A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino

Does Bayern Munich not want him? There was a link there a few weeks back although don't know how much substance as think it came from u.k media. Given Sarri is looking unconvincing at Juve I could see him there next season and also at PSG as don't think Tuchel will be there unless they win CL.

Plenty of top CL jobs he'll be in contention for imo. If Arsenal sack Emery in next few weeks I wonder if he'd actually consider that....Sol Campbell did of course.
 
Dinghy said:
Except beating good teams away (top 6), which Ole has already done more times than Pochettino. That's a sign of a tactically inept manager as he's had a strong squad to work with, and his style of football really isn't all that.
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I doubt anyone gave a shite about that while Spurs were finishing second and third. I doubt I will either if he did the same here. Weird how a tactically inept manager can finish that high in the league the last 4 seasons.

His problem has been winning trophies and not bottling down big games but he has never been tactically inept.

Also weird how people here have no problem anymore with us parking the bus in big games under Ole while they were slaughtering the gell out of it under Mourinho saying worse teams play better football against big boys. I myself don't have much problem with defensive tactics, but changing stances is interesting.
 
el3mel said:
Get him in. Yeah he has problems with winning trophies, but he'll rebuild the squad, coach proper football, and develop young players. He'll do everything Ole may "try" to do but more successfully and can do even more. Will be madness to stick with Ole next season and let him go to Madrid or Bayern.

He might not win trophies here but he'll perfect for our current state.
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Exactly what Ole is doing. So replacing him would be just stupid move right now. Poch would ”try” to do everything is doing.

Champagne Football said:
The money would be for him to take the Bayern job and win endless trophies in his sleep there, which would certainly silence the doubters who harp on about him not winning anything.
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Winning with Bayern is not that difficult. Almost like winning with PSG.

ivaldo said:
Spurs finished 4th and 5th four times out of the previous 5 seasons. Even the season where AVB got relegated they came 6th, with Sherwood finishing up the season with top 4 form. This notion that he single handedly took them from obscurity to relevancy is a bit of a fallacy. Let's not forget the successful transfers were a product of Levy and the scouting network, and not Poch - the man's said so much himself. The budget might well have been modest, but the signings were incredibly savvy. If Eriksen, for example, cost them £50m more it doesn't somehow make him a better player.
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Thank you. I’ve been trying to tell people few months back that Poch came to a team full of professionals. Not some club fighting against relegation.

Steerpike said:
I'm surprised at the speed of events with Spurs and Poch parting ways. I've no doubt the calls here on the cafe for Poch to replace Ole will be deafening, despite the fact that Spurs look set to replace Poch with someone most of us couldn't get rid of quickly enough (myself included), and despite the fact Spurs have won f-all under Poch.

Poch isn't the answer (he may not even want the job!). Be careful what you wish for!
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Agree.

Forevergiggs1 said:
The difference between Poch and Ole is when Poch took over Español they were rock bottom and he managed to secure a midtable finish for them, whereas Ole went down. Pochs' second season he had them mid table again which for a team like Español is like winning the lottery because they're nearly always flirting with relegation.

The reason he was sacked was because he wasn't given the funds to help build a team to consolidate their position in la liga. It doesn't matter how good a manager you are. If you can't bring in better players than what you have then you're doomed. Just presenting facts.
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Do you really watch spanish football because your fact is wrong. Espanyol were not rock bottom. They were 3 from bottom.
He got sacked because Espayol were last when that happened and he was complaining he didn’t get founds to buy players. That is just talk because he had a team that should be much higher up. Check your facts better next time.
 
Beachryan said:
Mate, please do compare Pochs premier league record to Oles.
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Will do, Ole's already got more away wins against top 6 than Poch. He's got way more points than Poch during his time as United-manager, with a worse squad. And he's beaten him twice (one pre-season game).
 
It's also funny that when Spurs were about to start being considered a big club and the expectations changed, Pochettino crumbled and couldn't handle the pressure. Yet people are 100% certain he is world class and will be a success at Manchester United, where managers like Louis van Gaal and Jose Mourinho failed.
 
Not the biggest fan of Poch, but he's clearly a better manager than Ole.

Get him in now and back him in the summer.

Doubt any of those hot prospect Bundesliga managers would join us.
 
