[anant]

He isn't even in the first 5 names : Pogba, De Gea, Ibra, Valencia and Bailly when he's fit

Apart from Valencia, none of the players have had as good a season as Herrera has. Valencia is the only player for whom you can present a decent case for being the better player, although I'd still argue that Herrera has possibly been our best player this season

 

[Philadelphian]

Apart from Valencia, none of the players have had as good a season as Herrera has. Valencia is the only player for whom you can present a decent case for being the better player, although I'd still argue that Herrera has possibly been our best player this season

Valencia has no competition. Herrera's competition is Fellaini. Ever think that's why they could be first on the sheet?

 

[Giant Midget]

Ander completed more passes than anyone else on the pitch yesterday. I don't believe passing is something he has major struggles with.



As long as he's racking up these numbers to go with his passing, I think we can all accept Ander being a starting XI player for us.

The number of passes isn't an indicator of quality of passing.

Too often he'll mess up the weight and angle of even the simple balls, which means the receiving player has to take an extra touch to control it before they make their next move.

 

[DWelbz19]

He is the sort of player that fans like to have in their team but he wouldn't look out of place in a mid-level Premiership team imo.

Aye - our equivalent to Dier/Wanyama

 

[Donut]

I like Ander and his passion, but he can be very sloppy. To me he seems talented and with a good feel for the game, but like he only started playing football when he was 14.

 

[Cassidy]

The number of passes isn't an indicator of quality of passing.

Too often he'll mess up the weight and angle of even the simple balls, which means the receiving player has to take an extra touch to control it before they make their next move.

He also plays very good passes too especially finding players in the flanks and in behind the lines. He is not the best passer in the side, but he is good enough for the moment and he is also a very positive player. Id like us to think about upgraded him later on, but for now we have other areas of the pitch that require attention first.

 

[Janson]

I really can't see him as a starter next season when we get more quality in the starting 11, especially in a 4231. But that doesn't mean he won't have a role as a squad player.

Most important thing is to accomodate Pogba.

 

[Shark]

I love him in the team for his energy alone, but yeah, he's nowhere close to being a top drawer midfielder and never has been. I can definitely see him in a squad player role if we got a more complete midfielder in place of him.

 

[#07]

 

[Loublaze]

I know the fans and the press were outraged and/or made fun of LVG when he said this - but he was right. In fact, someone like Rashers may want to try this method initially until he gets his confidence back in front of goal.
Seems like LVG, in his own inimitable way, was aware how 'jittery' the team can be, and this was one way of helping them to stay composed in front of goal.

Certainly Ander should try this, cause his shooting is wild and all over the place.

It certainly is. Sometimes he doesn't even look up before he pulls the trigger.

 

[Lawman]

Apart from Valencia, none of the players have had as good a season as Herrera has. Valencia is the only player for whom you can present a decent case for being the better player, although I'd still argue that Herrera has possibly been our best player this season

Pogba, Zlatan, Valencia even Myktarin have all been better imo. What I would say about Herrera is he's been consistent alongside DDG Rojo (since he got in the team) and Valencia our standout player.

 

[Lawman]

I really can't see him as a starter next season when we get more quality in the starting 11, especially in a 4231. But that doesn't mean he won't have a role as a squad player.

Most important thing is to accomodate Pogba.

Spot on

 

[bucky]

I really can't see him as a starter next season when we get more quality in the starting 11, especially in a 4231. But that doesn't mean he won't have a role as a squad player.

Most important thing is to accomodate Pogba.

Considering we have more pressing issues elsewhere I think he'll probably keep his place.

 

[Mr Smith]

He also plays very good passes too especially finding players in the flanks and in behind the lines. He is not the best passer in the side, but he is good enough for the moment and he is also a very positive player. Id like us to think about upgraded him later on, but for now we have other areas of the pitch that require attention first.

Talking about upgrading on him, even in the long-term, is silly. You may be able to get a player with slightly better ability, but you can't replace his attitude or the fact that he bleeds United. He's a hugely important part of our side, and he does what he's supposed to do well, even if he's not a world-class midfielder. Football isn't about finding the best player in every position that we can get and fitting them into a side. Herrera offers us balance, as well as a true comittment to the cause, and that's more valuable by far than a little bit of extra skill, which we've got elsewhere anyway.

