That's just a bandage then and exactly the problem we were having. Hope we take our time and understand what the issue is. Fix the root and not the branch.
Turning on Rangnick
- Thread starter horsechoker
- Start date
"severely undertrained group"? What?
We have decided to stick with depressing instead.
This is true mostly.
It is just amusing to see some people shits on previous managers then proceed to say things like I trust this guy to fix this and that etc. How do you even trust this guy? Based on nothing at all. And with his failed MLS coaches helping his 'genius' ideas implemented.
For a start, his formation seems ill suited to the squad and seemed outdated itself with the way we play it.
Oh can’t imagine Ronaldo jumping from the ship but expected though.
Plus the fact Ole built this squad. Contact extensions and big money signings. He had countless opportunity to sort the midfield yet kept signing attackers and defenders.
I mean yes Ralf is up against it and the players clearly aren’t performing but there are some very basic things to try and strengthen the team that he’s not doing. Try a three man midfield? Freshen the team up with some younger legs? He just seems as clueless as Ole sadly
He's talked a great game but we have seen 20 minutes against Palace. Not near enough impact or bounce. A few games in or not, being bossed by Newcastle and Wolves at Old Trafford is not acceptable for any manager. Maybe he's not had enough training sessions with Covid, the subs he can decide though and lineup. Mason being subbed, Elanga coming on the end. Scott and Matic playing 90 minutes, Ralph hasn't been here long but decisions have to be looked at. Can't put blame for the mess of this team on Ralph, that said we need to see some change, even minor. These players are a disgrace but the manager has an influence, we owe Ralph nothing. He has to prove to everyone he can change things.
His position had become untenable. The results were just too bad and the atmosphere too toxic. Remember the hellhole this place had become. Things are not great right now but there is hope. Let's see how we react. We just need a bit of patience.
They might as well not be here now really. It’s a disgrace that we spend so much but we’ve to wheel out Matic again and again. A player who Chelsea happily binned off. He was meant tobe a short term signing under Jose to shore us up and here he still is. Drives me nuts. You’re putting a slow non aggressive engine into a team you want to win aggressively. It’s pure foolishness.
Ralf picks the squad. And neither McFred nor Bruno were as bad under Ole as they've been right now.
The problem is not with the manager. Players have too much power at the club.
Starting the ball rolling with the manager situation was the first part of the process. It would be absolutely toxic by now if he was still here.
The next phase was to look at the players, I don't think anybody would have ever said otherwise, but the problem now is that the spotlight is now fully on the players and it's far worse than we imagined. There's question marks over everyone for me, even players just signed. This is by far the darkest period since Fergie. At least once upon a time we had players that put in effort such as Herrera, Fellaini, Smalling, Young, Carrick etc. Not saying they were good but you hopefully get my point. Being left with massively overpaid 'superstars' that put in no effort and get outplayed AND outfought by average teams is as bad as it gets. What a mess.
We have a culture of entitlement and lack of graft, courage and pride. This is as far away from a Manchester United team as I can remember. I can't stand the fact half of these play for us.
You must be joking. Bruno has been poor for a long time and McFred were the crux of the problems for everyone on here. Let's not rewrite history.
If you want to use that argument, well Tuchel got his CL title, Arteta got FA cup and even Ole had 10 win streak with PSG elimination during the same period.
What's the point of implementing some new system for only 6 months like the next manager will use it? We all know that he won't, especially if we aim for Ten Haag. Ragnick's goal should be to steady the ship, to try to get top 4 in easiest possible way, and then to choose new manager whom he will support on all levels.
And you are blinded by your biased opinion.
Not worth discussing indeed.
Why not, when these players are brought to a similar level of coaching, their level clearly drops, and they are look just as hesitant and frustrating as the rest.
Of course there are variable, you are the one trying to compare us to City to validate your hyperbolic opinion that we have so little to no talent, that we can't even play like a functioning team and all of this is down to players.
Rashford is a winger, he has played there for most of his career, and that is a fact irrespective of your personal description of what a winger means. Same for Greenwood.
Not many, and if you think that is an example of good wing play then again that is your description of a winger, not the factual one.
They do it with co-ordinated play and creating space and working as a team, they don't rely on some fixed winger to do it. They do this regardless of who plays, so not really down to some mystical winger doing that.
We crossed the ball a few times, and we also worked the channels and got behind them a couple of times. The problem was not that and has not been that, the problem has been the slow tempo, lack of energy and the lack of chemistry and cohesion in the team. No matter who has played, that has been a constant.
More hyperbolic nonsense.
They are no more intelligent than our players, they are just better coached and are far more functioning as a team. Those same players look just as brainless as our players when they are not playing for their clubs. There are certainly managers out there who can sort them out, and we do not and should not need any replacements to play as a functioning team.
