From when did you get this consensus ?
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
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From when did you get this consensus ?
There's literally a thread on here taking the piss out of it
maybe, but come on.. a PE teacher? How to lose all credibility in a sentence.
So you read one or two opinions thinking we'll go out and take it as the "general consensus" ? Cool.
I didn't say that did I?
And I asked from where did you get the "general consensus" about us not expected to get past the group and you just didn't reply ?
I'm not wasting my time sourcing this information, you'll be able to find examples of it all over the internet if you really want it.
So you post something about "general opinion" and you're not arsed to bring evidence to back it up ? Because this hurts your credibility to be totally honest.
You can always say you went over the top with this assumption...
Correct.
It's not about patience but about skill. Football clubs had a far smaller staff base back then. Managers were therefore raised to cover different roles. Clough for example used to occasionally drive the team's bus as well.
Things had changed now. Top clubs can afford to have specialised people covering certain key roles. That lead to great efficiency in certain aspects of the game but it also lead to managers becoming deskilled in certain areas of what was traditionally their job. Which is why United look sluggish in certain areas (ex transfers and fitness) and why we're so vulnerable to dressing room upheavals. Managers depend on their players to perform thus if they lose the dressing room, then most certainly they will lose their job. However DOFs do not depend on what happens on the pitch which makes them the perfect people to take certain football decisions like which players we need to retain and which players we should let go.
United need to become less of a business and more of a football club. Ironically the latter will help the former. It makes zero financial sense in United spending 80m in cash on a meah CB or give silly salaries to washed up players like Sanchez or Bastian.
PS this apply to any modern manager irrespective of whether he's Ole, Klopp, Pep etc. Sure the likes of Klopp would probably do better in certain areas such as man management, tactics and fitness. He's been longer at top level clubs then Ole is and would therefore have a better idea of the coaches available which in turn will improve coaching as well. However in certain areas such as transfers, getting rid of the deadwood, persuading players to join us etc we'll be as sluggish and as inefficient as we're now.
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They got knocked out because Barca was just better than them and we was just lucky.
They also beat Chelsea a few times in the knockouts playing the same way against a pragmatic Jose side. Whose teams lost because of this approach. Like what he did with us and Sevilla.
That does not answer the question of why you can’t adapt your better players. You’ve just came back at me with a preference on style of play. That’s totally different.
I’d post like this if I clearly was talking bollocks.
Christ. Ridiculous take.
The most Ole should be responsible for is our youth setup, he ought to be nowhere near managing the 1st team.
Managers now are more man managers, motivators. Look at Pep, Klopp, Jose they rely heavily on their staff to coach teams. Klopp's number 2, Arteta for Pep and now Jose has got a new number 2.
They are all people who have modern methods of football instilled, this is the reason Jose got rid of his old assistand and replaced him. We have Phelan.
how is pep rebuilding, he took over a team that is already champions material. He has spent 100s of millions on defenders alone and his team still needs improvement there. What have lampard and mourinho won so far? Have you seen what chelsea did over the summer? Why have you concluded their teams’ current form will last the whole season? Ancelotti has done well, agreed. Klopp took some 3-4 years in rebuilding.
we write anything in the build up for “ole has to go” don’t we?
Donkey, idiot, shit, useless, championship player...all that is used for our players (by the same people who are here "disgusted" when people talk about Ole in that way).
Scroll through Psg game thread and read what people said about Fred for example. There is no poster here who called Ole idiot or piece of shit for example.
Ole is worse than a PE teacher in lots of things. They would know how to deal with people close to doing something stupid.
Of course SAF did the same error with Rafael against Bayern. Should have taken him off then too.
Of course SAF did the same error with Rafael against Bayern. Should have taken him off then too.
Explane why please?
The issue is, that after over 100 games in charge, this question is still, and with much validity, being asked. That tells you so very much.
Ask the same question with fans from:
Liverpool, City, Chelsea, Tottenham, Everton, Southampton, Wolves, Leeds, Aston Villa, Palace, even Burnley and Sheff Utd who are currently having a torrid... Fulham.
What do you think the vast majority of their fans would say? No one knows, but I strongly suspect the vast majority, would say they are currently happy with and wish to support their manager's plans. Not game-to-game happy... but happy with the way things are being set out as there is a clarity either in place, or emerging, regarding the team, squad, ambition, expectation, approach etc..
