You think they wouldn't jump at the chance to take a £50m wonderkid back on loan?!
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You think they wouldn't jump at the chance to take a £50m wonderkid back on loan?!
Lots of speculations and assumptions being passed off as facts in this thread.
Hmm watching the games he's played I'm inclined to agree with a lot of people, IMO I don't think tracking back is the problem, I think he has been quite static and one dimensional in attack this season, and this has become a key problem. No doubt that a loss of confidence from the manager is exacerbating this as well.
For all his criticism on these threads, Lingard does show great movement on and off the ball, and willing to mix it up quite regularly with his attacking play, even if it doesn't always work.
For all his criticism on these threads, Lingard does show great movement on and off the ball, and willing to mix it up quite regularly with his attacking play, even if it doesn't always work.
First he isn't worth 50m and unless United pay them handsomely there is no reason for Monaco to develop a player for someone else. Monaco have plenty of players to develop for themselves and those are the players who are going to benefit Monaco in the future. Now, if United want to sell Martial for cheap, Monaco will be interested.
Personally, I wouldn't be surprised if Mourinho uses Ronaldo as an example, he probably wants Martial to play with more hunger, more power, more speed. He wants him to run at the second post everytime, to start counter attacks at full speed everytime while Martial is incredible pedestrian in everything he does.
Didn't he start up front in a cup game and was absolutely dreadful? Had to be moved to the wing after 30 minutes. I'd love to see him up front for us but i can see why Mou doesn't trust him there.. yet.
Mourinho dropped Mkhitaryan, which is a intelligent and equally fast player, for Lingard. Martial wasn't even near the choice to play that game.
Hear me out on this first. What about the 10m euro payment due if Martial scores another goal? If Mourniho was told he could reuse that money in the summer (along with the Martial fee). Conversely, he will lose 10m Euro from his summer budget. There's some logic in Mourinho not playing him. I reckon we'd only get 30m for him. If that brought his cost up to 45m, that would be hard for the Glaziers to swallow.
Be a Jose type of player. Work harder etc, do more for the team. Maybe like he asked Mkhitaryan at the start of the season.
I expect he'll be sold if we manage to get our transfer targets.
Past caring after that lazy horror show last week, fix up or do one Tone.
He's done himself no favours this year. The sad thing is we've witnessed so much talent in him last year. We rarely created chances in our games last year, so it was almost as if his goals ratio was like one shot one goal every time he got a sniff. I hope he lives up to his potential at United, because he's dynamite when he's on.
Jose has thrown the gauntlet dowm, up to Martial now.
Give the kid a break. The talks of selling him are crazy.
Mourinho have been critical of Benzema and Higuain for the better part of his time at Madrid but he didn't sold them. It really is down to Martial.
I like this type of thinking, but the flaw is that we lack goals and we need them, badly, at any cost. One extra goal scored between now and the end of the season could be the difference between being in the EL again or qualifying for the CL. The loss of revenue and potential disruption to our transfer plans dwarfs the miserly sum of £10m Euros.
Hopefully Martial can turn it around before the season ends but sadly I just can't see it. Whether this would mean he'll be sold remains to be seen, but I've thought for a while now that he may well be out of the door in the summer.
I did say in the summer Jose wouldn't like him and yet the consensus in the replies would be it would be the opposite
Forgive the Caf.
Quotes or it didn't happen.
I read that Martial showed lack of work ethic at Monaco, now he's showing it here.
I don't think for one second that Mourinho would want to freeze Martial out if he could potentially be used to help him win a league title with United. Mourinho wants to win! Simple. If Martial isnt going to play 110 percent for our manager then quite frankly he can go play for somebody else.
I forgot BFS signed last season, i thought it was the season before. But it's fairly obvious to the eye that he was off the pace of the premier league. He was a huge disappointment. One he picked up an injury under LVG he never got back in the side when he recovered. He is way way past his best. Some players come in to the PL late and adapt, zlatan for example, but BFS didn't.
Why isn't he back at Bayern if you think he's so good? Why isn't he playing for a champions league team? Why did it take a very average American side to come take him for free? Why is he playing for Chicago for Christ sake! He isn't good enough, the whole footballing world knows that, that's why mourinho flogged him.
Good points. However, these things have to work both ways. When the manager gives you the trust, you repay that trust with effort and performance.
