US Politics
- Thread starter Nick 0208 Ldn
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https://forward.com/news/686797/heritage-foundation-wikipedia-antisemitism/
The scumbags at the Heritage Foundation want to doxx Wikipedia editors whom it considers to be “antisemites”.
The scumbags at the Heritage Foundation want to doxx Wikipedia editors whom it considers to be “antisemites”.
The median salary for H1B visa holders is around 130K. Those low-paid indentured servants!
They say even a broken clock is right twice a day. Well done for not even being a broken clock.
What Bernie is missing is that tech needs skilled coders that aren't always readily available in the US, as they are in places like India, which receives 75% of H-1Bs. If someone running a startup in Dallas could recruit all their talent locally, they logically would, if for no other reason than it would be logistically practical.
Companies can hold those visas over a worker's head, making them basically well-paid indentured servants. If they really cared about Americans, they would make it cheaper for Americans to go to school and get the skills those companies need.
The foreign workers don't have to stay in the US though, correct ? If they don't like the work they're doing, they always have the option of returning to India or elsewhere. The latter sentence is something we know isn't going to happen since the cost of education isn't going down anytime soon.
These workers are probably supporting their families, sending money home. It's not easy just to say "screw it, I'm going home" and the companies know that.
Noted, but at the end of the day its still a choice. The US based companies aren't obliged to employ them because life is hard back home. Its an at-will transactional relationship that benefits both parties for as long as both sides deem it convenient.
Isn't the argument that this lopsided arrangement has consequences for the rest of the work force?
From my perspective most American workers benefit from having these coworkers but they don't exist in a vacuum.
That's not really true at all. Coders and many workers do not need to go into an office and can work remotely. Logically, someone starting a startup in Dallas would recruit talent nationally to find the best mix of employees not just locally. The only employers that want to recruit only recruit locally are outdated dinosaurs that are typically control freaks that want to force people to commute to an office when it's unnecessary.
I think the amount of H1Bs being issued is the bigger question. If there was a rule that said a US based company must interview a couple of Americans for a specific job before going the H1b route, then most would feel it justified if there were truly no available American candidates.
They could work remotely if a company had a telework policy that supports it, but some may not and instead prefer all their employees be in office a majority of the time.
The only employers that "prefer all their employees be in the office" are outdated dinosaurs that are typically control freaks or worse. There is no valid reason to force employees to commute to an office when its unnecessary. Remote work should absolutely be the standard across any job that does their work on a computer.
That's a different issue. The bottom line is employers have the right to set their own policies relative to their needs. I agree that telework is far more convenient, but it does have its limits and employers are within their rights to set whichever office v telework policy that suits them.
I came to the US on a H1B visa originally, part of the criteria for it being granted is that my company had to prove that the skills I had could not be fulfilled by an American, in my case that was true, the work involved was bespoke technolgy that had been originally developed in the UK
It has nothing to do with their rights and everything to do with their motivations. Of course they can legally set that rule but the reality most employers that do so are control freaks or worse and generally shite employers.
Out of curiosity, was there a path for you to convert your H1b status into permanent residency and eventually citizenship ?
Directly from the H1B - hard to know for sure, it would have been renewed because the reasons for granting it were still valid at the time, however before that happened I got married to an American and I applied for permanent residency, which I eventually got, I could apply for citizenship now but I haven't done so as of yet, it's an expensive process and financially might not be worth it TBH
Was curious about the cost and Google is saying it's 760 dollars for the application fee? Are there other hidden costs?
Yes there are other costs, you have to pay USCIS costs for background checks and such like, from what I've read it can cost as much as $2K - it depends on individual circumstances, TBH it's a huge hassle (maybe it should be) + when I applied to get my Green Card that cost over 1K + the time off work to go to the USCIS offices for multiple interviews, finger printing and stuff I've forgotten about
I'm an Indian in the US on a H1B Visa. My wait time would be over 130 years for a Green Card if I didn't explore more realistic options... The system is taking advantage of us the same way certain companies take advantage of it. @Raoul @Red in STL @2mufc0
It is a total nonsense point. Most people in H1Bs are in very good money, and those in tech are in top 5 if not top 1% salaries. Servants the lot of them!
