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2015-16 Performances

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5.6 Season Average Rating
Appearances
41
Goals
15
Assists
6
Yellow cards
5
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jem said:
Or the message could be: as a manager, I have faith in my players, and unlike some fans, I won't turn on them after a handful of bad games.

Don't get me wrong: I think Rooney is on the downside, but he's no stranger to slumps in form (which are often followed by extreme upticks in form,) so it's hardly surprising that LVG would persist with him, particularly when we don't exactly have a like-for-like replacement (I wouldn't mind seeing Hernandez get a run, but it's hardly controversial to field even an off-form Rooney over Hernandez.) Once this season is finished, I imagine a ruthless appraisal of Rooney's worth will be carried out. Until then, I'd expect to see him start the majority of games, and end up with 15-20 goals.
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The problem is that these "slumps in form" tend to last for months, and the last couple of years, they seem to come more often. We all know Rooney has a high ceiling, but his bottom level is just incredibly bad. Hernandez might not have the talent that Rooney has(had), but at least he will look like a footballer on a bad day, not a drunken leper. LVG is supposed to be a "hard man" that does not bend over backwards to accommodate star players (like Ribery), so why Rooney gets a free pass is just bemusing

Also: Rooney gets a free pass with the fans because he still is relatively young and we all think "he'll come good". Remember he broke through at 16, so it's not preposterous to suggest he peaked a long time ago and is now on the decline that most players see at 33-34. Remember Scholes and Giggs on their older days? They could serve up some real stinkers at times (not this bad though) and end up getting axed the next game, despite their status.

Getting axed is the kick up the arse he needs. Feck "he needs games to improve". He can prove himself in training like everyone else. A club aspiring to win the league can't accommodate passengers so they might find their form
 
Fergus' son said:
He normally scores for fun vs Newcastle if I remember correctly, if he doesn't put in a top performance vs them I would be very worried. What's the media reaction to his performances so far?
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The media will always love him - especially Sky

Compare him to the best No10s and strikers in the world at the moment and he's been well short for the last 4 years

People need to stop going on about what he has done in the past and look at what he does now - he's burnt out
 
simonhch said:
There has to be some consistency. Dropping him might seem like the easy and logical approach, but you can also destroy his confidence. I think he deserves more than two games to adjust to his new role. I am confident he will come good.
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New role? He has played as a striker for the majority of his career. Being told to stay up front instead of drop down into midfield should not be a huge problem for a pro player.

Destroy his confidence? Feck that too. Hes a grown ass man, not a toddler. Part of being a pro footballer is that you have to perform too stay in the team.
 
Still no compilation of that performance yet?
 
simonhch said:
There's a lot of assumption and revisionism in this post. Rooney has been a fantastic player for us. He's moved around the field and played just about everywhere in the last 5 years. Even in defensive midfield. So to say that 'the rest of his game has been largely poor' is very wide of the mark in my opinion, and defies the evidence on display.

For me, Rooney has exceptional game intelligence. It's what has allowed him to play as a 6, 8, 10, 9 and 11 over recent years. Because of his profile, salary etc, people are so quick to jump on his poor performances but I think it's very unfair. Yes, he was terrible yesterday. But, unlike you, I don't think this is because he can't roll a defender, beat a man, or lacks already game qualities; I think it's because he is yet again adjusting to a new position. A position in which he is on the fringes of the game. Something he finds more difficult because he's always liked to be heavily involved in the build up.

Rooney still had a lot of pace, and exceptional all round qualities. He deserves a run up front and I believe that LVG is the right man to coach him through this transition.
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It would be revisionism had I not been stressing the same argument for a long time. I'm merely maintaining my previous stance on Rooney. I think he's predictable at #10. I also think he's an excellent centre forward from a goalscoring perspective, with incredibly understated finishing ability.

His all round game, however, lets him down. His first touch borders on reckless and he seldom creates any sort of inspiration when on the ball. He hasn't for a long time.

His new position isn't all that new, really. He plays there for England and has played there at club level since March. Generally, he plays this role well and I still expect him to.

But let's be honest with ourselves, Rooney isn't beating players anymore. That part of his game died a long time ago, and that isn't revisionism or wide of the mark, because it isn't in evidence anywhere on the field.

Rooney needs to buck his ideas up. Bad games are part and parcel of football, but yesterday was genuinely something else. There are lads in the Ryman that would have put in a more credible performance than that up top and that just isn't right. Like it or not, his profile and salary do merit that little bit extra. He's being paid a lot of money to play like that, it's natural that he is subject to more attention.
 
