Woodward (old thread)

Should Studward remain as CE of Manchester United?

  • No - he should be sacked also.

    Votes: 40 22.6%

  • Yes - he should stay.

    Votes: 137 77.4%
  • Total voters
    177
  • Poll closed .
Status
Not open for further replies.
CassiusClaymore said:
I think that's probably close to the truth. On the one hand you can understand him being sceptical about signing players he hasn't personally seen but on the other hand why would he possibly think any of his Everton targets (all disrespect to them) would be good enough for us? Another example of how out of his depth he was.

He should've trusted the advice he had been given and kept some more of the original backroom staff around but of course we all know this already.
Click to expand...

This is where he failed Cassius, from the day he walked into Old Trafford and changed the backroom staff he ignored all advice being given to him from people at the very top of the game. Ignoring our scouts who he later replaced was just another example of a man who really had no idea what he was doing. Way too much ego, it's either his way or nothing.

Whereas LVG is precisely the opposite. Yes he has his own way and will bring some of his own staff, but he will leave the general club structure alone and listen to the staff. He strikes me as a very intelligent man, someone who thrives on information. Who will make the right calls based on the information he's been given by the staff.

It's going to be interesting to see what Ed delivers us this Summer. David May seems very excited, so that's good enough for me!
 
RedSky said:
This is where he failed Cassius, from the day he walked into Old Trafford and changed the backroom staff he ignored all advice being given to him from people at the very top of the game. Ignoring our scouts who he later replaced was just another example of a man who really had no idea what he was doing. Way too much ego, it's either his way or nothing.

Whereas LVG is precisely the opposite. Yes he has his own way and will bring some of his own staff, but he will leave the general club structure alone and listen to the staff. He strikes me as a very intelligent man, someone who thrives on information. Who will make the right calls based on the information he's been given by the staff.

It's going to be interesting to see what Ed delivers us this Summer. David May seems very excited, so that's good enough for me!
Click to expand...

What happened to your atNight?
 
Interesting to note in all of this is United had actually scouted players and had specific targets, including the midfield, whilst Ferguson was still the manager. Far from leaving the side "in a mess" as some have claimed, had Ferguson remained, or Moyes pulled the trigger, the targets in place would have started the rejuvenation process.
 
RedSky said:
This is where he failed Cassius, from the day he walked into Old Trafford and changed the backroom staff he ignored all advice being given to him from people at the very top of the game. Ignoring our scouts who he later replaced was just another example of a man who really had no idea what he was doing. Way too much ego, it's either his way or nothing.
Click to expand...

This is the backroom staff who found us zero midfielders between 2007 and 2013 - but, to their credit, did identify Obertan, Bebe and Zaha.
 
Pexbo said:
The point is that last years feck up over Herrera was attributed to Woodward and that has always been used as a stick to beat him with.

The truth has come out that it was Moyes who was never prepared to pay his buyout clause and only ever saw him as a £23m signing (Moyes own words in his column). LVG has identified Herrera as a player he likes and said to Woodward "I want him, go buy him for me". So he did.

That's a credit to Woodward. It seems like you are looking for him to negotiate a £20m transfer of Vidal before you will give him any credit.
Click to expand...

I genuinely had no idea. I haven't read any of Moyes' columns since he was fired and hadn't paid much attention to gossip about behind the scenes board room stuff. It was a genuine, not rhetorical question
 
Loon said:
Interesting to note in all of this is United had actually scouted players and had specific targets, including the midfield, whilst Ferguson was still the manager. Far from leaving the side "in a mess" as some have claimed, had Ferguson remained, or Moyes pulled the trigger, the targets in place would have started the rejuvenation process.
Click to expand...

It's a pity that Fergie damaged his own legacy by the choice of Moyes.
 
Will Absolute said:
It's a pity that Fergie damaged his own legacy by the choice of Moyes.
Click to expand...

Think that is pish to be honest. Fergie gave Moyes the foundations of a young side to work with and between him and Gill practically delivered Moyes: Garay, Thiago and Strootman on a platter. Moyes cocked it up for himself.
 
Stobzilla said:
Think that is pish to be honest. Fergie gave Moyes the foundations of a young side to work with and between him and Gill practically delivered Moyes: Garay, Thiago and Strootman on a platter. Moyes cocked it up for himself.
Click to expand...

Yes. And Fergie chose him.


Plugsy said:
No he didn't.
Click to expand...

You don't think what happened in the last year was damaging?
 
Will Absolute said:
Yes. And Fergie chose him.




