Willian

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I've resigned myself to this. Jose worships him, he wants out, we'll spend a fortne on him and sell Martial.

In some ways it will improve us. In others, it's yet another 28-30 yr old player coming on board with undoubtedly big wages, and if Jose fails next season and leaves = the new manager comes in and finds a squad with a fairly old spine that needs re-shaping and we get the whole 'transition' thing for 2yrs again.
 
Dec9003 said:
I like Willian a lot but he doesn't score many goals, which is our biggest problem this season.
If this goes through and we don't get another attacker I don't think it would be enough, but then maybe the players we have will simply improve for next season.
Is the speculation with Willian and Talisca all based on Joses comment about having a Brazillian in the squad perhaps?
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He opens up space and creates for others. He’s the type of player who’ll score 10 goals or so and make Lukaku have 20+ league goals and the supporting cast attackers 10+ each.

Add together all those increases and it’s what will make a big difference. /Willian isn’t being brought in for his goals primarily. It’s to actually give us RW width and creativity so we’re not as predictable as we are now.
 
unitedbhoy said:
Goal scoring per minute last season:
Willian goal per 235
Sane goal per 258
Eriksen goal per 284
Hazard goal per 224

I don't see an issue with Willan's goal scoring prowess - not to mentioned in an under performing Chelsea side.
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unitedbhoy said:
Hmmm

Willian assist per 254
Eriksen assist per 306
Hazard assist per 293

Willian has been one of Chelsea's best performing and most consistent player for the past few season imo. Great set piece taker as well.
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Real talk.


amolbhatia50k said:
I've always liked Willian but more as a useful squad player. He's never been a top player and never will be.
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...this is what I mean when people haven’t seen him play thus don’t know what they’re talking about.
 
VancouverUtdFan said:
He opens up space and creates for others. He’s the type of player who’ll score 10 goals or so and make Lukaku have 20+ league goals and the supporting cast attackers 10+ each.

Add together all those increases and it’s what will make a big difference. /Willian isn’t being brought in for his goals primarily. It’s to actually give us RW width and creativity so we’re not as predictable as we are now.
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If we buy Willian you’d imagine our front three will be Sanchez, Lukaku and Willian.

Unless Willian starts scoring at a very improved rate it’s putting a lot of pressure on Lukaku and Sanchez to score a lot more than they did this season.

A big risk imo, plus at his age we’d be looking to replace him and Sanchez at roughly the same time in the future.

I actually think Willian would be better centrally taking Lingards position. He’s got that turn of pace Jesse doesn’t.
 
VancouverUtdFan said:
He opens up space and creates for others. He’s the type of player who’ll score 10 goals or so and make Lukaku have 20+ league goals and the supporting cast attackers 10+ each.

Add together all those increases and it’s what will make a big difference. /Willian isn’t being brought in for his goals primarily. It’s to actually give us RW width and creativity so we’re not as predictable as we are now.
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That's my major worry though, I can see Lukaku getting twenty in the league no problem. I can't see the supporting cast all getting enough goals.
 
Willian is a decent player but targeting him over Mahrez / Bale??

He was about the only player that played well for Jose in his last (disastrous) season at Chelsea though, when others were downing tools - I'm sure that's a big driver for this move.
 
Summit said:
I disagree mate. Let us look at the signings our manager has made shall we, seen as though he'll be making more and is the reason I have no confidence in his choices atm. Actually James Ducker explains it well
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What a load of steaming hot bs. Jesus.


More like:

Lukaku - for sure starter...most dependant attacking player

Mikhi - swapped into Alexis

Alexis - for sure starter...came midseason so next season is what he’ll be judged on / no excuses

Zlatan - for sure starter...was one of best strikers in league and joined us on a free ffs. Was only going to be here for a couple years anyways and 2nd season got cut short with that essentially career ending injury. Was on verge of retiring but went to MLS

Bailly - for sure starter...injured all year, so people not remember him when he plays? One of the best CBs in the country

Pogba - for sure starter...due to squad limitations he’s playing box-to-box which doesn’t suit him. Even with him being as inconsistent there as he is, look at our winning % with Pogba in the team regardless of his form versus without him. Night and day difference and goes to show how great he is

Matic - for sure starter...most dependant midfielder who holds everything together

Lindelof - not a for sure starter...hasn’t played enough. Young so can’t conclude if he’s a failure or not


...more like 6 out of 7 signings bar Lindelof are our only for sure starters on the entire team, other than De Gea who’s the only for sure starter Mourinho inherited. Mourinho has hit on virtually all of his signings and shows how bad the team was prior to coming here.
 
