Agreed. Januzaj getting more game time for me was more than enough to tell me that he's not ready. Poor decision by Moyes.
Wilfried Zaha - Sold to Crystal Palace
- Thread starter Baby Faced Assassin
- Start date
- Status
Agreed. Januzaj getting more game time for me was more than enough to tell me that he's not ready. Poor decision by Moyes.
He didn't look comfortable at all on the left. In the one or two times we've seen him on the right he didn't look as raw...but obviously Moyes wanted the two cut-inside type wingers. But in reality were we expecting Zaha and Januzaj to win that for us? Not a chance.
He was very poor. Hardly the best time to blood a youngster though when in the middle of getting beat in what was one of the worst team performances I've ever witnessed at any level of football.
Harsh! In a match where we were comfortably outplayed and out muscled in midfield, what did you expect him to do?
He was put on to try and create something, it nearly happened with a good effort and he got crowded out a bit. It was worth the risk, the other options out of form Young or Welbeck..
Why are we trying to pussy foot around this and excuse players? I covered in my post that the circumstances for him coming on for his league debut were far from ideal given how shit the team was. That doesn't give him a pass though. He came on and he was poor. There's nothing wrong with saying it. It's true.
It seems the lack of any winning mentality from Moyes is spreading to the fans...
This was the exact opposite of the way Fergie says is best for introducing young players into the first team, ie build their confidence up by giving them 20-30 minutes at the end of games where we're comfortable. Clearly moyes was looking for something he wasn't getting but poor man management in my opinion.
Or you have a potential match winner on the bench or Ashley Young...Who do you put on to try and get you back into the game?
Yep, Fergie built up Macheda's confidence by giving him a few minutes at the end of games....oh wait...
Hindsight is a wonderful thing. If he curls that shot into the far corner we're saying it's a master stroke.
Nonsense. Macheda got his chance when we were trailing 1-2. Will Keane made his debut when we were trailing.
We didn't look like scoring anyway. Was worth a try.
So disputing your opinion of him equates to not having a winning mentality. Specious nonsense pretty much like your posts
You dispute that he was poor? Clearly the standards have been set extremely low this season.
They also got their debuts when we were pushing for an equalizer and had other world class players around them. Today, Newcastle outplayed us all over the pitch. They had more possession, more shots, better chances and deserved the win. You can't expect Zaha to come on for his debut and make a huge difference when the rest of the team is playing like shit? He still almost scored anyway with that one shot. I have faith that he'll come good but today was not the right setting to introduce him in.
Should have played from the start instead of Chica in my opinion.
As indeed have the standard of posting this season. As someone who has 34,000+ posts one would expect a better judgement and insightful posts but it sadly appears not.
The level is: Let's criticise an young player when the whole team is poor...
Complete nonsense. The situation we brought Macheda into was desperate and on the back of 2 successive defeats and Ronaldo was the only world class player available. He brought Young on against Everton which didn't work so he's tried something new
Look at the team sheet for that Villa game. Neville was playing as CB. We had many palyers injured. SAF had even put Welbeck on in that game. There is no harm in putting Zaha on and giving him chance to shine.
As indeed have the standard of posting this season. As someone who has 34,000+ posts one would expect a better judgement and insightful posts but it sadly appears not.
The level is: Let's criticise an young player when the whole team is poor...
Sorry, I didn't realise you weren't allowed to call a performance a poor performance because of other poor performances and age.
I'm not singling him out. I've already stated the team was poor. However, as this is a Zaha thread I'm speaking specifically about Zaha.
If it makes you feel any better I'll say it this way:
Rafael was poor
Vidic was poor
Evans was poor
Evra was poor
Jones was poor
Cleverley was poor
Nani was poor
Zaha was poor
Van Persie was poor
Anderson was poor
Its not like the team was a shambles like it is now though. And we were pushing hard for an equalizer in that game and were still a proper United team. Also having Ronaldo in your team never hurts, does it? The point I'm making is the team wasn't struggling for control and wasn't in a situation like we were this season. It still had the proper recovery spirit that United had over the last 20 years. This team has lost that spirit and belief to recover, and today we were getting out played and we didn't look like getting back in the game after going down. Bringing on Zaha for his debut, especially as he probably isn't full of confidence after not playing at all this season, in that situation, was the wrong move.
