Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?

  • Sack Ole & appoint new coach ASAP

  • Keep Ole & back him to finish rebuild

Results are only viewable after voting.
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bond19821982 said:
Spend 150m on Maguire, AWB, James and you call it as a slow and smart rebuild - seriously?. State of the excuses .
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James was a low risk gamble that did not work out. Hes still young so it wont be that hard to move him on if we want to'

Yeah, Maguire was overpriced, but that particular topic have been discussed to death already, so what more is there to say? Hes been pretty mediocre so far this season, but was excellent yesterday so hopefully he kicks on from here on out

AWB was 21 and British, so thats another 20 million to his price tag. Hes very good defensively, and interestingly enough, as much shit as he gets for his lacking attacking output hes actually been more productive than Shaw, even when taking minutes played into account \
 
The problem for people who are so desperate to see Ole out is that really Ole is doing a very similar job this season to all those around him.

We are ahead of Pep. Can overtake Frank if we win our game in hand. Still in the Carling Cup.

He was dealt a shit hand with the CL group. The defending was terrible in that Istanbul game.

But after the opening day of the season Ole has pretty much matched everyone around him. Unless you want him to be significantly better than Mourinho/Pep/Klopp than I don’t see how some of you will be satisfied.
 
Kajus said:
Those of you who want him sacked immediately, what exactly does this achieve and who do you get instead? I can understand wanting to look at managers with better record/potential to take over in the off-season, but what do you achieve by sacking him tomorrow? The players like him, it would just hurt team morale and would begin yet another rebuild. No top manager is currently available and the likes of Nagelsmann/Rose won’t quit their teams mid-season, so what exactly do you achieve by having Carrick or Phelan take over until the end of the season?
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I don't understand this kind of posts. It is common football logic. Manager is not good, you replace him. Literally all clubs do it. Some replace managers because of results, some because of bad petformances on the pitch. Dormund just sacked their manager despite being 5 points from the top and doing good in CL.

About managers; Allegri and Poch are free and available. Are they top managers? I don't know (imo they are) but they are surely 10 times better than this fraud. And if not them, there are dozens and dozens managers out there. Who say that they must be free? Football don't work like that. You buy a manager just like you buy a player. And currently we have situation where two are available for free and can start working tomorrow.

Why wait that failed Cardiff manager ruin another season? In any other club (especially big) he would be sacked long time ago.
 
Kajus said:
So who do you get in after sacking Ole tomorrow that is going to win us the league this season?
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Poch is present.

But anyway I didn't tell you to sack him tomorrow. I'm just replying on the "beginning another rebuild". It's simply not true. No new manager in every club has to rebuild a team from scratch whenever he's hired.

I won't sack him tomorrow but this season should be his last with us if it ends with just another top 4 and nothing else.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
I don't understand this kind of posts. It is common football logic. Manager is not good, you replace him. Literally all clubs do it. Some replace managers because of results, some because of bad petformances on the pitch. Dormund just sacked their manager despite being 5 points from the top and doing good in CL.

About managers; Allegri and Poch are free and available. Are they top managers? I don't know (imo they are) but they are surely 10 times better than this fraud. And if not them, there are dozens and dozens managers out there. Who say that they must be free? Football don't work like that. You buy a manager just like you buy a player. And currently we have situation where two are available gor free and can start working tomorrow.

Why wait that failed Cardiff manager ruin another season? In any other club (especially big) he would be sacked long time ago.
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How can you call him a fraud?

Over the last 38 games there surely can’t be many managers with a better record? Surely you can see he’s progressed the squad well.
 
Kajus said:
Those of you who want him sacked immediately, what exactly does this achieve and who do you get instead?
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In my opinion Ole is a deadend. He is not the manager that will have us challenge for the title.

1. Not waste time and wait for the inevitable to happen
2. Give his replacement more time to shape the team up and have a good idea of the squad ahead of their first summer transfer window
3. Give the players a boost of confidence, as at the moment it's clear that we don't have a serious plan, and the players often look lost.

Options that would be great improvements over Ole are available, like Allegri and Poch, and claiming that other managers would not leave their current clubs is pure speculation, maybe it's the case for Nagelsmann, but certainly would be considered by Rose or Gasperini.
 
Wumminator said:
How can you call him a fraud?

Over the last 38 games there surely can’t be many managers with a better record? Surely you can see he’s progressed the squad well.
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Please can you concisely explain how this system is different to Jose's was, aside from signing AWB, Maguire, James and Bruno?

