Would Fellaini improve under a new manager?

Wilson Litchmore said:
Ok you can question how much we paid for him but Everton paid 15m for him. He's been one of the best players for Everton and probably one of the players the least other players like to play against. He's terrorised us enough times. I think we paid a couple mil more than we should have but that's it. This is a player that's one of the cornerstone of the dark horses for the WC. If he has a good World Cup, the price will be justified.

He's a better player than most give him credit for in the right position. Like I said previously, this is the hardest season for a decade a player coming into this club.
Click to expand...
It doesn't matter how good of a player he is, he will never fit our system more so under van Gaal. He loses the ball too easily when under pressure which makes him a liability in a system which is based on passing the ball low, fast and accurately around the pitch. The ball not leaving the ground is already going against Fellaini's nature as a player.



I want to know where Fellaini would fit in that kind of build up.
 
Kill 'em all said:
It doesn't matter how good of a player he is, he will never fit our system more so under van Gaal. He loses the ball too easily when under pressure which makes him a liability in a system which is based on passing the ball low, fast and accurately around the pitch. The ball not leaving the ground is already going against Fellaini's nature as a player.



I want to know where Fellaini would fit in that kind of build up.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if posting a video of the dutch league 20 years ago proves that a successful premiership and international midfielder can't play well under whatever manager we get in
 
Has anyone watched him play for Belgium, is he any for them? They have an array of talent in midfield it seems the manager rates him very highly as a box to box midfielder.
I don't see it myself, however I haven't watched much of Belgium so I am interested to here the point of view of anyone who has seen him play in that team.
 
Cassidy said:
Has anyone watched him play for Belgium, is he any for them? They have an array of talent in midfield it seems the manager rates him very highly as a box to box midfielder.
I don't see it myself, however I haven't watched much of Belgium so I am interested to here the point of view of anyone who has seen him play in that team.
Click to expand...

I've seen him play once or twice for Belgium and he isn't bad. The World Cup will be interesting though. I think a few on here will be interested to see how he does for Belgium. You're right in that he's highly rated. Hopefully he can show something so that LvG can give him a chance and use him.
 
The thing that can truly save Fellaini now is if he turns over a new leaf and takes a trip to the barber, maybe a 1 all over. Its time for that novelty, limp afro to go. Maybe we could then take him more seriously as a footballer and human being in general.

Would also remind us less of his Everton days, David Moyes and in fact our last season.
 
Can't see having a major improvement from Felli next season TBH.

I'm pretty convinced that what we saw from him this season was the best he can give for this club.

He's not a typical player, his style will not suit VG style, possession, pressing, speed and pace.

If Moyes really wanted to give him a chance, he should have played him behind a striker without defensive duties. With Belgium, he actually plays as the second 8, their talent are on the wing and upfront. He's never outstanding with Belgium...

Really Really hope we can sell him next year (sent him to Roma to get Strootman)
 
Chaky_Best said:
Can't see having a major improvement from Felli next season TBH.

I'm pretty convinced that what we saw from him this season was the best he can give for this club.

He's not a typical player, his style will not suit VG style, possession, pressing, speed and pace.

If Moyes really wanted to give him a chance, he should have played him behind a striker without defensive duties. With Belgium, he actually plays as the second 8, their talent are on the wing and upfront. He's never outstanding with Belgium...

Really Really hope we can sell him next year (sent him to Roma to get Strootman)
Click to expand...

But he's played better for Everton in other seasons? So obviously he can play better than last season.
 
I wonder how he feels now that Moyes is gone. I'd make a guess that he feels pretty damn vulnerable.
 
I think theres too much pessimsm here, Fellaini will improve and be useful to do a job, but he'll never be a world beater, it's pretty simmple stuff
 
LVG might resent being challenged in the 'shittest hair' stakes
 
The only thing that's preventing me from writing him off completely at United is the fact that he seemed to have a lot of injury problems last season. It is difficult to know how much they affected him from settling at United.
 
Write off a 20m loss and flog him. Playing him regularly could easily cost us a league position or two.
 