Bobcat said:
New role? He has played as a striker for the majority of his career. Being told to stay up front instead of drop down into midfield should not be a huge problem for a pro player.

Destroy his confidence? Feck that too. Hes a grown ass man, not a toddler. Part of being a pro footballer is that you have to perform too stay in the team.
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He's only played as a number 9 for one season of his career. So you are a little misinformed there.

As for the second point; that is indicative of a very poor approach to leadership. Understanding the human element and being able to effectively manage and motivate individuals, is what makes great managers. Your approach is more in sync with football manager than reality.
 
Kag said:
It would be revisionism had I not been stressing the same argument for a long time. I'm merely maintaining my previous stance on Rooney. I think he's predictable at #10. I also think he's an excellent centre forward from a goalscoring perspective, with incredibly understated finishing ability.

His all round game, however, lets him down. His first touch borders on reckless and he seldom creates any sort of inspiration when on the ball. He hasn't for a long time.

His new position isn't all that new, really. He plays there for England and has played there at club level since March. Generally, he plays this role well and I still expect him to.

But let's be honest with ourselves, Rooney isn't beating players anymore. That part of his game died a long time ago, and that isn't revisionism or wide of the mark, because it isn't in evidence anywhere on the field.

Rooney needs to buck his ideas up. Bad games are part and parcel of football, but yesterday was genuinely something else. There are lads in the Ryman that would have put in a more credible performance than that up top and that just isn't right. Like it or not, his profile and salary do merit that little bit extra. He's being paid a lot of money to play like that, it's natural that he is subject to more attention.
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We can agree that he certainly isn't playing well at the moment. But again I disagree with the argument about his all round game. Rooney consistently posts up excellent numbers for goals and assists when playing in deep positions, i.e. As a 10. This is not indicative of someone who is devoid of creative inspiration.

Rooney gets way too much flak.
 
simonhch said:
We can agree that he certainly isn't playing well at the moment. But again I disagree with the argument about his all round game. Rooney consistently posts up excellent numbers for goals and assists when playing in deep positions, i.e. As a 10. This is not indicative of someone who is devoid of creative inspiration.

Rooney gets way too much flak.
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For me, Rooney is exactly why statistics can sometimes be deceiving. He puts up the numbers, which is why I like him furthest forward, but he leaves a lot to be desired from deep. His passing is predictable, his touch inconsistent and there are better players in these positions I would be selecting ahead of Rooney, both at the club and elsewhere.

When was the last time Rooney bamboozled a defender with a first touch, or shimmied past two oncoming players? When did he last burst past a player in midfield? I don't think it's there anymore. I appreciate you'll probably disagree, which is fair enough.

Our saving grace is that I think Rooney will still score plenty of goals for us this season, and last night wasn't the norm. Ideally, he'll get one against Brugge.
 
Bobcat said:
The problem is that these "slumps in form" tend to last for months, and the last couple of years, they seem to come more often. We all know Rooney has a high ceiling, but his bottom level is just incredibly bad. Hernandez might not have the talent that Rooney has(had), but at least he will look like a footballer on a bad day, not a drunken leper. LVG is supposed to be a "hard man" that does not bend over backwards to accommodate star players (like Ribery), so why Rooney gets a free pass is just bemusing

Also: Rooney gets a free pass with the fans because he still is relatively young and we all think "he'll come good". Remember he broke through at 16, so it's not preposterous to suggest he peaked a long time ago and is now on the decline that most players see at 33-34. Remember Scholes and Giggs on their older days? They could serve up some real stinkers at times (not this bad though) and end up getting axed the next game, despite their status.

Getting axed is the kick up the arse he needs. Feck "he needs games to improve". He can prove himself in training like everyone else. A club aspiring to win the league can't accommodate passengers so they might find their form
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Can't argue with too much of that.
 
Don't want to judge him after just 2 matches, but he's been really bad, LVG should look for another striker and drop him if he doesn't raise level of play.
 
Phil Thompson described it well, saying Rooney has no real threat to his position in the team as Hernandez and Wilson aren't going to dislodge him long term so perhaps he isn't on his edge as if RVP or Falcao were on the bench ready to take his place. I think he isn't suited to be the main focus of the attack due to the seasons being played out of position. He tends to drop back into midfield too much for my liking. Against Spurs and Villa he was awful, his first touch reminded me of Falcao last season, bouncing off him and going to the opposition team, he is a liability this season so far. In his defence he hasn't been given much chances but this shouldn't be an excuse, Spurs game he stopped for a cup of tea and only good luck we got the goal. Its embarrassing that a club of our stature is solely reliant on Rooney to provide 20+ goals a season. Early days and I hope he comes good but I don't believe it will happen.
 
