[Eugenius]

I think people need to realise statistics in football are basically useless. Very rarely are they actually helpful. Like I'm sure Smalling has a great pass completion percentage, but anyone who actually watches would get infuriated by the time he takes to pass, or by him passing behind a teammate or making a pass to someone tightly marked.

It's equally ridiculous to manipulate stats to suggest Lindelof should get VVD like praise for not being dribbled past, or to suggest he's good in the air. I mean don't we have one of the worst set pieces goals conceded records in the league? And that's with Maguire doing the heading for two people. DDG is also terrible in the air but how often do you see Lindelof clear a corner convincingly (I'm fairly sure I remember him ducking into one at the near post which led to us conceding a goal)?

Off the top of my head, direct physical challenges he's lost leading to goals this season - Crystal Palace at home, Southampton away, Liverpool at home (lucky Mane goal was disallowed for handball), Southampton at home. And I can remember several others where he's gotten very lucky with mistakes.

 

[A-man]

This debate seems to be getting sillier. It’s like saying Zlatan who basically p*ssed off everyone in the dressing room and gave the ball away all the time is better than Messi.

It is evident that Maguire and Lindelöf are not a good combination because of our recessive / passive back peddling and giving up of ground in that vital area between half way line and penalty area.

let’s not take it on another level and somehow try to argue that Lindelöf is anywhere near as good as Maguire. Lindelöf could look good next to a super dynamic fast and aggressive defender, but Maguire is basically a much more intimidating and ball playing version of Lindelöf and a defender who has no fear and knows when to step out. Lindelöf looks terrified half the time and knocks it out of play far too often and backs off the opposition far too often. He panics - simple. If you have played football you know.

this is compounded by a passive, nervous goalkeeper who lacks confidence, ball playing skills and totally lacks command of his penalty area.Lindelöf is not awful but you HAVE to look at it from the oppositions point of view.

I would love to play against Lindelöf, too easy and as for de Gea he never comes out for a cross and he looks like he is bolemic. He is getting paid so much money (so is Lindelöf - who looks like a chancer to me - he doesn’t look like he belongs in the first team)

de gea should be in the gym beefing himself.

we also need a dynamic DM

all this talk about sancho and grealish - I want them but we need 3 fecking players in the defensive area of the pitch

how anyone can’t see this I don’t know. I want us to improved I honestly can’t believe a Man Utd fan who doesn’t want us to improve thinks that Lindelöf, and de gea have been good enough over the last 2 seasons.

Maguire is the better CB of the two, for most teams. But it’s not by miles. If we look at the season, Lindelof was better after the COVID break. It could be coincidence. It could also be that he and his game style benefit from a functioning midfield more than Maguire does. And at the end Maguire looked very tired while Lindelof seemed to keep his shape and concentration better.

 

[Mercurial]

As long as he gets used like a toilet brush by power forwards and impact subs like Giroud & Adama did and a few lucky close calls, we will drop points to mid table teams and the sum of that adds up against us, we chase more for win (fatigue) or outright drop points. He just isn't going to cut it unless major improvement is done on his behalf and is bad for synergy. As some said, every time he is up vs a bully player people hold their breath. He has skills better suited for La Liga.

 

[BenitoSTARR]

Can't get past a man who'll give you space to run and keep backing off until a goal goes in.

Give me an example of when Lindelöf has allowed this to happen resulting in a goal.

 

[Henandez14]

I think the problem is irrespective of what he is now, some people are fixed on what he was when he first arrived. Clear that some of the myths attributed to him aren't true and whilst he's not vidic or Rio, but don't think he's solely the problem. It's worrying that you buy a CB for 80m then have to spend another 60m to cover the 80m defenders lack of pace etc. Even more worrying that we are creating a graveyard of CB's and still can't get it right.

