Welbeck?
Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances
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Rooney's going to put a transfer request on Hodgson's desk. 
No doubt Hodgson remembers the job he did on Xabi Alonso in the Champions League. I'd also trust Lallana with it.
Delighted with Hodgson. Next stop: bench.Rooney's going to put a transfer request on Hodgson's desk.
I do not think Hodgson is strong enough to bench Rooney for their first game.
Especially if they lost the media would kill him.
Rooney will start against Italy but if he fails to perform, then Hodgson can drop him. I suspect, however, that Rooney will start all the matches.
Especially if they lost the media would kill him.
Rooney will start against Italy but if he fails to perform, then Hodgson can drop him. I suspect, however, that Rooney will start all the matches.
Sturridge deserves to start up top. He's been the better striker this season, and he scored a great goal in the friendly the other night. Rooney is also still unfit, but I would play Sturridge up top even if Rooney was fit.
I agree with sturridge deserving to start on top but this thing about Rooney being unfit is hard to swallow. He has been training for almost 3 weeks now and he was not out that long.
I suspect he will not regain his "fitness" thus he will have to be excused for a poor showing at this WC.
I would like to see how England performed without him because once he is on the pitch the players will feel compelled to keep giving him the ball.
Rooney takes forever to get going after an injury so it is an excuse if he has an awful World Cup.
I don't buy it. It is a convenient excuse. RVP was out injured and is still, according to LVG, not fit yet he is playing very well.
How many matches does Rooney have to play until he is considered fit enough to perform well?
Is there a magic formula or is it after he has a good game we consider he has regained his fitness?
Nani had a bad injury and played very little for the entire season so he obviously was not match fit, yet, he had a great game in Portugal's first friendly.
No magic formula, he just usually comes back from injury playing terribly and it takes him a long, long time until he suddenly clicks.
One of the things that most annoys me about him.
Well England is obviously in a quandary. I am not sure if LVG would be so understanding.
He's being given a run out to build up his match fitness, having only played 65 minutes of football in the last 5 weeks. He is playing on the left to accommodate other players who were promised a start. There is no more to it than that, as Hodgson has said.
Naturally, the Rooney haters will attempt to put the most negative spin possible on it.
Naturally, the Rooney haters will attempt to put the most negative spin possible on it.
To be fair you could see Rooney wasn't at his usual match sharpness. He was all red faced and looked tired in the England match, he's not usually like that.
He may be "training fit", but there is getting match sharpness which is completely different.
I am in the camp though that believes Rooney has definitely lost the edge he used to have. He is still a great player, but not the dynamic talisman we used to know.
He may be "training fit", but there is getting match sharpness which is completely different.
I am in the camp though that believes Rooney has definitely lost the edge he used to have. He is still a great player, but not the dynamic talisman we used to know.
He was not meant to play in this friendly .Which shows he is far from ready for the World Cup and still needs to up his fitness levels .
Here we go, excuses are here already.
Somehow he is unfit, and wasn't supposed to play friendly game against Peru, even though in his interview from more than two weeks ago he said he is fully fit and can't wait for the WC, and that he feels better than ever.
Somehow he is unfit, and wasn't supposed to play friendly game against Peru, even though in his interview from more than two weeks ago he said he is fully fit and can't wait for the WC, and that he feels better than ever.
Rooney's going to put a transfer request on Hodgson's desk.
Do we expect Rooney to start a winger tonight then given all recent comments? I think he will want to give Lambert a go and could go with something like:
Sturridge Lambert Rooney
Gerrard Wilshere Henderson
As that way he'd play from the wide but wouldn't be the main attack focal point, if he can bag a goal from that position I think that will shut the press up. He didn't ever become the great we hoped, he can't single handedly win a World Cup, but he's a more accomplished striker than any other England International
Sturridge Lambert Rooney
Gerrard Wilshere Henderson
As that way he'd play from the wide but wouldn't be the main attack focal point, if he can bag a goal from that position I think that will shut the press up. He didn't ever become the great we hoped, he can't single handedly win a World Cup, but he's a more accomplished striker than any other England International
As has already been pointed out, there is a difference between being fully fit in a training sense, and match sharpness - it is the latter that Rooney is currently lacking, and that is understandable given he's only played 65 minutes of football in the last 5 weeks.