The team was in fecking shambles and was coming off the back of 2 straight defeats and looked completely devoid of ideas. Aston Villa then proceed to dominate us for 80 minutes of the game. That was a fecking desperate situation and Fergie gave Macheda the go ahead. There was absolutely nothing wrong in giving Zaha a go at it given the way the rest of the team was playing and the options he had
Naturally, but it did seem to me like a bit of a high pressure situation to throw the lad into, not ideal really.
I dislike Ashley Young's football as much as the next caffite, but that's got nothing to do with the choice of when to give Zaha his debut. To be honest, it should probably have happened sooner than today, in the league cup or at the end of one of our better performances. But even in this match, he had Welbeck on the bench and Nani had been no worse than RVP, Chicha, Cleverley etc.
Macheda's probably not the best example to use when we're looking at successful integration of young players into the first team..
Rafael got his debut in the last 10 minutes of an innocuous 1-1 draw in the first match of the season (against the barcodes incidentally), Evans got some time in the league cup before coming on at the end of an easy win vs Kyiv in the CL, Welbeck got some time in the league cup before making his league debut at the end of an easy win vs Stoke City. There's no lack of examples, and of players who have successfully been integrated into the first team.
Perhaps I was too specific in saying that it has to be at the end of comfortable matches, but that's only because I could have sworn I'd seen quotes about Fergie saying something very similar to that. Can't find the quote anymore though, so maybe it's just what I imagine he'd say
He was very poor but let's be fair to the guy...
Hardly a kick of a ball this season
The rumours about Moyes and his daughter
Been thrown on at a time when your club is in the shitter and your manager is under pressure and you are losing.
All at a very young age
Not a good mixture. Wouldn't judge him on today but I hope he gets more chances and gets better
Hardly a kick of a ball this season
The rumours about Moyes and his daughter
Been thrown on at a time when your club is in the shitter and your manager is under pressure and you are losing.
All at a very young age
Not a good mixture. Wouldn't judge him on today but I hope he gets more chances and gets better
It's totally unfair to judge Zaha on the basis of yesterday's game
Basically.
Look at the difference between Januzaj's debut and his.
Zaha was thrown on with the expectation to go out and change the game. Having played no football, the circumstances of the game and his position in the team it was totally unfair and despite getting his debut probably did more damage than good.
So he goes from being considered not good enough at this level and playing in the reserves to being a potential match winner?
I missed the game but it doesn't surprise me that he didn't put on a show. With him sitting out all of the season so far because his manager doesn't rate him his confidence is hardly going to be pumping. And then to come on chasing a game severely under pressure in a team that seems destined to play within itself...
But of course, his performance can be judged. Context is everything though. And I doubt he's been so poor in training as to warrant not getting any game time. I do hope he gets a January Prem-loan and tears it up.
Why do people feel the need to over-analyse EVERYTHING?
The smile on his face was so refreshing.
He was worth bringing on as something new to try and get the team going, I think.
He didn't really do that badly. No worse than anyone who we've put on the left has aside from Janujaz really.
He didn't really do that badly. No worse than anyone who we've put on the left has aside from Janujaz really.
I tend to agree that it was worth a try. It's the kind of move we've seen Fergie try in the past, like when he threw Macheda into the mix at Villa.
Agreed. Saw that and made me smile too. He seemed so happy to finally get his start.
fecking hell, I'm proper in bits here.
What did it say? Seems it's been taken down.
Yeah, it was a bit desperation, but there was nothing on the bench that hadn't been given its chance and failed enough times this season, so someone new and wanting to prove a point was worth a shot.
The Macheda thing was similar. I think he took Berbatov off to bring him on, which when you think about it now, is completely stupid on paper, but in those situations someone with a bit of a buzz about them can be a catalyst.
If he had scored that curving shot..
Can't say I'm all that excited about him. He looks like a talented kid alright, but from what I've seen from him so far I'm not sure he has the potential to become worldclass.
- Status