James Ducker has gone down a couple of notches after that daft tweet. It's like moving to the Guardian and rubbing shoulders with Jaime Jackson has somewhat dumbed him down.
 
Summit said:
I disagree mate. Let us look at the signings our manager has made shall we, seen as though he'll be making more and is the reason I have no confidence in his choices atm. Actually James Ducker explains it well
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No he doesn’t. James Ducker is an oppertunistic moron like the rest of them. By any reasonable standards Mourinho’s transfers have been fine and they’re a big reason to why we’re not completely hopeless in the league anymore. More than his safety-first tactics anyway.

Guys like Lukaku, Pogba and Bailly have the right age and potential, and if they want out they represent a lot of resale value or even profit depending on the contract situation and further inflation of the market.

Matic has been solid as feck and looks like he has at least two more good seasons in him.

The whining about Sanchez is borderline idiotic, the guy’s a tremendous player with a great mentality. Ten or twelve weeks in he already showed it against the likes of City and Spurs. We actually traded him for Mkhi who didn’t cost much to begin with. Potential injuries aside it’s very likely he will be one of our best players next year, more likely than him turning out to be a bona fide flop like so many are already claiming anyway.

Zlatan... Well, we should’ve stuck with just Rooney and Rashford last season I guess. Maybe should’ve added a Demba-ba calibre of striker for 50 million.

Lindeløf has been uninspiring though, I’ll give him that. But we won’t lose much money on him given his age and contract length, and he was bought in a context where Jones is a perma crock, Bailly seems to have the same type of rashness as Jones combined with the injuries. And most importantly, Rojo being unavailable for an unpredictable amount of time.

These transfers are nothing like the shite Moyes and Van Gaal pulled, pissing away hundreds of millions in a less expensive and inflated market, with really only Herrera, Martial and some very shite leage finishes to show for.

As for Willian. Well, I’d probably rather have him than Bale all things considered (mostly the extreme financial demands and injuries of Bale). That’s about the only positive way to spin it.
 
VP89 said:
James Ducker has gone down a couple of notches after that daft tweet. It's like moving to the Guardian and rubbing shoulders with Jaime Jackson has somewhat dumbed him down.
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Or wise up at making more money by driving controversial soundbites
 
Summit said:
I disagree mate. Let us look at the signings our manager has made shall we, seen as though he'll be making more and is the reason I have no confidence in his choices atm. Actually James Ducker explains it well
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People really eat garbage like this up which tries to spin everything as negative as possible.
 
Henrik Larsson said:
No he doesn’t. James Ducker is an oppertunistic moron like the rest of them. By any reasonable standards Mourinho’s transfers have been fine and they’re a big reason to why we’re not completely hopeless in the league anymore. More than his safety-first tactics anyway.

Guys like Lukaku, Pogba and Bailly have the right age and potential, and if they want out they represent a lot of resale value or even profit depending on the contract situation and further inflation of the market.

Matic has been solid as feck and looks like he has at least two more good seasons in him.

The whining about Sanchez is borderline idiotic, the guy’s a tremendous player with a great mentality. Ten or twelve weeks in he already showed it against the likes of City and Spurs. We actually traded him for Mkhi who didn’t cost much to begin with. Potential injuries aside it’s very likely he will be one of our best players next year, more likely than him turning out to be a bona fide flop like so many are already claiming anyway.

Zlatan... Well, we should’ve stuck with just Rooney and Rashford last season I guess. Maybe should’ve added a Demba-ba calibre of striker for 50 million.

Lindeløf has been uninspiring though, I’ll give him that. But we won’t lose much money on him given his age and contract length, and he was bought in a context where Jones is a perma crock, Bailly seems to have the same type of rashness as Jones combined with the injuries. And most importantly, Rojo being unavailable for an unpredictable amount of time.

These transfers are nothing like the shite Moyes and Van Gaal pulled, pissing away hundreds of millions in a less expensive and inflated market, with really only Herrera, Martial and some very shite leage finishes to show for.