FYI I don't think he's a fraud, I just think he's exactly what I would expect level-wise from an ex player without top level managerial experience.
 
Wumminator said:
How can you call him a fraud?

Over the last 38 games there surely can’t be many managers with a better record? Surely you can see he’s progressed the squad well.
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He is a fraud. When you talk and talk and talk every week about United DNA, attacking football and progress etc...and then you go full defensive on the pitch, then you are a liar and fraud.

And he didn't progressed. After 2 years and 300 mil we look awful on the pitch. Our attacking play is pure improvisation.
He is not United quality (he is not even PL quality). Man Utd manager must be top top quality. I am sorry if you think that i am spoiled fan or something but manager is the most important person in club and we need much better than ex Molde manager and failed Cardiff manager.
 
Bobcat said:
James was a low risk gamble that did not work out. Hes still young so it wont be that hard to move him on if we want to'

Yeah, Maguire was overpriced, but that particular topic have been discussed to death already, so what more is there to say? Hes been pretty mediocre so far this season, but was excellent yesterday so hopefully he kicks on from here on out

AWB was 21 and British, so thats another 20 million to his price tag. Hes very good defensively, and interestingly enough, as much shit as he gets for his lacking attacking output hes actually been more productive than Shaw, even when taking minutes played into account \
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Point is , I wouldn't call that as a rebuild. James doesn't even play these days. Spending 150m on 4 players who is just average is not a rebuild. Its just another example of how clueless we are in terms of manager or owner.
So basically your point on rebuild is void. It just doesn't add to what Ole has been saying.
 
My favourite go to excuse from the usual suspects is who else, if not Ole? Anyone who thinks there is nobody that can do better than Ole is either an opposition fan or fecking deluded.
 
laughtersassassin said:
No expectations. No shame.

We have a better fecking team than Leizpig. Blind as a bat you are. It was a possibility to go out sure but expected it was never.

And showing out after winning your first two games it's absolute crap management. Needed 4 points ffs
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Classy with getting personal rather tjan sticking to arguments around the topic.

We were expected to go out based on what the majority of posts in herr were saying during the ChL drawing. Even pundits and media had serious doubt, and with good reason. We did better than feared in my book.
 
bond19821982 said:
Point is , I wouldn't call that as a rebuild. James doesn't even play these days. Spending 150m on 4 players who is just average is not a rebuild. Its just another example of how clueless we are in terms of manager or owner.
So basically your point on rebuild is void. It just doesn't add to what Ole has been saying.
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That is it. Lvg and Jose got a lot of stick for their transfers. For players who (mostly) play for them. Awb and Maguire play for Ole too but they were not good transfers and if we sign attacking manager, they will be labelled as bad transfers as they are in reality.
This is not rebuilding. This is the same as in Lvg era and Jose era. Manager buys players who he needs for his vision of football.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
Set in stone :lol:

Against the mighty Leipzig, 3rd best team in Germany. A team we actually twatted 7-3 on aggregate.
Hilarious the excuses.
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Its not an excuse. It was based on most recent form leading up to the game. United started their way worse and really looked out of form. Whether they are mighty or not doesn't matter. We've beaten mighty teams, but have also been beaten by non-mighty teams over the last 2 decades. I don't see how mighty/not-mighty has anything to do with it.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
That is it. Lvg and Jose got a lot of stick for their transfers. For players who (mostly) play for them. Awb and Maguire play for Ole too but they were not good transfers and if we sign attacking manager, they will be labelled as bad transfers as they are in reality.
This is not rebuilding. This is the same as in Lvg era and Jose era. Manager buys players who he needs for his vision of football.
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I agree with this. The Maguire signing is the worst decision made by Ole and ultimately it’s the decision that will cost him his job.
 