And so he's being given match minutes to build his sharpness up. It is an entirely justifiable and sensible thing to do on Hodgson's part, but the frothers are utterly determined to make some sort of drama or crisis out of it.
Rooney's fitness is just a convenient cover for the stark reality in which he just isn't that good. Not at #10, anyway. That performance the other night was how he regularly plays in that position for us. Inconsistent touch, a turn to his outside at every opportunity, floated balls out wide or failed attempts over the top. The guy is a striker and nothing more. Though, Roy would be sensible in trying him out as a wide forward, where at least he can cross well, cut in and shoot and use his clever movement to get in behind defenders. This may well be a good call from Roy, it just depends on whether he has the balls to stick to it.
Here we go, excuses are here already.
Somehow he is unfit, and wasn't supposed to play friendly game against Peru, even though in his interview from more than two weeks ago he said he is fully fit and can't wait for the WC, and that he feels better than ever.
Rooney is getting set up to be England's scapegoat at this WC when in reality the team isn't good enough and Rooney is one of the best England have.
I watched the game vs Peru and Rooney and Sturridge were both below average but Sturridge scored a quality goal now he's all the rage.
I'm certainly not a Rooney hater but I find it very, very hard to like him now. I'd like to see what his reaction would be if he wasn't an automatic pick for England - would he up his game or sit there and sulk?
Why shouldn't he be an automatic pick for England? He was their top scorer during the qualifying campaign, with 7 goals in 9 matches, including a couple of openers in the last two key games.
He was also statistically the second best English centrally positioned forward in the Premier League last season after Sturridge, producing excellent numbers as both a Number 10 and a Number 9.
He is not in the team because of his reputation, as so many seem to suggest. He is in the team because he is arguably England's best forward player - second best this season, but i'm not sure that Sturridge is ultimately better overall - and continues to show that in domestic football.
His record in general for England is 28 goals in 55 competitive starts, which is actually very good.
It's bizarre that this player who actually *does* tend to perform for England* when the chips are down, and has done it for Man Utd for years at the highest level, is the one being questioned and doubted.
It's even more bizarre when people cite the likes of Lambert and Lallana as his replacement, two players who haven't even performed as well as him this season, and who aren't as proven at the highest level.
*Yes, you can reference 2006, 2010 and 2012 - in all of which there were extenuating circumstances (a broken metatarsal leading up to 2006, a sprained ankle leading up to 2010, and a suspension in 2012, where he still managed 1 goal in 2 starts).
I doubt Hodgson will bench Rooney in the actual tournament. remember he's the same guy who played an unfit Rooney in Euro '12 and said he'd be in trouble(with Rooney) if he didn't play him.
@NessunDorma
That is a skewed stat. What is his record in major tournaments?
@NessunDorma
That is a skewed stat. What is his record in major tournaments?
I don't agree in the way you equate match sharpness with match fitness. If you say he is "training fit" but not "match fit" I would understand and agree but why can't he come on the field make some good plays and then have to be taken off due to tiredness.
When it comes to Rooney it appears acceptable for him to have poor technique and skill following a short term injury.
I do not consider myself a Rooney hater. I hate the built in excuses people give him.
If he has a poor World Cup people have already made excuses for him. If he has a good-great World Cup he will appear superhuman for performing so well despite lacking "match fitness/ sharpness ).
This thread never ceases to amaze. Grown men who know a lot about football turning to raging whoppers at the drop of a dime.
No, it's not a 'skewed stat' at all - it is an accurate stat. Rooney has 28 goals in 55 competitive starts for England.
