If he wasnt a good keeper he wouldnt have the second highest save % in tbe league, the reason he has to make so many saves is because he has no defence in front of him.
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If he wasnt a good keeper he wouldnt have the second highest save % in tbe league, the reason he has to make so many saves is because he has no defence in front of him.
True, and some of his saves have been excellent , but he doesn't fill me with confidence, and some of his mistakes are horrendous.
You think facts proving made up statements wrong are going to convince some people that Onana isnt absolutely crap?
You think facts proving made up statements wrong are going to convince some people that Onana isnt absolutely crap?
Do you really believe that Onana will be a great keeper for us in the next 5 years? ( He has a 5 year contract I think. )
I dont know, i do think he is better than he has been showing so far though. If he can be great also depends on the rest of the team. While i dont think he will ever be the best goalkeeper in terms of making wondersaves on a regular bases, i do think he can be a good goalkeeper for a big club.
Shoot in sight would include all kind of shots we face. Intention is one thing. Execution is another. There is a reason other performance related stats are being developed to get to grasp more insight to a game of football. It's illogical to think players decide to shoot off target on purpose.
Also Allison has played less games than Onana in the league as well as in all competitions.
I just looked at overall, so 2 less games and 20 less shots faced over 14 matches. So your talking just over 1 extra shot on target per game. He also has EL where Kelleher has been playing and that's why I only looked at the PL.
So what did Barca, Ajax, Inter and now Utd see in him as shot stopping and handling are the fundamentals to GK?
Not sure what long term actually means but I suspect it will be longer than people think.
Feels like VdS was just a cheap punt by us, instead of a sought after long research. He was 35 y.o. when we got him, and was with Fulham for years achieving nothing there.
Brad Friedel had more better games against us than VDS with Fulham.
Its actually funny, they paid money for a GK that is by reports stronger on passing side and then we dont play possession focused football to cover whats lacking on shot stopping side.
SAF said something along the line that VDS was always on the radar after Peter Scheimel left. VdS mid career crisis (his Juventus stint), prevented us from signing him sooner. Understandable since the pressure here was huge and VdS was not in great state of mind on top PL physical style of play.
While I think he exceeded expectation with his performance, I believe his signing was a product of research process. VDS is as all rounded GK as it gets, which we needed back then rather shot stopper in Tim Howard, or crazy maniac sweeper ball playing GK in Barthez.
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We are not at a point where we need a super GK in the mould of Schmeichel or VDS. Just a solid GK who offers a stabil 7 every game. No blunder, a couple of great save every few games perhaps.
But Onana doesnt even provide that. Another several match with similar performance he'll be having a mountain to climb with his reputation as a clown in goals. We of all clubs should be familiar with GK being too mentally weak to play for United, we've had trains of them in past
But Onana doesnt even provide that. Another several match with similar performance he'll be having a mountain to climb with his reputation as a clown in goals. We of all clubs should be familiar with GK being too mentally weak to play for United, we've had trains of them in past
Sincerely doubt he will be here in 5 years time. His howlers in the Champions League have all but knocked us out of this year's competition. He's made some good saves but his reflexes are slow. He's not a complete disaster but he's nowhere near what it said on the tin when we bought him.
He reminds me of Roy Carroll, and not in a good way. Both just seem to choke at key moments.
He reminds me of Roy Carroll, and not in a good way. Both just seem to choke at key moments.
He signed for Fulham because Al Fayed promised they'd be the Man United of the South and paid him as such. He was sold a bill of goods.
Of course there's research process, as all the buy should go. But I don't think United bought a 35 y.o. Gk as a long-term target. He was never even the best Gk in PL when at Fulham. There wasn't any fuss or Fulham's resistance. It seemed like we're the only top team in the whole world that was interested on him that year.
Is it controversial to say that a steady eddy keeper like Sanchez may have been a better fit?
They didnt. Tony Coton's book said he suggested him to Fergie, who thought he'd half retired and didnt have it anymore. And Fergie saw him as a 2 year stop gap. Its only when he discovered just how well prepared he was he thought he could get 5 years out of him. Fergie wanted him in 1999, though.
Yes Sanchez is shite.
Both him and Raya have been mentioned quite a bit. Both have also made pretty big errors this season, they'd be getting slated just as much on here
No doubt. Although even at Fulham, he was Netherland's main Gk. So agreed with @ti vu , even it was a "punt" buy, it was a very calculated one.
Other top team already had their GK sorted. VdS very much forced his way out too since he didn't have much time left on his contract. Fulham didn't have much choice when selling VdS.
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/2295586/van-der-sar-wants-fulham-exit
And yes, VdS was not meant to be a long term solution given that his original contract was only two year. Tim Howard contract was freshly renewed, also hinted that VdS was originally meant to be stop gap, to help with Tim Howard development. However, soon VdS proved himself to be a good long term that Tim Howard got let go the following summer.
Profile wise, VdS is meant to be a GK with no weaknesses. Not every attribute is elite, but even the weaker areas are good to even very good level.