Great post.
It’s ridiculous. Spend 80m on a defender then spend even more on a foil for 80m defender. Lindelof has come on in leaps and bounds from the huddersfield game and is now a starting cb for most premiership sides. He would partner Laporte at city and replace Gomez next to Vvd no problem. I actually think Lindelof should partner whatever “dominant cb” we get and not Maguire. Leicester never played a high line while Maguire was there and he had Ndidi ahead of him. Maguire will always be a problem in a high line no matter who he’s partnered with imo

 

[romufc]

On the other hand you have Lindelof who as well as barely going in for a tackle, barely goes in for an interception, in the air he is weak, not strong, not fast and makes more mistakes.

Then you look at every Liverpool CB other than VVD and they all make more tackles than our CBs. So it doesnt matter that he's not aggressively looking to make tackles because his partner is. And thats the point of a partnership.

Its almost like they'd need to have more than 1 single stat in common to be anything like each other as players.

Do they?

Let me just give you a few stats to compare Joe Gomez V Our CB's

Gomes. . Maguire .Lindelof
Duels Won % 56.3 65.2 63.4
Ariel duels % 58.8 71.3 65.8
Recoveries 151 237 215
Tackles won % 70 62.2 52
Interceptions 38 72 26


Those stats show you Harry Maguire has been an absolute beast for us.

Can you point out where Lindelof has made mistakes and costed us points this season?

Yes, he isn't the strongest or quickest but he has done a good job in our defence. We will be a better team with a better defender but fans like you who keep criticising Lindelof every game, without real reason.

 

[A-man]

As long as he gets used like a toilet brush by power forwards and impact subs like Giroud & Adama did and a few lucky close calls, we will drop points to mid table teams and the sum of that adds up against us, we chase more for win (fatigue) or outright drop points. He just isn't going to cut it unless major improvement is done on his behalf and is bad for synergy. As some said, every time he is up vs a bully player people hold their breath. He has skills better suited for La Liga.

The reason is that some people like you think Lindelof was “bullied” when Giroud scored, is because they have already made up their mind about him. Like you say you hold your breath, then Giroud scores the same way he always does, and the defender is bullied because it was Lindelof and you were waiting for him to get bullied. If exactly the same situation had happen to Maguire you would never say he was bullied. Instead people would say he was slow, because that is what people believe about him.

 

[Mercurial]

The reason is that some people like you think Lindelof was “bullied” when Giroud scored, is because they have already made up their mind about him. Like you say you hold your breath, then Giroud scores the same way he always does, and the defender is bullied because it was Lindelof and you were waiting for him to get bullied. If exactly the same situation had happen to Maguire you would never say he was bullied. Instead people would say he was slow, because that is what people believe about him.

All out pro like Giroud and bully experts sniff out the weakness in him, thats why they try him.

He cost us the FA cup vs Chelsea and somehow got the blame shifted on to De Gea. His head clearance is weak. He is very indecisive
I have nothing against him and cheer for him for our NT. I just don't think he cuts it for us. He did some things well and is improving, but is he all that great going forward?

Granted everyone can have a bad day and many were uncaring or glad we got eliminated in the FA to salvage a UCL it still looked bad and the energy was already spent and they were in same situation as us and needed to rotate.

Highlights for FA cup vs Chelsea



2.40 Giroud clearly went for Lindelöf like a tommahawk missle.
4.05 fingerpointing to Fred to solve it once he was passed indecisiveness and confusion cost us 2nd goals .
6.45 close call was a tourist on the corner, saved by DeGea
6.50 yet again indecisiveness costing us a goal, pointing vs acting.

One match out of many, bad day for him, but sooner or later the close calls will be converted like this and i stand by my analysis. Over a season it detracts from synergy and costs points. Wish him the best for our NT and the club, but unless he steps up his game at a faster pace he will be replaced sooner than later.

 

[romufc]

The reason is that some people like you think Lindelof was “bullied” when Giroud scored, is because they have already made up their mind about him. Like you say you hold your breath, then Giroud scores the same way he always does, and the defender is bullied because it was Lindelof and you were waiting for him to get bullied. If exactly the same situation had happen to Maguire you would never say he was bullied. Instead people would say he was slow, because that is what people believe about him.

I don't know if it is me, it feels like some fans want us to concede goals and they want Lindelof to make mistakes so they can say... "I always said it, we cannot do anything with him in the team".