He is capable of playing better than he has so far, although not at the standard required to become a regular starter. He seems to be a very shy individual; when he speaks he does so in little more than a whisper. He appears to lack self confidence generally, so its not surprising that his confidence is shot to pieces on the pitch, after his travails this past season.

For a manager to improve him, it would probably require an arm round the shoulder approach. I'm not so sure than Van Gaal is that type of manager, or that the gains from doing so would be worthwhile. Hopefully we will strengthen Centre Midfield sufficiently this summer to render Fellaini surplus to requirements.
 
Chaky_Best said:
I'm pretty convinced that what we saw from him this season was the best he can give for this club.
Click to expand...
How can you be convinced that a bit part role in a season effected by injury and marred by an under performing unit as a whole in midfield and in general as 'the best he can give'. That train of thought makes so little sense I am well and truly mind boggled.

If you can't see a player improving from that then I don't understand why you'd bother watching football. Players have bad games, bad seasons and bounce back from them. It happens probably more than world class footballers continuing to be world class footballers. What we have here is laziness and impatience and ignoring that there is room for a player to grow, adapt or change. Maybe it's generational but it would certainly make football pretty boring if we were to just sell every player who has a bad season and roll the dice on someone else 5 or 6 times a year.
 
I personally don't feel we can rightly evaluate any player that we only had in the Moyes-era. I'm sure LvG will know what he wants and how best to achieve it, with or without Fellaini.
 
Why do people think that a player who was a vital cog in a top 6 side will go to Celtic or West Ham? He may not be United first team quality and his propensity to foul is annoying, but he still will go to a decent size club, here or abroad.

Some of the comments and the general hate towards him is asinine.
 
The amount of stick Fellaini has taken in here is disgraceful. He's a good player and a good addition to our squad. He plays very well with Belgium a team full of stars. If given the chance he will turn out a good addition albeit an expensive one.
 
Fellaini represents all that was wrong with the Moyes era. We actually thought that it was going to work here. Players like him only look good when the team is built around them and are set up in a way that the other team is going to dominate possession.

If he wants to play in a team like United that aims to play a possession style attacking game then he needs to massively improve his ball control and passing range to be even considered as an option in central midfield. Even a player like Cleverly who is considered mediocre at best is much more comfortable on the ball and has better movement that Fellaini. And to top that, he doesn't even have a physical presence and cannot be a threat from outside the box as his shooting is not exceptional either.

I think he can be a very useful player but in a different team (non top 4) and in a specific setup.
 
We're dreaming if we think Fellaini could actually lead a United to CL contending caliber. He might be a decent squad player as we take the three years it will probably take to seriously compete for a CL trophy, but he'll never be the guy who helps us lift it.
 
Some of you are seriously blinded by hatred.

Once he was over his injury issues in the premier league he had a decent few games.

Against West Brom particularly in my mind stood out, he was absolutely solid in that game and without him IMO we could have lost.

Sure he is never going to outpass Barcelona or make a mazy dribbling run through a defence, but if used correctly he could be an important player.

Let's give him another year - if he is still the same then fine cut our losses.
 
Adam-Utd said:
Some of you are seriously blinded by hatred.

Once he was over his injury issues in the premier league he had a decent few games.

Against West Brom particularly in my mind stood out, he was absolutely solid in that game and without him IMO we could have lost.

Sure he is never going to outpass Barcelona or make a mazy dribbling run through a defence, but if used correctly he could be an important player.

Let's give him another year - if he is still the same then fine cut our losses.
Click to expand...