 

[Isotope]

Talking about upgrading on him, even in the long-term, is silly. You may be able to get a player with slightly better ability, but you can't replace his attitude or the fact that he bleeds United. He's a hugely important part of our side, and he does what he's supposed to do well, even if he's not a world-class midfielder. Football isn't about finding the best player in every position that we can get and fitting them into a side. Herrera offers us balance, as well as a true comittment to the cause, and that's more valuable by far than a little bit of extra skill, which we've got elsewhere anyway.

That also true. If we are aiming for the league, a long winding season ahead needs players with this attitude. And he's a good player as well.

 

[Cassidy]

Talking about upgrading on him, even in the long-term, is silly. You may be able to get a player with slightly better ability, but you can't replace his attitude or the fact that he bleeds United. He's a hugely important part of our side, and he does what he's supposed to do well, even if he's not a world-class midfielder. Football isn't about finding the best player in every position that we can get and fitting them into a side. Herrera offers us balance, as well as a true comittment to the cause, and that's more valuable by far than a little bit of extra skill, which we've got elsewhere anyway.

Fair point.

 

[EmPeeKay]

I love this guy, things happen on the pitch when he's in the starting 11 and he is not afraid to pull up his sleeves and put a real shift in. In addition to that he plays for the shirt and embraces the entire philosophy and culture of Manchester United.

He's one of our best players in the team at this moment in time and hopefully he will be with us for years to come.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Talking about upgrading on him, even in the long-term, is silly. You may be able to get a player with slightly better ability, but you can't replace his attitude or the fact that he bleeds United. He's a hugely important part of our side, and he does what he's supposed to do well, even if he's not a world-class midfielder. Football isn't about finding the best player in every position that we can get and fitting them into a side. Herrera offers us balance, as well as a true comittment to the cause, and that's more valuable by far than a little bit of extra skill, which we've got elsewhere anyway.

Good post.

 

[VP89]

Talking about upgrading on him, even in the long-term, is silly. You may be able to get a player with slightly better ability, but you can't replace his attitude or the fact that he bleeds United. He's a hugely important part of our side, and he does what he's supposed to do well, even if he's not a world-class midfielder. Football isn't about finding the best player in every position that we can get and fitting them into a side. Herrera offers us balance, as well as a true comittment to the cause, and that's more valuable by far than a little bit of extra skill, which we've got elsewhere anyway.

Are you saying Herrera is the only box to box midfielder who would have a loyal attitude towards his club?

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

Are you saying Herrera is the only box to box midfielder who would have a loyal attitude towards his club?

I think its hard to bring in a player in the middle of his career who feels such a connection to the club. Evra was one of them, Vidic too and I see the same in Herrera and to some extent Valencia as well. You kind of need that backbone to any quality side, otherwise it becomes a bunch of mercenaries like City or PSG.

 

[VP89]

I think its hard to bring in a player in the middle of his career who feels such a connection to the club. Evra was one of them, Vidic too and I see the same in Herrera and to some extent Valencia as well. You kind of need that backbone to any quality side, otherwise it becomes a bunch of mercenaries like City or PSG.

Evra was a world class left back and Vidic a world class centre back. Herrera is not close to world class. I agree you're only referring to attitude but its just a wishy washy statement for someone to claim a certain player's attitude cannot be replaced.

I think there are many potential box-to-box midfielders out there who would feel a similar commitment if they joined. We can name a good number of players who adored the club and didn't leave unless they were shown the door. Vidic, Evra, Rio, Herrera, Valencia are multiple examples from yourself. To me that says such attitude is readily available in certain profiles, not exclusive to Herrera.

 

[Stacks]

Pogba, Zlatan, Valencia even Myktarin have all been better imo. What I would say about Herrera is he's been consistent alongside DDG Rojo (since he got in the team) and Valencia our standout player.

Nonsense. Those players bolded have been patchy and done their job sporadically. Ander has done his job consistently like a Kante and the defensive contributions back this up. Miki and Zlatan are our best player but Miki didn't get into the team soon enough. Pogba has played the most and has been largely hit and miss; shown flashes, but indifferent many games which seem to pass him by especially the key ones. Valencia and Ander are too of our most consistent imo

 

[VP89]

Nonsense. Those players bolded have been patchy and done their job sporadically. Ander has done his job consistently like a Kante and the defensive contributions back this up. Miki and Zlatan are our best player but Miki didn't get into the team soon enough. Pogba has played the most and has been largely hit and miss; shown flashes, but indifferent many games which seem to pass him by especially the key ones. Valencia and Ander are too of our most consistent imo

Ironic.