Ole has not engendered that amongst his supporter base, and after over 100 games in charge, that is down to one person, alone.
Ask the same question with fans from:
Liverpool, City, Chelsea, Tottenham, Everton, Southampton, Wolves, Leeds, Aston Villa, Palace, even Burnley and Sheff Utd who are currently having a torrid... Fulham.
What do you think the vast majority of their fans would say? No one knows, but I strongly suspect the vast majority, would say they are currently happy with and wish to support their manager's plans. Not game-to-game happy... but happy with the way things are being set out as there is a clarity either in place, or emerging, regarding the team, squad, ambition, expectation, approach etc..
Ole has not engendered that amongst his supporter base, and after over 100 games in charge, that is down to one person, alone.
Should have been sacked for that according to the caf. Novice manager he was leaving a player on the pitch.
SAF was often a high risk manager. Backfired that time.
This is the CAF, high risk only if it works otherwise you're a crap manager.
When Ole goes conservative, it isnt the United way.
True, but I think when you are ahead it is better to play it safe sometimes.
Ole really went for a win last night. Not played for a draw with a more compact team.
Vs Sevilla as an example the subs to attack should have been much earlier.
If Martial scores though we would be happy with going for the kill and attacking them.
So Saf is also worse than a PE teacher because he also failed to take Rafael off as he was on yellow?
You can't take off every player who is on a yellow card.
Fred was just asking for the red, though.
Yeah PE teachers are talented in terms of reading people. They could see those cards miles away.
No, but when they are close to get a red card it might be best to take them off.
It should not have been a red though, but PSG dives like crazy to fool the ref.
Both Rafaels an Freds cards are not yellow for me, but they get them for being close to get sent off before.
Its not taking players with yellow cards is that Fred was playing way to intensive and everyone new the second yellow was comming. Thats on Ole. But feck me blaming the lost on him after Martial screw those 2 chances and a bad luck goal conceded is way to harsh. I think we should replace Ole but can't blame everything on him.
It’s amazing to see
I feel like he can't win on here (unless he wins!)
Basically he need to win a title to turn everyone on his side! Ideally a big one.
If my memory serves me right Carrick was at CB against Bayern and he fecked up for one goal. It was not the sending off that was crucial. Also Rafael's first was not even a yellow and Fred should have been sent off instead of the yellow. He was very lucky to be on the pitch.
We'll be waiting forever then. Because he's never doing that. How many semi-finals did we lose last year? 3? Perennial nearly men is what we are under him.
There is that final winning edge lacking. Feels like Arsenal under Wenger near the end a bit. Although they won some Fa cups so if we do that I will be fairly pleased.
And then it’s the players and individual talent so, I guess he still doesn’t win
Really? Throwing a series of results on a screen does not constitute a conclusive review of what average means. Galatasaray, Brugge, Atalanta, Basaksehir are all lower tier clubs, BD and RB are challenging but hardly world beaters, we beat RB 5-0. Your only case is against Madrid, but in the last few years Madrid have been re-building, they are at risk this season of being knocked out in the group stages because they cannot even beat Shaktar, twice.
Now I didn't watch all the games, but the 1-0 victory of RB and the 3-1 over us demonstrates how average they are. We should have won that game and RB dominated PSG in the 1-0 defeat. It happens, teams win and they do not deserve too. When you put a team that costs millions in front of a team that costed probably half of that (Bayern), you can see the gap. Someone in this forum already correctly pointed out that when we played PSG in 2019, they were miles better than they are now.
If you want to get all anal about historic games, lets break it down like this, Tuchel has a 75% win % in total. Clearly majority comes from the French league, so if we strip out all these games, his win % in Europe is under 60%. Decent ratio, but heavily skewed by last season with there run to the final where they were more fresher than the counterparts who all were managing tight schedules in domestic competitions, packing in the final 10 games of the season in just a month. My point to you is, we can swing data how we want it to look, but unless you give me a concrete qualitative example of what is NOT average to back up your wiki reading, I really have nothing else to say to you because I highly doubt, you sit and watch all PSG games.
that Leipzig game next week is huge. If they actually manage to crash out after winning the first two games, it'll be very hard for me to continue to defend Ole. It's not the easiest group, I get it. But that Istanbul bottle job still pisses me off to no end and yesterday's game was there for the taking as well. Should already be through after the start to that group stage.
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