Believe me, there's an enormous gap in terms of quality between Fabregas and him
Would Fellaini improve under a new manager?
- Thread starter MZX7
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Believe me, there's an enormous gap in terms of quality between Fabregas and him
Did overpay yes but its no reflection on his ability. There was a match thread here for one of the last few games where posters were brutal about him because he didnt score from a half decent chance, it was ridiculous. He was running like a bastard up and down the pitch and actually getting into the box to attack and people were giving him dogs abuse over it. I always say give someone two full seasons before you make your mind up about them
And thats his fault because?
Maybe he's got a lot to offer he hasn't already but I don't see how Fellaini offers anything significant to our side
Last Summer when we signed him I thought, big guy, will be great in air, combative midfielder - he'll play a Mascherano role and let Carrick or whoever play more advanced - we might start bullying teams in midfield
Since then my opinion has changed a lot - he is too slow and doesn't sense danger like Mascherano, technically limited, passing is very average, shooting poor, not a great tackler, wasteful, anonymous at times - he wasn't even productive at set pieces apart from getting a Wilson assist against Hull
I think he was a much better player and footballer at Everton - is United too much club for him? Based on what we saw last season he is an expensive mistake we should correct this summer
Last Summer when we signed him I thought, big guy, will be great in air, combative midfielder - he'll play a Mascherano role and let Carrick or whoever play more advanced - we might start bullying teams in midfield
Since then my opinion has changed a lot - he is too slow and doesn't sense danger like Mascherano, technically limited, passing is very average, shooting poor, not a great tackler, wasteful, anonymous at times - he wasn't even productive at set pieces apart from getting a Wilson assist against Hull
I think he was a much better player and footballer at Everton - is United too much club for him? Based on what we saw last season he is an expensive mistake we should correct this summer
Whose blaming him? He's just not united quality, same as moyes. He should go
No, Fellaini was a threat for Moyes style of play at Everton. Just like the rest of the team under Moyes Fellaini and no idea how we were supposd to play. You watch him at CM this summer for Belgium..completely different player
And who is United quality? Cleverly? Fletcher? Carrick? How well did they do last season?
Ha ha, I said that about Moyes too!
I agree with you. If we had signed him from Villa for £10m he wouldnt get half the stick. It is the aforementioned factors, not the football itself, which has created this animosity. It is way out of all proportion - of his football abilities, that is.
But I can understand the frustrations, myself, because of how much we paid for him. I know a lot of people feel very differently about this, its not our money etc etc, but for me its natural to judge a player on the basis of what you pay for them. You buy a player for £25m, you expect a £25m player.
But Im not going to take it a step further as many people do and in all seriousness say I saw a better player playing 5-a-side at the park last weekend, or he is the same quality as your average league 2 player. That is nonsense.
I think people just get frustrated and then overshoot in their criticisms.
Look, the thread was would Fellaini improve under new manager (LvG) and the answer is yes definitely
Does that mean he is the answer to our problems? No but it doesnt hurt to have depth. Van Gaal would definitely be aware
of the Belgian lads and would know how to use a player like Marouane. Ive no doubt at all that he would improve under someone
who is ten times the coach of his last manager.
Does that mean he is the answer to our problems? No but it doesnt hurt to have depth. Van Gaal would definitely be aware
of the Belgian lads and would know how to use a player like Marouane. Ive no doubt at all that he would improve under someone
who is ten times the coach of his last manager.
I believe we need a new midfield many of those players shouldn't be here. If I'd had to choose whom I keep as squad player I'd rather see us keep a homegrown talent then an overrated and probably over paid cm with the wrong characteristics to succeed at OT
He has become the poster boy for Moyes' failed United stint - that's pretty obvious. And it certainly isn't fair and objective on him.
And those who have a problem with his hair are devoid of culture and taste. The hair alone made him worth the fee.
And those who have a problem with his hair are devoid of culture and taste. The hair alone made him worth the fee.
