You misinterpreted. No worries, though.Glad you approve!
Other ideas after ending of lockdown should include;
When everyone returns to work at the beginning of every shift they all assemble outside (whatever the weather) to;
*sing the company song
*sing a version of; "wash your hands, maintain your space and protect the NHS"
and then end
*with the National Anthem and/ or 'God for Boris, England and St. George'
NB Penalty for non-compliance with any of the above is repeated (enforced) visits to Barnard Castle dressed in sack clothe and ashes until restriction is lifted by Dominic Cummings intervention
Westminster Politics
- Thread starter altodevil
- Start date
It polls well but when it comes to actually voting on it then it's another matter.
Alternatively we can appease the idiots who don't understand the science and reasons behind a passport and;Glad you approve!
Other ideas after ending of lockdown should include;
When everyone returns to work at the beginning of every shift they all assemble outside (whatever the weather) to;
*sing the company song
*sing a version of; "wash your hands, maintain your space and protect the NHS"
and then end
*with the National Anthem and/ or 'God for Boris, England and St. George'
NB Penalty for non-compliance with any of the above is repeated (enforced) visits to Barnard Castle dressed in sack clothe and ashes until restriction is lifted by Dominic Cummings intervention
*Include crayons in a food group with glue and jelly bean sandwiches so the idiots don't feel that their nuritional choices are being demeaned.
*Rather than discuss the realities of a situation, create a false situation that the idiots think somehow validates their point (which it doesn't to anyone who isn't an idiot)
*Make being a constant contratrian idiot a valid debating tactic.
NB Penalty for non-compliance is for absolutely feck all to happen because as shit as this country is we're not a totalitarian regime.
I think you're missing out the other two groups affected by this; NHS staff and patients who can't get appointments due to these self assessors becoming infected.
NHS staff are vaccinated and those self assessors would presumably either be a) also vaccinated; or b) under 50 with no underlying conditions (meaning risk of hospitalisation is minute).
I'm talking about the strain on services, not the risk of infection though.
How will services be strained if the only people getting infected are either already vaccinated and ergo have a minute change of hospitalisation or are under 50 (hell even under 60) with no underlying conditions and ergo have a minute chance of hospitalisation.
Not yet... but wait until the Tories have been in power for the next two decades.
The current so called 'two party system' will become (is becoming already) a one party system with that one party always finishing 'first past the post' because they carry the post with them and plant it down as and when they feel like it.
Well, there goes my chance of a decent night's sleep.
Spot on.
So the longest any party has maintained a majority under the FPTP system since 1800 is 19 years (the tory party from 1807 to 1826)... 5 elections
the only other time a party has won a majority in 4 elections in a row was 1979 to 1992 (thatcher and major)
Currently the conservatives have won a majority in the last erm 1 elections so I think its a little early to assume its ging to be 5 straight conservative majorities and 20+ years of uninterpreted majorities
I would like to see the move to PR but its not going to happen unless we get a hung parliament and personally i think thats much more likely over the next 20 years than 4 straight conservative majorities
I agree, it seems unlikely but the current political situation in Scotland is a real problem for labour and may impact it.
If either Scotland stays, but the SNP remain a force or Scotland get independence I can't see how Labour makes up all those seats in England personally. They were getting 40 plus seats per year up to 2010 which is now down to 1 and they have to make those up in the rest of the UK somehow.
from a purely political power basis its shocking the conservatives have not taken the approach of supporting indy ref 2 ... I do wonder if secretly they wouldnt mind it happening and wouldn't campaign all that hard to stop it?
If scotland was to leave i can only imagine that there would be redrawing of all electoral boundries in the UK done independently and im not sure how that would change the map?
Of the last 125 years, the Tories have been in power for 80 years.
The elites being in bed/owning the media certainly helps.
Like everything, there is good and bad about PR (which I cannot see happening any time soon).
Yes it should be fairer, particularly for the smaller parties like the Greens for example.
But for generations, we have been accustomed to knowing who have won and who the next government is by the next day.
It is up to the opposition to change the voters minds.
And while I would love the Labour party to become the next government, I am becoming less optimistic by the day.
The first past the post system is stacked against the opposition. Also it is not representative, didn't UKIP get 1 million votes but zero seats quite recently? As much as I disagree write their party, those voters not being represented what causes disenfranchised and angry population. This is partly why the Brexit referendum, for example, was such a protest vote.
@sun_tzu
On another note, every non Tory party and the population as a whole would benefit from PR. It is more representative.
