Wayne Rooney | 2012-14 Performances

Status
Not open for further replies.
Nope, the only one that would really come close (still a universe away) would be Cristiano Ronaldo. But a completely different scenario in the fact that it was not really a secret in the end and done mutually behind closed doors with all parties seemingly satisfied.

I'm not telling everyone Moyes should have done that or even attached a fee. I'm just making the connection of that if the club wants him sold in the end and is wanting/holding out for top dollar then announcing Rooneys intentions to leave wouldn't really effect the price and bargaining power of the club.
 
If only the Sunday Supplement took calls from the public, barring that infamous scene involving Lipton on Chelsea TV it is not often for your Fleet Street journo to be called out on a story.

I did send Neil Ashton an email the other week when he was presenting the Transfer Tavern albeit in regard to failure to dispute anything which a guest from the Mirror was claiming.

Spain has its newspaper which are so entangled with the clubs that objectivity is but a footnote, in the case of the British media it is a matter of individual reporters. Whilst i think people would understand that it is in their interests to foster contacts at clubs in a respective region, ultimately a duty to their profession should lay at the heart of what they do [a fine theory anyhow lol].

There also exists this flaw of credibility being given to ex-pros regardless of good sense, Steve Claridge and Darren Gough the arbiters of rational thought? I think not.
 
ghaliboy said:
Nope, the only one that would really come close (still a universe away) would be Cristiano Ronaldo. But a completely different scenario in the fact that it was not really a secret in the end and done mutually behind closed doors with all parties seemingly satisfied.

I'm not telling everyone Moyes should have done that or even attached a fee. I'm just making the connection of that if the club wants him sold in the end and is wanting/holding out for top dollar then announcing Rooneys intentions to leave wouldn't really effect the price and bargaining power of the club.
Click to expand...

Really?

If Chelsea think he's not for sale, and if they're determined to sign him, then they'll inevitably bid more towards the end of the transfer window in an attempt to meet the price at which we would be "forced" to sell. This may result in Rooney being subject to a bid of £40m or so, on transfer deadline day.

On the other hand, if Chelsea know that we want rid of the player in order to maintain morale and unity amongst the rest of the squad, they suddenly gain a whole lot of power where previously they had none. This would likely mean that United were forced to settle for maybe £30m on transfer deadline day, in order to move the player on.

As it stands, we don't actually know United's stance behind the scenes, but by saying the player is not for sale publicly, Moyes is playing this spot on.

We may only be talking about £5-10 million of a difference, but that's a lot of money, and worth bargaining hard over.
 
What do we imagine would actually happen if we simply refused to sell Roo?

Does he sulk and play like crap? Does he go on a scoring spree? Does he rot in the reserves? Does he refuse to play?

How does this work?
 
JmRssll555 said:
Really?

If Chelsea think he's not for sale, and if they're determined to sign him, then they'll inevitably bid more towards the end of the transfer window in an attempt to meet the price at which we would be "forced" to sell. This may result in Rooney being subject to a bid of £40m or so, on transfer deadline day.
Click to expand...
It's absolutely no different to coming out and telling Chelsea (maybe they have already behind closed doors) 'this is what we want for the player, pay it or not'. Chelsea can make silly bids all they want but if the window closes and Rooney hasn't been moved on by then and he's still our player then what does he do but keep playing in a world cup year? This kind of leads me to believe United is telling the truth when they say they won't be selling at any price and won't be listening to any more offers from Chelsea and then to him not being sold.

That's what I mean by there really is no difference to saying 'not for sale' or to say 'is worth XX and that's what we want'. In the end if we want to move the player and we want a certain fee then that is what we're going to get considering we hold all the bargaining power. Imo the bids from Jose are either a wum designed to unsettle the player or a pisstake trying to snag him for cheap. In either scenario releasing our intention to sell at a certain price makes no difference. IF we want to sell, if anything it will cause Jose to sit up and believe he actually has a chance at signing him. If we don't want to sell... Well that's another hypothetical.
 
Ghaliboy is spot on.

Aside from having two years left on his deal, after which he'll be 30 (and not necessarily a fit 30), he's fecked because he can't sulk during a World Cup year. United hold all the aces.
 
Rooney wouldn't refuse to play in a season leading up the World Cup, true. What he would do is fail to give his all and risk an injury before another international tournament.

That's why he must go now for the sakes of both him and the club. No doubt he'll have a great season at Chelsea to spite us but everything points to him giving somewhere around 50% if he stays.
 