No one did that with mata. Maybe because he is a good player
It's not really a fair comparison, is it?
Everyone agrees we overpaid for Fellaini, for starters. Mata was a so-called marquee signing - Fellaini clearly wasn't. Except some still try to twist it that way, somehow - as if paying a grotesque amount for Fellaini was the epitome of Moyes' stone-age idiocy, implying that he - Moyes - actually believed Fellaini would solve all our midfield woes, etc.
Completely different contexts, I'd say.
And, yes - Mata is obviously a better player than Fellaini and thus less likely to be afforded zero patience.
What I am saying is that no one cares who brought the player. What they care about is the talent. Mata is at United level, Fellaini isnt, Ole was at United level, Bellion wasn't, Robson was at United level, Davenport wasn't. Its that simple.
Much better players have failed to enter United's system and were shown the door. At a point JSV was the second most rated playmaker in the world, second only to a certain Mr Zidane. He came at United, he failed to fit in our system (I remember him complaining on Italian media that in England he's forced to drop deep, win the ball and contribute in defensive duties, something he never did before) and he left. Its not about patience, its about style of game. At this level you need to be more then just a big guy who plays it safe and can control the ball well with his upper body. Also his 'physical superiority' may be appreciated at clubs like Everton, Stoke and Bolton but in the CL that would probably land him a red card. We don't need that shit at OT.
Honestly if VG manages to do miracles with him it would great and a clear testimony of how great VG is as a manager. However I wont hold my breath about that. If someone offers us 10-15m then we should ship him out at OT ASAP. At least we would get some of the money back before his valutation gets lower.
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Yeah, alright - the Veron example is fair. Some players don't fit in for whatever reason - and then there's nowt to do but move 'em on. Fellaini could be in that bracket, sure.
The other analogies are less apt, though. OGS versus Bellion is gold versus dross, both punts who could have gone either way at the time of their respective purchases. Robbo versus Davenport is neither here nor there. Davenport did well for United until Hughes came back from the continent - he was our top scorer in one of his seasons for us, and Fergie's preferred partner for McClair before Hughes returned.
We'll see what Van Gaal has to say about Fellaini. If he deems him the sort of player he simply can't use - fair enough. I'll wait and see, though.
You're feeling to see my analogy. People judge the talent and not the man he brought them. No one 'hated' SAF because he brought Djemba Djemba and no one judged Djemba Djemba as a great player because he was brought in by SAF. Same as Fellaini. Any hostility about him is not because Moyes brought him in but simply because he's not the type of player that succeeds at OT.
I hate Moyes football and I could never see it succeed at OT. However I am the first to admit that (apart from Fellaini) all his transfer targets were top quality players who would have improved us greatly. Fabregas, Shaw, Carvalho, Kroos, Mata and Herrera are all great talent. I had issues about Baines but he's currently better then Evra.
You see people can distinguish between one thing and another. Just because I dont think that Fellaini is not good for us that doesn't mean that I hate him. Also just because I dont like Moyes tactics that doesn't mean I am 'punishing' Fellaini for it.
Yes, alright - fair enough. But then you can't compare him to Djemba Djemba. Because they aren't remotely similar in terms of fees and/or the status they had before they arrived. Surely you can see that Fellaini's fee makes a difference in terms of how he is regarded?
And surely you can see that a player David Moyes - an extremely unpopular figure among many United fans at the moment - brought to United from his old club, is bound to be regarded with much more skepticism than any player Fergie may have taken a punt at - for a much smaller fee?
You may be 100% objective in your assessment of Fellaini - but I doubt all his detractors are.
The whole hate thing... I don't get it - childish and idiotic
Moyes, Fellaini and guys like Young, Cleverley etc have tried their heart out - that's all you can ask
If they have failed while giving everything you have to respect them
I've a lot of sympathy for Fellaini - didn't ask for the transfer fee, probably isnt ever going to be good enough to justify it but its not like he can suddenly start playing like Paul Scholes because he tries harder is it?
