[Water Melon]

Ander wins lots of tackles and makes a lot of interceptions. Why would we want to replace him? He is the best winner of the ball in the league, he helps keep the ball and does not fold under pressure. He is no Busquets, but com'on he does not have Xavi and Iniesta next to him. He is no Keane, but there is no Fletcher, to cover his arse in case of emergency. If anything, he is adapting to that CDM position and is doing quite well. Fair play to a player, who loves being here and always tries his best.

 

[Lawman]

There is no extra stat to show. In case you haven't noticed the stat Herrera has beefed up most is not "tackles". It's "interceptions". I repeat "interceptions". A player needs to be able to cover passing angles well in order to make as many interceptions as Herrera did.

And he has kept shape well when Carrick isn't on the pitch.
When has this happened?
Then you'd say that Herrera doesn't offer ANYTHING in attack. But when Carrick's playing with Herrera pressing ahead, he's suddenly a headless chicken. Can't have it both ways.
Where did I say he was a headless chicken?


If Pogba, world's most expensive player can't grab the ball & dictate the tempo and has to rely on an inferior player in Herrera, technique-wise, there's no point in him playing.

What are you ranting about?

In case you haven't noticed yet, what Herrera excels at is "interceptions".

He does go around tackling people like Phil Neville and more often than not wins those. But he isn't running for the sake it. He is covering space as he is closing down the opponent. So, if he fails to win the tackle, no problem, he is going to intercept the pass. It's clever pressing. Not running like a headless chicken as you imply.

So I imply he's a headless chicken I never actually said that!

There is no extra stat to show. In case you haven't noticed the stat Herrera has beefed up most is not "tackles". It's "interceptions". I repeat "interceptions". A player needs to be able to cover passing angles well in order to make as many interceptions as Herrera did.

I understand what interceptions I repeat interceptions are! Herrera's interceptions come mostly when he shutting players down (a great skill to have) but the point I was making was it is very different from having defensive nous, like the previous poster had alluded to.

And he has kept shape well when Carrick isn't on the pitch. Then you'd say that Herrera doesn't offer ANYTHING in attack. But when Carrick's playing with Herrera pressing ahead, he's suddenly a headless chicken. Can't have it both ways.
Back to the headless chicken thing I never said!


If Pogba, world's most expensive player can't grab the ball & dictate the tempo and has to rely on an inferior player in Herrera, technique-wise, there's no point in him playing.

In no way does Pogba rely on Herrera it's obviously the other way around this season with Pogba taking the responsibility on playmaking.

In case you haven't noticed yet, what Herrera excels at is "interceptions".

Jesus you are ranting!

He does go around tackling people like Phil Neville and more often than not wins those. But he isn't running for the sake it. He is covering space as he is closing down the opponent. So, if he fails to win the tackle, no problem, he is going to intercept the pass. It's clever pressing. Not running like a headless chicken as you imply.

Look I never said he was a headless chicken once but you then state he is like Phil Neville so go and figure! Your post is a rant and laughable "interceptions I repeat interceptions" wtf you are like a 6 year old being sent to bed who's having a tantrum.
You have jumped to conclusions and got your knickers in a twist because some have dared to point out Herrera is not all that. He is a good premier league player much like Nicky Butt was but we need better long term.
Get a grip of yourself man before you post again!

 

[Lawman]

I said Herrera is very important because there is no one who is actually capable of doing his role for us in our team. You don't have to look beyond the Hull game when he helped us get a point by being the only player tracking back when they broke through on goal.

You still haven't mentioned a single player who can perform his role for us. Carrick is definitely not that player for us. Pogba surely isn't. Fellani - not a chance. So who?

Think you'll find it was Herrera that got caught out there and made good ground to get back.
It's a bit like the crowd favourite GK who drops the cross and makes a good save from the incoming striker for the crowd to then applaud him and then call him a great GK with saves like those!
The whole Herrera thing in here is bordering on cult like just the same as Blind was last year. With quotes such as "no team has 11 world class players" but with Blind last year what do you know we have replaced him with a relative unknown in Bailly who looks much better (he didn't have to be world class).
The same will be done with Herrera and much like the fan boys of Blind they will not come back into the forum and state you know what I was wrong.
By the way we just sold Morgan who was capable of similar traits and probably would not have got caught out in the first instance against Hull (not saying he's better or not just answering your question).