You don't think what happened in the last year was damaging?
Click to expand...

No i don't believe any United fan will judge Fergie by Moyes' mistakes. The only ones that will are the ones who have been gunning for him since the Glazer affair e.g those who somehow think the Bebe signing is the definitive moment in the history of the football club.

I don't doubt there are "fans" desperate in any way to tarnish his association with the football club but I don't think their existence is particularly important.
 
Plugsy said:
No i don't believe any United fan will judge Fergie by Moyes' mistakes. The only ones that will are the ones who have been gunning for him since the Glazer affair e.g those who somehow think the Bebe signing is the definitive moment in the history of the football club.

I don't doubt there are "fans" desperate in any way to tarnish his association with the football club but I don't think their existence is particularly important.
Click to expand...

I'm not gunning for Fergie, and in any accounting of his contribution to MUFC, the balance is overwhelmingly in his favour; but his choice of successor was the single most important decision of his entire tenure, and he got it wrong. A blemish on an otherwise almost perfect record.
 
I don't see how Will's post garnered those responses.
Fergie's legacy was he team, his staff ans the elite club itself.
Did Moyes not damage any of that? Of course he did.
Was Moyes his choice? Yes. How do you have a problem with Will's statement.
 
Will Absolute said:
I'm not gunning for Fergie, and in any accounting of his contribution to MUFC, the balance is overwhelmingly in his favour; but his choice of successor was the single most important decision of his entire tenure, and he got it wrong. A blemish on an otherwise almost perfect record.
Click to expand...

I'd say deciding to promote the class of 92 and change the core of a title winning team which then led us to unprecedented success was a much more important decision than choosing his successor.
 
Amir said:
It's not a theory. This is what Moyes said a couple of days ago:

"Without going over old ground regarding last summer's transfer window, I want to make two points. The last thing we wanted was to make him my first signing as United manager and the only signing of the summer.

"That was always going to bring too great a spotlight on him. But by the time we got to deadline day the club hadn't been able to close a couple of big deals and there was no choice."

Why didn't we go or pay heavily for other players? Now that IS a theory. I think Moyes was like a scared cat, fearing the possibility of signing someone who he didn't know 100%, either personally or by extensive scouting. So good names came and went, and nothing happened.
Click to expand...

"The club (Woodward) hadn't been able to close a couple of big deals and there was no choice".

So the Club (Woodward) , were unable to seal the deal with priority signings and United were left having to stump up for Fellani because of the Clubs (Woodward) failure to attract our top targets . .

Thanks for clarifying it . .
 
Drummer said:
"The club (Woodward) hadn't been able to close a couple of big deals and there was no choice".

So the Club (Woodward) , were unable to seal the deal with priority signings and United were left having to stump up for Fellani because of the Clubs (Woodward) failure to attract our top targets . .

Thanks for clarifying it . .
Click to expand...
Fecking Woodward for not offering 40m to sign Baines for Moyes (and then to throw him on toilet after Moyes got sacked) and for doing the deals for only Thiago, Strootman, Garay and Herrera but then Moyes vetoe them. He should have done the deals for at-least another 38 players in order for Moyes to be able to choose some of them.
 
He's turning out to be a good apple after the shambles of last summer. Mata and now Herrera? I'm not sure what more he can do.
 
where's the proof (that I've seen floating around here a bit) that Moyes actually rejected Thiago, Strootman, Garay etc?

Genuine question.
 
Cina said:
where's the proof (that I've seen floating around here a bit) that Moyes actually rejected Thiago, Strootman, Garay etc?

Genuine question.
Click to expand...
Garay confirmed it that things changed and United didn't want him as much after we changed the manager. I have posted the article at least twice on the Caf and have seen it a few other times being posted.

For Herrera, Graham Hunter posted that Moyes said to him that Ed wanted to go all in but Moyes wasn't convinced that he is worth that money and decided to scout him for an another year. It is possible that he is bullshitting, but in that case Moyes can use legal actions, and he has done it in the past. For Thiago, the closest thing comes from his father (while Thiago denied it) and of course a lot of reports (including Hunter who says that is a friend of his father).
 
Drummer said:
"The club (Woodward) hadn't been able to close a couple of big deals and there was no choice".

So the Club (Woodward) , were unable to seal the deal with priority signings and United were left having to stump up for Fellani because of the Clubs (Woodward) failure to attract our top targets . .