Literally every time we concede a goal, blame Lindelof.

 

[jamesjimmybyrondean]

He's only rated by United fans.

 

[gajender]

I don't know if it is me, it feels like some fans want us to concede goals and they want Lindelof to make mistakes so they can say... "I always said it, we cannot do anything with him in the team".

Literally every time we concede a goal, blame Lindelof.

No it's not you and it's not something limited to Lindelof either some of the posters have this innate need to be proven right even if the evidence is to the contrary they would still stick to their Guns .

 

[Mercurial]

I don't know if it is me, it feels like some fans want us to concede goals and they want Lindelof to make mistakes so they can say... "I always said it, we cannot do anything with him in the team".

Literally every time we concede a goal, blame Lindelof.

No way, every true fan want us to win, but perhaps truth is his skillset, and physical or mental attributes have maxed out to their limits and more and more people notice how he isnt up to par for where this club aims to head and belongs. Me being first to eat a shoe and admit it if he turns into a world beater.

 

[romufc]

No it's not you and it's not something limited to Lindelof either some of the posters have this innate need to be proven right even if the evidence is to the contrary they would still stick to their Guns .

I agree on that it isn't limited to Lindelof. Our fan base spends alot of time and effort focusing on the negatives of every player.

Lindelof - blame all goals on him, like you have seen a poster has posted the video of Semi final and said he cost us the cup, when there was 11 players and we had 0 attacking play. Yes, that is Lindelof's fault. Lindelof is to blame that Maguire got done same way he did in the first half.

Shaw - Same old story about how he cannot attack, yet when he plays it seems Rashford plays better and we attack better

Have seen similar trends with Pogba, Matic, Martial as well,

 

[Mercurial]

I agree on that it isn't limited to Lindelof. Our fan base spends alot of time and effort focusing on the negatives of every player.

Lindelof - blame all goals on him, like you have seen a poster has posted the video of Semi final and said he cost us the cup, when there was 11 players and we had 0 attacking play. Yes, that is Lindelof's fault. Lindelof is to blame that Maguire got done same way he did in the first half.

Shaw - Same old story about how he cannot attack, yet when he plays it seems Rashford plays better and we attack better

Have seen similar trends with Pogba, Matic, Martial as well,

Sorry you feel that way but Lindelöf is the bench option for a classy CB looking at things objectively.

 

[romufc]

Sorry you feel that way but Lindelöf is the bench option for a classy CB looking at things objectively.

The thing is, I am not saying he is a starter for United. I agree that with a classy, quicker CB, Lindelof should be 3rd choice.

The same applies to Fred, McTominay right? but we all they done well in games, we have said they have been good for us. Same with Lindelof, he has been good for us this season. That doesn't mean he is the best CB. When was the last time we had 2 reliable CB's? in terms of fitness?

 

[georgipep]

Sorry you feel that way but Lindelöf is the bench option for a classy CB looking at things objectively.

Just adding the word "objectively" doesn't make you objective. The objective facts are that this season with the Lindelof/Maguire pairing we've conceded significantly less goals. If another CB comes, replaces either one of them and we achieve even better results (while keep our attacking improvement too), then you might have a point to claim something "objectively".

 

[Mercurial]

Just adding the word "objectively" doesn't make you objective. The objective facts are that this season with the Lindelof/Maguire pairing we've conceded significantly less goals. If another CB comes, replaces either one of them and we achieve even better results (while keep our attacking improvement too), then you might have a point to claim something "objectively".

I stand corrected

 

[Mercurial]

The thing is, I am not saying he is a starter for United. I agree that with a classy, quicker CB, Lindelof should be 3rd choice.

The same applies to Fred, McTominay right? but we all they done well in games, we have said they have been good for us. Same with Lindelof, he has been good for us this season. That doesn't mean he is the best CB. When was the last time we had 2 reliable CB's? in terms of fitness?

