Alejandro Garnacho (out) | Chelsea make enquiries

Please. He's nowhere near Amad technically. Posters are seriously overrating Garnacho here.
Yeah that’s a mad statement.

Amad is quicker, better at dribbling, better defensively, presses better, better at shooting, better at picking a pass, I’m not sure where the list ends.
 
I’m not sure about this one. I’ve had issues with his decision making, but he’s only 20 and I find him oddly dangerous whenever he plays - even with some of his technical deficiencies he seems to always be some sort of a threat. I feel that if/when it clicks, he’ll be one of those guys that puts big numbers on the board. He seems to have the drive
 
Thing I find crazy, Lecce want 34m reportedly for Dorgu but we will settle for 50m for a player who's prem proven with masses of potential to be a big player.
It’s explained by the fact Dorgu’s true value is around £10m, while Garnacho’s is around £60m.
 
He's a player who we signed a couple of years ago for a few hundred thousand, has had some good moments and is an okay talent. 70 million would be incredible money.

He is also statistically the best 20 year old in the league. And at least for some of us, a very high ceiling. If you judge him for what he is today, then I agree 70m is good.
 
For whatever reason I just can’t find myself annoyed or sad at his exit if it raises us solid funds.

When all is said and done I can’t help but think that his potential is capped by his lack of pace and power and personality wise I can’t shrug the feeling that there is always going to be some low key drama with him.

Better players than him have left the club and better players will in the future. He’s no really an academy product, despite what his homegrown status might suggest.
Yeah lack of pace is a killer. Could never understand people saying that he’s pacey.
 
Please. He's nowhere near Amad technically. Posters are seriously overrating Garnacho here.
He is very young and need patient for him to develop. He is already putting in good numbers in PL at this age. He hasn't get used to a new system yet.

Amad was nowhere near PL level at 20. Of course, Amad is the better player now and I hope Garnacho will be as good soon.

Just a few months ago we have Amad, Garnacho and Mainoo as the future of Man Utd. Fast forward now, people want Mainoo and Garnacho to be sold already.
 
He is very young and need patient for him to develop. He is already putting in good numbers in PL at this age. He hasn't get used to a new system yet.

Amad was nowhere near PL level at 20. Of course, Amad is the better player now and I hope Garnacho will be as good soon.

Just a few months ago we have Amad, Garnacho and Mainoo as the future of Man Utd. Fast forward now, people want Mainoo and Garnacho to be sold already.


Mainoo?
 
He is very young and need patient for him to develop. He is already putting in good numbers in PL at this age. He hasn't get used to a new system yet.

Amad was nowhere near PL level at 20. Of course, Amad is the better player now and I hope Garnacho will be as good soon.

Just a few months ago we have Amad, Garnacho and Mainoo as the future of Man Utd. Fast forward now, people want Mainoo and Garnacho to be sold already.

Yeah, I'm okay with both being sold. It will quickly fix the PSR issue and allow proper players to be brought in that fit the manager. Don't really see what the problem is with that, to be honest. A lot of bed-wetting for nothing. But I highly doubt this club is capable of spending that money well, including the random fecks INEOS brought in, so it's highly likely they will be replaced with the same for more money, or just straight up worse. But maybe worth a try.
 
Excuse my ignorance of current Serie A, but does Conte still play 3 at the back? If so, why is he looking at Garnacho if we can't seem to fit him into a similar system? Is he seeing something Amorim can't, or is it just that Serie A may be an easier league for AG to perform in?

I still wouldn't mind seeing him tried at LWB so we become a bit more attacking in those areas. Having Maz and Dalot as the WBs really does make us pretty much a flat 5 at the back.
 
The reason why Garnacho has to imminently is because he's delaying the squad adapting to Amorim's system. Let me explain.

Amorim wants him to play more centrally and in the half spaces, but there hasn't been a single game where he's done that. Not a single one. So we've got an issue :-

Either he can't understand what is expected from him positionally or he refuses to apply the role expected of him. Both are not good.

For eg. When Garnacho plays he chooses to go out to the wing, which forces the LWB (usually Dalot) into the left sided no. 10 position. Amorim dislikes players swapping positions for structural reasons.

The last thing a team needs when trying to learn a new system is to complicate it by players rotating roles in game. This is what Garnacho forces on the team when he plays. Folks, you have to see this surely!
 
Excuse my ignorance of current Serie A, but does Conte still play 3 at the back? If so, why is he looking at Garnacho if we can't seem to fit him into a similar system? Is he seeing something Amorim can't, or is it just that Serie A may be an easier league for AG to perform in?

I still wouldn't mind seeing him tried at LWB so we become a bit more attacking in those areas. Having Maz and Dalot as the WBs really does make us pretty much a flat 5 at the back.
If he wants him, he wants him, not our problem where he plays once gone.
 
He is very young and need patient for him to develop. He is already putting in good numbers in PL at this age. He hasn't get used to a new system yet.

