Just paper talk, the same as you. I suppose any bad-mouthing will come out after the players concerned leave the club.
What will it take to sack moyes?
- Thread starter bosnian_red
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Just paper talk, the same as you. I suppose any bad-mouthing will come out after the players concerned leave the club.
I'm just wondering, who's decision/authority would it be to sack the manager?
Would it be the chairmen (two of the Glazer brothers), would it be the Executive Vice Chairmen (Woodward) or would it be the Club Directors (Gill, Edelson, Charlton and Ferguson)?
Would it be the chairmen (two of the Glazer brothers), would it be the Executive Vice Chairmen (Woodward) or would it be the Club Directors (Gill, Edelson, Charlton and Ferguson)?
The former three, I imagine. Formally speaking, that is. Gill, Charlton and Fergie are non-executive directors or whatever the proper term is - they don't have the authority to sack people as far as I'm aware. But I'm sure the Glazers/Woody will listen to their opinions on the matter.
Quite a few players have been hinting at that indirectly. Rio's tweets, zaha's tweets, hernandez's agent, most significantly Fletcher recently saying there has been a few squabbles.
Relegation.
Suffered once before.
Suffered once before.
some type of off field scandal involving moyes partying with hookers and strippers while on the booze
(sorry just answering the original thread question)
(sorry just answering the original thread question)
A word from SAF : Let him sleep with ze fishes
Sir David Moyes won't be sacked... his debut will be difficult but he'll last for more than 20 years and will win us tons of trophies...
Sounds like a PhotoShopportunity for someone.
I remember it well and that goal by Law, that everybody says put us down.
Moyes from last nights press conference, It was gently pointed out that his team were 21 points worse off than at this stage last season. "Well, I was at Everton so I wasn't 21 points worse off," he replied. "I was at Everton." Unbelievable !!
Funny how these things end up in the press when things arent going well. Rio clearly isnt in the long term plans, Hernandez (understandably) wants to play more and could end up with a move which benefits him and his agent if given the chance, and Zaha, by all accounts needs a firm hand. The refusal to allow him to go on loan to a London club tells you all you need to know there.
I think, in general, fans need to decide what they want the club to be going forward when calling for him to be sacked.
A lot of people on here were anti-Mourinho, the suggestion being that "he doesnt stick around long enough". There's some argument that in modern football "dynasties" just dont happen anymore - clubs appoint a manager, he has maybe 5 years then everyone moves on. Its proved relatively succesful for some clubs - so you can make some arguments for that being applicable here.
As it stands the club clearly went the other route and picked a man who they hoped would stick around long term. He has a huge job to do under massive scrutiny, and with an ageing squad to rebuild he hasnt been given the help from the board that he would have liked. It evidently hasnt gone well and you can debate why as lng as you like.
I can see why some people want him sacked. Its tempting to think that if he goes the problems will be solved. I personally dont think that's the case. The club is in a msssive period of transition and its going to take a while to build a new squad capable of challenging for the title - we need, for me at least 7 or 8 players, who will themsleves need time to gel.
Whether Moyes is the right man to take us forward, I doubt, but I'd be sad to see the club revert to the Chelsea model of sacking a manager without giving him a chance - especially given the job he's being asked to do.
I still cant understand what he meant by this.
He's judging his performance on his own with Everton last year?
I dunno. Just assuming....He better not be or else, the players, club, the fans and more importantly, the man himself are in trouble
Could it be a sly dig at the current players ?
He says : "I wasn't 21 points worse off"
Not, I am not 21 points worse off which would mean he's comparing it to Everton last year.
It simply doesnt make sense.
Long shot but even then only makes sense if he says "I am not 21 points off".
Weirdly, he's talking about last season even in this with the "I wasn't".
Then I too have no clue what he meant by that.
Off course he will stay, he'll get no better job / pay elsewhere
He'd be fired on the spot and escorted out at other clubs. He doesn't stay because he's loyal to Everton, but because he got no better offer. It's one thing to stay in one club while whole Europe wanted you, it's another to stay at one club because that's about the best you can get
Really no clue then...Unless he's saying that the players are 21 points worse and he's not due to the fact he wasn't here so he's taking no responsibility?....It's a hard one to understand
That has a lot to do with SAF IMO.
Maybe he's saying that when he was at Everton, he doesn't get 21 points worse off. Which probably means that he can do that even with Everton, but fails to explain why he can't do it with us
I can't see him getting the sack anytime soon, since all the qualities SAF said Moyes has are more geared towards the long term. That scottishness or whatever he said, work ethic, persistence etc.
Aye true.
He'd pretty much need to smear his own shit over the Stretford End and make it spell out, "Welcome to Goodison Park" before we sack him....Or should I say, the board sack him
I cant make head or tail of it but atleast he blabbered some nonsense rather than "Ah, we've been unlucky but hopefully it will change" stock line of his.
To be fair to Him, there's not much you can say when you're losing, especially when you lose as much and as bad as us.
But at least try to come up with some smarter line
It's clear that he's going nowhere, however he's starting to look and sound like a man that's under pressure. The media and fans are slowly starting to turn and I think it's safe to say that the honeymoon period is over for him.
Now we will see what's he's really made off, he will either thrive or fold.
Now we will see what's he's really made off, he will either thrive or fold.