He stays fit and that in itself is as you say an improvement over what we had and the pairing is a lot better than the old ones. My main gripe with him for us is that he just doesn't seem to have it in him to realise the potential he was identified as having and on the bad days the shortcomings cost us in reverse. For example in the Swedish NT he is often excluded from having to talk to local media "to protect him" for no good reasons other than the fact he attracts national interest. He seem to lack the assertiveness or confidence needed to really take things to the next level. Im fairly confident it would compensate some other of his shortcomings, and im hoping the nurturing ways of Ole and the turtle paced confidence gains can give him that.

This is his Performance thread so some critique on his shortcomings are valid, as you say he is the best of what we have at the moment and I back him until that changes even though I wish the position was addressed. Im not a barbarian savage after all.

 

[romufc]

He stays fit and that in itself is as you say an improvement over what we had and the pairing is a lot better than the old ones. My main gripe with him for us is that he just doesn't seem to have it in him to realise the potential he was identified as having and on the bad days the shortcomings cost us in reverse. For example in the Swedish NT he is often excluded from having to talk to local media "to protect him" for no good reasons other than the fact he attracts national interest. He seem to lack the assertiveness or confidence needed to really take things to the next level. Im fairly confident it would compensate some other of his shortcomings, and im hoping the nurturing ways of Ole and the turtle paced confidence gains can give him that.

This is his Performance thread so some critique on his shortcomings are valid, as you say he is the best of what we have at the moment and I back him until that changes even though I wish the position was addressed. Im not a barbarian savage after all.

I agree about Lindelof, he lacks a few things to make him a top top CB, but it also doesn't mean he is rubbish like alot of posters seem to say.

I have always maintained that to get challenging with Liverpool and City, a better pairing is required. However; at the moment that's who we have, we should support or players when they are trying. It isnt like Lindelof makes glaring mistakes every game.

 

[Mercurial]

I agree about Lindelof, he lacks a few things to make him a top top CB, but it also doesn't mean he is rubbish like alot of posters seem to say.

I have always maintained that to get challenging with Liverpool and City, a better pairing is required. However; at the moment that's who we have, we should support or players when they are trying. It isnt like Lindelof makes glaring mistakes every game.

On that we agree then. League is a win by not getting 1-upped vs the mid teams and consistently getting the boring unmemorable wins mixed in with the top matches. A title run starts at the back and our against goals look good on paper for a total tally but they are also too many at the same time in matches we lost or drew, not wins that we outscored 4-2 like the top 2 teams did. Hence a somewhat lack of consistency is worrying and need to be "fixed" one way or the other be it tighter at the back or compensated by outscoring. I do trust in the judgment of our current upper coaching staff. At the end of the day they have done a fantastic job so far with the players of the correct mindset/attitude that got to stay after the Ole purging. If they say a player need to go its not unfounded and they still believe in Lindelöf, his forward passing saves him for now and he genuinely wants to be here and make it wich noone can hold against him at least.

 

[BenitoSTARR]

I don't know if it is me, it feels like some fans want us to concede goals and they want Lindelof to make mistakes so they can say... "I always said it, we cannot do anything with him in the team".

Literally every time we concede a goal, blame Lindelof.

I genuinely get sick and tired of seeing the same unsubstantiated opinions being banded about as objective or factual. I swear half of the people on here can not be fans by the very definition of the word:

“Someone who admires and supports a person, sport, sports team etc.”

Half of the posters in the football forums just want to shit on our players because they have no other frame of reference so one bad game and you can be labelled as xyz forever.

It’s symptomatic of a wider issue of everything having to be perfect or the fifa video game generation where taking your league 2 team to champions league in 4 seasons is seen as a realistic career mode.

Lindelöf is a victim of his first impression. The Lindelöf we have now does not deserve the diatribe against him.

Is he world class? No.

Is he a weak point? No.

Can we realistically upgrade his current ability this window? No.

 

[romufc]

I genuinely get sick and tired of seeing the same unsubstantiated opinions being banded about as objective or factual. I swear half of the people on here can not be fans by the very definition of the word:

“Someone who admires and supports a person, sport, sports team etc.”

Half of the posters in the football forums just want to shit on our players because they have no other frame of reference so one bad game and you can be labelled as xyz forever.