Thanks for clarifying it . .
Click to expand...
Who, in this world, always gets their ''top'' targerts ? That is especially more pronounced when your top targets are difficult to prise away from their current clubs e.g.how long did Real Madrid chase Ronaldo from us or Barcelona chase Cesc himself ? The fact is a top manager will always have fallback and stopgap options to avoid exactly what happened last season. The fact that the club didn't have fallback options falls squarely on the football side's door step, of which your boy Moyes was in charge. Unless you want Woodward to scout players for us there is no way you can lay the blame on us not having other options to pursue when it was realised that Cesc and Baines weren't on!
It's extremely unrealistic to expect Woodward to attract top players beyond what he can control - the purse. There is pretty much nothing more he can do beyond offering them a huge wage increase and in cases like Fabregas' recent move it's pointless to waste time on such a player if he has indicated that he wishes to move to London. In my view Woodward's failure becomes attributable to him when he has gotten as far as getting the player to the negotiating table and his offer falls short like what happened with Gill and Fergie over Hazard.
 
Shark said:
He's turning out to be a good apple after the shambles of last summer. Mata and now Herrera? I'm not sure what more he can do.
Click to expand...

He could sign Messi and some on the caf would still say that SAF/Gill/Moyes/Ghost of Busby should get the credit.

I mean, he's not blameless for the fiasco last summer, but clearly he's a quick learner (which you have to be to be commerically successful), and so far he appears to be stepping up to the challenge - unlike Moyes.
 
I think time will prove that it was Moyes who cocked up everything last summer from being a small time dour and clueless manager as opposed to Woodward being at fault.

Moyes has already admitted it was his idea to pull the plug on Herrera last summer as he felt the price to steep. It was also Moyes fault for ignoring Strootman and making a last minute panic buy to sign Fellaini. I really don't see how Woodward can take the blame for any of that. In fact i'd say Woodward utterly despises Moyes now for being such a dithering dave in the transfer window resulting in the reputations of both men taking a pummeling. Moyes probably thought he could stroll into Man Utd without spending a penny and easily win the league again at the same time with the same players such was his delusional belief of his own false hype from his time at Everton.
 
Im all for a bit of Moyes bashing but I think Moyes problem was the opposite of the overconfidence of believing his own hype. The abiding image of Moyes' appointment for me is in that article where he said the blood drained from his face. He was scared stiff, terrified of making a mistake, terrified of making decisions in case they turned out to be the wrong one. Dithering is surely something that is associated with fear rather than unwarranted bullishness.
 
Looks like another transfer gone arseways. Watch the Woodward hacks defend him still however.
 
Let's wait until the deal actually falls through before we put this one down as another Woodward cockup. It isnt his fault Bilbao are notoriously obtuse when it comes to transfer business. He may still get it done.
 
Lynk said:
Looks like another transfer gone arseways. Watch the Woodward hacks defend him still however.
Click to expand...
Are you fecking serious? The man has offered €36m for Herrera, more than the fee chelsea paid for fabregas and Bilbao have rejected, what in god's name do you want him to do? Just pay whatever Bilbao want?
 
Speak said:
It doesn't look that way.
Click to expand...
We won't pay 50 million euros. That's what we'll have to pay now to get him.
Devil_forever said:
Are you fecking serious? The man has offered €36m for Herrera, more than the fee chelsea paid for fabregas and Bilbao have rejected, what in god's name do you want him to do? Just pay whatever Bilbao want?
Click to expand...
Bilbao are a fecking cnut of a club to deal with, he should've coughed up the money or not bother at all. Anyone who follows La Liga knows this.
 
Lynk said:
We won't pay 50 million euros. That's what we'll have to pay now to get him.

Bilbao are a fecking cnut of a club to deal with, he should've coughed up the money or not bother at all. Anyone who follows La Liga knows this.
Click to expand...
His clause was €36m until the 1st of July, why the hell would he pay over that?
 
Speak said:
In that case, it's not Woodward's fault really, is it?
Click to expand...
It is, we shouldn't be bringing players for medicals and feeding the media when we haven't signed the player. If this falls through it will send a similar message that happened last season, we'll look weak.
Devil_forever said:
His clause was €36m until the 1st of July, why the hell would he pay over that?
Click to expand...
Because Bilbao won't accept it. They did the same for Martinez. Either pay the tax or don't bother, Bilbao don't negotiate. They aren't in the position to.
 
you'd bloody think they learned from last summer with this wouldnt you?

eitherway, it still will be done, no way Woodward will allow himself to be embarrassed like that again, through €40million is insane money for such an unproven player.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.