As for Willian. Well, I’d probably rather have him than Bale all things considered (mostly the extreme financial demands and injuries of Bale). That’s about the only positive way to spin it.
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I suppose there is the negative way of looking at this and the rose tinted glasses way. It will most probably be somewhere in the middle. Not sure why you are referencing Moyes and LvG though? No one mentioned them in this.
 
The holy trinity 68 said:
I really hope he comes to United. The only Chelsea player that I like. He is fantastic and one of the only players not to down tools under Mourinho. He has been their best player this season, and anyone who says Hazard has is wrong and just going off how highly rated his reputation is.

Willian is a work horse and also provides flair in attack. Can play on the left, on the right, through the middle, and can even play as a wingback in a 3 5 2 system if necessary. The guy is better than Mata, Lingard, Martial and Rashford. What is there not to want?
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He has certainly not been our best player this season (not even in my personal top 3, actually) and definitely hasn't been better than Eden. Saying this as someone who watched every second of every match we played this season.

Willian has been a personal favorite of mine during his time here and I'd like him to stay, but like most Chelsea fans I interact with on other forums I wouldn't be against replacing him with a new, younger winger.

One of the biggest complaints we have with Willian is how wildly inconsistent he is. He has an excellent stretch here and there when he can look like a world class attacker and then he can disappear and really piss off the supporters with how ineffective he is.

Think seeing Willian in a United shirt would be a bit like Mata. Will hurt at first but he's not a player who's going to take you guys to a new level so the feeling of hurt will quickly fade. He'll be his usual solid self but nothing spectacular. I'd be more fearful of facing United were you to sign Mahrez or Bale.
 
There's absolutely nothing wrong with Mourinho's buying (so far). It's what he does with the players he signs that is the issue.
 
Willian is talented but he tends to get into tunnel vision mode and run into trouble. Him and Sanchez on opposite wings could have a personal competition in frustrating, brainless, loss of possession.

Set piece quality might be his most important quality that he could bring to this team.
 
Rather have Bale if available ( coming from a person who hate signing Bale)

Not because he is a bad player but we can do much better and he is getting to an age where we will soon be looking for replacement.
 
I’m willing to bet that if we sign Willian, he’ll be moved to RB or RWB in a 352 by the end of the 18/19 season. I don’t think his productive enough to be apart of a 3 man forward line. He doesn’t seem consistent enough either. I think the very best we would get is 1 season. Then both he and Sanchez will need big money replacements.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Do you judge Iniesta's playmaking and creativity through his assists?
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If you're going to completely ignore Willian's statistical return over the past season then I'm not sure if there's any discussion to be had here.

No idea why you're bringing Iniesta up.

Willian is an extremely solid PL player with a good return rate. Anyone who watches Willian and doesn't think he's United quality, I'd love to know any obtainable players they think would bring more to the team.
 
Are we becoming Chelsea's feeder club? (Or whatever the opposite of that is). When do we get a crack at Hazard?
 
marktan said:
Are we becoming Chelsea's feeder club? (Or whatever the opposite of that is). When do we get a crack at Hazard?
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Using Essien calculator, my calculation is in 2 years time after he turned 29 y/o
 
Alabaster Codify7 said:
I've resigned myself to this. Jose worships him, he wants out, we'll spend a fortne on him and sell Martial.

In some ways it will improve us. In others, it's yet another 28-30 yr old player coming on board with undoubtedly big wages, and if Jose fails next season and leaves = the new manager comes in and finds a squad with a fairly old spine that needs re-shaping and we get the whole 'transition' thing for 2yrs again.
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Resigned to what exactly? Why is everyone so fecking ageist all of a sudden? Its called experience and Willian has a PL winners medal. We have shipped out most of our winners the last 5 years. Please cut out this age nonsense theres loads of young players in the squad.
 
Right now what we need is reliable players who will hit the ground running, literally. No time for flashy signings or young talent signings, we had plenty of those. What we need is squad balance, players with excellent techniques who play fast pace - direct football, we are desperately in need of width.
I don't necessarily like Willian, but he fullfils all our needs right now, plus premier league experience.
If we manage to sign him without breaking the bank, I say go for him today.
 
Some were saying Matic was underwhelming signing. It's like the signings we're drooling over are working great or something.

Willian is going to make us a balanced side for the first time for years.
 
Surprised at the objections to Willian, especially considering we haven't had a RW for god knows how long. He's been the best player on the pitch against us a few times, and he carries the ball at speed better than any of our current crop (by a long way). He would give us some much needed balance. I'm obviously in the minority, but I think that he would be an excellent addition. He is a very good player.
 
