Yep, not much point really.
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Yeah, there he just chose the hard working Oscar as the main #10 and decided he didn't need Mata or De Bruyne despite both being much more talented players at the time and obviously better options. A lot of your arguments seem to be "the manager is always right because it's his job and he was very successful". Which is a truly awful argument. Even the best managers sometimes don't pick the obvious easy choice because they try to be too clever, or are too worried about other things unnecessarily or whatever. Mourinho's main concern is always control and defensive solidity. The reason fans want both Martial and Rashford is because they are our best attackers. It makes us more unpredictable, more attack minded, more exciting, etc.. Obviously too attacking for Mourinho, and that's an issue in itself because he isn't willing to go really attacking and play exciting football. And that's always going to follow him until he changes.
You can't really protect and make excuses for Mourinho about everything. People are seeing what he's doing with Martial is absolutely wasting away an amazing talent. Do you think he would play Mbappe all the time if he had him from before? Or Ousmane Dembele? I think they'd be treated exactly like Martial has been for the last year and a bit, too attack minded to be automatic starters on the wing, and not given the trust and freedom to develop into what they can be. Think about Ronaldo when he first came here. Imagine what Mourinho would've done with him. Would've contained him and brought him in and out of the side until Ronaldo decided he would need to go somewhere to really develop, and Mourinho's logic (just like it was for De Bruyne) would be: hey, they player can leave if they want and don't want to fight for their place and adapt to my tactics. Fair enough, but it's fecking dumb as you're losing a generational talent and you have to adapt when you have players of certain qualities. Martial is one of those.
Mourinho I trust pretty much completely when it comes to defensive decisions. He knows what he wants and is proven to be great at it over the years. Attacking wise? Far from it. He's never shown a very good attacking system that isn't completely reliant on just having incredible players everywhere like he had at Real Madrid. Everywhere else it's "functional" but not very pretty.
Nah, it isn't going to help him at all. He's an attacker and that side of his game comes before anything. He'd much prefer playing in a team that presses high up than a team where he has to track back most of the time. Insigne played for a manager like that in Benitez and it did nothing for his game and look now what the two past seasons have done for his football. You're crazy if you think him chasing fullbacks while barely seeing the ball is going to improve him all that much.
This idea of not questioning managers is totally ridiculous. These guys get fired every two minutes but somehow we're supposed to act like they know everything about everything.
This guy @haram has got to be a troll or the biggest, blindest Mourinho's supporter the world has ever seen. Eveytime Mourinho does something right, he will go around broadcasting it everywhere, but for every wrong that Jose does, he goes to any lengths possible to somehow justify it, by any means necessary. No use arguing with him, he doesn't believe in logic but in blind faith.
Ha ha ha!
Some of you are missing the point.
Many people are putting forth the idea of playing Martial on the left, and Rashford on the right. Ok. This is the most simplistic way of trying to solve our current problems. Nothing wrong with it being simplistic.
Ok.
Do you guys not think Mourinho is aware of this possibilty? That he has not thought over it? That there are potential problems with setting up like this? When I put these problems forward, people get upset.
People keep screaming about playing both on the wings as if Mourinho is some moron. The fact is, we had a good balance before Pogba got injured. There are people who are now claiming there was never any balance. That's bollocks.
Also, people keep screaming about De Bruyne. Yeah, and Fergie should have played Pogba ahead of Rafael against Blackburn. Give it a fecking rest. All managers make mistakes with players. Even with this mistake, Chelsea went and won the league the following year. They did play good football that year, even if for the latter half they were grinding wins.
I am not saying Mourinho is perfect. Some of you need to have some respect for a manager that has won as much as he has. At least give some thought to his methods. At least apply context. You all just scream about the way you want things done, and dismiss Mourinho's methods. If it wasn't for City being the best side in Europe atm, this level of hysteria does not even occur.
People are obssesed with Martial. He has his limitations as a player. Yes, Martial would be better as forward in a 3 up top, with less defensive responsibilities. This does not mean we shift our system for him. Especially when Rashford does a great job at LF. Maybe he will change it. Maybe we will see a 343 which is an idea I put forth earlier.
I want to see where we stand with Pogba back in the team, and then see how Mourinho reacts depending on the TEAM performance.