What that level of performance is, is up for discussion but it seems obvious that players like Rashford and Fellaini have repaid that trust and earned more.
Asking for more trust and playing time but not reciprocating that on the pitch becomes self-entitlement after a while. This doesn't work, especially when you have a squad where others are fighting for the spot.
It is clear to me that there are fans that have too much of an emotional investment to Martial which is clouding their judgement. Some fans might also have some dislike or disagreement with Mourinho so they will try to paint him as a villain. They are expecting Mourinho to change his system for a 21-year old that is not proven at the top level. Could you imagine if Martial had a meeting with Mourinho and told him he shouldn’t be expected to do the off the ball work that Rashford, Lingard, Young, Mkitharyan are expected to do…he would not get another minute on the pitch for Mourinho.
The emotional attachment also leads to a false analysis of Martial’s performance. They love Martial because he can make magic with the ball at his feet (this is why I love Martial as a player), so when Martial is dribbling left to right past 2 defenders then passing to Ibra for a goal or doing his signature curled shot into the top corner from the corner of the box they think he has had a good game. What they do not see is that the defence is playing a high line so they are susceptible to a player running the channels, or, when Pogba is moving the ball towards the goal Martial hugging the left side leaves us exposed to a counter attack from the left.
Mourinho is willing to allow players similar to Martial to play in his team if they follow his instructions and believe in his tactics. Martial is not a lazy player; he simply puts his energy onto a different part of the game than what Mourinho wants. It seems to me that Mourinho is playing Martial against specific teams because his attributes are best suited to the set-ups of those teams but hesitates to play him in bigger games because he doesn’t give the team a good structure. This seems to also be why Shaw is struggling; he struggles to follow Mourinho’s instructions. It doesnt mean they are bad players or that Mourinho doesnt like them as people; it means that their natural game does not suit the manager’s needs whereas a player like Rashford does suit the manager’s needs (hence why Rashford has played so much). If a player follows Mourinho's instruction he will be rewarded eg. Fellaini, Lingard, Rashford, Herrera.
I find it very strange that some fans expect the Manager to change his system; especially when the system is proven. What is the point in getting a manager if you are demanding the manager to change the principals and rules that made him successful?
The emotional attachment also leads to a false analysis of Martial’s performance. They love Martial because he can make magic with the ball at his feet (this is why I love Martial as a player), so when Martial is dribbling left to right past 2 defenders then passing to Ibra for a goal or doing his signature curled shot into the top corner from the corner of the box they think he has had a good game. What they do not see is that the defence is playing a high line so they are susceptible to a player running the channels, or, when Pogba is moving the ball towards the goal Martial hugging the left side leaves us exposed to a counter attack from the left.
Mourinho is willing to allow players similar to Martial to play in his team if they follow his instructions and believe in his tactics. Martial is not a lazy player; he simply puts his energy onto a different part of the game than what Mourinho wants. It seems to me that Mourinho is playing Martial against specific teams because his attributes are best suited to the set-ups of those teams but hesitates to play him in bigger games because he doesn’t give the team a good structure. This seems to also be why Shaw is struggling; he struggles to follow Mourinho’s instructions. It doesnt mean they are bad players or that Mourinho doesnt like them as people; it means that their natural game does not suit the manager’s needs whereas a player like Rashford does suit the manager’s needs (hence why Rashford has played so much). If a player follows Mourinho's instruction he will be rewarded eg. Fellaini, Lingard, Rashford, Herrera.
I find it very strange that some fans expect the Manager to change his system; especially when the system is proven. What is the point in getting a manager if you are demanding the manager to change the principals and rules that made him successful?
I agree with this. If you expect the manager to trust you on the pitch as a Manchester United player, you need to work your heart out for the team and carry out his instructions to the tee. The fact is if he does not do the necessary work the manager requires, then he is essentially asking the other 10 players to carry him. There are only two players in the world who can demand this type of treatment, and Martial is far from the level of Ronaldo and Messi.
It actually hurts to see a player as talented as Martial not making full use of his talent due to lack of effort and not listening to his manager. With his potential coupled with hard work and commitment, he could go far. Hope he take onboard what the manager and coaches are trying to tell him
He's been on holidays this season anyway.
