find a way to fit Rashford and Martial together occasionally, doesn't even have to be all the time. The mind boggling thing is that one of our 2 most threatening attacking players is always on the bench and that's what's severely limiting us.
France all day for the World Cup for me. They are 11/2 at the minute and have serious depth. Looks a nice bet. Martial is making the squad even if he just continues to damage teams off the bench here for the rest of the season. It's just he wasn't even doing that last season. He's getting the hunger back it seems. It's good to see him enjoying himself and regularly amongst the goals and assists again. In another season or two he really could be a dominant player in this league. Even the best defenders can't handle him on his day. If that ever happens all the LVG was just a misunderstood genius and built our foundations posts will be funny/terrible.
On a side note- I'm Irish but I genuinely think England have a good chance at this World Cup too, for the first time ever really... they just had to axe rooney, the last of the old guard and start again. Some nice young aggressive players who also play regularly at the highest level in the mix. They won't fear many teams this time around.
On a side note- I'm Irish but I genuinely think England have a good chance at this World Cup too, for the first time ever really... they just had to axe rooney, the last of the old guard and start again. Some nice young aggressive players who also play regularly at the highest level in the mix. They won't fear many teams this time around.
If rumours start to get strong about Martial leaving next summer then I will have to make a Martial>Mourinho banner for OT.
Why would it be any more imbalanced than it currently is? It's just lazy justification for the extremely baffling decision of not starting our best players together.
He shouldn't be in competition with Rash for the wing spot.
the later is doing better job with his diffensive contributions, which improves our system of play the manager prefers, at least against top teams.
However, I think he's better replacing Mikhi, who has been rather depressing to watch.
Martial, is much better at holding the ball under pressure, quick and talented running with the ball, and extremely effective in cutting through diffence lines.
the later is doing better job with his diffensive contributions, which improves our system of play the manager prefers, at least against top teams.
However, I think he's better replacing Mikhi, who has been rather depressing to watch.
Martial, is much better at holding the ball under pressure, quick and talented running with the ball, and extremely effective in cutting through diffence lines.
I disagree with plenty of opinions on here but I can usually see somebodys point. But i really don't get your reluctance to having a player as talented as Martial in the team.
Mata has now started to get dropped. So not sure Jose shares your opinion there.
You made a statement, I debunked it with facts and now you won't respond 'cause I sound like I'm arguing?
Don't get the logic behind that but to each his own I guess
Jose thinks Rashford on the right offers more balance than Mata?
The imbalance is a result of Pogba and Fellaini getting injured though...
We haven't had a balanced attack for many years so them two being out, whilst doesn't help, isn't why we're unbalanced.
I'd understand man city talking about balance, napoli? Sure. But this man united team shouldn't be beating it's chest about balance all in the name of not shaking things up.
Don't fix what isn't broken is solid advice but our team is currently broken AF attacking wise so playing our 2 most dangerous attackers from the get go should be a no brainer really... except if you're Jose of course
Don't fix what isn't broken is solid advice but our team is currently broken AF attacking wise so playing our 2 most dangerous attackers from the get go should be a no brainer really... except if you're Jose of course
He only played in the first four of those games. Our performaces got worse after that. That includes the 4-0 game against Everton.
The team was working with Pogba. Once he is back we should go back to that. If it doesn't work, you change it.
It's broken without Pogba.
As someone said, where's the Martial to Barca story coming from?
It’s really not.
A news story a few weeks ago
So we were unbalanced at the start of the season? Is that what you are saying?
And last season, and the season before and the season before that. Difference is we have players to correct it now but a guy who doesn’t seem to see the path for the trees.
So the team we started with at the start of this season was the same as the teams from the last couple years?
Yeah, Martial - Herrera - Matic - Rashford is very balanced, got it!
Do you really expect an answer to that?
You should answer it.
What is the answer you want, the team Under Jose has never been balanced, the team Under LVG was never balanced. Difference is now anyone can see that the way Jose has us play is ridiculous for what we have in the squad.
From players we have, arguably the most balanced squad has DeGea,Valencia,Bailly,Smalling,Shaw,Matic,Pogba, Herrera,Martial,Lukaku, Rashford in a 433.
Jose then needs to allow the fullbacks to go forward, push the whole team forward. Move the defensive line up the pitch, don’t have Rashford and Martial retreat back to defensive positions but rather have them just watch their fullback.
Simple adjustments would get the best out of this team, and surely improve both Martial and Rashford and even give Miki options if he is played in midfield to actually pass the ball to.
The team at the start of the season was balanced. Just because you have a 433 dream with Rashford and Martial on the wings does not change that.
It really wasn’t balanced tho, it was actually horrible. My dream is actually 352 but hey ho, you’re balance argument is your opinion and you’re entitled to it even tho your whole premise of Mata cutting inside being more balanced with Valencia being laughable as that requires a fullback who can actually make something happen in the final 3rd.
Your reasoning behind laughing emojis or have you just ran out of ideas to defend that notion you were peddling.
Definitely! A few games where Martial/Rashford made an impact late on papered over the cracks big time.
Im laughing because you're talking total shit.
If that's how you want to rewrite it, ok.
Ok explain to us in your opinion why was it balanced?
I'm not rewriting anything. For the games in which we scored 4 we were average and a fresh Martial/Rashford proved to be too much for opposition teams to handle during the last 10 or so minutes.
Winning games, keeping clean sheets, scoring goals, good transitions from defence into attack, majority control of games.
Now explain to me why we were horrible?
I would say the good transitions from defence to attack is some sort of myth within your own head. Controlled games? Maybe 1 or 2 but I guess you have one of these blinkered mentalities where you just look at the shoreline and not the actual football being played on the pitch.
Probably explains why you didn’t actually put forth an argument as to why it’s balanced.
No I mean it's way too small a sample size to just say put Pogba in and it's a perfectly balanced selection. And just because we won against relegation fodder with that personnel doesn't mean it'll work like that suddenly when he comes back (against better opposition). Things change a lot in football. Mkhitaryan is way off form now (as you'd expect since this is more his norm then the first few games), and mata is ineffectual as ever. Put Pogba in, along with Martial+Rashford together on the wings, and it's a much more balanced attack with a threat from both sides of the pitch and not having a completely lopsided attack reliant on the left winger.
You're reading way too much into a few games at the start of a season against some awful sides. Like way too much. This is turning into Luke Shaw at the start of 15/16 levels. Can't even ignore how in those performances, they went through pretty long stale periods until Martial got subbed on in garbage time and killed the opposition off even more once the game was effectively done. Pogba of course makes a huge difference to us, but I'm just confused as to what possible reason you think that Mata or Mkhitaryan (or both) deserve to start on the right and #10 at the expense of Martial or Rashford?
I think they offer better balance. Pogba has been the difference and we can see that now that he has been injured. Also, no system is perfect really.
I don't think Mkhi is that great a player btw.
Pogba is obviously a big difference but I dont think mkhitaryan or mata offer something more then having both rashford and martial there. Just purely looking at those. Wouldnt it be more balanced by having a very similar threat on both sides of the pitch, and have the fullbacks hold the width and overlap, with the creativity/control of pogba and whoever plays #10 to supply them and lukaku chances? Its what fergie when for a lot of the time and its basically what Pep does now. Barca/bayern/madrid/psg all have very big threats from both sides of the pitch. We basically write off the right side to just Valencia's runs and try to overload the middle with average playmakers and still end up relying on pogba. I dont see how thats better balance. Isnt better in an attacking sense compared to rashford being out there, and defensively who cares, they all do a decent job defensively for wingers anyway.
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