Raoul said:
Hope we opt for a younger option - Douglas Costa would be idea.
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Costa doesn’t track back like Willian or the type or RW Mourinho would want.

If Willian doesn’t end up being available, I’d much rather have Mahrez than Costa who’re the same age.
 
devil in me said:
Surprised at the objections to Willian, especially considering we haven't had a RW for god knows how long. He's been the best player on the pitch against us a few times, and he carries the ball at speed better than any of our current crop (by a long way). He would give us some much needed balance. I'm obviously in the minority, but I think that he would be an excellent addition. He is a very good player.
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Exactly I'm on bored with this too. I can see us signing him and keeping Martial, a swap deal isn't needed. No idea why but I have a hunch Martial will light it up next season.
 
I'm not sure buying Willian is the right path to League/world domination. He would help us cement that 2nd place though.
 
For all you saying that this will be an underwhelming signing, you’ll all be eating crow just like you did with the Matic transfer(at our lousy expense smh).
 
Raoul said:
Hope we opt for a younger option - Douglas Costa would be idea.
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Costa looks highly unlikely mate, he has been amazing for Juve and the fans adore him. We should have snapped him up last year, would have been perfect for us.
 
devil in me said:
Surprised at the objections to Willian, especially considering we haven't had a RW for god knows how long. He's been the best player on the pitch against us a few times, and he carries the ball at speed better than any of our current crop (by a long way). He would give us some much needed balance. I'm obviously in the minority, but I think that he would be an excellent addition. He is a very good player.
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Exactly mate would be chuffed if we sign him. Imagine Sanchez, Willian and Lukaku as our frontline if all hit form we could easily win the PL.
 
I don't watch much football except United because of the time difference, but I can remember watching him and being impressed. I hope we get him.
 
Raoul said:
Hope we opt for a younger option - Douglas Costa would be ideal.
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Doesn't he mostly operate on the left? I'd want David Neres for the right wing. I think he'd fill the Gabriel Jesus role for us. (without all the injuries, of course)
 
Mainoldo said:
Good. So was the Iniesta question! Glad I matched it.
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Not at all. You responded to something very obvious with something very silly.

VancouverUtdFan said:
Real talk.



...this is what I mean when people haven’t seen him play thus don’t know what they’re talking about.
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Really? Is he as good as Salah, KDB, Hazard etc? Or was I right that he's not a top player? So I do like Willian. He's a good footballer. But he's not brilliant. I'd rather see us for more of what Liverpool have been doing signing the likes of Mane, Firmino, Salah etc. all better than Willian and all 24/25 and at the right age to 'explode'. We don't have to go for solid and dependable. We could go for brilliance as well. He's be a good addition for sure but we should be aiming higher.
 
beingshe7don said:
Haha... Since when does someone with veteran status in the game with PL experience need time to settle in? Yes... let's all give Alexis time to settle in.... and let's turn a blind eye to the fact that three other players who we bought were affected by him. Sounds like a sound argument to me.... I'm "convinced".

As for Martial.. this will be his 3rd season... He's showed us what he's capable of... He barely started any games. He gets criticized all the freaking time. Mbappe plays in a pub league for one... I don't doubt that Mbappe is a better player than Martial at this point in time. If teams like Chelsea, Spurs, Arsenal and Juve are considering Martial, I think we should really take a good look and access whether has he been really all that bad? He's playing in a rigid, park the bus system where he's got to run back to defend because he's got the piece of shit, Young (who can't defend) behind him.

Tell me which player has improved this season? Why is Martial being made the scape goat? The system is flawed and no one will ever improve. Replacing quality players and buying experienced guys is not a sure shot guarantee to success. MARK MY WORDS, WE WON'T WIN THE LEAGUE NEXT YEAR. Jose can go and buy Willian, Perisic and it will still not make a difference because the game has changed... and Jose is still trying to rub two stones to build a fire.
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If you want to talk Martial then take the convo to his thread.
 
el3mel said:
Some were saying Matic was underwhelming signing. It's like the signings we're drooling over are working great or something.

Willian is going to make us a balanced side for the first time for years.
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Exactly. How old were RVP, Zlatan and Matic and just how effective they were for us. I will never understand the Caf's weird obsession with age. Actually look at the quality of the player ffs.
 
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