If nothing else, the US should increase H1Bs while reducing illegal immigration.
you changed the quote from lower paid to low-paid which makes it a completely different point
It is a nonsense point in any case.
People in H1B, especially those in tech which I am highly familiar with, are in really high salaries. In FAANG, which is most of tech people in H1B, they are in several hundred thousand of dollars annual salaries. This is not companies taking advantage of people, and them being servants, it is simply not being enough good developers in the US, so companies have to sponsor H1Bs, wait until people get them, and then paying them high salaries.
There are lots of things that might need be fixing in the US, but this is not one of them. At least not in the way that right wingers and left wingers say (essentially stop them), but maybe by increasing them for certain countries (India), increase the 3 month find a new job or leave if getting layoff etc.
Your best bet is to marry an American
I wasn't taken advantage of, in fact quite the reverse in my case, my wife-to-be worked for the same company and we met whilst I was on work trips
The company I work for is a multi-national that has staff in virtually every country going, inter-office transfers used to be very common (less so these days) and I asked for a transfer, it suited their needs so they OK'd it and sorted it all out, it would have cost them at least $10-15K but they value their employees, salaries are in the middle, so are benefits, but they are flexible and generally accomodating, this is reflected by the fact that the nunbers of people who have worked there for more than 20 years is staggering
if they aren't taking advantage why are they paying them less than the median salary on average?
First, are they?
Second, it would be interesting to see what is their level/seniority? Are people under the same level/seniority getting paid less if in H1B?
Third, people who are in H1Bs are just starting their jobs (in a few years you would love to green card / permanent residency), so of course you are getting paid less than people who are longer in the company, it is how seniority works.
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so you don't actually know? Are you still sure the point is nonsense?
Most H1bs are now from india/ china and stay in the status for decades as we don't get green cards.. there are people making more than a million on h1bs at tech companies
Regarding status that is not correct, a H1B visa is valid for 3 years and can be extended once for another 3 years, to remain the process to gain permanent residency has to have started, otherwise you have to leave and cannot return for at least 1 year before applyinbg again
I wasn't paid less, in fact I was likely paid more because my skill level was better even though I was offically the same level/seniority
Interesting ethics question.
Say I’m not a multibillion dollar tech company but one of the smaller ones.
I can’t afford US tech talent at US average salaries, to hire the number I need the company to succeed. But I can hire H1B workers while simultaneously quadrupling or quintupling (if not a lot more) what they would have been earning - is that so wrong - long as I don’t hang their visas over their head etc. seems like a win win ?
Say I’m not a multibillion dollar tech company but one of the smaller ones.
I can’t afford US tech talent at US average salaries, to hire the number I need the company to succeed. But I can hire H1B workers while simultaneously quadrupling or quintupling (if not a lot more) what they would have been earning - is that so wrong - long as I don’t hang their visas over their head etc. seems like a win win ?
I think the system needs to improve, to make it easier to convert H1Bs to permanent residence, and I find the quotas for different countries a bit weird. But the point of tech workers in h1Bs being underpaid and modern servants is just populism nonsense.
You can change jobs while in h1b, so they cannot hang the visas over your had.
H1B is very similar to skilled worker visa in the UK (which is what I am on). And I could be a lot of things, underpaid is not one of them. Same for everyone of dozens of people I know who are on H1B (in one case getting paid over a million per year).
Yeah, I do not know a single case of someone being paid less cause they are on H1B.
Its just pathetic how Dems are so latched onto decorum and civility. Trump has been invited to the Carter funeral despite the countless disparaging remarks he made towards Carter.
They are complete doormats. For the next presidential election they need someone that can go gloves off instead of this impotence they are showing recently. "When they go low, we go high" will not cut it.
yes, obviously it's wrong to exploit workers