Judge Red said:
Rooney wouldn't refuse to play in a season leading up the World Cup, true. What he would do is fail to give his all and risk an injury before another international tournament.

That's why he must go now for the sakes of both him and the club. No doubt he'll have a great season at Chelsea to spite us but everything points to him giving somewhere around 50% if he stays.
Click to expand...

If he coasts and doesn't put 100% effort in, he gets dropped - simple.

You can't play on autopilot leading up to a World Cup.
 
Judge Red said:
Rooney wouldn't refuse to play in a season leading up the World Cup, true. What he would do is fail to give his all and risk an injury before another international tournament.
Click to expand...


You don't really know that, it's a silly assumption if you ask me. Why would you feck around knowing that there is an important international tournament waiting at the end of the season. Half arsed, maybe but then Moyes just benches him and if he's unfit by the Jan window then sell him for silly money then.
 
Exactly.

England hardly have great strikers to challenge Rooney. He was suspended for 2 games during the Euros and we still took him. Rooney is first name on list, if England qualify.

Even if he has a really bad season.
 
The only thing that will keep Rooney out of the World Cup is an injury. Hell, even injuries haven't kept him out of previous tournaments. By April and May, he'll be useless IMHO.

I like the idea of waiting until the final day of the transfer window, when Chelsea will have already been to Old Trafford, and not giving him a second of match time between now and then. It's pretty much a necessary ploy when you're handing over a player of his stature to a main title rival.
 
I'd rather sell him to Arsenal. Unless Chelsea offer something crazy like £60m or more then it's not worth it. Rooneys goals could help win Chelsea the premier league.

Where as I don't see Arsenal challenging. He will also screw up their wage structure, which hopefully would unsettle Wilshere.
 
Bojan11 said:
I'd rather sell him to Arsenal. Unless Chelsea offer something crazy like £60m or more then it's not worth it. Rooneys goals could help win Chelsea the premier league.

Where as I don't see Arsenal challenging. He will also screw up their wage structure, which hopefully would unsettle Wilshere.
Click to expand...


You've pretty much detailed exactly why he won't be moving to Arsenal.
 
It was interesting on Talksport this morning, they had John Cross, from guess who, The Mirror, and they were talking to Ray Houghton about Suarez. At the end of the interview Ray shot down Cross about Rooney, basically saying that Rooney needs to remember the loyalty the club have shown him and that they have made him a very rich man. Nice to see someone not sympathising with Wayne for a change.
 
Judge Red said:
The only thing that will keep Rooney out of the World Cup is an injury. Hell, even injuries haven't kept him out of previous tournaments. By April and May, he'll be useless IMHO.

I like the idea of waiting until the final day of the transfer window, when Chelsea will have already been to Old Trafford, and not giving him a second of match time between now and then. It's pretty much a necessary ploy when you're handing over a player of his stature to a main title rival.
Click to expand...



Slevs said:
I don't believe either of the injuries. He wants a transfer but doesn't want to hand in an official one so he can get the loyalty bonus. He'll probably use the "I was forced out" card, but we're not that stupid. We have the advantage, let him sweat, make Chelsea bid something ridiculous like 45m pounds a few minutes before the deadline after Rooney hands in a transfer request.
Click to expand...
Yup, same here. That's the ideal scenario.
 
Rooney is a prat, as alot of footballers are. Still, even if we kept him, I don't think he would drag his feet and mope around the pitch in a sulk. I believe Wayne is a player who will continue to give 100% on the pitch. Afterall, if we don't let him go this window, it doesn't mean Wayne will automatically think "Ok then. I will stay forever". If he wants to move, then that will probably continue to be the case, and he'll have to continue playing well for clubs to be interested in him. I believe we are in a strong position though; If we sell him now, we stand to make alot of money from it. If we don't, then he still has to play well in order to get a move next summer, and to play for England. Whilst Rooney is England's most talented player, you just don't know what kind of season other English players are going to have. Sturridge was very good in the 2nd half of the season. If he does that for a full season now, then he could be a serious contender to play centre forward for England. Same goes for Welbeck, and possibly even Walcott. It's unlikely, but it's not impossible. There's about a 99.9% chance Rooney is going to the World Cup as a starter, but I don't think even he would rest on his laurels and think "I'm Wayne fecking Rooney, mate!" and not do his best.
 
Slevs said:
I don't believe either of the injuries. He wants a transfer but doesn't want to hand in an official one so he can get the loyalty bonus. He'll probably use the "I was forced out" card, but we're not that stupid. We have the advantage, let him sweat, make Chelsea bid something ridiculous like 45m pounds a few minutes before the deadline after Rooney hands in a transfer request.
Click to expand...