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I can’t really disagree with your analysis other than to shift the emphasis. You argue, in think, that Onana should have saved the first two shots, whereas I will only go so far as to say that he could have those shots. Either way, it’s pathetic management by the club that we have downgraded at keeper to the point where there’s no aspect of his game that improves us defensively or offensively over our previous keeper, who the mob here demanded we “get rid” of.
You bored mate?
That's what I get for being optimistic
Can someone make a poll, so everyone can express their opinion whether they think Onana has been an upgrade on our previous GK?
You need a very high level of consistency from your goalies and/or the ability to make world class saves. VDS is arguably the most consistent goalie I've ever seen. I can remember one or two mistakes from him, but that's about it. He was extremely consistent. He was also a good shot stopper, albeit not at Schmeichel's or DDG's level. VVD was also great with his feet - from what I've seen from Onana, I'd argue VDS was arguably consistently better. DDG was a world class shot stopper at his best, and he would keep us in games making saves that basically no other goalie would make - that was his forte, at his peak, and it was at such a high level that attackers started doubting scoring against him. Then he fell off a cliff, to an extent. Schmeichel had a little bit of everything. He was arguably as good a shot stopper as peak DDG, but in addition he was also the most commanding goalie I've ever seen in the box - both aerially and one on one against attackers. Simply majestic and frightening at the same time. He was also, at the time, a pretty good distributor - especially his throws were extremely long and accurate, and he did orchestrate quite a few counter attacks with his long throws to the wingers.
Onana needs to find his feet. I think he has some great attributes, but he needs to show consistency - it's still early days, but he needs not only consistency, but he needs a high level of consistency with some world class elements if he wants to succeed at United.
It was raining
I think he's largely been fine in the league to be honest.
It was always going to be a tough ask because there exists a large number of people waiting for him to fail and to make DDG comparisons.
The way I see it is, he's just got to get through this first 6-months, settle in, settle down and then we'll judge him from Christmas until the end of the season.
Being United's goalkeeper is arguably one of the toughest jobs in football, so he deserves some time.
It was always going to be a tough ask because there exists a large number of people waiting for him to fail and to make DDG comparisons.
The way I see it is, he's just got to get through this first 6-months, settle in, settle down and then we'll judge him from Christmas until the end of the season.
Being United's goalkeeper is arguably one of the toughest jobs in football, so he deserves some time.
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/david-de-gea-2022-23-performances.471392/post-30622801
Or to quote yourself:
"Nonsense. Find a keeper that suits the style ETH wants to play and you will see right away the difference it will make. Doesn't have to be 70-80m."
Is this good enough evidence?
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https://www.redcafe.net/threads/david-de-gea-2022-23-performances.471392/post-30622801
Or to quote yourself:
"Nonsense. Find a keeper that suits the style ETH wants to play and you will see right away the difference it will make. Doesn't have to be 70-80m."
Is this good enough evidence?
Maybe my reading isn't so good today.
But, where does it say anywhere there that a goalkeeper or Onana in particular would transform the attack?
Maybe you should go back to the DDG thread and do some reading, yes.
I think the Sanchez signing shows how difficult it is to find a steady eddy. People have this idea that a steady eddy does all the basics right and doesn’t make mistakes. But in reality only great keepers fit the profile. Sanchez regularly looks unsteady. Goalkeepers have a much harder and wider job now than they used to, keepers who used to be considered solid now have glaring weaknesses because they’re asked to do much more.
I have done. There is just one poster who keeps banging on about how others were saying a new keeper would transform the attack. Same poster carried it into pre season, specifically brought it up after Onana played less than one half of football for the club and has even carried it on into this thread too.
Here's one I did post.
I cannot find one example of anyone else directly blaming DDG for the team not finishing chances or actually posting that Onana or any that other keeper replacing DDG would have a transformational effect on the teams attacking output.
It's been 40 minutes
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Sommer was there for free, he is by far the best goalkeeper in the Serie A this season. Inter sold Onana and replaced him with a much better keeper for free. They also used that money to buy Pavard and Thuram, both would probably start today for us.
Excited to see what he’s got in store for us tonight. Can he make it 6 from 6?
He has it in his locker, so be ready.
But in the post I quoted to you, you are saying that if we just change DDG with a GK who suits ETH's style, right away we will see the difference it will make. I also remember you an me having the same debate and you claiming how easy it will be to replace DDG, because according to you he was total shit, and any semi decent GK will be better than him, Raya and Sanchez were constantly thrown with their performance stats. Now Raya and Sanchez have also both shown that they are absolute crap, just like Onana has been for us.
And neither does anyone say that finishing was expected to be improved by the new GK. He sloppily says "attack" and you've pretty much did say "transform the transition", and since we were proudly saying that we are mostly a team that is strong in the attacking transition under ETH, does it not mean the same?
No they do not mean the same thing.
DDG has easily been replaced. Onana is not crap, he hasn't covered himself in glory. But, just have a look at the stats and performance metrics. Aside from camera saves. He's not been markedly worse than DDG in any area.
Oh we are just making things up now.
looking forward to another Onana masterclass tonight, 3 easy goals seems to be the norm in Europe..
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