 

[SirScholes]

Apart from Valencia, none of the players have had as good a season as Herrera has. Valencia is the only player for whom you can present a decent case for being the better player, although I'd still argue that Herrera has possibly been our best player this season

No, Valencia ibra with 20 goals is a great return and been more important given his lack of support in attack.
Dave has made what? 2 errors?
Bailley has been great every game
Herrera has been good in spells and anonymous in others especially during our run of draws against smaller teams

 

[SirScholes]

Evra was a world class left back and Vidic a world class centre back. Herrera is not close to world class. I agree you're only referring to attitude but its just a wishy washy statement for someone to claim a certain player's attitude cannot be replaced.

I think there are many potential box-to-box midfielders out there who would feel a similar commitment if they joined. We can name a good number of players who adored the club and didn't leave unless they were shown the door. Vidic, Evra, Rio, Herrera, Valencia are multiple examples from yourself. To me that says such attitude is readily available in certain profiles, not exclusive to Herrera.

Mate you can throw Anderson in there as well to help your point, loves the club, didn't count for much tho ha

 

[EmPeeKay]

Is it just me or are some people giving him the white glove treatment?
If we're brutaly honest, Pogba hasn't really hit the ground running either, but it seems he is cut a bit more slack because he is our "star signing".

 

[RedDevil@84]

Caf at it again. Herrera not world class enough to be in next season team. So as per caf

De Gea - Class
Valencia - Ok now. But need an upgrade
Bailly - Looks good
Jones/Smalling - Need an upgrade
Shaw - Doesn't play. But still world class. So ok
Rojo - Ok now. Need an upgrade.
Carrick - Old. Need an upgrade.
Blind - Need an upgrade
Herrera - Need an upgrade
Pogba - Class
Rooney - Old, Throw him out
Lingard - Not Utd level. Need an upgrade
Rashford - Potential is high. But can't be a starter
Mata - Not good enough, Need an upgrade
Miki - World class as of now
Ibra - World class. But getting old. Better get an upgrade.
Martial - Attitude problems, or Jose hates him. If he goes, need an upgrade.


Wonder from where do we get so many players who are willing to move to Utd and also would be at least better than the existing lot.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

Evra was a world class left back and Vidic a world class centre back. Herrera is not close to world class. I agree you're only referring to attitude but its just a wishy washy statement for someone to claim a certain player's attitude cannot be replaced.

I think there are many potential box-to-box midfielders out there who would feel a similar commitment if they joined. We can name a good number of players who adored the club and didn't leave unless they were shown the door. Vidic, Evra, Rio, Herrera, Valencia are multiple examples from yourself. To me that says such attitude is readily available in certain profiles, not exclusive to Herrera.

Even leaving aside the attitude, I'd love to know how many attainable midfielders are out there that can tackle, pass and play with the kind of energy he does while making a midfield two with Pogba work. I would assume there aren't many.

 

[Dobbs]

Caf at it again. Herrera not world class enough to be in next season team. So as per caf

De Gea - Class
Valencia - Ok now. But need an upgrade
Bailly - Looks good
Jones/Smalling - Need an upgrade
Shaw - Doesn't play. But still world class. So ok
Rojo - Ok now. Need an upgrade.
Carrick - Old. Need an upgrade.
Blind - Need an upgrade
Herrera - Need an upgrade
Pogba - Class
Rooney - Old, Throw him out
Lingard - Not Utd level. Need an upgrade
Rashford - Potential is high. But can't be a starter
Mata - Not good enough, Need an upgrade
Miki - World class as of now
Ibra - World class. But getting old. Better get an upgrade.
Martial - Attitude problems, or Jose hates him. If he goes, need an upgrade.


Wonder from where do we get so many players who are willing to move to Utd and also would be at least better than the existing lot.

There's a big swing of opinion on nearly all of the above players you've mentioned. So not sure how or why you're coming to a Caf concensus on each one.

Also we are after all 6th in the league and out of the ECL. Hardly outrageous to say some players need to be improved upon.

 

[VP89]

Even leaving aside the attitude, I'd love to know how many attainable midfielders are out there that can tackle, pass and play with the kind of energy he does while making a midfield two with Pogba work. I would assume there aren't many.

You want to know how many midfielders can tackle and pass with energy? Odd question as obviously there are many. He doesn't do either of them to a great level that certain posters suggest. He doesn't often find killer passes nor is he seemingly capable of long range vision. He tackles enough and is energetic no doubt, but that quality is there in many players from say Dembele, Kante, Gueye, Coquelan in the Premier League alone.