It’s symptomatic of a wider issue of everything having to be perfect or the fifa video game generation where taking your league 2 team to champions league in 4 seasons is seen as a realistic career mode.

Lindelöf is a victim of his first impression. The Lindelöf we have now does not deserve the diatribe against him.

Is he world class? No.

Is he a weak point? No.

Can we realistically upgrade his current ability this window? No.

It is tiring. It is weird because the Lindelof hater's would actually not take anything he has done this season. There has been an improvement in Lindelof this season, he has been a consistent performer all season.

It is quite annoying that every goal we concede is somehow blamed on Lindelof. Someone posted earlier saying he cost us the FA cup. Those kind of posts goes to show the mentality of certain fans.

No credit to the attacker. If Lindelof is such a bad defender, why is our defensive record so good since Jan? Another poster mentioned to me it is the rest of the team that have bailed him out, we would be the same if anyone else played.

If you really want Manutd to be successful, you have to back your players, sometimes they make mistakes. Can anyone pin point say 3 errors Lindelof has made that have cost us points this season?

Even the best in the world VVD makes mistakes occasionally. No football player is error free.

 

[A-man]

All out pro like Giroud and bully experts sniff out the weakness in him, thats why they try him.

He cost us the FA cup vs Chelsea and somehow got the blame shifted on to De Gea. His head clearance is weak. He is very indecisive
I have nothing against him and cheer for him for our NT. I just don't think he cuts it for us. He did some things well and is improving, but is he all that great going forward?

Granted everyone can have a bad day and many were uncaring or glad we got eliminated in the FA to salvage a UCL it still looked bad and the energy was already spent and they were in same situation as us and needed to rotate.

Highlights for FA cup vs Chelsea


2.40 Giroud clearly went for Lindelöf like a tommahawk missle.
4.05 fingerpointing to Fred to solve it once he was passed indecisiveness and confusion cost us 2nd goals .
6.45 close call was a tourist on the corner, saved by DeGea
6.50 yet again indecisiveness costing us a goal, pointing vs acting.

One match out of many, bad day for him, but sooner or later the close calls will be converted like this and i stand by my analysis. Over a season it detracts from synergy and costs points. Wish him the best for our NT and the club, but unless he steps up his game at a faster pace he will be replaced sooner than later.

You know what? CBs are very often “responsible” when a goal is conceded. It comes with the job. He is also responsible for the third best defensive result in the PL, 3 goals from Liverpool. Of those goals, I wouldn’t say that he has been the main responsible for many of them. Watch a compilation of Giroud’s goals and you’ll see that 4/5 goals are in the face of a CB. He has scored against many good teams with good defence. Within a week after our game he scored against both Liverpool and Wolves as well. If he had scored those goals against us I am sure you would have said Lindelof was bullied or passive.

I don't know if it is me, it feels like some fans want us to concede goals and they want Lindelof to make mistakes so they can say... "I always said it, we cannot do anything with him in the team".

Literally every time we concede a goal, blame Lindelof.

Lindelof has a style that is far from the traditional English CB. Many people are stuck in the past and think that a CB should be tough as nail, last ditch tackling and screw is own team mate’s wife, or else he is not good enough.

We can all see that the result has been good for Lindelof and Maguire, therefore the haters now use emotional complaints like “he is not United material”, “ he is weak as piss”, “he waves with his arms”.

We can clearly see that Ole value other things than that, and it looks as he is happy with his CB pair. The team also play a positive and match winning football at the moment with lots of goals scored and the clean sheets racking up.

What is needed is one more CB of similar caliber as we can’t count on these two guys to play week in week out next season again. Injuries will come at some point and then with all the backups always injured or unfit there will be a disaster.

 

[romufc]

Lindelof has a style that is far from the traditional English CB. Many people are stuck in the past and think that a CB should be tough as nail, last ditch tackling and screw is own team matewife, or else he is not good enough.

We can all see that the result has been good for Lindelof and Maguire, therefore the haters now use emotional complaints like “he is not United material”, “ he is weak as piss”, “he waves with his arms”.

We can clearly see that Ole value other things than that, and it looks as he is happy with his CB pair. The team also play a positive and match winning football at the moment with lots of goals scored and the clean sheets racking up.