I think Fellaini may improve a bit under a new manager, less pressure, better atmosphere in squad possibly
Moyes, Fellaini and guys like Young, Cleverley etc have tried their heart out - that's all you can ask
If they have failed while giving everything you have to respect them
I've a lot of sympathy for Fellaini - didn't ask for the transfer fee, probably isnt ever going to be good enough to justify it but its not like he can suddenly start playing like Paul Scholes because he tries harder is it?
I think Fellaini may improve a bit under a new manager, less pressure, better atmosphere in squad possibly
Well he surely couldn't be worse
Yes, Van Gaal most certainly is going to play with a 3-man midfield and it's better suited for Fellaini. Although i am nit sure LVG will want him here.
I can only see him succeeding at a lower-table club, say West Ham or Stoke, that bases itself on heavy physical play. United just isn't that kind of team and I don't see him ever doing well here.
I can see him improving...but not sure if van Gaal has him in mind for the team he wants to play.
if not he will be shipped out.
if not he will be shipped out.
Thing is that Van Gaal can't simply ship him out easily, can he? We paid a lot of money for him - and he's presumably on decent money. Finding a suitable buyer might not be that easy. There are other squad members it would be far less problematic for Van Gaal to get rid of.
Fellaini and Ashley Young are 'Arry type players surely?
I was thinking a similar thing. I could definitely see him being interested in Young.
I've seen more than a few posts suggesting that he's unfairly slagged here. I have no problem with that. Their opinion is their business and my opinion is mine.
That said, the weight of the evidence points to the conclusion that Fellaini has no business wearing the red shirt.
claiming a player is unfairly slagged is quite a long way away from people claiming he could lead us to success. ffs
Harry tries to get his teams to play decent stuff unlike Moyes. So can't see him taking Fellaini.
Fellaini is a wonderful player for teams that play awful dull tactics where the teams only tactics is to get the ball out to the wing and then cross it in to some giant in the box........but as a central midfielder I'd have darren gibson any day of the week in central midfield rather than fellaini....I know fellaini looks good playing for belgium but for us in central midfield he just looks a clear level below everyone else and looks like he is capable of getting 2 red cards in every game.....if it was joey barton that had commited some of the fouls that fellaini has done for us then it would have been red no question but maybe the refs have almost felt sorry for fellaini for getting so much stick from all sides that they were lenient on him
Read some of these posts more carefully. No one has suggested that Fellaini is the next Zidane, but the suggestion that Fellaini could (emphasize "could", not "will") become an important player for us next season has been made on several occasions.
That's not an irrational belief to hold, by the way. He performed well at Everton and does a job for Belgium. Still, neither are anywhere close to the cauldron that is Old Trafford. I don't think it's in him to be anything more than a squad man for us, but there are those who differ. We'll find out, won't we?
I was replying to your post where you were making the claim..... ffs...
Fellaini is effective. He isn't a footballer who plays the game, he disrupts the game. He will improve under LVG but he will never develop into a Scholes/Gerrard/Alonso etc. He is mainly there for his large presence, his aggression and his ability to disrupt the opposition.
I have nothing against Fellaini, he's just doing his job. He's not going to hand in a transfer request because he thinks he's too shit for United is he?
He could improve his effectiveness under LVG.
I have nothing against Fellaini, he's just doing his job. He's not going to hand in a transfer request because he thinks he's too shit for United is he?
He could improve his effectiveness under LVG.
Totally agree, he completely attracts the refs attention and is a walking red card. I hate to be mean and unfair on players but really don't like seeing him in a United shirt. He's just such a dirty, immobile and negative player.
Reading through this thread I thought this post deserved a mention. I too am someone who is indifferent to the impact and don't really care how much he cost. As long as he puts his bollocks on the line and plays his heart out if he's good enough then he's good enough. If he's not, then he's not and we move on.