Fact is if Rooney continues to not score/assist, then he will be dropped. No two ways about it. Van Gaal will notice that and he will be forced to change things up. If he does feck all in the next couple of games, then I can see him being dropped or at least substituted around 60 minutes more often.

I haven't given up on him yet - I just think he's having a really bad start. I think he'll kick into gear in a few games time.
 
First person I have seen in the media actually writing Rooney off for the first time as a striker. Ian Wright thinks Rooney is finished as a number 9, and should only ever be used as a 10.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
He was absolutely shite last night and only slightly better against Spurs but the some of the catastrophisation in this thread is laughable. Typical redcafe. Everything is so fecking extreme.
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It is Wayne Rooney? I don't know what you expect really. The fans have found all manner of vitriolic abuse to hurl at him. On the pitch and off it. Sometimes I sit here reading the posts and I can feel almost the foam gathering at the corner of their mouth. It is on another planet in terms of being over the top, some of these guys really just need to take a step outside and soak up some rays and remember we won 1-0 away from home.
AKDevil said:
Seriously, Lukaku could do a better job for us up top.
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Really? You mean Lukaku who is 6'3 and 94kg and has essentially played holdup9 for his entire career due to his size and natural athletic affinity of the role would do a better job playing holdup9 than the 5'9" 85kg jack of all trades striker who has plaudits in a number of roles and positions bar the one we are playing at the moment?

Well feck me, I'm sold.
 
Instead of focusing on his best position, i'd like an explanation as to why sometimes he completely loses his touch and vision.

Fergie made it clear in the past that rooney was always going to struggle with age, he even pointed out how his father looked with age and how it runs in the family. Based on that i've always felt that rooney had enough technique and football intelligence to alter his game with age, i expected his to lose some pace and fitness, but he's losing things he shouldn't lose with time, suddenly he can't control the ball or make a simple pass, that tells me that there's more to it than getting older, i think something isn't ok in his head.
 
many of the abusive comments about Rooney is either agenda driven or displays lack of football knowledge.

Rooney will end his playing days in midfield for us. For now he still has a lot to offer as a striker. He had very poor service Friday and was isolated.

Yes he had some poor touches and a couple of bad passes. But he also made some very good passes that was not taken advantage of or not read.

He can still play as an out and out striker for at least two more seasons.
 
Someone said:
Instead of focusing on his best position, i'd like an explanation as to why sometimes he completely loses his touch and vision.

Fergie made it clear in the past that rooney was always going to struggle with age, he even pointed out how his father looked with age and how it runs in the family. Based on that i've always felt that rooney had enough technique and football intelligence to alter his game with age, i expected his to lose some pace and fitness, but he's losing things he shouldn't lose with time, suddenly he can't control the ball or make a simple pass, that tells me that there's more to it than getting older, i think something isn't ok in his head.
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Very strange that isn't it. I kind of remember the first time I noticed his touch was absolutely dogshit a few years ago. Before that I kind of hero-worshipped him. It was like like Space Jam and the Monstars had stolen his talent or something. Then he went on a streak and scored loads of goals and did some ridiculously good things for a few weeks....

I think its fitness. You wouldn't think it could have such an impact but I think it does. I know that when I was not match fit my touch would completely desert me - its like your whole body is slightly unbalanced. Then the confidence goes a bit because you made such a pigs ear of a skill that is pretty fundamental to a footballer. On Rooney's history his touch and his eye for goal will come back after 4 or 5 games where he's played week in week out as soon as he really gets match sharp. As he gets older the time it takes for him to do that becomes longer and longer.

Add to that the entirely natural change that happens to any footballer once they make shed-loads of money and he realises its just a job he's doing week in week out. The hunger goes just a little bit.
 
United again! said:
It is Wayne Rooney? I don't know what you expect really. The fans have found all manner of vitriolic abuse to hurl at him. On the pitch and off it. Sometimes I sit here reading the posts and I can feel almost the foam gathering at the corner of their mouth. It is on another planet in terms of being over the top, some of these guys really just need to take a step outside and soak up some rays and remember we won 1-0 away from home.