Amad was nowhere near PL level at 20. Of course, Amad is the better player now and I hope Garnacho will be as good soon.

Just a few months ago we have Amad, Garnacho and Mainoo as the future of Man Utd. Fast forward now, people want Mainoo and Garnacho to be sold already.
I’m not a fan of the “he’s young” excuse. Garnacho has already made around 120 senior appearances for the club, which is more than enough to fairly assess his abilities. And let’s be clear, progression isn't always linear; there’s no guarantee that he’ll suddenly improve after this point, especially when he's been consistent in showing the same limitations across all those appearances.

In all his appearances so far, Garnacho hasn't shown himself to be anything more than an average winger. I've expressed similar concerns about him before, and they still stand: he struggles in multiple areas(poor dribbler, poor finisher, weak physically, no blistering pace) not just decision-making, which is often attributed to his age and the only thing people notice as his weakness. If we can get anything close to £60-70m for him, it would be a great deal, considering it would be our second-largest sale ever—especially for a player who still has so much to prove.

With Mainoo, I’m willing to be a bit more patient. He doesn’t have the same number of senior appearances as Garnacho and has had stop-start seasons due to injuries. But make no mistake—Mainoo has a few deficiencies in his game as well. Poor atheleticism(no pace, poor stamina as he struggles to last full games), poor at progressive passing that he needs to be addressing.
 
Excuse my ignorance of current Serie A, but does Conte still play 3 at the back? If so, why is he looking at Garnacho if we can't seem to fit him into a similar system? Is he seeing something Amorim can't, or is it just that Serie A may be an easier league for AG to perform in?

I still wouldn't mind seeing him tried at LWB so we become a bit more attacking in those areas. Having Maz and Dalot as the WBs really does make us pretty much a flat 5 at the back.

Because i think Conte plays a 343?

We play a 3421.

Its the one thing i dont like about Amorims tactics - if he would be flexible enough to allow us to play 343 he can have the perfect balance of his tactics, the players of his disposal and even the history of the club having wonderful front 3's..

However, he is so strict with his tactics that he continues to play Bruno as a wide AM and Zirkzee as a target man.
 
Of course, I don't give a shite about Napoli, but I am interested in how we could potentially use him differently if he stays.
Purely guesswork since I know nothing about Napoli, but he might play 3-4-3 with wingers up top. Kvaradona was also playing on the wing for them, and can't imagine it was wing back
 
Why are we even considering selling a player who could have higher ceiling than Amad?
Few things wrong with this statement..

1. Garnacho doesn't currently have a higher floor than Amad, and I don't think he has a higher ceiling either. His main attributes seem to be just getting past a player with pace. He's a winger in a system we are trying to build with Amorim that doesn't really use traditional wingers. I don't see that he really fits what we need in one of the two 10's, he'd probably be a wing back but I don't think he'd want to play there. He's not that great at dribbling, his technical ability is far lower than Amad's and I don't think that long term he will give the defensive work rate needed for WB. He is obviously a talent and he is doing well for us, I would argue however that Amad is more talented than him, and we have more talented lads in the academy currently than when he was the same age in the academy.

2. I don't think we are actively looking to sell him in any way. But there are a few factors that go into this;
- We need a massive rebuild and we are completely skint.
- He has an academy player which means any amount of money we make on Garnacho is pure profit, this goes a long way to helping us fund our transfer spending in January and in the summer for a rebuild that is massively needed.
- He cost us a few hundred thousand, and he could go for anywhere between 50-70mill, that's an insane profit, and we have to think about whether his current and potential future output will compare with this amount of money and how it could help us to build up the team.
- Any player is up for sale technically, that doesn't mean we are actively looking to sell them, but if a team comes in with an amount of money that seems suitable we clearly aren't going to say no either, we'd be stupid to at least not consider offers if they are above our valuation for example, rather than just flat out saying no.
- These teams have clearly gotten some kind of encouragement from somewhere in order to continue their pursuit, meaning it's likely Garnacho or his team have let them know he would be interested.
- There have been issues and questions asked about Garnacho's attitude and commitment at times, it may be that Amorim doesn't like what he see's and if a team wants to take that off our hands for a lot of money, again, we'd be silly not to at least hear them out.
 
Maybe Garnacho is pushing for a move. He's just going about it in a far more professional manner than the other guy.
 
Excuse my ignorance of current Serie A, but does Conte still play 3 at the back? If so, why is he looking at Garnacho if we can't seem to fit him into a similar system? Is he seeing something Amorim can't, or is it just that Serie A may be an easier league for AG to perform in?

I still wouldn't mind seeing him tried at LWB so we become a bit more attacking in those areas. Having Maz and Dalot as the WBs really does make us pretty much a flat 5 at the back.
He changed it up a few weeks into the season and plays 4-3-3 now.
 
Because i think Conte plays a 343?