 

[m1y2]

Bit of an unnecessary long post, you agree with me about him not being world class, this was the point I was making.
Rooney because he also did the water carrying job in terms of playing left wing for a spell
It's possible to have ball winning midfielders that are world class you know.

okay, so name them? Rooney is certainly not a ball winning midfielder

 

[SirScholes]

Some realistic transfer options please? We always list Vidal and the likes but none of them are realistic. Hardly anyone has that passion to play for us- look at Vidal's case- we were reportedly interested in him, if he did fancy us, he'd have joined us then.
It's our obsession with big names that is behind all this criticism. Like I said earlier, he is statistically better than the benchmark we have set for players in his role, Kante. So, all other factors considered, he can't be that worse than him that we demand a replacement

Move on from stats please I'm not having Herrera is a better ball winner than kante.
I don't need to produce a list of players attainable to have the opinion that Herrera is decent not world class.
I'm not a scout

 

[SirScholes]

okay, so name them? Rooney is certainly not a ball winning midfielder

I don't have to mate, at no point did I say he was, just said he was asked to play left mid for fergie because he would put a shift in:
This is going round in circles, if you agree Herrera isn't world class then there is really no argument here

 

[m1y2]

I don't have to mate, at no point did I say he was, just said he was asked to play left mid for fergie because he would put a shift in:
This is going round in circles, if you agree Herrera isn't world class then there is really no argument here

he is not but he's an definite starter and must have player in the team capable of brilliant performances which he put in this year,throughout being very solid at worst. Well we all know how rooney looked in the midfield, he hasn't played left mid under fergie he played under the striker and dropped deep centrally when defending, he played a left striker for some time which was a good position for him when he was still agile...

Herrera is also asked to play deeper and sacrifice his ability for players like Pogba but he can adjust as he has different skillset than Wayne but let's not go argue about this as it's getting sort of off topic, think we pretty much agreed... just asked you if you could name some world class defensive midfielders, you failed to name any

 

[JeffBoomTetris]

So I imply he's a headless chicken I never actually said that!




Look I never said he was a headless chicken once but you then state he is like Phil Neville so go and figure! Your post is a rant and laughable "interceptions I repeat interceptions" wtf you are like a 6 year old being sent to bed who's having a tantrum.
You have jumped to conclusions and got your knickers in a twist because some have dared to point out Herrera is not all that. He is a good premier league player much like Nicky Butt was but we need better long term.
Get a grip of yourself man before you post again!

You are losing it as well. Calm down with the underlined sentences.

Of course, he's not all that. But who in the team is actually playing like him. Valencia? Carrick? Zlatan? Who else? I can't see it. He isn't going to play like you tell him to, or I for that matter. Only Jose decides best. And according to Jose's selection history, he's been a key player.

When has this happened?
Eh? Don't tell me you don't pay attention to a DMC playing. Just look at the last game against Leicester. We didn't have Carrick. But, Herrera did his job. He held the midfield by always providing an safe option. Result- we dominate ball. Leicester were limited to 1 shot on goal thanks in large part to the back 4 & the midfield 2.

In no way does Pogba rely on Herrera it's obviously the other way around this season with Pogba taking the responsibility on playmaking.
That's the way it should be. Pogba has his own duties and Herrera has his. But when Pogba isn't doing so, why should Herrera do 2 men's duties? Why are you criticizing Herrera for not taking initiative? See.... you are clearly contradicting yourself.

I understand what interceptions I repeat interceptions are! Herrera's interceptions come mostly when he shutting players down (a great skill to have) but the point I was making was it is very different from having defensive nous, like the previous poster had alluded to.
Does high tempo pressing mean a player has no defensive nous? Dare I say, he is defensively more complete of all the midfielders bar Carrick. Pogba might drop deep and cover sometimes but his decision making in the defensive phase needs a lot of work.

 

[SirScholes]

he is not but he's an definite starter and must have player in the team capable of brilliant performances which he put in this year,throughout being very solid at worst. Well we all know how rooney looked in the midfield, he hasn't played left mid under fergie he played under the striker and dropped deep centrally when defending, he played a left striker for some time which was a good position for him when he was still agile...

Herrera is also asked to play deeper and sacrifice his ability for players like Pogba but he can adjust as he has different skillset than Wayne but let's not go argue about this as it's getting sort of off topic, think we pretty much agreed... just asked you if you could name some world class defensive midfielders, you failed to name any

Leave the Rooney thing alone you haven't understood the point I'm making I'm not suggesting play him in midfield or at all, you picked up half a conversation and I can't be bothered to go through that all again.
So there or no world class midfielders capable of tackling at all in world football?
Modern day football hasn't any world class midfielders? Ok mate keep spinning that.
I'm not going into naming players, we've agreed he isn't world class, he is better than our other options at the job he is doing, but isn't world class.
This was the only point I was making

 

[Lawman]

You are losing it as well. Calm down with the underlined sentences.