Greck said:
Except they did. Ole would have to win 2 cups this season to match Jose's tenure
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But we've all cried out for that rebuild post SAF. Jose didn't seem to at all try and build something sustainable in the long run, and as I see it left a team worse off than we have now. LvG did seem to be relevant at the time, after having gotten Holland to a 3rd at the WC, and did get a few youngsters up, but didnt really focus on anything outside of that, which for me was too shortsighted. It really takes an abundance of time to get to SAF's glory years.
 
bond19821982 said:
Point is , I wouldn't call that as a rebuild. James doesn't even play these days. Spending 150m on 4 players who is just average is not a rebuild. Its just another example of how clueless we are in terms of manager or owner.
So basically your point on rebuild is void. It just doesn't add to what Ole has been saying.
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Schrodinger's players. They are both average and world beaters, so which is it? Considering Maguire, AWB were among our most consistent performers last season and Bruno is hands down our best player, then the rest of the squad cant be very good
 
PoTMS said:
My favourite go to excuse from the usual suspects is who else, if not Ole? Anyone who thinks there is nobody that can do better than Ole is either an opposition fan or fecking deluded.
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We cant just go and get a manager that is a bit better than Ole. We need a top manager or we might aswell stick with the manager that is ahead of Pep and likely going to be ahead of Lampard too.
 
westmeath said:
I agree with this. The Maguire signing is the worst decision made by Ole and ultimately it’s the decision that will cost him his job.
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Its a big assumption that he was the main man for that purchase.

People still love Pep who has spent a fortune more on his defence yet they are behind Oles United.
 
To me the position is clear.

If you think Poch is the man, then you get that sorted now.

If Poch isn't the man then we might aswell keep Ole until the summer when he could potentially take a big manager from another team.
 
I think watching the likes of Liverpool and Spurs play slow today, and Chelsea yesterday, it probably serves as a reminder that every team is off par more often than they should be. It's worth noting for me as I evaluate Ole but worth sharing too.
 
So two points off top at best and at worst 4 points is still a decent job. Considering Martial and Greenwood have yet to fire and Cavani has not been properly integrated due to his late arrival and injuries, things should get better.

Only issue I have is with defence rotation. We have constantly played Maguire and Lindelof, and this might come back and haunt us later. A CB and RB in winter transfer window to rotate would be decent window.

Although I am not really convinced by Ole but apart from Champions league disaster, he has found himself in decent position in the league (assuming we win our game in hand). Let's see where we are after December, this month will tell a lot about Ole man management skills considering the amount of games we have to play.
 
bsCallout said:
To me the position is clear.

If you think Poch is the man, then you get that sorted now.

If Poch isn't the man then we might aswell keep Ole until the summer when he could potentially take a big manager from another team.
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I see it the same as this. If you're married to a woman but you know 100% you don't have a future together long term, why would you decide to stay with her any moment longer? You are doing yourself and her a favour by breaking up and not wasting each others time.
 
Zhagzi said:
Classy with getting personal rather tjan sticking to arguments around the topic.

We were expected to go out based on what the majority of posts in herr were saying during the ChL drawing. Even pundits and media had serious doubt, and with good reason. We did better than feared in my book.
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Who has a better team. Us or Leipzig?

Surely you think us no? So if Leipzig where expected to go through over us that is because they have a much better manager.

Luckily this thread is discussing that very topic.
 
pratyush_utd said:
So two points off top at best and at worst 4 points is still a decent job. Considering Martial and Greenwood have yet to fire and Cavani has not been properly integrated due to his late arrival and injuries, things should get better.

Only issue I have is with defence rotation. We have constantly played Maguire and Lindelof, and this might come back and haunt us later. A CB and RB in winter transfer window to rotate would be decent window.

Although I am not really convinced by Ole but apart from Champions league disaster, he has found himself in decent position in the league (assuming we win our game in hand). Let's see where we are after December, this month will tell a lot about Ole man management skills considering the amount of games we have to play.
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You forgot to mention the "Table since Bruno came in"

Needs work 7.5/10
 
Andycoleno9 said:
I don't understand this kind of posts. It is common football logic. Manager is not good, you replace him. Literally all clubs do it. Some replace managers because of results, some because of bad petformances on the pitch. Dormund just sacked their manager despite being 5 points from the top and doing good in CL.

About managers; Allegri and Poch are free and available. Are they top managers? I don't know (imo they are) but they are surely 10 times better than this fraud. And if not them, there are dozens and dozens managers out there. Who say that they must be free? Football don't work like that. You buy a manager just like you buy a player. And currently we have situation where two are available for free and can start working tomorrow.

Why wait that failed Cardiff manager ruin another season? In any other club (especially big) he would be sacked long time ago.
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No, it’s not common football logic. City is a very recent and simple example, they felt that Pellegrini wasn’t good enough, but they carefully planned their next steps and kept him as a manager until they got Pep to take over.