We play a 3421.

Its the one thing i dont like about Amorims tactics - if he would be flexible enough to allow us to play 343 he can have the perfect balance of his tactics, the players of his disposal and even the history of the club having wonderful front 3's..

However, he is so strict with his tactics that he continues to play Bruno as a wide AM and Zirkzee as a target man.
I just remember Conte fielding 2 very defensive midfielders (Kane/Matic) and having Alonso and Moses as wing backs, and they definitely provided the width, so not much different to us in principle. However, in practice we look much more like a 5-4-1 at the moment, which is why I'd prefer more attacking players in the WB positions.
 
Yeah lack of pace is a killer. Could never understand people saying that he’s pacey.
He’s got decent pace, but he’s no young Giggs. He does have real tenacity and intensity to his game though. In terms of pace, he goes flat out too much. Same as Rashford. The best players keep a little in reserve so they can fool the defender. Amad is great at that. Arguably slower top speed, but he’s has an extra gear that keeps fooling defenders.
 
Its the bitter pill we need to take to get some players in who can actually benefit the formation and this team. I would love to keep him in the squad however the financial situation is asking us to take some tough decisions for the short/medium term vision of the club.
 
Maybe Garnacho is pushing for a move. He's just going about it in a far more professional manner than the other guy.
This seems very possible. I don’t think he has made any secret of his desire to ultimately play in Spain and he may well consider a move from United to a potential title winning side in Italy as a good next step. Having won the Youth Cup, Carabao and FA Cups with us he might feel he has maxed out with us clearly years away from a title challenge. I could not be mad at him if that is what he wants to do, he is not a local lad and he is right to do what he believes is best for his career.
 
Yeah lack of pace is a killer. Could never understand people saying that he’s pacey.
Pace is great but how it is used is far more important. Dan James had pace, Rashford has pace, Bernardo Silva is a snail in comparison but who was has been the more dangerous wide player of the three over their careers?
 
Are we going to sell a player of great potential and replace him with players who may or may not improve us. Given our track record of late it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.

What a mess this club is.
 
He’s got decent pace, but he’s no young Giggs. He does have real tenacity and intensity to his game though. In terms of pace, he goes flat out too much. Same as Rashford. The best players keep a little in reserve so they can fool the defender. Amad is great at that. Arguably slower top speed, but he’s has an extra gear that keeps fooling defenders.
I watched an old clip of United v Chelsea earlier. Schmeichel kicked the ball down the wing and Giggs left the fullback absolutely floundering in his rear view mirror, before crossing on the run for Hughes to knock in. The commentator said “it’s like a mini trying to catch a Porsche” or something like that. It really made me miss us having that lightening pace, it was a real threat. We haven’t really had it since Ronaldo
 
Pace is great but how it is used is far more important. Dan James had pace, Rashford has pace, Bernardo Silva is a snail in comparison but who was has been the more dangerous wide player of the three over their careers?
Yeah but Bernardo silva isn’t a one trick pony and has a footballing IQ.

That said I’d absolutely take Dan James in a wingback role right now
 
Are we going to sell a player of great potential and replace him with players who may or may not improve us. Given our track record of late it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.

What a mess this club is.
Potential means little at this club nowadays, there isn't a single player that has developed and delivered on their early promise at this club in the past decade.
 
Excuse my ignorance of current Serie A, but does Conte still play 3 at the back? If so, why is he looking at Garnacho if we can't seem to fit him into a similar system? Is he seeing something Amorim can't, or is it just that Serie A may be an easier league for AG to perform in?

I still wouldn't mind seeing him tried at LWB so we become a bit more attacking in those areas. Having Maz and Dalot as the WBs really does make us pretty much a flat 5 at the back.

I think they play 4 at the back. Looks like they don't really have wingbacks in the squad or CB depth. I assume it's just a like for like Kvara replacement.
 
Its the bitter pill we need to take to get some players in who can actually benefit the formation and this team. I would love to keep him in the squad however the financial situation is asking us to take some tough decisions for the short/medium term vision of the club.
This is the crux of the matter and, in addition, he is unlikely to reach his potential the longer he plays under Amorim because what he is being asked to do is way out of his natural strengths. So refusing £50m now could easily turn into a free loan plus half the wages covered in a couple of years.

There was a time we thought Martial, Rashford and Greenwood were the future of the club but we will be luck to recoup anything more than £25m for them.

Getting £50m for him could allow us to bring 3 players, if we play our cards right, negotiate the right fees and get our our talent ID right. That's what we need now and it's sad that we might have to part with him due to big mistakes made in the past but it is what it is.
 
The question isn’t should you sell Garnacho for 60/70m, it’s do you trust Manchester United to spend that money to improve the squad vs just keeping him.

Nope not at all with these leeches, agree with @pocco about Kobbie because need money. Saw someone say they would turn on INEOS if they sold him well already have so no bother