UK General Election - 12th December 2019 | Con 365, Lab 203, LD 11, SNP 48, Other 23 - Tory Majority of 80

How do you intend to vote in the 2019 General Election if eligible?

  • Brexit Party

    Votes: 30 4.3%

  • Conservatives

    Votes: 73 10.6%

  • DUP

    Votes: 5 0.7%

  • Green

    Votes: 23 3.3%

  • Labour

    Votes: 355 51.4%

  • Liberal Democrats

    Votes: 58 8.4%

  • Plaid Cymru

    Votes: 3 0.4%

  • Sinn Fein

    Votes: 9 1.3%

  • SNP

    Votes: 19 2.8%

  • UKIP

    Votes: 6 0.9%

  • Independent

    Votes: 1 0.1%

  • Other (BNP, Change UK, UUP and anyone else that I have forgotten)

    Votes: 10 1.4%

  • Not voting

    Votes: 57 8.3%

  • Undecided

    Votes: 41 5.9%
  • Total voters
    690
  • Poll closed .
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Shamwow said:
I predicted that your "I'm just trying to understand guys" post would be followed up by something like this.
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Step 1 - hide your agenda
Step 2 - make seemingly harmless opening statement
Step 3 - reveal agenda
Step 4 - ....
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Step 1 - hide your agenda
Step 2 - make seemingly harmless opening statement
Step 3 - reveal agenda
Step 4 - ....
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Step 4 is complain that all the evil marxists are calling you a Nazi which couldn't be further from the truth because you know reasons.
 
villain said:
It's great that these people in your personal anecdotal stories have 'found a way' of surviving the ever-growing poverty in this country.
However the statistics are there for a reason, over 50% of the homeless actually have a job, and over 6 million people employed are classified as living in poverty.
Your friends not being a part of that doesn't make these statistics go away, and it illustrates a very clear disconnect of the problem facing the poorest in society.

Even if 'you are a good reliable worker' and you can get a job as a labourer, or in a coffee shop - someone is still going to have to be a security guard, or a mcdonalds worker, or a street cleaner and do all these shitty jobs that nobody else wants to because they pay so poorly.
That doesn't mean they deserve to be homeless, nor should their character be an indicator of exactly how much they should earn.
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Its a question of micro vs macro. A single person might be able to change their circumstances for the better, but the system is such that not everyone can. Which is why even though anecdotes can be useful to ilustrate a point, they arent helpful when it comes to considering national policy.
 
berbatrick said:
@Fiskey I remember some years back that you quit Labour because of Corbyn. Was it because of his policies or his racism?
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I was a Lib Dem member, never a Labour member, although I felt I could've supported Labour under Blair/David Milliband. I think Corbyn's heart is probably broadly in the right place, just that he's not a strong enough candidate to lead (intelligence, charisma etc.). I also think that some of the current Labour parties economic policies (and instinct beyond policy) would be disastrous for the country.
 
villain said:
It's great that these people in your personal anecdotal stories have 'found a way' of surviving the ever-growing poverty in this country.
However the statistics are there for a reason, over 50% of the homeless actually have a job, and over 6 million people employed are classified as living in poverty.
Your friends not being a part of that doesn't make these statistics go away, and it illustrates a very clear disconnect of the problem facing the poorest in society.

Even if 'you are a good reliable worker' and you can get a job as a labourer, or in a coffee shop - someone is still going to have to be a security guard, or a mcdonalds worker, or a street cleaner and do all these shitty jobs that nobody else wants to because they pay so poorly.
That doesn't mean they deserve to be homeless, nor should their character be an indicator of exactly how much they should earn.
Click to expand...

I agree with you, and this is surely a reason for the minimum wage to be quite aggressively increased, which all the parties are promising. The government also need to get to grips with the gig economy, to make sure those workers are getting the minimum wage.
 
fergieisold said:
why the constant focus on protecting perpetrators of bullshit behaviour? I doubt them having a poor upbringing provides much comfort to the neighbours who’s lives have been made shite.