It’s not common logic, it’s actually the opposite - if the manager hasn’t lost the dressing room and isn’t being detrimental to team morale it’s completely moronic to sack the said manager without having any plans to replace him. This is literally all irrational emotion because of your personal dislike of him and no logic at all. We aren’t waiting for Ole to ruin “yet another season”, because he hasn’t ruined one yet. He got 3rd in a season where the first two spots were nailed on before gameweek 1. Can Allegri or Poch do better than that? I don’t believe they can.

Eplel said:
In my opinion Ole is a deadend. He is not the manager that will have us challenge for the title.

1. Not waste time and wait for the inevitable to happen
2. Give his replacement more time to shape the team up and have a good idea of the squad ahead of their first summer transfer window
3. Give the players a boost of confidence, as at the moment it's clear that we don't have a serious plan, and the players often look lost.

Options that would be great improvements over Ole are available, like Allegri and Poch, and claiming that other managers would not leave their current clubs is pure speculation, maybe it's the case for Nagelsmann, but certainly would be considered by Rose or Gasperini.
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Allegri is Mourinho 2.0, just a little worse at everything. As for Poch, do you really believe he is capable of winning the league here? I’ve seen nothing that could even remotely suggest that. As for the others, there is no non-speculative way to know what they would do, so we will just have to leave it at that. I don’t think they would, but that’s just my opinion.
PoTMS said:
My favourite go to excuse from the usual suspects is who else, if not Ole? Anyone who thinks there is nobody that can do better than Ole is either an opposition fan or fecking deluded.
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Define better. Would Poch be able to get 5 more points, but still finish 3rd? Sure, I can see that. Are those 5 more points “better” if they mean missing out on someone like Nagelsmann in the summer because we are giving the newly hired manager at least a full season? Not in my book. What you’re describing is called “the greedy algorithm” in game theory and it is almost always the suboptimal strategy.
 
Still 5pts off top (spurs) with a game in hand. Currently only 4pts behind the scousers with a game in hand.
 
Berbaclass said:
What's the chances of us being that close when it actually matters at the end of the season?
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Who knows. We've had a tough start fixtures wise really. And up against first few weeks because of Europe in August.

I don't think anyone is going to romp home this season.
 
We have a pretty easy game next with Liverpool and Spurs facing each other so if Liverpool lost we might get closer to them. Once can just hope that Liverpool can keep losing their current game though.
 
How you all who are Olein are not concerned how many games, important games, he messed up tactically? Just to name most important (knockout) games;

Leipzig; went with 7 defenders and lost game in first half basically.
City in league cup; went with 2 midfielders, City could have scored 6 or 7 in first half.
Chelsea in FA cup. Total mess. Changed lineup and formation. Then he neither won a game or rested the players.
Sevilla in EL. Didn't do much wrong but we lost the game

And his subs in general .....that is just comical. But he will learn, right?
 
Bobcat said:
Schrodinger's players. They are both average and world beaters, so which is it? Considering Maguire, AWB were among our most consistent performers last season and Bruno is hands down our best player, then the rest of the squad cant be very good
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Who said they are world class. The signings has been pretty meh. All for this rebuild!
 
This league is there for the taking. Reminds of the LCFC winning season where the champion will probably have points in the low 80s and we'll still probably finish outside the top 4.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
That is it. Lvg and Jose got a lot of stick for their transfers. For players who (mostly) play for them. Awb and Maguire play for Ole too but they were not good transfers and if we sign attacking manager, they will be labelled as bad transfers as they are in reality.
This is not rebuilding. This is the same as in Lvg era and Jose era. Manager buys players who he needs for his vision of football.
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Precisely this. Unless we get a cautious manager who will look to defend first , both Maguire and AWB is going to get the chop. All for this slow ,smart and cultural reboot shit.
 
This league campaign is probably the worst league I have seen since Leicester one. All big teams are rubbish.
 
Imagine the effect a new manager would have on these bunch of top class players, without the distraction of Champions League, and an actual coach at the helm. I would really fancy us to win it.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
How you all who are Olein are not concerned how many games, important games, he messed up tactically? Just to name most important (knockout) games;

Leipzig; went with 7 defenders and lost game in first half basically.
City in league cup; went with 2 midfielders, City could have scored 6 or 7 in first half.
Chelsea in FA cup. Total mess. Changed lineup and formation. Then he neither won a game or rested the players.
Sevilla in EL. Didn't do much wrong but we lost the game

And his subs in general .....that is just comical. But he will learn, right?
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Just to be clear - you don’t think you can do the same for every single manager in the prem at the moment?
 
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