What I do find hilarious though is grown men coming to a forum to spit their venom at a player like a toddler who's had his pacifier taken away. These are the same grown men that will hound every bad performance and refuse to give credit if and when he plays well. For me it's galvanized a feeling of the same hope that when we first heard about Moyes we were all in a state of 'aghhhh.. Ok we'll support him but that is not the best appointment' and some of the vitriol coming from opposition fans galvanizd a sense of 'you know what.. feck it.. I want him to do well to shut these wankers up'.
We sit back and we watch it unfold and whatever happens happens. But acting like toddlers throwing the toys out of the pram is just funny to me. Seeing some people turn at the drop of a dime into infants mashing their hands on the keyboard is entertainment enough.
That's nice. Some bloke who watches United doesn't think he has it in him. Considering the laughing stock that Old Trafford is at the moment I think that one is entirely off the map and some players deserve a clean slate. If he can perform under LVG that is all we can ask for. But not even giving him the chance is completely stupid. It's not even a case of 'well I can see something there, lets see how he does.. I hope he does well..' It's a case of 'Well we'll see won't we....... HAH I TOLD YOU HE'D BE SHIT' when in truth the people you are arguing with don't care and will be happy to say, 'what a shame it didn't work out for him'. The impatience of the modern fan is also humorous.
I respect the opinion that Fellaini might come good for United, but to insinuate that because we only "watch United" and are not on the training ground every day and thus our opinion lacks merit is delusional.
The problem with Fellaini isn't that he's shit (he's not), it's that what he does well is what we don't need. He's a fantastic target man, a 10 in an old-fashioned English longball game. He would have been sensational playing for top English clubs in the 70s and 80s and that is by no means an insult. But the style of play most us want to see United play isn't classic English longball. Who knows what Louis will bring to OT but it seems unlikely that it would be a return to that. Moyes tried it and it was a miserable failure.
Fellaini is simply not a creative mid, not a box to box mid, not a wide mid, not a deep lying mid and not a defensive mid. He just isn't any of that. What he is brilliant at is attacking the box in search of long crosses, either for the direct shot or the knockdown ball. We saw that at the very end of the season when he won a header for the Wilson finish.
Fantastic stuff, but playing to Fellaini's strength in the air just can't be our attacking philosophy next season.
There is nothing impatient about observing the obvious.
This here is the biggest myth on the planet today. people are being lazy in both their observations and their thinking. Just because someone is a big man and can chest a ball doesnt automatically mean that they are a target man. There is far more to Fellaini's game than being a big bastard. Also the other amusing one is the whole lack of mobility and passing range myth. Just watching him you can see he covers a ton of ground in every game and passes both long and short. He doesnt launch it long and he doesnt sit around waiting for high balls to be launched at him. Just google Fellaini all touches and go back and watch his games and you will see he is often a one touch passer. The stats back it up as well where he was consistently in the games he played in covering more ground than anyone else and also in the top 2-3 for passes completed.
It is really amusing to me how so many in here are blindly falling into the whole long ball big man routine with Fellaini which in turn is blinding so many to how he actually plays.
I know this isnt Fellaini for Utd but its the 1st link that comes up when you do Fellaini all touches. BTW its worth doing Fellaini all touches for Belgium. The guy isnt a long ball merchant as some in here would have you believe.
He is a big man who plays pass and move football, thats his style. Out of all the passes in that clip only 2 were lofted passes, the rest were on the floor. The big target man myth is nothing more than lazy observation and thinking.
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Should LVG emphasize our game on passing the ball and keeping it on the ground through quick movements, Fellaini can pack his bags because he will NEVER fit in a new system made for top clubs.
Perfect illustration of what im saying. Watch the video I posted and you will see that he was passing the ball on the ground and moving as soon as he passed the ball. Pass and move.
I think he can. His passing ability is underrated. I'm not saying he's Scholes or anything but he's decent enough.