Dinghy said:
Will do, Ole's already got more away wins against top 6 than Poch. He's got way more points than Poch during his time as United-manager, with a worse squad. And he's beaten him twice (one pre-season game).
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Oh cool, great. So Oles points per match is better? His win ratio? You know, those little things that determine where in that table thing we finish?

Jesus wept, Oles premier record is worse than Moyes. What is wrong with people?!?!?
 
Dinghy said:
Will do, Ole's already got more away wins against top 6 than Poch. He's got way more points than Poch during his time as United-manager, with a worse squad. And he's beaten him twice (one pre-season game).
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Is that true? Wow.
 
el3mel said:
I doubt anyone gave a shite about that while Spurs were finishing second and third. I doubt I will either if he did the same here. Weird how a tactically inept manager can finish that high in the league the last 4 seasons.

His problem has been winning trophies and not bottling down big games but he has never been tactically inept.

Also weird how people here have no problem anymore with us parking the bus in big games under Ole while they were slaughtering the gell out of it under Mourinho saying worse teams play better football against big boys. I myself don't have much problem with defensive tactics, but changing stances is interesting.
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His Spurs-side has looked awful in a lot of these big games and crumbled under pressure, that's not a good sign. And he has had 5 years and a strong squad to do something about it, which he till this day weren't able to do.

As for the Mourinho-comparison , you're really comparing our high pressing under Ole with what we saw under Mourinho? We couldn't even put together one decent counter-attack a' game when he was here. It's not remotely the same at all. Not to mention that we've had big injuries to many of our best players.
 
How many times do we have to put up with the club's and certain fans inadequacy. This is another round of coaches being available who are world class / better than our current dreadful management. Ole's fans are using the longevity argument as a thesis to back mediocrity but if you give Ole 3 years with Manchester United and Poch 3 years with Manchester United on the basis of what we have seen who is the most likely to attain success ? The probability scenarios of success under Ole are about as useful as his Norwegian cup title win, it didn't stop him falling elsewhere as he's currently failing now.

If your a billionaire investor and you have a choice to invest in either Ole or Poch for the credibility of your asset as well as the success you'd be a fool to even have to consider anything.
 
Dinghy said:
His Spurs-side has looked awful in a lot of these big games and crumbled under pressure, that's not a good sign. And he has had 5 years and a strong squad to do something about it, which he till this day weren't able to do.

As for the Mourinho-comparison , you're really comparing our high pressing under Ole with what we saw under Mourinho? We couldn't even put together one decent counter-attack a' game when he was here. It's not remotely the same at all. Not to mention that we've had big injuries to many of our best players.
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High pressure, what high pressure? Do you watch our big games? We had 32% against Liverpool at home, 34% possession against Chelsea at the bridge. Even when we defeated them 4-0, they had more possession and more shots. Even when we defeated Spurs last season, we had 38% possession and defended for our lives in second half. Also during our FA Cup run last season we had 33% possession when we defeated Chelsea and 37% when we defeated Arsenal. I can go on. Had 35% possession when we drew with Liverpool 0-0..and so on.

Ole's style in big games can be described by any thing bar high pressing fantasy. I have no problem with defensive tactics as I said but trying to change the narrative and put a daydream fantasy like we high press in big games is what I have problem with. Our tactics in big games are still park our big bus and hope for a counter, individual skill or a set piece to get our goals.
 
passing-wind said:
How many times do we have to put up with the club's and certain fans inadequacy. This is another round of coaches being available who are world class / better than our current dreadful management. Ole's fans are using the longevity argument as a thesis to back mediocrity but if you give Ole 3 years with Manchester United and Poch 3 years with Manchester United on the basis of what we have seen who is the most likely to attain success ? The probability scenarios of success under Ole are about as useful as his Norwegian cup title win, it didn't stop him falling elsewhere as he's currently failing now.

If your a billionaire investor and you have a choice to invest in either Ole or Poch for the credibility of your asset as well as the success you'd be a fool to even have to consider anything.
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Agree. It will be madness for me to ignore the managerial big changing round that's going to happen in next summer to stick with Ole. For me that will end in tears when next season came. Hopefully the board isn't stupid, even though I bet they are.
 
el3mel said:
High pressure, what high pressure? Do you watch our big games? We had 32% against Liverpool at home, 34% possession against Chelsea at the bridge. Even when we defeated them 4-0, they had more possession and more shots. Even when we defeated Spurs last season, we had 38% possession and defended for our lives in second half. Also during our FA Cup run last season we had 33% possession when we defeated Chelsea and 37% when we defeated Arsenal. I can go on. Had 35% possession when we drew with Liverpool 0-0..and so on.