What is needed is one more CB of similar caliber as we can’t count on these two guys to play week in week out next season again. Injuries will come at some point and then with all the backups always injured or unfit there will be a disaster.

Well put. It is frustrating when someone is trying to put a player down because he waves his arms.

I don't know if you have heard this but alot of people would say, if you have to put in a last ditch tackle means you were out of position to begin with.

I agree, we need similar calibre of player, perhaps someone quick which may help us hold the line slightly higher.

I think most of our trouble comes from lack of protection in midfield. The number of times teams bypass our midfield and are up against our defence is staggering. I feel our defenders need to be protected better.

To put it into perspective, we have conceded 3 less goals than Liverpool from open play. Our weakness has always been set plays, that is not down to one person, it has to be a collective effort.

I have seen everyone raving about Soyuncu, Ricardo, Chilwel over our defence, yet they have conceded more than we have. Add to that they have a ball winner in Ndidi.

So if you look at it, our defence is not as bad as some fans make it out to be.

 

[He'sRaldo]

You are referring to some kind of romantic picture of the old classic CB who was to be tough and took care of things himself. What you think is leaving responsibility is cooperation and working as a unit. And the reason why you don’t see conceded goals because of it, is because it works.

I know you're a big Lindelof fan, so I'll ask you. Do you think he's generally passive at all with his defending, or do you think all he does is good defending?

 

[A-man]

I know you're a big Lindelof fan, so I'll ask you. Do you think he's generally passive at all with his defending, or do you think all he does is good defending?

If you read my posts you can see that I think he needs to work on his aggressive side.

 

[A-man]

I know you're a big Lindelof fan, so I'll ask you. Do you think he's generally passive at all with his defending, or do you think all he does is good defending?

And as a big Lindelof hater/critisizer , do you think he any good qualities at all or the good results are just luck?

Can tell you I’m a fan of the whole club not just Lindelof.

 

[A-man]

Well put. It is frustrating when someone is trying to put a player down because he waves his arms.

I don't know if you have heard this but alot of people would say, if you have to put in a last ditch tackle means you were out of position to begin with.

I agree, we need similar calibre of player, perhaps someone quick which may help us hold the line slightly higher.

I think most of our trouble comes from lack of protection in midfield. The number of times teams bypass our midfield and are up against our defence is staggering. I feel our defenders need to be protected better.

To put it into perspective, we have conceded 3 less goals than Liverpool from open play. Our weakness has always been set plays, that is not down to one person, it has to be a collective effort.

I have seen everyone raving about Soyuncu, Ricardo, Chilwel over our defence, yet they have conceded more than we have. Add to that they have a ball winner in Ndidi.

So if you look at it, our defence is not as bad as some fans make it out to be.

Better organisation at set pieces is critical. Both in attack and defence.

To upgrade the CBs is not the most important, besides you never know what you get. Some of the names people were calling for one year ago have been injured or had poor seasons. But we need one who is good enough for PL who is happy if he ends up as a rotational player. Unfortunately I don’t think it is so attractive to join United as there is a long line of CBs who need matches, like Bailly andTuanzebe.

 

[He'sRaldo]

And as a big Lindelof hater/critisizer , do you think he any good qualities at all or the good results are just luck?

I don't think I'm a hater as that's a strong word. I have praised him in the past, and there have been points during the season where I have been convinced that he could be a starter if he keeps improving.

But regardless, he has a lot of good qualities. To give a few examples, his ball control, passing between the lines, anticipation, concentration are usually good. The issue is his passivity is his main most outstanding attribute, and none of the other qualities are good enough to offset it, especially when you can see it affecting the whole team.

Can tell you I’m a fan of the whole club not just Lindelof.

Absolutely man, you and me both. I didn't mean it in a negative way.

 

[ivaldo]

Lindelöf is a victim of his first impression. The Lindelöf we have now does not deserve the diatribe against him.

Is he world class? No.

Is he a weak point? No.

Can we realistically upgrade his current ability this window? No.

This.