All parties should band together, so in each constituency, have only one non Tory MP, standing against the a Tories on the sole platform of voting in PR then calling another election.
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If labour had joined the "remain alliance" we would have had that a couple of elections ago - looking back perhaps a shame we didnt.
If labour got on board with PR then it would seem the way to go for a PR alliance in the next eection where of they got in it would be a coalition of all the parties for 4 years and they would pass full PR reform - not sure labour are ready to go there but would be really interesting if they did as a lab/lib/snp/green/plaid coalition would be a really strong prospect in more than half the constituencies so would have a realy chance of winning and if PR reform was explicit in the manifesto then again it would be pretty much impossibe for the opposition to derail it even if they could delay it a little in the lords etc... possibly tied in with an agreement for a full scottish indy ref once the PR reforms for sunsequent elections had been passed
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Yes, under normal circumstances I would agree but there are two major factors in play right now;
1/ The UK is in danger of fragmenting, with Nationalist parties in the ascendancy, the Tories will become (if not already) in time and in all but name, the English version of SNP.
2/ The Labour party (North and South of the border)is seemingly doomed to oblivion; the 'blow' it gave to its red wall supporters (Brexit and electing Jezzer leader) looks like becoming 'mortal' for the party as a National player. The Labour Party is now at best, seen in the North of England (and probably in Scotland too) as a Greater London based party of left leaning intellectuals, at worst, a 'nest' of ultra left conspirators, who ridicule any sort of Nationalist aspirations in at least three of the UK countries, Scotland, Wales and increasingly England, the exception seeming to be Northern Ireland.
These two factors don't seem to be changing anytime soon and the long haul towards a single dominant (Nationalistic) Government, regularly elected is on the cards.
It seems to be human nature that when we are in a trend we have a tendency to think that trend will just go on and on. Happens in lots of things from investing to football.
As for politics, Blair once looked like he couldn't lose, and indeed was a shoo-in for EU president when he condescended to be ready. Thatcher's revolution made sure Labour would never rule again and Wilson retired boasting he left Labour as the natural governing party of Britain. Believe it or not all those made sense at the time, and all were wrong. Times do change, and particularly in politics.
As for politics, Blair once looked like he couldn't lose, and indeed was a shoo-in for EU president when he condescended to be ready. Thatcher's revolution made sure Labour would never rule again and Wilson retired boasting he left Labour as the natural governing party of Britain. Believe it or not all those made sense at the time, and all were wrong. Times do change, and particularly in politics.
True enough. This is also why PR is unlikely to happen. Whoever is elected as a majority in a FPTP system is not going to propose PR as in their view it would curtail their own current and future power.
I think the only way it happens is a PR allience with labour the libs, The SNP, the greens on board
Promice the SNP indy ref 2 once the PR legistlation is passed
then all 4 agree that only one candidate stands per constituency and explicitly in the manifesto the first legistlation that will be enacted is PR
i think all except for labour would get on board with this - might labour change their stance - I hope so
There are some moves towards pushing for this
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/br...vists-push-for-electoral-reform-the-i-7391738
but thats the only way I see it passing
Any form of hung parliament might end up with PR if that became a condition of coalition, although the details would have to be nailed down first, unlike the last time.
I don't believe the Tories are guaranteed an overall majority for a minute, there is always change and the unexpected.
absolutly - there will at some point be an enquiry into the handling of Covid
Pritti Patel will no dount be pushing for some form of reintroductions of poor houses
Boris will be fluffing his lines
Sunak will be trying to push him out
Gove will be ***-ping himself silly ready to plunge a knife into sunaks back
the realites of paying for covid and the reality of post brexit trade will be real by then
the push for indy ref 2 will be well underway
who knows what will be going off on the irish border by then
Farrage and Fox will be trying to out biggot and bluster each other and take whatever is left of the brexit vote
and as you say a while bunch of unknows as well
I can't see the SNP agreeing given that they'd half their seats in a PR system. Possibly in return for a referendum but I can't see Labour (or even the Lib Dems) agreeing to that.
Even Labour are generally overrepresented in terms of MPs compared with vote share, so they would effectively be conceding that they are happy to never solely run the country (only as one of a 3-5 party coalition).