Ole's style in big games can be described by any thing bar high pressing fantasy. I have no problem with defensive tactics as I said but trying to change the narrative and put a daydream fantasy like we high press in big games is what I have problem with. Our tactics in big games are still park our big bus and hope for a counter, individual skill or a set piece to get our goals.
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Who gives a feck if it is 38 or 51% possession if we create better chances, score more goals and win tough away games? I'm sure even you have been able to see that we commit players to press high up the pitch a lot of the time, which is the complete opposite of Mourinho's way of parking a bus. Last game at the Bridge, Chelsea weren't anywhere near looking like the more dominant/better side despite having the ball 66% of the time. A huge factor that you seem to forget is that we've had major injuries in most of these games as well.
 
Off the top of my head these are the big English game wins we've had under Ole:

PL:Spurs,Chelsea.
FA Cup: Arsenal,Chelsea.
LC: Chelsea.

We've drawn against Liverpool twice in the PL and Chelsea,Arsenal once in the PL.
 
Dinghy said:
Who gives a feck if it is 38 or 51% possession if we create better chances, score more goals and win tough away games? I'm sure even you have been able to see that we commit players to press high up the pitch a lot of the time, which is the complete opposite of Mourinho's way of parking a bus. Last game at the Bridge, Chelsea weren't anywhere near looking like the more dominant/better side despite having the ball 66% of the time. A huge factor that you seem to forget is that we've had major injuries in most of these games as well.
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The only time I see that high press is here on Caf. Rarely I have seen us press high at all at any big games. Maybe 1 or 2 times at best. We are still as defensive as ever in such games or maybe even more. People are just more warming to the idea and giving it better names because Ole. I don't care much about being defensive or parking the bus at the end, I actually gave him credit after Liverpool and Chelsea games, but the situation is just funny. Bring any Tom, Dick or Harry and let them have consistently less than 38% possession in big games and people will be calling for his head asap, saying worse teams play better football and take the game to big clubs.
 
el3mel said:
Get him in. Yeah he has problems with winning trophies, but he'll rebuild the squad, coach proper football, and develop young players. He'll do everything Ole may "try" to do but more successfully and can do even more. Will be madness to stick with Ole next season and let him go to Madrid or Bayern.

He might not win trophies here but he'll perfect for our current state.
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I think we are on to something now with Ole. At least the matches are enjoyable again. And he’s doing the right things. If we were to sack Ole now and get Poch, it will be a mess right now. I think there is a reason Spurs wants mou..he can bring the throphies poch could not. And look where that got us...
 
Suedesi said:
How's Mourinho's top 6 record with United? Apparently he only beat Arsenal and City away in three years with us.
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You're right, he won 2/15 away. 0/6 in his first season.
 
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Champagne Football said:
You can bet your lady dollar that Levy will have made Pochettino sign a deal as part of the severance, stating he can not sign for another PL rival for a year or something.

Pochettino won't be coming here anytime soon.
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It makes sense but at the same time as we don't know the details of his contract and what happens in the event of being sacked it's difficult to know. Don't the managers usually get paid the balance of their contract when sacked anyway?
It's not like Poch wouldn't have some say in the matter and Levy is not known for throwing extra money around.
 
There's a lingering doubt in my mind,regarding Pochettino, that thinks whether this is the early beginnings of a possible downward slope in his career.

I'm likely to be proven wrong.Again.
 
el3mel said:
High pressure, what high pressure? Do you watch our big games? We had 32% against Liverpool at home, 34% possession against Chelsea at the bridge. Even when we defeated them 4-0, they had more possession and more shots. Even when we defeated Spurs last season, we had 38% possession and defended for our lives in second half. Also during our FA Cup run last season we had 33% possession when we defeated Chelsea and 37% when we defeated Arsenal. I can go on. Had 35% possession when we drew with Liverpool 0-0..and so on.

