I never said we were. You say that's what we should be doing. Give me some examples of teams that have made such a big leap from where we were?
How can people have serious debates on here when this kind of stuff is believedLeicester. They even won the PL and now after getting rid of Ranieri and appointing Rodgers are constantly punching above their weight. And by the way we were 6th when Jose was sacked on the 15th of December. Nothing to say that he would not have got us into the CL spots by the end of the season. Or even to 2nd place too.
Yes he was toxic and needed to go. But if we are judging everyone by the same standards these are the facts.
Klopp also gave no attention to Fa Cup or League cup, our fans wouldn't accept that. His best team was always fresh and available.
As shown by the crying yesterday of not starting Brunowhat do you mean? Most of our fans would give up all the cups to win the PL or the CL. We even refused as a club to play in the FA Cup to play in the FIFA Club Championships.
How can people have serious debates on here when this kind of stuff is believed
As shown by the crying yesterday of not starting Bruno
I agree, I also think facts show he would have won us the champions league by now if we kept him and Ole and his useless selfish ways didn’t get involvedWhy not? We were in the 6th on 15th December. You cannot show any facts.
I watch it also to as see the team win trophies. If not that then what's the point watching football?
No, but fans doI have no issues of not starting Bruno yesterday.
Leicester. They even won the PL and now after getting rid of Ranieri and appointing Rodgers are constantly punching above their weight. And by the way we were 6th when Jose was sacked on the 15th of December. Nothing to say that he would not have got us into the CL spots by the end of the season. Or even to 2nd place too.
Yes he was toxic and needed to go. But if we are judging everyone by the same standards these are the facts.
Martial isnt first choice imo and he definitely wont be next year.He's part of it. He's spent well over 200 odd million and won feck all. Funnily enough didn't we buy Martial?
It’s totally disingenuous debating with no point continuing after seeingIf you genuinely believe that, I don't see many bothering to debate with you again. That's crazy.
what do you mean? Most of our fans would give up all the cups to win the PL or the CL. We even refused as a club to play in the FA Cup to play in the FIFA Club Championships.
A freak Leicester title win proves absolutely nothing. They aren't challenging for the PL/CL now are they? Rodgers got knocked out of the Europa by Slavia Prague a few weeks ago, where was his amazing coaching then?Leicester. They even won the PL and now after getting rid of Ranieri and appointing Rodgers are constantly punching above their weight. And by the way we were 6th when Jose was sacked on the 15th of December. Nothing to say that he would not have got us into the CL spots by the end of the season. Or even to 2nd place too.
Yes he was toxic and needed to go. But if we are judging everyone by the same standards these are the facts.
A freak Leicester title win proves absolutely nothing. They aren't challenging for the PL/CL now are they? Rodgers got knocked out of the Europa by Slavia Prague a few weeks ago, where was his amazing coaching then?
I think we win the league without injuries too. Easy to say aint itLimited resources, they could easily finish second this season which would be impressive. I think they beat Prague with the injuries also
If you genuinely believe that, I don't see many bothering to debate with you again. That's crazy.
Didnt say they would win the league. We have a deeper squad than them too and a larger budget. They have had an impressive season given their injuriesI think we win the league without injuries too. Easy to say aint it
A freak Leicester title win proves absolutely nothing. They aren't challenging for the PL/CL now are they? Rodgers got knocked out of the Europa by Slavia Prague a few weeks ago, where was his amazing coaching then?
No but excusing results for other managers due to injury is a bit richDidnt say they would win the league. We have a deeper squad than them too and a larger budget. They have had an impressive season given their injuries
Would you swap for Rogers? The bluffer who lost out on top four the last game of last season and just got dumped out of the Europa league by salvia Prague. Try to answer without bringing money spent into itA freak Liverpool and Chelsea struggling. Freak injuries to Liverpool. Leicester is challenging us to the 2nd spot for sure. That Rogers just knocked us out of the FA Cup.
It was a generalisation. I'm not saying we are challenging City I'm asking for examples of teams who have gone from typically being 5th to challenging for PL/CLs as the poster said.Yes you did say that. See above.
Rich why? Im simply stating the facts and not even comparing him to anyoneNo but excusing results for other managers due to injury is a bit rich
I think Ole is a poor long term choice as well but in the spirit of fairness I'll give you a concrete reason this isn't true. It's not mathematically possible.Show me why? The previous season he got us 2nd. No reason why he could not. The reason he got sacked was different and rightly so he was sacked for being toxic. A man who was won the PL many times and the CL twice can also get to the 2nd spot of the PL for sure from the 6th position in December. I am rightly showing you that the bar is being changed for Ole. If anyone else was the current manager it would be different.
You are seriously comparing Liverpool having a couple of injuries to a 5000-1 title win?A freak Liverpool and Chelsea struggling. Freak injuries to Liverpool. Leicester is challenging us to the 2nd spot for sure. That Rogers just knocked us out of the FA Cup.