Not a Fellaini hater but here's the thing though :

1 He might've had decent games against West Brom, Crystal Palace and teams of similar calibre. But then any top half central midfielder will have decent games against them. Does that justify them having a starting/ squad role for United, a team that has been contending for league trophies and European Cups for the past 20 odd years. For a player worth 28 million you'd expect him to perform against the big boys. And he hasn't done that in all honestly, especially against Bayern where his acute lack of technique was on full display. We as a club should aspire to having the best technical players around. We've had it in the past with Robson, Ince, Keane, Scholes, Carrick. Some really great names have graced our midfield. That's the level we should be aiming to get back to. Unfortunately Fellaini just doesn't cut it, even at his best Everton form where he was a brute #10 and a focal point in their side. He's just not a defensive midfielder, he doesn't have enough awareness, has little discipline, fouls constantly and most importantly doesn't have the engine. Those are things that can't be taught to a player of 26, he's set in his ways. To make him succeed we'd have to sacrifice Rooney/ Mata/ Kagawa and play Fellaini as a #10, his favoured position at Everton. There's nothing wrong with saying he's not United quality tbf. It's not hate. Sometimes you make a mistake, but you have to move on and rectify it. Plugging you finger in the dyke will only work out for so long.

2 It could be argued that letting him go now would be the humane thing to do. He's been made a scapegoat, a floppy symbol of the previous manager's tenure and the psychological impact on the poor guy can be devastating. If he has a season similar to what he had last year I can honestly see the crowd turn on him on top of his value deprecating further. Right now he has some remnant goodwill from the Everton days, that's still in public memory. If he has another poor outing most teams wouldn't be interested in him. I think the best thing to do now is offload him while he still has some value in the market. We'll recoup maybe 10-15 million to add to our transfer budget + we'll free up wages for an incoming player. It's a win-win honestly for both parties.
 
Adam-Utd said:
Some of you are seriously blinded by hatred.

Once he was over his injury issues in the premier league he had a decent few games.

Against West Brom particularly in my mind stood out, he was absolutely solid in that game and without him IMO we could have lost.

Sure he is never going to outpass Barcelona or make a mazy dribbling run through a defence, but if used correctly he could be an important player.

Let's give him another year - if he is still the same then fine cut our losses.
Click to expand...

i agree. Unfortunately, Fellaini will always be linked with Moyes. I am very interested to see how the player does with Belgium in the world cup. Hopefully, he can come back with a different mentality and put last season behind him. Still has a role to play. He does not become a bad player after a season where 70% of the squad were below par. Needs self belief.
 
Gannicus said:
We're dreaming if we think Fellaini could actually lead a United to CL contending caliber. He might be a decent squad player as we take the three years it will probably take to seriously compete for a CL trophy, but he'll never be the guy who helps us lift it.
Click to expand...
Who in these forums is claiming he can lead us?
 
invictus said:
Not a Fellaini hater but here's the thing though :

1 He might've had decent games against West Brom, Crystal Palace and teams of similar calibre. But then any top half central midfielder will have decent games against them. Does that justify them having a starting/ squad role for United, a team that has been contending for league trophies and European Cups for the past 20 odd years. For a player worth 28 million you'd expect him to perform against the big boys. And he hasn't done that in all honestly, especially against Bayern where his acute lack of technique was on full display. We as a club should aspire to having the best technical players around. We've had it in the past with Robson, Ince, Keane, Scholes, Carrick. Some really great names have graced our midfield. That's the level we should be aiming to get back to. Unfortunately Fellaini just doesn't cut it, even at his best Everton form where he was a brute #10 and a focal point in their side. He's just not a defensive midfielder, he doesn't have enough awareness, has little discipline, fouls constantly and most importantly doesn't have the engine. Those are things that can't be taught to a player of 26, he's set in his ways. To make him succeed we'd have to sacrifice Rooney/ Mata/ Kagawa and play Fellaini as a #10, his favoured position at Everton. There's nothing wrong with saying he's not United quality tbf. It's not hate. Sometimes you make a mistake, but you have to move on and rectify it. Plugging you finger in the dyke will only work out for so long.

2 It could be argued that letting him go now would be the humane thing to do. He's been made a scapegoat, a floppy symbol of the previous manager's tenure and the psychological impact on the poor guy can be devastating. If he has a season similar to what he had last year I can honestly see the crowd turn on him on top of his value deprecating further. Right now he has some remnant goodwill from the Everton days, that's still in public memory. If he has another poor outing most teams wouldn't be interested in him. I think the best thing to do now is offload him while he still has some value in the market. We'll recoup maybe 10-15 million to add to our transfer budget + we'll free up wages for an incoming player. It's a win-win honestly for both parties.
Click to expand...
This is the problem though, your taking his fee and expecting him to be something he's not.