If you want to focus purely on his tournament output - and I have already said that there were genuine mitigating circumstances for 3 of them - it's played 14, scored 5. Of those 14 games, only 12 were starts. So that's 5 goals in 12 starts, which isn't even that bad in it's own right.
I am by no means saying he has been good at his last 3 tournaments, even given the context of injuries and suspension, because he hasn't.
But he has generally been good for England, has been good to great for United, and is in the England first XI on merit.
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He wasn't awful with his touch or technique in that game though. He just physically began tiring at the end of the match. I don't remember any of his sloppy touches or clumbsy dribbling, like he did earlier in the season for Utd.
Trust me though I don't think the sun shines out his arse, I sometimes feel having Sterling or Barkley in the hole could be just as effective. We need people who can dribble not just pass sideways.
Calm down!
Not once did I say he shouldn't be an automatic pick for England - I said "I'd like to see what his reaction would be if he wasn't an automatic pick for England".
It's not that Wayne isn't a good player, I just find it difficult to like him and I'm unsure of his attitude when things aren't going his way.
Rooney is England's top goalscorer in competitive ( non-friendly ) matches but he does not appear to score in competitive matches against the elite countries.
His goals are heavily skewed towards qualifying matches where the competition is not very strong.
Since it is well-established that he does not perform well following an injury then it is only logical that he should not be an automatic pick in those circumstances.
His goals are heavily skewed towards qualifying matches where the competition is not very strong.
Since it is well-established that he does not perform well following an injury then it is only logical that he should not be an automatic pick in those circumstances.
He has been injured going into his two worlds cups. He missed Euro 2008 as England didnt qualify and only got two games at Euro 2012(his own fault of course).
Well he was injured going into this one too
"those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it"
The last time Rooney went into a major tournament without a serious injury or suspension hanging over him was 2004, when he was named in the Team of the Tournament.
That was 10 years ago and unfortunately does not apply now because he is also just coming off an injury. Then he was a player of immense potential now he is someone who has failed to live up to said potential.
Wait for the Rooney fan boys to slaughter you for that comment. Obviously he became a great player, but not anywhere near what he could've become with the determination of a Ronaldo.
I agree if Rooney is in form he is a very good player and important to England but when he is not he is quite unproductive.
So with everyone saying he is not match fit/ sharp, based on his history, why do you think he should be an automatic pick for England right now?
So with everyone saying he is not match fit/ sharp, based on his history, why do you think he should be an automatic pick for England right now?
He had a minor niggle that he could have played through if he'd needed to, but Giggs did him a favour and allowed him to rest it for the last couple of games of the season. It isn't comparable to a broken metatarsal or sprained ankle. In 2006 and 2010, he was chasing general fitness *and* match sharpness. Now he's just chasing match sharpness, which should come from the friendly games.
Such is the received wisdom. Even though Rooney has been much more productive in his last three seasons with the club than in his first three seasons:
"The truth is an offense but not a sin", Courtesy of the late Bob Marley. I am accustomed to them. I said he failed to live up to his immense potential but they will probably omit the "immense" part.
To be honest Nessun dorma ( good name by the way, I host an opera show on a local radio station ) I was referring to his performance for England.He had a minor niggle that he could have played through if he'd needed to, but Giggs did him a favour and allowed him to rest it for the last couple of games of the season. It isn't comparable to a broken metatarsal or sprained ankle. In 2006 and 2010, he was chasing general fitness *and* match sharpness. Now he's just chasing match sharpness, which should come from the friendly games.
Such is the received wisdom. Even though Rooney has been much more productive in his last three seasons with the club than in his first three seasons:
For utd he has been a great player but imo not as great as some think.
Rooney's minutes per goal record at international level between 2003-2006, back when he was still good: 193 minutes per goal.
Rooney's minutes per goal record at international level between 2011-2014, during the period of his decline: 151 minutes per goal.
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