Ole's style in big games can be described by any thing bar high pressing fantasy. I have no problem with defensive tactics as I said but trying to change the narrative and put a daydream fantasy like we high press in big games is what I have problem with. Our tactics in big games are still park our big bus and hope for a counter, individual skill or a set piece to get our goals.
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I can't remember the last time we were able to go toe to toe with a big team or play better than them. Yea, we have had results against a few teams, but by hanging on for dear life. It's also no wonder Spurs are in disarray, half the damn team is going to be out of contract. They're not going to risk a big payday to put in 100% and get hurt.
 
FrankDrebin said:
There's a lingering doubt in my mind,regarding Pochettino, that thinks whether this is the early beginnings of a possible downward slope in his career.

I'm likely to be proven wrong.Again.
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Have to say I have a similar busted flush feeling about him. But what the hell do I know?
 
Castia said:
He took a struggling club and made them competitive on a non-existent budget. The players you mention like Kane and Ali we’re nowhere near their current level, one had been on various failed loans whilst the other was signed for peanuts from MK Dons. Most of the squad he’s brought on leaps and bounds, he had Alderweirald on loan from Ath Madrid at Southampton it wasn’t like he was handed a top CB at the time he’s constantly helping players improve.

They have no right being in any final, he’s massively overachieved.
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He's a good manager who has shown himself capable of developing players and building good teams on a limited budget, but let's not rewrite history. What is it with making Spurs out to be some shite mid-table side that Poch turned into contenders? They were on the cusp of becoming a regular top four team before he arrived. They'd finished in the top five four times in the five seasons before he arrived, including two top four finishes. During his tenure, both United and Arsenal stopped being regular top four sides, making it easier than ever to achieve.

I'm not trying to take anything away from Poch, I'm just incredibly tired of seeing his achievements being made out to be a lot greater than they were.
 
adexkola said:
How you figure it was the right decision? Unless they foresaw that Rodgers would be available 3 years down the line?
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adexkola said:
Tell me more Nostradamus

I don't know how anyone can have so much certainty about how a season will end. Ditto for those who thought Mourinho was going to relegate Chelsea that season, or think Ole has a good chance of relegating United.
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Stop being such a smartass. He lost the dressing room which I'm sure you're aware of.

While getting relegated was obviously not a certainty, in such a situation you either have to get rid of (most of) the squad or the manager.
 
el3mel said:
It's your opinion of course if you prefer to stick with Ole but for sticking with him next season and letting a valuable candidate as Poch run away from our hands will end in tears few years from now on. He's perfect to out current position. He has his problems but his strong points are everything we need right now. Honestly for me the entire Ole reign is just a waste of everyone time seeking a dream of an ex player returning us to the glory. We might disagree but it's my opinion and I respect yours in that regard.

I don't get the idea about comparing the current league position only though. He had a meltdown at Spurs and got sacked, it doesn't negate him finishing regularly in top 2 and 3 the previous 4 seasons. Also as has been pointed out multiple times, Liverpool took the same risk with appointing Klopp even though his last season with BvB was as crap as Poch's last one. Looking at the big picture is what matters.
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For the sake of club and the manager, Poch will need a few break time to rest and clear his mind. It’s not right to give him a new job after horrible situation he was in. And also by being careful with our choice, at the same time it’s also giving Ole chances to prove the doubters like you wrong.

There is always manager that we can pick and Poch isn’t the only one. Rush decision can lead a shambolic decision which what come out in your mind right now thinking that we must snitch Poch now before other club take him.

And for someone who don’t rate our current squad like you, then there is no point giving the job to Poch right now if the current squad won’t be able to support him to do well.
 
passing-wind said:
How many times do we have to put up with the club's and certain fans inadequacy. This is another round of coaches being available who are world class / better than our current dreadful management. Ole's fans are using the longevity argument as a thesis to back mediocrity but if you give Ole 3 years with Manchester United and Poch 3 years with Manchester United on the basis of what we have seen who is the most likely to attain success ? The probability scenarios of success under Ole are about as useful as his Norwegian cup title win, it didn't stop him falling elsewhere as he's currently failing now.