He is a limited player, he should be used at the base of LVG's 4-3-3 with the strict instruction of destroying play and then quickly looking to move it forward.
 
Adam-Utd said:
This is the problem though, your taking his fee and expecting him to be something he's not.

He is a limited player, he should be used at the base of LVG's 4-3-3 with the strict instruction of destroying play and then quickly looking to move it forward.
Click to expand...

Agreed man. His price tag is a huge sticking point. If he'd costed his actual market value of around 12-15 million we wouldn't have made such a fuss about it. Also last summer we were all expecting big things in the market, getting linked with good players left right and centre. So to end up with Marouanne, an unsexy choice while spending more than what Bayern spent on Thiago or Roma on Strootman or Fellaini's replacement McCarty at Everton irked a lot of people. That just compounded the problem further because he was getting compared to the players we "missed out" on.

Also there have been suggestions that he should be at the base of a 4-3-3 and destroy things. But I just can't envision it in a team coached by Van Gaal. Historically his defensive midfielders are probably the most important cogs in his team. They have to be tactically and technically astute with great reading of the game, know when to drop back between the CMs, when to get forward, when to press and when to back off, the ability to set the tempo from deep. You look at Davids, Rijkaard, Guardiola, Cocu and some other world-class Van Gaal DMs. I just can't see Marouanne adjusting to that system when he's lacking the mental aspect, discipline, technique and concentration required of such an intense role. I know this may sound harsh but as you pointed out he is a limited player but you look at van Gaal's history of having great DMs and it just doesn't add up. Even Van Bommel, one of the weakest of the lot technically had a superior technique + workrate.
 
Stack said:
Who in these forums is claiming he can lead us?
Click to expand...

That is precisely the question. And the answer is nobody. I haven't seen anyone claiming he's the solution to our midfield woes - not now, not back when he first arrived. And yet there's some sort of underlying premise to these debates that he should be a world beater, but that he isn't - and that, thus, we should get rid of him as soon as possible.

If he doesn't suit Van Gaal - fine. That's Van Gaal's business. The utter dismissal of anything related to the man is uncalled for, however. He wasn't intended to solve our midfield issues alone - he was an overpriced but perfectly decent midfielder who has now had a mare of a season due to circumstances entirely beyond his control.
 
Yes. Fellaini can be much better than he has been so far under a new manager and, more importantly, within a properly functioning team.

As was said above, he may not get a chance to prove that point with us, but if he doesnt Im sure he'll prove the point somewhere else.
 
If we get a decent fee for him we should sell. If not we have to give him another chance.
 
ZDwyr said:
But he's played better for Everton in other seasons? So obviously he can play better than last season.
Click to expand...
As a support striker yes, as a midfielder, at best he was marginally better at Everton than here.

The other problem is that under Van Gaal I really think that the likes of Pearson have more chances than him (next season). Van Gaal wants player who are good both tactically and have good technique. Fellaini fails miserably on it. On a high tempo game with a lot of short passes, and with players who have very specified tactical duties, I really can't see how Fellaini might be decent on that system. Time will tell, but I will be really surprised if at-least we won't attempt to get rid of him during the summer.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
That is precisely the question. And the answer is nobody. I haven't seen anyone claiming he's the solution to our midfield woes - not now, not back when he first arrived. And yet there's some sort of underlying premise to these debates that he should be a world beater, but that he isn't - and that, thus, we should get rid of him as soon as possible.

If he doesn't suit Van Gaal - fine. That's Van Gaal's business. The utter dismissal of anything related to the man is uncalled for, however. He wasn't intended to solve our midfield issues alone - he was an overpriced but perfectly decent midfielder who has now had a mare of a season due to circumstances entirely beyond his control.
Click to expand...