I don't think he will hand in a request. His wages here are not exactly peanuts and if nothing happens he will play here for the next season. A few good performances and fans will be swayed back into his favour.
 
I think he will hand one in. He doesn't want to be here, quite clearly, and I think it would be a far harder climb to win back fans compared to 2010 - fans are fickle, but a few goals won't cut it now. Obviously a lot of people will forgive him, but a sizeable amount won't. He doesn't care about that anyway, evidenced by his massive u-turn from now and last year when he said he wanted to retire here, plus his silence over the entire thing.
 
I'm glad the club are standing firm at the moment but I feel its only a matter of time till he goes.

It's a shame that his career at United will end with sour grapes, as on the whole he's been a fantastic servant to the club. I'd like to think the relationship could be repaired but then I don't think the fans can as easily forgive this time round so it seems like no other option than to part ways.

Disappointing.
 
Yeah, he'll definitely go, just a matter of time now really. I'd rather it wasn't to another Premier League side, but if they pay over the odds then let them have him.

I can't say I feel any sort of ill/resentment towards him mind - he was fantastic for us and I can't really be arsed getting upset about him wanting to leave or anything. That's life/football afterall.
 
x42bn6 said:
The ideal scenario also includes us having a replacement lined up. I don't think we should let Rooney go without replacing him.
Click to expand...


I think we have enough cover as it is. Buying a central midfielder would offset the loss of Rooney and void in the central midfield spot at the same time. Fellaini isn't this central midfielder but would still be a good signing (on another note).

Fruit Cake said:
I don't think he will hand in a request. His wages here are not exactly peanuts and if nothing happens he will play here for the next season. A few good performances and fans will be swayed back into his favour.
Click to expand...


This isn't like 2010. He hasn't and won't sign a new contract. Everyone knows that he can go next year for little money, it's just a case of how much Chelsea need him to put in that much money. I think it will go down to the wire, with Chelsea offering something crazy and us accepting in the last minute. We're not getting a direct replacement in, instead we're getting the central midfielder we need and offsetting Wayne's role to Kagawa and the new signings.
 
Trigg said:
I'm glad the club are standing firm at the moment but I feel its only a matter of time till he goes.

It's a shame that his career at United will end with sour grapes, as on the whole he's been a fantastic servant to the club. I'd like to think the relationship could be repaired but then I don't think the fans can as easily forgive this time round so it seems like no other option than to part ways.

Disappointing.
Click to expand...

Well summed up really.

The guy is a fecking knob but he has been brilliant for us. He will be a huge loss but if he wants to act like a slapped arse, it's better for him to go. The scouse cnut
 
OnlyTwoDaSilvas said:
I don't think even he would rest on his laurels and think "I'm Wayne fecking Rooney, mate!" and not do his best.
Click to expand...

I dunno.........isn't that exactly what wanting guarantees about starting games, and thinking he is at his peak and has nothing to prove is?
 
If he won't sign and new contract in the future (and it's getting clear now that he won't) then we need to cash in on the fat feck. Sending him abroad is ideal however if Chelsea want to pay ludicrous money for him at the end of the window than that won't be a bad option either.
 
Bryan_Munich said:
The amount of money is pretty irrelevant for me unless we are able to spend it.
Weakening ourselves whilst strengthening Chelsea makes no sense whatsoever.
Click to expand...


Cannot agree more... anyone of you remember his determination, his anger for the win, his bicycle kick against Shitty? Some posters here are so ungrateful to the great player he is, yet unforfunately it's quite understandable since Rooney has equally been ungrateful to the club, so they say. I won't be happy to see imho our best player going to a rival like that.
 
dmode said:
Cannot agree more... anyone of you remember his determination, his anger for the win, his bicycle kick against Shitty? Some posters here are so ungrateful to the great player he is, yet unforfunately it's quite understandable since Rooney has equally been ungrateful to the club, so they say. I won't be happy to see imho our best player going to a rival like that.
Click to expand...


Would be bordering on professional suicide for Moyes, which is why I believe the club won't allow it to happen.
 
JmRssll555 said:
Really?

If Chelsea think he's not for sale, and if they're determined to sign him, then they'll inevitably bid more towards the end of the transfer window in an attempt to meet the price at which we would be "forced" to sell. This may result in Rooney being subject to a bid of £40m or so, on transfer deadline day.