 

[He'sRaldo]

If you read my posts you can see that I think he needs to work on his aggressive side.

I'm of the opinion that usually first team starters at Man Utd need to be able to have a very dominant attribute that helps them dominate the opposition.

For instance Maguire has prescence, strength and heading, AWB has inhuman tackling, Pogba has a lot of things, Rashford has insane speed, Martial has superb dribbling and physicality, Greenwood has clinical finishing, etc. These attributes help the players to simply be better than their opponents for most matches.

The issue with Lindelof is he's a first teamer and I don't really see him having any such attribute. He has a lot of good ones, but nothing really outstanding. And that wouldn't be so bad, but then he has what I would consider one of the main weaknesses in a CB which is meekness. That's why I can't be sure of him as a first teamer; as a bench option he'd be very good though.

 

[A-man]

I don't think I'm a hater as that's a strong word. I have praised him in the past, and there have been points during the season where I have been convinced that he could be a starter if he keeps improving.

But regardless, he has a lot of good qualities. To give a few examples, his ball control, passing between the lines, anticipation, concentration are usually good. The issue is his passivity is his main most outstanding attribute, and none of the other qualities are good enough to offset it, especially when you can see it affecting the whole team.


Absolutely man, you and me both. I didn't mean it in a negative way.

My apologies, and think I agree with most of what you wrote except I believe he has qualities that are enough. I have 3-4 favourites in the squad and Lindelof is one of them. Highly likely I am a bit biased but I truly believe that he and Maguire can improve more and more to become what United need. Looked promising at the second half of the season.

edit: as someone wrote recently, they work good as a unit. When one consider skills this is often overseen; cooperation and working as a unit. Both in defence and possession.

 

[romufc]

I'm of the opinion that usually first team starters at Man Utd need to be able to have a very dominant attribute that helps them dominate the opposition.

For instance Maguire has prescence, strength and heading, AWB has inhuman tackling, Pogba has a lot of things, Rashford has insane speed, Martial has superb dribbling and physicality, Greenwood has clinical finishing, etc. These attributes help the players to simply be better than their opponents for most matches.

The issue with Lindelof is he's a first teamer and I don't really see him having any such attribute. He has a lot of good ones, but nothing really outstanding. And that wouldn't be so bad, but then he has what I would consider one of the main weaknesses in a CB which is meekness. That's why I can't be sure of him as a first teamer; as a bench option he'd be very good though.

That's a load of crap.

James brings insane pace, shall we start him?
Pogba has alot of things like?

Lindelof is calm. isnt that a trait? Or are we going to ignore it because it doesnt help with the narrative?

Not long ago, some fans on here were saying Martial isnt a No.9 because he isnt aggressive or he doesn't show it.

 

[georgipep]

I'm of the opinion that usually first team starters at Man Utd need to be able to have a very dominant attribute that helps them dominate the opposition.

For instance Maguire has prescence, strength and heading, AWB has inhuman tackling, Pogba has a lot of things, Rashford has insane speed, Martial has superb dribbling and physicality, Greenwood has clinical finishing, etc. These attributes help the players to simply be better than their opponents for most matches.

The issue with Lindelof is he's a first teamer and I don't really see him having any such attribute. He has a lot of good ones, but nothing really outstanding. And that wouldn't be so bad, but then he has what I would consider one of the main weaknesses in a CB which is meekness. That's why I can't be sure of him as a first teamer; as a bench option he'd be very good though.

Are you assembling a team of superheroes or a team to win football matches? What exactly is Wijnaldum's and Henderson's dominant attribute? or Firmino's?

 

[Ekeke]

Do they?

Let me just give you a few stats to compare Joe Gomez V Our CB's

Gomes. . Maguire .Lindelof
Duels Won % 56.3 65.2 63.4
Ariel duels % 58.8 71.3 65.8
Recoveries 151 237 215
Tackles won % 70 62.2 52
Interceptions 38 72 26


Those stats show you Harry Maguire has been an absolute beast for us.

Can you point out where Lindelof has made mistakes and costed us points this season?

Yes, he isn't the strongest or quickest but he has done a good job in our defence. We will be a better team with a better defender but fans like you who keep criticising Lindelof every game, without real reason.