This place is so predictable. Now everyone is coming out with "stories" they've heard somewhere w/o providing any credible source. And of course people buy whatever said of those stories given the narrative has shifted this season and anything to rationalise their assumptions and speculations is game.
No one was hearing those "stories" when Martial was tearing things up and just like no one will be hearing them stories if Martial ever managed to get himself oup of his current predicament.
Well this should have been expected anyways.
No one was hearing those "stories" when Martial was tearing things up and just like no one will be hearing them stories if Martial ever managed to get himself oup of his current predicament.
Well this should have been expected anyways.
Excellent post! If I was a scout I'd give you a like for that! Spot on, sir!
Excellent post
Football fans are massive hypocrites. They will show no loyalty towards players going through patchy form while expecting the world in return.
Cleared a lot of things in my head after reading this. Good post.
Absolutely bang on. I've been trying to get this kind of message across on here for weeks but didn't ever write it half as good as that.
Great post.
Yes, Some people retreat back to a shell when life turns on them. He is a young kid who was on top of the world last season and has lost alot this season. Some react by pushing on while others, especially the introverts pull back into their shell. Whats wrong with trying an arm around the shoulder? Clearly criticism doesn't work.
Effective teachers do this. I believe effective coaches do well to practice this. Luke and Martial need seem to need a little hand.
Effective teachers do this. I believe effective coaches do well to practice this. Luke and Martial need seem to need a little hand.
A manager 100% should change his system if he has talented players. The same thing happened with Costa and Hazard last season, they were made to feel inadequate and their form went to shit. Martial has already proven himself for us so it is such a shame to see an enormous talent not getting the game time his potential deserves.
http://www.sofoot.com/jardim-a-voulu-blesser-martial-dans-sa-fierte-212890.html
Google translate part of the interview:
"Jardim also returns in this interview on one of his most controversial decisions in Monaco: the exit of Anthony Martial 26 minutes after his entry in play in Nantes. A choice he assumes and justifies. "After five minutes, I saw that he did not follow the instructions I had given him throughout the week. I decided to crack down and score. For him, to say to himself "Ah, yes, I must get to work." The fact that the sanction is public has wounded him in his pride and prompted him to react in the most beautiful way. We know what happened next."
Edit:
More about same incident
http://www.eurosport.fr/football/li...i-27-minutes-plus-tard_sto4372227/story.shtml
----------------
http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=2235158.html
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1862/pr...dim-im-not-surprised-by-martials-performances
Both Jardim & Martial mentioned they had to work physically & mentally.
Google translate part of the interview:
"Jardim also returns in this interview on one of his most controversial decisions in Monaco: the exit of Anthony Martial 26 minutes after his entry in play in Nantes. A choice he assumes and justifies. "After five minutes, I saw that he did not follow the instructions I had given him throughout the week. I decided to crack down and score. For him, to say to himself "Ah, yes, I must get to work." The fact that the sanction is public has wounded him in his pride and prompted him to react in the most beautiful way. We know what happened next."
Edit:
More about same incident
http://www.eurosport.fr/football/li...i-27-minutes-plus-tard_sto4372227/story.shtml
----------------
http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=2235158.html
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1862/pr...dim-im-not-surprised-by-martials-performances
Both Jardim & Martial mentioned they had to work physically & mentally.
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What puzzles me is that LVG would have been more strict and quite detailed in how he wants someone to play, and Martial didn't seem to have a problem giving LVG what he wanted, yet with Jose it's been one long struggle. Maybe a clash of personalities, sadly...
LVG was the one who bought him though, presumably he wouldn't have bought a player who didn't have the characteristics he wanted. I highly doubt Jose would have signed Martial. I think Martial was also more willing to give his all for the coach who showed belief in him by paying such a big fee. LVG gave him his big chance, while he doesn't owe Mourinho anything. I'd like Martial to adapt and stay but it's looking increasingly like Martial values retaining his style of play over remaining at United.
Tell that to Di Maria, Depay and Schneiderlin. I don't think Van Gaal put anywhere near enough thought into who he signed.
There is no simple explanation why Martial struggles. It's a combination of several factors: personal weaknesses (I wrote about them last season and was criticised by his fans) and Jose's inabilty to work with young talents (it's not like Rashford has progressed under him, not to mention Shaw).
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