I have to point out that neither has Solskjaer, yet. We might balls up the last few games the same way we did in 2014/15 (one win, two draws, three defeats in the last six games). So far the only post-SAF manager who actually finished second is José Mourinho - and that one turned out to be the falsest of false dawns, not unexpectedly, considering the quality of the performances throughout that 2017/18 season. The parallels, sadly, are there.LVG didnt even finish second
Maybe I read your post where you said you thought they would have beat Slavia without Injuries wrongly (you actually wrote beat them with injuries but that makes no sense because they didn’t beat them they got knocked out so I assumed it was a typo by you)Rich why? Im simply stating the facts and not even comparing him to anyone
You are seriously comparing Liverpool having a couple of injuries to a 5000-1 title win?
I'll remind you when we have injuries (as we have done recently) the difference you say it makes.
So let me get this straight, the solution for our very poor general play in almost every game is to spend ton of millions on expensive world class players? Strange to say that about the manager people seem to say he's building for long term, that the only way to improve our style of play and tactics on the pitch is by just spending more and more money.
Its not easy to say because without injuries we are not better than City. They are a better team than Slavia without injuries. Add to that, winning a one of game and a league are totally differentMaybe I read your post where you said you thought they would have beat Slavia without Injuries wrongly (you actually wrote beat them with injuries but that makes no sense because they didn’t beat them they got knocked out so I assumed it was a typo by you)
following that if you thought they’d beat them without injuries, I think we’d win the league without injuries. Easy to say. That’s where I was coming from
With actual centre backs on the bench. The coaching is the same though so the the quality of player shouldn't matter right? Or is that just for us?A couple of injuries? They've been playing CMs at CB all season.
Entertainment? I
Yes if we were being entertained most of the time I could agree with you. The fact most of the time it's slow, tedious, no action on goal doesn't make it entertaining for me. I watch it as optimistically I hope that one day it will click and occasionally it does, but not enough.Entertainment? If you're not enjoying watching because we don't play Peps well oiled version of the game then I get it, but that isn't what most people are debating here. Most seemingly believe that football should only be played like a robust oil engine or a computer program which during training installs considered variables and then we watch managers may programmers come together and see which version was better.
If I want to watch a computer simulator run with a project lead, personally I would watch something else, an esport perhaps like DOTA that does exactly what is being asked for. To me, I watch football because of the human element and complexity added via memorable players who make things happen even. Ferguson's United struggled for a time with teams that sat back, when we learned to break those down (whilst not micro managing every decision), our team looked amazing. I'm happy to watch new players work out how to do the same as that in my opinion will lead to long term success. It's those same lessons that were never passed from Ferguson's last team to our current players and in my opinion, is where much of the United way, is really evident.
It's also why he was happy to be on the bench for us for so long even though he would have started for plenty of other good teams.A lot will disagree but I still believe Ole is too much of nice guy for this job.
People will argue "well how do you know this"?.....You just need to look at how he carries himself. How he deals with other managers, how he conducts his pre/post match interviews etc. Its always an attempt to be the nice guy. The fake laughs. The constant friendly comments etc.
I've seen him on the touchline so overly friendly with other managers during games and 90% of the time getting a lot less friendly reaction back. Its because they know, they are in a business where only thing that matters is winning, not your opponent liking you.
I don't believe he is like that in public then a Alex Ferguson type with the players. His character will be consist. The players will pick on this and know if they don't give that extra 20% its no big deal, what's the worst that can happen? Ole will give them a friendly chat?
This works with some players i.e Shaw, but as a whole for the general progress of the team he needs to be tougher.
Lets stop pretending he's something he isn't. This whole mentality is part of the reason we haven't won much since Ferguson left.
Itll have to be some balls up with Leicesters fixture list and the way others are playing tbf.I have to point out that neither has Solskjaer, yet. We might balls up the last few games the same way we did in 2014/15 (one win, two draws, three defeats in the last six games). So far the only post-SAF manager who actually finished second is José Mourinho - and that one turned out to be the falsest of false dawns, not unexpectedly, considering the quality of the performances throughout that 2017/18 season. The parallels, sadly, are there.
It's also why he was happy to be on the bench for us for so long even though he would have started for plenty of other good teams.
A lot will disagree but I still believe Ole is too much of nice guy for this job.
People will argue "well how do you know this"?.....You just need to look at how he carries himself. How he deals with other managers, how he conducts his pre/post match interviews etc. Its always an attempt to be the nice guy. The fake laughs. The constant friendly comments etc.
I've seen him on the touchline so overly friendly with other managers during games and 90% of the time getting a lot less friendly reaction back. Its because they know, they are in a business where the only thing that matters is winning, not your opponent liking you.
I don't believe he is like that in public then a Alex Ferguson type with the players. His character will be consist. The players will pick on this and know if they don't give that extra 20% its no big deal, what's the worst that can happen? Ole will give them a friendly chat?
This works with some players i.e Shaw, but as a whole for the general progress of the team he needs to be tougher.
Lets stop pretending he's something he isn't. This whole mentality is part of the reason we haven't won much since Ferguson left.