Yes. Yes they do make more tackles than Lindelof and Gomez (Thats with a Z not S) averaged the same number as Maguire, 1 per 90 minutes but as you just showed Gomez had a better success rate than Maguire.

You are literally comparing the overall numbers of recoveries and interceptions between Lindelof who started 35 matches, Maguire who started 38 matches and Gomez who started 22 matches. They are closer to double than the same amount. Gomes played 2000 mins this season, with Lindelof playing 3124 and Maguire playing 3450. No shit the total number of recoveries - which is literally just picking up the ball when nobody has it, so it isnt defending, and interceptions are going to be higher for players who played over 50% more matches. Thats how it works.

Gomez is a 23 year old CB that is better than 26 year old Lindelof 3 years his senior.

So because the other team didnt finish chances, he didnt make a mistake?

You are a fan of a player not a fan of a club. You start with the belief "Lindelof is a fantastic CB" and then you work your way backwards from there, creating misleading stats that omit the truth to pretend that its a fair comparison. Pathetic

 

[Robbie Boy]

I like Lindelof, but for some reason he gets a hard time on here.

 

[romufc]

Yes. Yes they do make more tackles than Lindelof and Gomez (Thats with a Z not S) averaged the same number as Maguire, 1 per 90 minutes but as you just showed Gomez had a better success rate than Maguire.

You are literally comparing the overall numbers of recoveries and interceptions between Lindelof who started 35 matches, Maguire who started 38 matches and Gomez who started 22 matches. They are closer to double than the same amount. Gomes played 2000 mins this season, with Lindelof playing 3124 and Maguire playing 3450. No shit the total number of recoveries - which is literally just picking up the ball when nobody has it, so it isnt defending, and interceptions are going to be higher for players who played over 50% more matches. Thats how it works.

Gomez is a 23 year old CB that is better than 26 year old Lindelof 3 years his senior.

So because the other team didnt finish chances, he didnt make a mistake?

You are a fan of a player not a fan of a club. You start with the belief "Lindelof is a fantastic CB" and then you work your way backwards from there, creating misleading stats that omit the truth to pretend that its a fair comparison. Pathetic

The % are based on games played. So how is he better than who we have?

So, again I will ask where are the mistakes Lindelof has made? I can pick Gomez and VVD mistakes as well, but as we all know every player makes mistakes.

Your beloved Smalling keeps conceding penalties, 5 this season.

No, I start with a belied of supporting the team, not isolating a player and hating him. That is pathetic. Agendas against your own players.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Are you assembling a team of superheroes or a team to win football matches? What exactly is Wijnaldum's and Henderson's dominant attribute? or Firmino's?

Wijnaldum and Henderson have insane stamina and physicality which allows them to cover a lot of ground. Wijnaldum also has very good press resistance and doesn't get dispossessed often.

And besides, unless we have a manager like Klopp, we shouldn't be looking to start average players consistently. We don't have Klopp.

 

[He'sRaldo]

That's a load of crap.

James brings insane pace, shall we start him?
Pogba has alot of things like?

Lindelof is calm. isnt that a trait? Or are we going to ignore it because it doesnt help with the narrative?

Not long ago, some fans on here were saying Martial isnt a No.9 because he isnt aggressive or he doesn't show it.

James does have a standout attribute that allows him to be in the squad as a squad player. However, his overall game isn't at the level yet. But he does have that attribute that brought him to Utd in the first place, as without his pace he would be nowhere near.

I remember an interview where Ole himself said he tries to take advantage of the players' special attributes, and tells the players to showcase what attribute it is that brought them to Utd. He even said it himself that his own standout attribute was his finishing.

You don't have to disagree with that premise just to defend a favourite player. It's one thing to defend the player with normal arguments, and another to condescendingly disagree with anything disconsenting. The latter is tiring.

 

[Deleted 112447]

I like Lindelof, but for some reason he gets a hard time on here.

The Lindelof hate and Smalling admiration i see from some, is some of the most surreal stuff. Amazing how different football can be interpreted by different people.