Mourinho is obviously aware of potentially playing Martial and Rashford at the same time on either wing. Dont be daft. He is also aware of the affect it will have on our team in details NO ONE on this forum can go into. That is the point I am making. Yet everyone on here seems to think he is some daft idiot who cant see how great it would be. No. He know's what it will bring to our play. More so than ANYONE with an interest in Manchester United. If you cannot accept that, I dont know what to say.
These fine details within setting up a team which separates us forum posters from actual top level coaches and managers. Patterns of play. Transitions. Areas to press. That's not even the surface. When I try to explain what Mata brings to the team and Martial's limitations, people get upset.
I cant take people seriously when their idea of solving our problems is simply playing Martial on the left and having a LB overlap. It just isn't that simple. If it was, it would have happened already.
Rashford hasn't improved? Rashford barely sees the ball? Thought so. Rashford's work rate, both attacking and defending is better. His movement is better. Martial should improve those parts of his game. Martial is an attacker after all, he should especially improve his attacking work rate and movement.
Many people are putting forth the idea of playing Martial on the left, and Rashford on the right. Ok. This is the most simplistic way of trying to solve our current problems. Nothing wrong with it being simplistic.
Ok.
Do you guys not think Mourinho is aware of this possibilty? That he has not thought over it? That there are potential problems with setting up like this? When I put these problems forward, people get upset.
People keep screaming about playing both on the wings as if Mourinho is some moron. The fact is, we had a good balance before Pogba got injured. There are people who are now claiming there was never any balance. That's bollocks.
Also, people keep screaming about De Bruyne. Yeah, and Fergie should have played Pogba ahead of Rafael against Blackburn. Give it a fecking rest. All managers make mistakes with players. Even with this mistake, Chelsea went and won the league the following year. They did play good football that year, even if for the latter half they were grinding wins.
I am not saying Mourinho is perfect. Some of you need to have some respect for a manager that has won as much as he has. At least give some thought to his methods. At least apply context. You all just scream about the way you want things done, and dismiss Mourinho's methods. If it wasn't for City being the best side in Europe atm, this level of hysteria does not even occur.
People are obssesed with Martial. He has his limitations as a player. Yes, Martial would be better as forward in a 3 up top, with less defensive responsibilities. This does not mean we shift our system for him. Especially when Rashford does a great job at LF. Maybe he will change it. Maybe we will see a 343 which is an idea I put forth earlier.
I want to see where we stand with Pogba back in the team, and then see how Mourinho reacts depending on the TEAM performance.
Mourinho is obviously aware of potentially playing Martial and Rashford at the same time on either wing. Dont be daft. He is also aware of the affect it will have on our team in details NO ONE on this forum can go into. That is the point I am making. Yet everyone on here seems to think he is some daft idiot who cant see how great it would be. No. He know's what it will bring to our play. More so than ANYONE with an interest in Manchester United. If you cannot accept that, I dont know what to say.
These fine details within setting up a team which separates us forum posters from actual top level coaches and managers. Patterns of play. Transitions. Areas to press. That's not even the surface. When I try to explain what Mata brings to the team and Martial's limitations, people get upset.
I cant take people seriously when their idea of solving our problems is simply playing Martial on the left and having a LB overlap. It just isn't that simple. If it was, it would have happened already.
Rashford hasn't improved? Rashford barely sees the ball? Thought so. Rashford's work rate, both attacking and defending is better. His movement is better. Martial should improve those parts of his game. Martial is an attacker after all, he should especially improve his attacking work rate and movement.
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It is evident that Jose should create a special set up to get the best out of Martial, kinda like Fergie did with Ronaldo. But Jose is just not the manager to do that, he wants everyone to fit his system. Fergie had the ability to create a system based on the player's strengths
I tend to agree with this. SAF showed a great deal of flexibility and adaptability when needed. Explains his longitivity and success. He didn’t though make everyone fit recklessly too. He like Mou has clear plans and ideas. I do see some valid points that haram is making. It’s not that Mou is purposefully ignoring successful formations and attacking set ups well. Why in hell would he? I trust his judgement. I really think Martial is coming good and looks so much more happier. Not sure why some people are so impatient and want him to play all the time! His performance dictates that. For one, I am always so happy when he starts but not sad when he doesn’t. Reckon he will start on Sat and score a couple!
You’ve not once given any reasoning for why you think the team is balanced, or in your opinion how it functions better with Mata other than a blatant lie.(Valencia goes to the byline) when has that ever happened in the last 2 years?
People have broken things down for you and your only response is have faith in Jose.