Of course, he's not all that. But who in the team is actually playing like him. Valencia? Carrick? Zlatan? Who else? I can't see it. He isn't going to play like you tell him to, or I for that matter. Only Jose decides best. And according to Jose's selection history, he's been a key player.

When has this happened?
Eh? Don't tell me you don't pay attention to a DMC playing. Just look at the last game against Leicester. We didn't have Carrick. But, Herrera did his job. He held the midfield by always providing an safe option. Result- we dominate ball. Leicester were limited to 1 shot on goal thanks in large part to the back 4 & the midfield 2.

In no way does Pogba rely on Herrera it's obviously the other way around this season with Pogba taking the responsibility on playmaking.
That's the way it should be. Pogba has his own duties and Herrera has his. But when Pogba isn't doing so, why should Herrera do 2 men's duties? Why are you criticizing Herrera for not taking initiative? See.... you are clearly contradicting yourself.

I understand what interceptions I repeat interceptions are! Herrera's interceptions come mostly when he shutting players down (a great skill to have) but the point I was making was it is very different from having defensive nous, like the previous poster had alluded to.
Does high tempo pressing mean a player has no defensive nous? Dare I say, he is defensively more complete of all the midfielders bar Carrick. Pogba might drop deep and cover sometimes but his decision making in the defensive phase needs a lot of work.

I only underlined as to make clear the difference in my posts to yours.
Look it's clear where I stand with Herrera I think like Blind last year he is doing a good job but long term we need better.
Will we need a world class player to replace him no much like Bailley and Blind.
I realise he's a fan favourite but I'm just telling you my view.
I watch him a lot I'm a season ticket holder I do appreciate him but he is limited and nowhere near as good as some people say on here. I think he may find himself like Blind with less game time next year as if we sign Griezman and another midfielder as expected then he will be the one to sit out if we go 4231.
Time will tell but I was correct with Mata, Rooney, Darmain, Lingard and Blind (and wrong with Rojo, Morgan and Bastian) so I'm not infallible and happy to be proven wrong like Rojo is doing.

 

[m1y2]

Leave the Rooney thing alone you haven't understood the point I'm making I'm not suggesting play him in midfield or at all, you picked up half a conversation and I can't be bothered to go through that all again.
So there or no world class midfielders capable of tackling at all in world football?
Modern day football hasn't any world class midfielders? Ok mate keep spinning that.
I'm not going into naming players, we've agreed he isn't world class, he is better than our other options at the job he is doing, but isn't world class.
This was the only point I was making

better to leave rooney out, you didnt understand my point either so it's getting confusing for you now it seems, so you fail again to name a world class defensive midfielder with the qualities I mentioned, someone who is that little cut above herrera? I just wonder what is the player you are looking up to? What is so hard on to name players you rate higher?

I am loosing my patience with ppl like you who spout random general stuff and fail to be specific bcs they hardly understand some of the aspects of the game..

Herrera is one of the best in the league along with Kante in what he does and that's a fact without the need to really call players world class or not, even both players have quite different qualities between themselves so it'd be very black and white to praise one over other imo and yet you find ppl who will say no valencia had a better season, costa had a better season etc, well that's very subjective and unfair to call someone over others

 

[anant]

Move on from stats please I'm not having Herrera is a better ball winner than kante.
I don't need to produce a list of players attainable to have the opinion that Herrera is decent not world class.
I'm not a scout

All I'm saying is he can't be way worse than Kante, as his stats are better. Sure, Kante is better but Herrera isn't as far as from Kante's level as you seem to suggest

 

[SirScholes]

All I'm saying is he can't be way worse than Kante, as his stats are better. Sure, Kante is better but Herrera isn't as far as from Kante's level as you seem to suggest

Please find a quote where I have compared kante or any player to Herrera.
He isn't world class, there is better players, he is currently the best man for the job out of what we have.
There have been games he could of done more than just been a ball boy for pogba intact and there are games he's done well in.
Personally the last 4/5 games I've found him to consistently put on average performances.
But that's been discussed in post match threads already

 

[SirScholes]

better to leave rooney out, you didnt understand my point either so it's getting confusing for you now it seems, so you fail again to name a world class defensive midfielder with the qualities I mentioned, someone who is that little cut above herrera? I just wonder what is the player you are looking up to? What is so hard on to name players you rate higher?

I am loosing my patience with ppl like you who spout random general stuff and fail to be specific bcs they hardly understand some of the aspects of the game..

Herrera is one of the best in the league along with Kante in what he does and that's a fact without the need to really call players world class or not, even both players have quite different qualities between themselves so it'd be very black and white to praise one over other imo and yet you find ppl who will say no valencia had a better season, costa had a better season etc, well that's very subjective and unfair to call someone over others

Just a heads up if you use "text talk" you'll get a slap on the wrist.