On the other hand, if Chelsea know that we want rid of the player in order to maintain morale and unity amongst the rest of the squad, they suddenly gain a whole lot of power where previously they had none. This would likely mean that United were forced to settle for maybe £30m on transfer deadline day, in order to move the player on.

As it stands, we don't actually know United's stance behind the scenes, but by saying the player is not for sale publicly, Moyes is playing this spot on.

We may only be talking about £5-10 million of a difference, but that's a lot of money, and worth bargaining hard over.
Click to expand...
Exactly, I was saying the same. I doubt that there is a big club who says that this player is for save (except Madrid). The club doesn't get anything for doing these kind of stupid things.

Ruud10 said:
What do we imagine would actually happen if we simply refused to sell Roo?

Does he sulk and play like crap? Does he go on a scoring spree? Does he rot in the reserves? Does he refuse to play?

How does this work?
Click to expand...

If this happen we then wouldn't give him wages. Rotting in the reserves is the worst option by a distance. We lose all those money.

Feed Me said:
Ghaliboy is spot on.

Aside from having two years left on his deal, after which he'll be 30 (and not necessarily a fit 30),he's fecked because he can't sulk during a World Cup year. United hold all the aces.
Click to expand...

Yes, he can. He'll be in Brazil (bar an injury) regardless of how shit he'll play (or doesn't play at all). Uncle Woy and the morons who are on FA don't have the guts of dropping him.
 
Hodgson will pick him regardless. In fact, he made a point of saying this when the transfer story broke; the subtext is "We care about you, Wayne, even if your club doesn't":


Roy Hodgson: “His situation at United doesn’t really impact his England commitments,” said the England manager. “There is no doubting his commitment to England and I am sure I will be dealing with a highly motivated player.

“He has played pretty regularly. If you tot up his games played for the season he will nudging 50 so I am not concerned about his playing time.”
Click to expand...
 
Bryan_Munich said:
The amount of money is pretty irrelevant for me unless we are able to spend it.

Weakening ourselves whilst strengthening Chelsea makes no sense whatsoever.
Click to expand...

We'll spend it somehow. Doesn't mean that only if we spend the same amount of money we get from his sale (and wages that some people forget at times) and then invest in a new star signing is a good business. There could be many young players who will get a new contract here (Rafael, De Gea etc) in a new year or so. Probably Rooney's money will get spend on increasing these players wages, probably we'll improve training facilities, or sign some young player. What is sure though is that losing 60m pounds on him with the current massive debt we have is not healthy and everybody who think that these won't affect us economically in the future must think twice.

dmode said:
Cannot agree more... anyone of you remember his determination, his anger for the win, his bicycle kick against Shitty? Some posters here are so ungrateful to the great player he is, yet unforfunately it's quite understandable since Rooney has equally been ungrateful to the club, so they say. I won't be happy to see imho our best player going to a rival like that.
Click to expand...

Completely useless remembering if he doesn't want to continue here and doesn't have the will and desire to play for us. And he isn't our best player. The only season ever he was our best player was 2009-2010 and possibly 2011-2012 (though a big doubt). He can be you're favorite player but he isn't our best player.
 
Yeah his striking rivals for England are in no better shape

Carroll
Welbeck
Bent
Defoe
Walcott
Sturridge

he could probably score 5 goals all season and still be the key man up front for England.
 
Revan said:
We'll spend it somehow. Doesn't mean that only if we spend the same amount of money we get from his sale (and wages that some people forget at times) and then invest in a new star signing is a good business. There could be many young players who will get a new contract here (Rafael, De Gea etc) in a new year or so. Probably Rooney's money will get spend on increasing these players wages, probably we'll improve training facilities, or sign some young player. What is sure though is that losing 60m pounds on him with the current massive debt we have is not healthy and everybody who think that these won't affect us economically in the future must think twice.
Click to expand...

Unless we spend it on a player of equal or greater quality I meant.
 
Zen said:
Yeah his striking rivals for England are in no better shape

Carroll
Welbeck
Bent
Defoe
Walcott
Sturridge

he could probably score 5 goals all season and still be the key man up front for England.
Click to expand...

He could impregnate Kate Middleton and he'd still start for England at the World Cup.
 
dmode said:
Cannot agree more... anyone of you remember his determination, his anger for the win, his bicycle kick against Shitty? Some posters here are so ungrateful to the great player he is, yet unforfunately it's quite understandable since Rooney has equally been ungrateful to the club, so they say. I won't be happy to see imho our best player going to a rival like that.
Click to expand...

You make good points but there comes a point where all the hassle simply isn't worth it anymore.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.