2016 US Presidential Elections | Trump Wins
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to talk about United's dreadful home defeat at the hands of Big Ange's Tottenham Hotspur. Should this have been the end of Ten Hag? How long does he actually have left? And does Nik finally want ETH out?!
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This is terrible for the Dems. The GOP is dominating the airwaves. A Biden run that's not focused on negative personal attacks would bring much needed interest to the Dem primaries.
Ah well, at least Trump is still leading.
Ah well, at least Trump is still leading.
I hope the US doesn't reduce itself to voting in the wife of a former president. I mean FFS, we are talking about what is supposed to be a serious democracy here. The son of a former president being elected just 8 years after his dad was bad enough.
She isn't running as the wife of a former President. She's running as herself and as a citizen has every right to do so.
The other option could be a guy whose brother and father were 2 of the last 4 presidents.
Another option is a Billionaire who has never held public office and thinks immigrants are rapists. Yet another is a retired neurosurgeon who thinks school teachers should carry guns. When you distill the choices, Hillary and Jeb aren't so bad for their respective sides.
Yeah, just like Mrs Shinawatra of Thailand, Mrs Jagan of Guyana and Mrs Kirchner of Argentina. All women who by remarkable coincidence (and nothing else) managed to be elected as presidents soon after their husbands had left office.
Yep. And it's worrying that Americans don't see this as an indicator that something it wrong with their democracy.
Bush I
Clinton
Bush II
Obama
Bush III/Clinton II
Maybe Chelsea Clinton can have a pop in 2024.
And after Chelsea, maybe one of the Obama girls can have a go.
It wouldn't surprise me at all.
It wouldn't surprise me at all.
We've had this discussion before. People in the Clinton and Bush family are free to run for public office. The public can accept or reject them just as they can any other candidate.
Yeah no, Hillary is a JD from Yale, a senator and secretary of state on her own accord. That's mighty impressive no matter her family relations.
Those criticizing her are conveniently overlooking her qualifications to push their lazy narrative.
She became a senator and secretary of state AFTER her husband was elected POTUS!
Keep dreaming.
She'd never have been the Senator from NY without having been married to the President and thus would never have been Sec. State.
From what I have seen of Sanders, I like him.
Would I be right in thinking he is unelectable?
Would I be right in thinking he is unelectable?
She's completely qualified though - its not as if she could've magically deleted her name recognition prior to running.
Who cares ? Its utterly irrelevant.
Pretty much yes.
Her husband may never have made president without hillary beside him either
Would she also not be able to pass law school if her husband wasn't Bill Clinton? She was a partner at a law firm, a congressional legal counsel before marrying Bill and if her public office credentials don't work out, she also served on the board of directors for Walmart while living in Arkansas.
You could say that about any former president. It doesn't change the fact that Hilary piggy-rided on her husband's slimy lying back to become a senator and then Secretary of State, and along with him used their political connections to create one of the biggest political slush funds of all time in the form of the 'Clinton Foundation'.
JFK's son would have been a cert for President if he had lived.
I think Obama's eldest daughter will one day certainly have a chance if she pursues a political life.
Having famous relatives who became President does help.... but they still need to prove they have what it takes to be elected.
I think Obama's eldest daughter will one day certainly have a chance if she pursues a political life.
Having famous relatives who became President does help.... but they still need to prove they have what it takes to be elected.
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I'm sure Obama judged his choice for Secretary of State based on her husband. He seems like that kind of guy.
I don't get this criticism for Hillary. Love her or hate her, she's a highly accomplished person. If Barbara Boxer, Elizabeth Warren, Kirsten Gillibrand can be US Senators without being the wife of a former US president, why couldn't she?
I'd say it's easy to be a Jackie Kennedy or Diana. It's fecking hard to be Hillary Clinton.
I'd say it's easy to be a Jackie Kennedy or Diana. It's fecking hard to be Hillary Clinton.
Did I say that? No so what point are you trying to make? Reality is without being the First Lady she never would have had the opportunity to be NY's senator and thus Sec. State.
Her time on Walmarts board coincided with Bill's time as Governor of Arkansas correct?
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All I said is she would not have been NY's Senator. Which let's face it is true.
That is a valid point
It might be, just for the sake of argument let's agree on that. But how do you know had she not married Bill she wouldn't be Senator of another state?
I don't which is why I made no claim about that.
That's why the logical thing to do is acknowledge that Hillary is a fully qualified candidate for the US presidency. Speculations on where she'd be in life without her husband are pointless.
You did say she wouldn't have been Secretary of State, though.
I'd agree that she has a raised profile that allows her to realistically run for President, due to being Bill's wife. This doesn't say anything about whether she's capable of performing the role of President, however. She's demonstrated clearly that she is. Which is why this conversation's usually bullshit. The fact there has never been a female nominee from the Democrats or Republicans shows you probably need something extra to get you there, even if you're the most capable woman in the world.
Look the two Bush boys would never have gotten on the world or national stage. Where would JFK and RFK and Teddy have gotten without their Dad's money and connections? Hillary's career path is tied directly to being Bill's wife. Al Gore's political career was certainly aided by his Dad being a Senator from Tennessee. And so on and so forth.
This does mean they are all incompetent and would never have achieved anything with their lives. It just recognizes something that helped them along their current path.
This does mean they are all incompetent and would never have achieved anything with their lives. It just recognizes something that helped them along their current path.
I think that's widely accepted, to be fair. The impression I get of American politics is that it's full of people who largely are where they are because of their connections. But I don't think Hilary Clinton particularly has it easier than the Bush brothers, for example, or many of the other examples of people who got into power because of family ties.
First Lady to NY Senator to Sec. State the connections are clear.
It has nothing to do with putting her down because she is female. I pointed out make politicians who owe their positions to family connections
She and Bill built their wealth, influence and political muscles together from scratches. That's a damn sight better than W and Jeb, JFK or Al Gore.
Much the same way people say Hillary is where she is now because of her husband, you can say he wouldn't be 42nd without her along the way.
Well she is smarter than the Bush brothers.
Yep, that's mostly the point I'm making. She's undoubtedly benefited from her husband's position greatly, but there are plenty of others who had ridden their family ties to a greater extent. Clinton's certainly been heavily involved in politics anyway, so she's not really any less qualified than the other Democratic candidates. Probably more qualified than a lot of them.
That's not particularly difficult, to be fair.
The rest of my post that you snipped said basically exactly that. This conversation goes back to someone saying America would be reducing itself by voting for her, which is what most people here are arguing against.
I hope people realize I have not said she is unqualified.
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