I will be one to admit that i thought he would be a very good player for us when we signed him. Someone who could bully other midfields and just grab a a game by the scruff of the neck and be a driving force for us. Last season i was hugely disappointed. Not just by Fellaini but by the whole team. I have not completely written him off yet however and i just want to see how he will do in the World Cup in a team that he will feel more comfortable in. Maybe next season, we will see a completely different Fellaini. The lad has all the characteristics to be a fan favorite. Just needs to put his head down and prove it to everyone. He might not get that chance if he is sold this summer
 
Don't see any improvements coming from him, his best games came against the likes of West Brom, Crystal Palace......but look what happened when up against Liverpool, City, Bayern he was chasing shadows all game.

Wouldn't be surprised to see Van Gaal sell him.
 
There's a massive difference between hating a player and not rating him at all. Fellaini shouldn't have stepped inside OT unless he's an opponent or a paying guest
 
Whoever the manager, he will improve if he can improve his passing. And also may be try to get away from a silly challenge.
 
We can all agree that he is not the best midfielder around and that we paid way more money than we should have to attain his services. Yet, i find the whole criticism on him a bit unfair. It's not his fault we payed Everton that kind of money to sign him and it's certainly not fair to say that "he represents everything wrong with the Moyes Era" when the vast majority of our first team players performed under their usual standards this season.

He still can offer many things, no matter who CM joins United during the summer. Fellaini has certain abilities which are non existent in our midfield, right now. He is a strong physical presence in front of the back four, he can close down the opponent with the ball in our half and regain possession in the middle of the pitch. He is also the one and only midfielder we have who can win aerial duels in the midfield, an aspect of the game in which we've been struggling the last couple of years. No other midfielder in the squad can block/intercept these "first" long balls from the keeper or defense towards the forwards, so we often have to drop very deep to defend.

Of course he has to work hard and improve his passing and keep his calm when the going gets tough. But as far as i remember he used to make the right first passes when he was at Everton, either it was a long ball towards a winger who had open space in front of him or a short pass to his nearest teammate to control the tempo. My point is that Fellaini probably knows what the best option is, he just has to work on the quality of his passing and he has to try to keep his concentration for the whole 90 minutes. Under a manager like LvG i believe both these things are possible.

Imagine that if LvG manages to get the best out of him, we could afford to buy two quality midfielders to play in front of him and create a fast, mobile and with excellent off the ball movement midfield. I've read opinions which suggest that LvG will drop him because he doesn't rate players like Fellaini. I don't believe that's true, how much a player can offer is always determined by how his abilities fit in the group of players he plays with. As i said above, while Fellaini won't ever get a 10 minute video on YT with dribbles, superb first touches and Hollywood passes, he can give balance in our midfield through his defensive contribution.

Don't forget that it was LvG who gave Rijkard an anchorman role that revitalized his career in his mid thirties and he also used Guardiola, in his thirties, in a limited (mostly defensive role) at Barcelona. And it was the same LvG who used to start a "dirty" player like van Bommel in each and every game at Bayern. He works with what he's got and tries to instill his philosophy, no matter the formation. He expects his players to follow his orders to the letter but he also adjusts his formation/plan to the players he has. Right now we have two different players for the anchorman/holding midfielder role, Carrick (at 33) and Fellaini. Who knows what his plans are for them. If i could bet on one thing, i'd say that van Gaal wouldn't accept the United job if he believed that the whole squad should be torn down and be rebuilt from scratch. The man said it himself: "My goal is to return Man. United to the first position in the PL immediately".

Having said that, the biggest problem for Fellaini is that he hasn't blended well with the rest of the squad. His body language in the Hull game where Giggs used him in a more advanced role, so that we could take advantage of his aerial ability, showed his frustration. He made himself available for a cross or a pass in the box numerous times, but only Januzaj was trying to pass the ball to him and use him as an option to initiate attacking plays. Even though our first goal came through a header that he won in the box, the rest of the players kept ignoring him. Let's see what will happen when the new manager arrives at Carrington.
 
He should try a different league, Italy maybe? He's a good player, but he just doesn't fit in here.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.