They might have had a poor upbringing, it’s a shame. They’re still knobs though.
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Sure, they're knobs, that doesn't mean government policy shouldn't actively look to find out why they're behaving that way.
 
Fiskey said:
I was a Lib Dem member, never a Labour member, although I felt I could've supported Labour under Blair/David Milliband. I think Corbyn's heart is probably broadly in the right place, just that he's not a strong enough candidate to lead (intelligence, charisma etc.). I also think that some of the current Labour parties economic policies (and instinct beyond policy) would be disastrous for the country.
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Oh, then I have you mixed up with someone else I think.
 
Cheesy said:
Sure, they're knobs, that doesn't mean government policy shouldn't actively look to find out why they're behaving that way.
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Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime.
 
villain said:
It's great that these people in your personal anecdotal stories have 'found a way' of surviving the ever-growing poverty in this country.
However the statistics are there for a reason, over 50% of the homeless actually have a job, and over 6 million people employed are classified as living in poverty.
Your friends not being a part of that doesn't make these statistics go away, and it illustrates a very clear disconnect of the problem facing the poorest in society.

Even if 'you are a good reliable worker' and you can get a job as a labourer, or in a coffee shop - someone is still going to have to be a security guard, or a mcdonalds worker, or a street cleaner and do all these shitty jobs that nobody else wants to because they pay so poorly.
That doesn't mean they deserve to be homeless, nor should their character be an indicator of exactly how much they should earn.
Click to expand...

The guy in the video is just as anecdotal as my friends' situations.
 
Sassy Colin said:
The guy in the video is just as anecdotal as my friends' situations.
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Maybe embrace the debate and address his point about statistics instead of trying to win with smart arse quips?
 
Fiskey said:
I agree with you, and this is surely a reason for the minimum wage to be quite aggressively increased, which all the parties are promising. The government also need to get to grips with the gig economy, to make sure those workers are getting the minimum wage.
Click to expand...

I'll await costed manifestos before I believe all parties are serious about increasing minimum wage, but yes I agree with you otherwise.

Sassy Colin said:
The guy in the video is just as anecdotal as my friends' situations.
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What part of "55% of homeless people have a job & 6 million employed live in poverty" don't you understand?
Your 2 friends & that guy in the video are representative of less than 0%
 
I really don't want to watch this, blood already boiling in anticipation :lol:
 
Sassy Colin said:
My labourer friend can earn good money for months at a time, but then be out of work for month, but he saves for the inevitable dead periods. He hates living in a room, but it's still better than a hostel.

I have another friend who works in a well know coffee shop chain, but his problem was more than he had to work early shifts on a Sunday which did not suit him, but seems to have worked things out now and doesn't have to do it anymore. Again, he has respectable accommodation and is looking forward to his family coming over from Slovakia to see him.

I think that if you are a good reliable worker, your hours are likely to be regular almost like a full time job. It's not an ideal situation, but the coffee shop guy is the sort who will find himself in a permanent position sooner or later.
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He's clearly said himself he isn't a reliable worker. He's said he's tired from living on the streets. He's said he has mental health problems.
sammsky1 said:
Debate started

What’s wrong with Corbyn’s right eye?
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Dunno!!
 
Why are Tories saying Jeremy has to choose a side? He doesn't need to. He just needs to get the best situation lined up from both sides and deliver the 2nd referendum.
 
This ‘7 years of negotiation’ line by Corbyn is a good line of attack. Will make neutrals very wary.
 
Why does it matter whether Corbyn will campaign for Leave or Remain?
 
villain said:
Why does it matter whether Corbyn will campaign for Leave or Remain?
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Presumably for strong remainers who don't want to vote for Labour only for them to publicly back their leave deal in the ref. McCluskey would clearly push for it.
 
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