Really? You mean Lukaku who is 6'3 and 94kg and has essentially played holdup9 for his entire career due to his size and natural athletic affinity of the role would do a better job playing holdup9 than the 5'9" 85kg jack of all trades striker who has plaudits in a number of roles and positions bar the one we are playing at the moment?

Well feck me, I'm sold.
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Some were saying he is not good enough to play for us. If Rooney is good enough to play as a lone forward, Lukaku certainly is. And you've also actually just pointed that out and why to those who didn't think he could do the job.
 
Ricardo de la Vega said:
Very strange that isn't it. I kind of remember the first time I noticed his touch was absolutely dogshit a few years ago. Before that I kind of hero-worshipped him. It was like like Space Jam and the Monstars had stolen his talent or something. Then he went on a streak and scored loads of goals and did some ridiculously good things for a few weeks....

I think its fitness. You wouldn't think it could have such an impact but I think it does. I know that when I was not match fit my touch would completely desert me - its like your whole body is slightly unbalanced. Then the confidence goes a bit because you made such a pigs ear of a skill that is pretty fundamental to a footballer. On Rooney's history his touch and his eye for goal will come back after 4 or 5 games where he's played week in week out as soon as he really gets match sharp. As he gets older the time it takes for him to do that becomes longer and longer.

Add to that the entirely natural change that happens to any footballer once they make shed-loads of money and he realises its just a job he's doing week in week out. The hunger goes just a little bit.
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And the fact that he's been playing out of position for essentially 3 years or so and hasn't had enough chances to keep his striker skills up. When you haven't been playing in your regular role for long periods of time, that time away erodes those skills. It may take a long time for him to get those abilities back or he may never get them back.
 
Red Dreams said:
many of the abusive comments about Rooney is either agenda driven or displays lack of football knowledge.

Rooney will end his playing days in midfield for us. For now he still has a lot to offer as a striker. He had very poor service Friday and was isolated.

Yes he had some poor touches and a couple of bad passes. But he also made some very good passes that was not taken advantage of or not read.

He can still play as an out and out striker for at least two more seasons.
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After the upgrade in quality of midfielders in the last couple of summer transfer windows, that really is a depressing thought.
 
Perfect example of an over hyped English player with no work ethic who in the off season drinks beer, smokes cigs and eats fish and chips and thinks he is world class. England won't win anything as a footballing nation until they get some disciplined players in their ranks. I have been saying for a few years now that Rooney is past it and I am as convinced as ever. A waste of natural talent.
 
Red Dreams said:
he can replace any of them.
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How..I don't understand the extremities people have with Rooney. Positive or negative. How can Rooney replace the midfielders we have now? What role? He isn't mobile enough anymore, his short passing isn't great. He can spray passes around so you'd think his best role in midfield could be as a holding mid but he doesn't have the defensive positioning for that. But by that time I am sure we would have much better options.

I'm seriously baffled by that comment.
 
Red Dreams said:
many of the abusive comments about Rooney is either agenda driven or displays lack of football knowledge.

Rooney will end his playing days in midfield for us. For now he still has a lot to offer as a striker. He had very poor service Friday and was isolated.

Yes he had some poor touches and a couple of bad passes. But he also made some very good passes that was not taken advantage of or not read.

He can still play as an out and out striker for at least two more seasons.
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You are seriously deluded. He doesnt offer a lot for a striker, he actually barely offers something. No goals, no hold up nor link up play, he doesnt create space for others. The only reason Rooney plays, is that Chicha and Wilson are no world beaters either. In every other top team, he'd be seriously benched a long time ago.

And no, he can barely playbas a out an out lone striker now, never mind in 2 year.

You just ask yourself, hoe many good games has Rooney actually had in 2015, it's really far less than the poor-average-non existent he's had.
 
How does he have a rating of 5.4? He should be around 1 or 2 for the first two games of the season.
 
I hope van Gaal doesn't think the answer is to fit him in the midfield somewhere. He still doesn't do enough in the #10 role for me.
 
ZDwyr said:
I hope van Gaal doesn't think the answer is to fit him in the midfield somewhere. He still doesn't do enough in the #10 role for me.
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There is no way he is going to play in midfield. There isn't even enough places to play the actual midfielders.
 
Sky1981 said:
#10 is the pinnacle of football. That's where maradonna, zidane, kaka and other maestro of the game played, and you think a guy who can't trap a ball nor making a clean 5 yards pass will excel at number #10?
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I never said he would excel in that position I just said LVG could move him back there and allow Januzaj to go up front. Mata should be #10 he has the skill and vision for it.
 
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