Finally they will be acutely aware that as part of a PR system a centre right Tory and further right party (ala UKIP, Brexit Party, Reclaim etc) would be as likely as a left leaning rainbow coalition.
yup thats what labour would have to get on board with
effectivley giving up the chance for sole power knowing it is unlikley the conservatives could ever attain it either
A more social democratic European type governance
as for the SNP - i think only for indy ref 2 would they get on board ... but if Labour and Libs were committed into PR then that would probably be a valid trade off for them as they wouldnt need that SNP block of mps in westminister after any reforms
Not sure labour are ready to get on board with the idea but given the last election and foots election campaign pretty much shows they will never get into power pushing a far left agenda then almost guaranteeing a centre left governance does not seem like a bad outcome
I imagine Labour will also be aware that after PR were enacted the likelihood is that the Lib Dems would just end up auctioning their 10-20% to the highest bidder (in terms of power) whether it be the Tories or Labour.
You'd effectively see the Lib Dems making the Tories less authoritarian, but no different economically; or making Labour more right economically. Effectively both situations would become very similar.
The reason the FPTP system survives is because, by and large it works; even when there is no clear winner, a forced 'coalition' emerges that can 'get things done', not everything, but enough to suit the major parties election pledges.
Thereafter, usually the junior party in the 'coalition' then gets 'pasted' at the next election because the price for joining a coalition/so called 'sharing power' is that you have to give up at least one of the policies you gained the majority of your votes on, and therefore disappoint your bedrock supporters, who hit back at the next GE... see Lib Dems and Univ Fees etc.
Smaller parties are usually too scared to risk 'joining together' for obvious reasons, not only that, but the public has demonstrated time and again it knows how to vote strategically, it doesn't need one party to say 'heh vote for me, but if I get in I am going to vote for another party's policies!
An 80 seat majority in Parliament is a strong position, even if all the other parties voted together they cannot defeat the Government, only elements within its own side going 'rogue' can do that. To lose that sort of majority in one GE is unlikely, it could take two or three GE's to breakdown such dominance. However history does show that when any government gets past three successful GE's it usually finishes up shooting itself in the foot, either internal squabbles, or 'dirty tricks' uncovered, or PM's or other senior Ministers getting caught out in scandals, etc.
A lot depends upon what the UK indeed the world looks like after the pandemic, how much has changed temporarily how much permanently and is there anyone who really knows what to do in these new circumstances? If not the tendency will be to stick with what you know!
The Tories always see themselves as the 'natural' Party of Government and history suggest they are right, because the truth is the UK or most of it is conservative albeit with a small 'c'.
Thereafter, usually the junior party in the 'coalition' then gets 'pasted' at the next election because the price for joining a coalition/so called 'sharing power' is that you have to give up at least one of the policies you gained the majority of your votes on, and therefore disappoint your bedrock supporters, who hit back at the next GE... see Lib Dems and Univ Fees etc.
Smaller parties are usually too scared to risk 'joining together' for obvious reasons, not only that, but the public has demonstrated time and again it knows how to vote strategically, it doesn't need one party to say 'heh vote for me, but if I get in I am going to vote for another party's policies!
An 80 seat majority in Parliament is a strong position, even if all the other parties voted together they cannot defeat the Government, only elements within its own side going 'rogue' can do that. To lose that sort of majority in one GE is unlikely, it could take two or three GE's to breakdown such dominance. However history does show that when any government gets past three successful GE's it usually finishes up shooting itself in the foot, either internal squabbles, or 'dirty tricks' uncovered, or PM's or other senior Ministers getting caught out in scandals, etc.
A lot depends upon what the UK indeed the world looks like after the pandemic, how much has changed temporarily how much permanently and is there anyone who really knows what to do in these new circumstances? If not the tendency will be to stick with what you know!
The Tories always see themselves as the 'natural' Party of Government and history suggest they are right, because the truth is the UK or most of it is conservative albeit with a small 'c'.
Usually would imply this is based off a reasonable dataset
I'm not sure it is though
No doubt that happened with the last coalition but the other coalitions
Well we had the war time governments but that's not really comparable
I don't think the "coupon coalition" of 1918 is either
And that's pretty much the data set... so I'm not sure you can draw "usual" conclusions from it
There is a much stronger tradition of minority government than coalitions in the UK
I am shocked, I tell you. Shocked.
Good thread which simplifies what’s happened
They could ban elections tomorrow and no-one would give a shit.
Yeah saw this. Needs a proper investigation. Cameron not satisfied by starting Brexit, fecker is trying to rip off taxpayer as well.
one down... now just prtii patel to stick the knife into before he can off boris an become PM