Well, there's much you shouldnt say though. We played very well, created lots of chances, we're just unlucky etc.
You can make a case if it's a bad day or once in a blue moon freak loses.
But considering we lost on close to weekly basis, I guess he ran out of the save line to say.
Perhaps, but that's not what I'm driving at.
United fans have, periodically over the years laughed at other clubs who've sacked managers. Chelsea and Real Madrid have been called a "circus" and a lot of fans, if asked, I suspect would have suggested that stability was an important factor in the clubs long term success. I recall in particular a few comments from United supporting mates of mine when Rafa was getting stick off his own fans and what a joke the club, and the fans involved were.
A lot of United fans sat in their ivory towers looking down on other clubs because we had the advantage of arguably the greatest manager ever and continued success. Now, as soon as things start going wrong, its toys out of the pram time and the same people are calling for him to be sacked less than a year into the job.
As I said, Moyes wasnt my choice - I would have went for Mourinho, he clearly being keen on the job and probably happy to stick around at least for a relatively long period of time. I doubt whether long term Moyes has got what it takes.
I just find it interesting how quickly the tide has turned because things have taken a nose dive. I suspect a lot of those fans simply aren't used to not being top of the pile. I wonder whether the older fans are taking a more measured approach.
In what way do you mean, specifically?
I just find it interesting how quickly the tide has turned because things have taken a nose dive. I suspect a lot of those fans simply aren't used to not being top of the pile. I wonder whether the older fans are taking a more measured approach.[/quote]
It just feels a whole lot different this time. Back then we didn't have all the pressure from the press, social media, 24 hour tv coverage, the need to be in profit as a business, shareholders, debt etc. And if I am honest there was a resignation then that Liverpool were all-powerful and dominant. The big difference for me is that there was no urgency then. But now in these different times I am scared that once we are out of Europe we will lose our best players, lose a big chunk of income and be unable to service the debt. We could get into a downward spiral that would be very hard to get out of. We could even go the way of Leeds.
That's why I and a lot of my peer group want Moyes out. He is not the man to manage such a big club and a big problem.
It just feels a whole lot different this time. Back then we didn't have all the pressure from the press, social media, 24 hour tv coverage, the need to be in profit as a business, shareholders, debt etc. And if I am honest there was a resignation then that Liverpool were all-powerful and dominant. The big difference for me is that there was no urgency then. But now in these different times I am scared that once we are out of Europe we will lose our best players, lose a big chunk of income and be unable to service the debt. We could get into a downward spiral that would be very hard to get out of. We could even go the way of Leeds.
That's why I and a lot of my peer group want Moyes out. He is not the man to manage such a big club and a big problem.
Sir Alex's message to the players at the end of last season, the character he's always instilled in them and his continuing presence on the board and in the stands, play a big factor in the players' attitude IMO. I dont think we'll see a "broken" atmosphere among the players as you might have had at other clubs in the same scenario.
Well yeah but some of that spirit has to be credited to Moyes as well. We can't say everything negative is because of Moyes but anything positive is just a remnant from SAF's days as manager.
I don't think there is a real correlation between fan age and Moyes tolerance levels. A lot of long term fans still wanna see the back of him. With Moyes there is no cause for optimism whatsoever for the end of the season or next season. This is what IMHO has hurt most fans, they don't see that much improvement from Moyes on the team.
That's fair.
Another factor is the players' pride. They've been criticized as much as anyone and that must hurt their pride given they've won title after title. Also they're not used to being "losers".
This is how I see it. I grew up with Liverpool winning everything and us being a good cup team. I don't know if Moyes is the right man, but he's got a massive job on his hands. He was never going to walk in and pick up where Fergie left off. On the one hand people are saying that Moyes hasn't inherited the same situation Fergie did when he took over (ie complete rebuilding job) and that everything is in place for success. It seems to me that lots of the same people are panicking like feck because they forsee a Liverpool-type decline if we don't get shut of Moyes immediately. I agree that Moyes is a bit timid in not wanting to deviate too much from the winger-dominant DNA of the club, but I think he will get to the point where he gets angry and starts doing things his way. He's in the shadow of a legend right now, the legend who hand-picked him, and I believe he thinks he owes him.
I'm not so sure. Fans with a long enough memory will rememnber what it was like before Fergie, and even what it was like in the early years of his reign. They may, I think be more pragmatic, but I cant comment not being that old myself.
I still think a lot of people calling fopr him to be sacked are ignoring the bigger picture - namely the underinvestment in the squad over the last 5 years. Its made his job a lot harder, even if he hasnt made the most of what he has. You can argue all day long about how much of where we are is Moyes fault, but for me the major problems have been evident long before he arrived and are now becoming glaringly evident.
I'm optimistic in general that the club seems to realise this and intends to make numerous big signings in the summer. That element is exciting to me as a fan. Whether Moyes is the right man to do that is, I suppose, the question.
It just interests me how quickly people have turned on a man that Fergie himself chose to succeed him. The armchair fans can criticise all they like about his tactics, and speculate about what's going on behind the scenes. They may be right, but I also susp[ect the same circiticisms get levelled at a the vast majority of managers who have a rough start, even if they then go on to do alright.
He is not repaying him though is he? In a way he is making him look a fool.