This reads like a more eloquent version of one of Ty's interviews on Arsenal Fan TV
Martial is going nowhere.
There is nothing wrong with that post, taken in isolation that is a good post.. but you're assuming that Mourinho's entire thought process is entirely logical and based entirely on footballing matters on the pitch and that 100% if you play Rashford on the right, it will play out exactly like Jose has envisioned and lead to a lack of success.
That is what is annoying people, because sometimes no matter what Jose has thought out and envisioned, he can still bollocks it up because at the end of the day he is human. Furthermore these days, he seems to make more strange decisions than when he did at his peak and also seems more stubborn. Not saying the overall gist of your post isn't right, most likely it is, but you have to concede that yes he might have thought it through.. and is potentially right with his conclusions, but that doesn't mean that everyone else is definitely wrong.
Would hate to see you on an Arsenal forum backing Arsene Wenger.
Exactly my point. Just the bare fact that he has the tendency to self destruct by been petty. All the logical line of reasoning that a manager of his CV should have will always be questioned. I bet you, all these talks of Martial should be startg etc, is probably gettg to him in a wrong way, he will probably want to prove a point or two by benchg him for personal satisfaction...
How can we be more ‘balanced’ to only have a threat on one side? @haram
Martial is 21 and has to play more period...or we risk losing him. I'm sorry but 20mins a game isn't going to cut it for any ambitious young player who wants to improve. Against Chelsea for instance Miki was atrocious and has been for a while yet played 60mins and Martial is very strong and ideally suited against strong defenders such as chelsea's where Rashford sometimes tends to struggle a little bit.
Jose has little if any favoritism..i mean you talking a coach who didn't hesitate to drop zlatan for the chelsea return game at home last season....but he's human and can make mistakes too. He can be a bit drawn to players whose attributes he cherishes..such as graft and courage etc
Jose has little if any favoritism..i mean you talking a coach who didn't hesitate to drop zlatan for the chelsea return game at home last season....but he's human and can make mistakes too. He can be a bit drawn to players whose attributes he cherishes..such as graft and courage etc
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Was once speculated that Jose wouldn't start Rashford and Martial because he liked to have a striker on the bench. Curious to see if that changes now that Zlatan is back
I reckon by the end of the season Zlatan will have played more minutes than Martial in the league.
That move to set up the goal against Germany was immense.
Sad possibility. I'm not totally convinced Jose's plan wasn't to bring in perisic for the 352 and have he, Lukaku and Zlatan start every league game when fit.
I was talking about a balance throughout the team.
This is a fair post. IMO Mourinho is logical, and the fact that we were playing well with the team that started the season, makes me trust him even more.
I wouldn't be backing Wenger because all Arsenal do is lose.
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with a team lacking creativity and the manager choosing not to start the only creative attacking player we have is beyond stupidity. I am not saying JM is stupid, but him insisting on not starting Martial in the league is a stupid move just to prove something that didn't workout.
Both starting! Lets see how it goes lads.
You're too slow bro!!
He's usually crap on the RW. Hopefully Jose sticks him on the left.
Hopefully he and Rashford both have storming games so that their respective camps can take a break this week.
Didn't anyone tell manager that is shouldn't happen? As you clearly had some theory for that
Didn't anyone tell manager that is shouldn't happen? As you clearly had some theory for that
If I was wrong then I was wrong, I have no problem admitting it. Still should see how it goes though.
Hopefully they both have storming games so we can continue with playing our two best attacking talents at the same time moving forward you mean.
This.
Time to switch it on big time, Anthony. He could secure a regular starting position if he does well here.
It really is a hugely pressurised game for him. A pivotal game in his season.
The person on the right only has to surpass what mata has been doing on that wing all season for this to be an improvement.
Well Mata offered more than just direct play from the wing. We may change shape during the game and Mata ends up on the right anyway. Im interested in seeing how we set up throughout the game.
Would love for him and Rash to play great together today and cement themselves in the starting lineup. The coming off the bench strategy has worked well a lot this season but I love watching them both too much
Basically. Both him and mata have been wank so any decent performance is good enough
that's the thing, a regular place shouldn't hinge on one performance, especially for young players who tend to be generally inconsistent. His contribution (numbers wise) has been better than other players in the team this season so i think the manager should make an effort to have him involved from the start more often as he's done today, hopefully Martial has a good game.
I think Mata will still play on the right.
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