But to entertain your question - Nianggolan, Matuidi, Dembele, Niguez, Weigl are all much better players than Herrera is. Their attitude towards the respective clubs they play for is seen to be brilliant so I'm at odds as to why certain posters go over the top with "Yeah but Herrera bleeds United" and how he offers something no one else can.

 

[Dobbs]

You want to know how many midfielders can tackle and pass with energy? Odd question as obviously there are many. He doesn't do either of them to a great level that certain posters suggest. He doesn't often find killer passes nor is he seemingly capable of long range vision. He tackles enough and is energetic no doubt, but that quality is there in many players from say Dembele, Kante, Gueye, Coquelan in the Premier League alone.

But to entertain your question - Nianggolan, Matuidi, Dembele, Niguez, Weigl are all much better players than Herrera is. Their attitude towards the respective clubs they play for is seen to be brilliant so I'm at odds as to why certain posters go over the top with "Yeah but Herrera bleeds United" and how he offers something no one else can.

It's the post match interview. So much stock is put into these days. If a player or manager can say the right things they're onto a winner.

Not that I'm saying Herrera isn't committed on the pitch. He obviously is. I agree with you though that it's not some rare quality that's incredibly difficult to come by.

Bailly, Rojo, Valencia, Jones, Young, all show the same kind of attitude as far as I can see.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

You want to know how many midfielders can tackle and pass with energy? Odd question as obviously there are many. He doesn't do either of them to a great level that certain posters suggest. He doesn't often find killer passes nor is he seemingly capable of long range vision. He tackles enough and is energetic no doubt, but that quality is there in many players from say Dembele, Kante, Gueye, Coquelan in the Premier League alone.

But to entertain your question - Nianggolan, Matuidi, Dembele, Niguez, Weigl are all much better players than Herrera is. Their attitude towards the respective clubs they play for is seen to be brilliant so I'm at odds as to why certain posters go over the top with "Yeah but Herrera bleeds United" and how he offers something no one else can.

Well I'm not someone who takes that into account as a sole reason someone should play over someone else but Niguez and Weigl are certainly better players even if neither of them appear to be attainable from their current clubs. I'd think Herrera is about the same class of a player as Dembele, Nainggolan or Matuidi. Suggesting they are each "much" better than him would make you guilty of not recognizing his on-field value beyond his passion for the club.

 

[VP89]

Well I'm not someone who takes that into account as a sole reason someone should play over someone else but Niguez and Weigl are certainly better players even if neither of them appear to be attainable from their current clubs. I'd think Herrera is about the same class of a player as Dembele, Nainggolan or Matuidi. Suggesting they are each "much" better than him would make you guilty of not recognizing his on-field value beyond his passion for the club.

I wholly disagree - such is the overrating of Herrera at this place. Dembele is quite obviously a superior player to Herrera, as is Nianggolan or Matuidi. I watch every game of Ander, he's a clean player that puts himself about, but honestly that is it. There is little further he does. There are quite a few big games where we fail to control the game as well as we should and the burden of that rests on players like Carrick and Herrera.

Nianggolan can really boss games and although I've seen less of him he certainly takes control of games more than Herrera does and chips in with occasional goals to help the team. Matuidi tends to be more split on opinion, he was certainly a beast pre-injury and I'm not sure how he's doing now. And going back to Dembele, he is literally better in every department. I'm quite suprised you think Herrera and Dembele are the same level.

 

[m1y2]

I wouldn't be surprised if those shots were some sort of tactic by Jose. A lot of the times Herrera takes those shots he is higher up on the pitch so there isn't much support for the defence as he's stationed in and around the box. By smashing it either stops any potential counter attacks and on the rare occasion it could result in a goal.

How do I know this? No fecking idea, just an assumption as a lot of the times he smashes those shots it's when the ball is there to be won.

well I think you got the point, certainly when you commit so many players forward it's a must to finish the attack, his role in the team should be clear to everyone by now, Jose gives him specific instruction to stay more back and hover around win the balls back set the counters, keep it easy so the other palyer can dwell on the ball longer in advanced positions etc etc.