If your a billionaire investor and you have a choice to invest in either Ole or Poch for the credibility of your asset as well as the success you'd be a fool to even have to consider anything.
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Looks like irony is completely lost on you, considering how inadequate you yourself are as a supporter that you are desperate for a manager that has been struggling worse than our current one. No one knows what is going to happen in 3 years time, and that includes you. It is always hilarious to see people like you ignore and downplay his achievements, and always highlight his one failure at Cardiff as if Saint Poch was never ever been sacked himself, when he failed as well when he was at Espanyol. And if Ole has been failing, then Pochettino has failed worse with a better team that he has been given time to organise, so why should we go for him again ??

Of course there is a choice, that is if you do not have your head shoved up Pochettino's ass then the choice is not that obvious between two managers that have both been struggling.
 
Five years is a long time in football and it seems to have gone stale for Poch at Spurs. Doesn't mean he's not a top class coach, this happens to basically all managers throughout their careers.

He put Spurs in a superb position domestically for 2-3 years but was never backed by the club to really have a go at winning the league. Instead there was basically zero investment for almost 2 years.

He'll probably come back from this refreshed and start winning major titles at a club which is actually proactive in improving its squad.
 
ivaldo said:
Spurs finished 4th and 5th four times out of the previous 5 seasons. Even the season where AVB got relegated they came 6th, with Sherwood finishing up the season with top 4 form. This notion that he single handedly took them from obscurity to relevancy is a bit of a fallacy. Let's not forget the successful transfers were a product of Levy and the scouting network, and not Poch - the man's said so much himself. The budget might well have been modest, but the signings were incredibly savvy. If Eriksen, for example, cost them £50m more it doesn't somehow make him a better player.
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Good post, among a sea of drivel. No idea why Spurs pre-poch are talked as if they were Brighton or something.
 
Beachryan said:
I don't get the Caf sometimes. There's some obscure winger playing in the Dutch second division- get the lad in.

There's a coach who has been a success everywhere including the Prem, delivering out performance constantly while improving youth? Nah mate don't want him.

The choice between Ole and Poch is like choosing Anderson over Essien because he's nice. Poch is demonstrably better at managing a football team than Ole.

So ffs get him in. We're terrible.
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And yet, we are higher in the table and playing better than a better team manged by the so called demonstrably better manager Poch.

And yeah, the caf is weird, every one is clueless and usually end up talking shit, but never own up to it. They keep stupidly believing that there is some quick fix, or some magical manager that will solve all our problems, when it has been proven that there are deeper lying issues that need to be solved, and unless that happens we will always struggle.
 
I’m confused. Are we ridiculing Spurs’ club stature or minimizing what Pochettino was able to achieve there? Can’t have it both ways.
 
Ace of Spades said:
Looks like irony is completely lost on you, considering how inadequate you yourself are as a supporter that you are desperate for a manager that has been struggling worse than our current one. No one knows what is going to happen in 3 years time, and that includes you. It is always hilarious to see people like you ignore and downplay his achievements, and always highlight his one failure at Cardiff as if Saint Poch was never ever been sacked himself, when he failed as well when he was at Espanyol. And if Ole has been failing, then Pochettino has failed worse with a better team that he has been given time to organise, so why should we go for him again ??

Of course there is a choice, that is if you do not have your head shoved up Pochettino's ass then the choice is not that obvious between two managers that have both been struggling.
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It's got nothing to do with heads up asses. If you think Ole is a better manager then Poch your about as useless as your name on a football forum.

The relativity of Ole being sacked with Cardiff is valid because he relegated a premier league team. Manchester United play in the English league therefore our domestic success is based in the premier league. Klopp got relegated in the Germany has this influenced his capabilities in England ? Let's make it even more simplistic for the lackluster, Poch has achieved more in English football than what Solskjaer has.
 
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Some people are talking about us not looking at some 'word class' manager again when they are available. I think they forget about the baggage coming with some of them.

The last 2 time we appointed that sort of managers, it went well for us.

Not saying he will be a failure here or we are not even interesting in him. I am just pointing out that we really need to be careful with it considering our shit history with that kind of managers.
 
passing-wind said:
It's got nothing to do with heads up asses. I'll make it simple for the plain minded, if you think Ole is a better manager then Poch your as useless as your name on a football forum.
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It has everything to do with with head up assess, or else people would not be desperate for a manger who has beeñ struggling worse than our current one with a better team. I will make it simple for the cluessess ones, if you think Poch is going to solve our problems, and do better with this squad when he has struggled worse with a much better squad, then you are as cluessess as your post history suggests.
 
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