I'm not going into naming players because it's not about comparing them it's about what they could bring to the team.

We've already agreed Herrera isn't world class so I don't understand what your getting your knickers in a twist over.

 

[VP89]

In which world had Carrick been better than Herrera? Carrick has had a few good games for us this season but we have got on fine without him.

Watch our games, and evaluate our record with and without Carrick in the team.

Seriously I need to stop this discussion because you don't get the point or are purposely being obtuse when you quote Bailly and Carrick as more important players to this team, especially considering that we have done fine without both but we have no one to replace Herrera with.

Don't use a lack of replacements to cite why a player is so great. He can be important by default of that circumstance, but it is not related to him as a player alone. If youre looking at output of our first XIs, Mkhitaryan, Zlatan, Bailly, Carrick, Valencia are are key.

As far as Kante is concerned, yes he was brilliant last season but Herrera has been better this season and I don't understand what exactly you are trying to prove by bringing up last season's performances by Kante for Leicester.

As for Nainggolan, it is again a case of the grass being greener and all. You have no idea how he will deal playing the role Herrera has had to play for us. So yes, you are way off the mark. Just because you will prefer another player doesn't mean Herrera is worse than him especially considering what we see every week and the stats themselves.

Oh ok, maybe we should stop looking at available players who could improve us all together. No fecking player arrives with a guaruntee label. What we do know is Nianggolan is a superior player to Herrera.

You are right. Stats aren't everything bt watching games are. Your midfield was torn apart by Spurs wih Kante in it. You are dreaming if you think Kante would walk into every team bar one.

This wasn't a quote to my post, but highlights your lack of knowledge about other teams. Kante would easily walk into any team in the league and Chelsea weren't "torn" apart by Spurs. Did you actually bother to watch the match?

Also I hate it when people nit pick faults in other players and forget there are games where Herrera himself has been embarassingly anonymous.

 

[bosnian_red]

He's been great out there today. If only he knew how to shoot first time

 

[Vaibhav Raj]

This might be one of those game where the team is playing so good everyone looks good, but Herrera's been an absolute one man army out there in the midfield. Top notch interceptions (I forgot the count of times he won the ball back) and very expressive with his passes.

 

[space]

Great so far

 

[Womp]

People asking what he is good at only need to watch the game today. He is everywhere. Was one point he nicked the ball back in the middle of the pitch and released MickyT(?) I think it was.

 

[Godfather]

Majestic performance so far.

 

[Joga Bonito]

Immense so far, that tackle he made midway through the half was glorious (think that was the one which got Mourinho applauding him on the touchline).

 

[sullydnl]

Playing very well, having a very good season. Good stuff.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

Kante-esque.

 

[Santoryo]

If Kante put in a performance like Herrera did in this half with winning every ball back and quickening the play he'd have been wanked all over by commentators and Caftards alike.

People will say Herrera is good after such performance and be cautious in their praise for him but if this was Kante I couldn't even begin to imagine the level of worshipping he'd have been getting.

 

[SwansonsTache]

Herrera putting in a display like today for any other side in the PL and we'd have a thread about his potential transfer to us in no time.

 

[Ish]

Aye, he's been magnificent.

 

[DWelbz19]

Been immense so far. Feels like he has tackled and intercepted everything.

 

[Zoo]

Immense today.

 

[Ish]

Second goal started with another tackle from him again. I'd love to see his stats when this match is done.

 

[Amar__]

Does nothing on the pitch. Poor man's Henderson.

Anyone has some stat or something about how many goals we scored after he's won the ball or started the counter attack?

 

[drdoityourself]

Ngolo Ander

 

[DWelbz19]

Anyone got his stats for the game? I'm sure they're very impressive.

 

[ivaldo]

Kante is a limited Herrera.

 

[klayton88]

Easily my MOTM and his best performance in a United shirt.

 

[anant]

Easily my MOTM and his best performance in a United shirt.

There is absolutely no way he'll put in a better shift than that Pool performance

 

[Kag]

He's a brilliant player. He can do a lot more in an attacking sense but it's not his job under Mourinho. He does what the manager demands down to a tee.

 

[Adisa]

Immense.

 

[JeffBoomTetris]

A subdued first half. But he rescued it with a steely performance in the 2nd half.

 

[Robbie Boy]

If Kante put in a performance like Herrera did in this half with winning every ball back and quickening the play he'd have been wanked all over by commentators and Caftards alike.

People will say Herrera is good after such performance and be cautious in their praise for him but if this was Kante I couldn't even begin to imagine the level of worshipping he'd have been getting.

Spot on. It's so bloody annoying, too.

 

[bugmat]

Won the ball that lead to both goals, but ppl here think he's shit.