But when he commits himself it needs to result in a finished attack because Pogba is not so reliable to defend and cover but as the time goes and our new supermidfield gels I think it can be little more interchangable. I think Jose might not counted with having too allround midfield before he came here, Pogba was a must buy no matter what kind of midfielder Jose would prefer so it will be interesting to see what his plans are, try to find a direct replacament for Carrick, I am no scout but there might not be a similar player around available and he didnt really rely on him this season until after he proved his worth. Pogba wasnt really stable at the beginning and Fellaini have played a lot when he should stay on the bench so Carrick was a welcomed player even he didnt really counted with him as a first option and he really shouldn't be as he's just too old and will hang up his boots soon.

Soooo I think we will get either different type of no6 or Herrera will continue his transformation into a 6 and Pogba will be moulding into a more B2B player who in big games will be more playmaking from deeper positions and covering the back 4 with Ander or will push forward more in easier games leaving us little exposed but by that time Herrera could master that role and with aggressive back four, the third attacking but fast aggressive player like Mhki and fluid players all over the pitch we could cover for that easily against lesser teams when we attack more anyway.

All in all ander's shooting will always going to be little wild as he just can't lose the balls in that areas

 

[roonster09]

Well I'm not someone who takes that into account as a sole reason someone should play over someone else but Niguez and Weigl are certainly better players even if neither of them appear to be attainable from their current clubs. I'd think Herrera is about the same class of a player as Dembele, Nainggolan or Matuidi. Suggesting they are each "much" better than him would make you guilty of not recognizing his on-field value beyond his passion for the club.

What is that Weigl does so well that Herrera can't? I always see people saying him as Carrick replacement but whenever I watch Dortmund play I was never impressed with his play. He is good player and played good but not sure why he is rated so highly.

Defensively is he better than Herrera? Weigl - 1.3 tackles and 2.5 interceptions per game whereas Herrera wins 2.34 tackles and 3.5 interceptions per game.

Passing? Weigl completes 90% whereas Herrera completes 88%.

Movement so that he is available for pass? Weigl plays 77 passes per game whereas Herrera 79.6 passes per game.

More inventive passes? Weigl - 0.24 key passes and 0.24 chances created per game whereas Herrera 1.25 and 1.40 respectively.

Better in the air? Herrera wins 59% aerial duels compared to 52% by Weigl.

Maybe something that can't be measured in stats like closing down and work rate? I doubt it.

Not saying Weigl is bad player as he isn't, in fact very good player but what is that he does so much better than Herrera?

Similarly I checked the stats for Saul also, there isn't a stat where he is better than Herrera (the one's I mentioned above)

I know judging just by stats is not the say but I really doubt Weigl is any better than what we already have.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

I wholly disagree - such is the overrating of Herrera at this place. Dembele is quite obviously a superior player to Herrera, as is Nianggolan or Matuidi. I watch every game of Ander, he's a clean player that puts himself about, but honestly that is it. There is little further he does. There are quite a few big games where we fail to control the game as well as we should and the burden of that rests on players like Carrick and Herrera.

Nianggolan can really boss games and although I've seen less of him he certainly takes control of games more than Herrera does and chips in with occasional goals to help the team. Matuidi tends to be more split on opinion, he was certainly a beast pre-injury and I'm not sure how he's doing now. And going back to Dembele, he is literally better in every department. I'm quite suprised you think Herrera and Dembele are the same level.

Yeah, I'm not seeing it and stats confirm my intuition.

 

[Orc]

If you use your eyes, though, you'll see that Dembele is the better player. Just like someone used stats last week to try to say that Herrera is better than Kante. Stats don't tell the entire story.

 

[VP89]

Yeah, I'm not seeing it and stats confirm my intuition.

If you use your eyes, though, you'll see that Dembele is the better player. Just like someone used stats last week to try to say that Herrera is better than Kante. Stats don't tell the entire story.

This. I can look at stats when I'm less familiar on the players in comparison, but by watching both players every week its clear that Dembele is a better midfielder than Herrera.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

If you use your eyes, though, you'll see that Dembele is the better player. Just like someone used stats last week to try to say that Herrera is better than Kante. Stats don't tell the entire story.

How else would you view those stats?

 

[Ole90+3]

I wholly disagree - such is the overrating of Herrera at this place. Dembele is quite obviously a superior player to Herrera, as is Nianggolan or Matuidi. I watch every game of Ander, he's a clean player that puts himself about, but honestly that is it. There is little further he does. There are quite a few big games where we fail to control the game as well as we should and the burden of that rests on players like Carrick and Herrera.

I can't remember reading anything so painfully wrong on these forums. I would almost think your a WUM but the amount of replies of you've gotten indicates otherwise.