If you think that simply buying new players will magically solve all our problems then you are in for rude awakening. Not like we have not tried it before, every player that plays well at other teams just magically turns crap when they get here, wonder why that is ?
We have zero quality in midfield, no control at all, no link between the defence and attack...
This is not RR's fault...the midfield players at his disposal are absolutely crap.
That said the body language of the players is atrocious, so few of them giving max effort
This is not RR's fault...the midfield players at his disposal are absolutely crap.
That said the body language of the players is atrocious, so few of them giving max effort
This idea that Ole had laid foundations and we were only a player or two away from challenging was total nonsense. Lots of these players aren’t good enough, some passed their best and a lot of the ones that are talented enough lack the character and/or work rate to make it at the highest level.
Rangnick is probably trying to change too much, too quickly and a lot of these players look like they are either out the door ASAP or just waiting for the next manager.
It’s also clear the formation and tactics aren’t working and he needs to make changes and take responsibility for that but there is no quick fix here.
Rangnick is probably trying to change too much, too quickly and a lot of these players look like they are either out the door ASAP or just waiting for the next manager.
It’s also clear the formation and tactics aren’t working and he needs to make changes and take responsibility for that but there is no quick fix here.
Bruno scored a hat trick at the start of the season
whats a long time to you...six weeks?They've been just as bad if not worse under Ole at times.
Turning on a manager so soon is ridiculous. These players haven't taken responsibility on the pitch for a long time. No desire or leadership. We look like we're still 7/8 quality signings away from mounting a serious challenge.
Bruno scored a hat trick at the start of the season
He was poor at the end of last season too in terms of his general play and losing possession.
Yep. Just a deluded Ole inner with a poor memory.
100%. It was over.
Seriously - what the hell happened this year? Last season, we were a good to (mostly) very good team, which a lot of people already seem to have forgotten. This season, we started out as (mostly) middling to good, then nosedived to being an absolute accelerating trainwreck, beyond all notion of repair. Ole out, Carrick and then Rangnick in, which has taken us back to (mostly) middling to good. But no more than that - we're still a long way off what we were for most of last season, or after the January window of the season before that. And, we don't seem to be improving.
Something, somewhere, has broken and it is not obvious what it is. It's not Rangnick's system is bad or unclear (still less that he doesn't have one, as some already seem prepared to believe). It's not that Ole was incompetent (though half the board seem determined to believe so). It can't be that a bunch of players who were key performers not long ago have suddenly gone to shit in no time, and all at the same time.
Let’s have it right… other than 30 mins against Palace, it’s been absolutely crap.
I buy all the arguments about morale and attitude, but that doesn’t completely absolve the manager.
the shape looks terrible. I have never seen a United team give the ball up so easily….
Playing 2 mid 30s strikers with no legs…
A formation that no other top teams play…
odd substitutions like Mason today…
its very early days, but it’s fair to say that the early signs do not look good
I buy all the arguments about morale and attitude, but that doesn’t completely absolve the manager.
the shape looks terrible. I have never seen a United team give the ball up so easily….
Playing 2 mid 30s strikers with no legs…
A formation that no other top teams play…
odd substitutions like Mason today…
its very early days, but it’s fair to say that the early signs do not look good
I don't care about Ole. I'm just here to stop people like you from throwing players under the bus as you struggle to grasp what's going on.
the plastics are bubbling up from their toxic molten plastic lava. The post Ole out hunger pangs are starting up. Never change you utter fecking helmetsAnyone expecting him to come in and get this team to play amazing football with this group of players was always going to be disappointed.
Hopefully he can help us become more of a modern team in his 2 years as a consultant.
Hopefully he can help us become more of a modern team in his 2 years as a consultant.
You can't say "let's have it right" and then jump right on the hyperbole train. This has not been "absolute crap". Some of it's been good, some of it's been okay, some of it's been below par and a little bit of it has been absolute crap. Not impressive - but mediocre.
Anyone who want's this guy gone after just a few games is insane.
Some combination of the following reasons:
- Fans being back meaning more pressure on a mentally weak squad
- Ronaldo unbalances the team tactically and psychologically
- Euro hangovers for key players
- Entropy, Ole's vibes had run their course and we regressed to the mean.
- Ultimately, when things fall apart they do so slowly, and then quickly.
Or maybe we're overreacting to bad form now just as we were overreacting to big signings in the summer?
Same happened with Chelsea. At the end of Lampards time, people defending him said he didn't have the players to succeed. A few months under Tuchel and people said they'll push City all the way. Now, they've changed their minds again and City's team is way better apparently.
We are Top 10 ito players.
Ralf is another day late, pound short appointment after we missed out on Klopp and Tuchel.
I mean the point is those 30 minutes are exactly how he wants us to play. We can play like that, but for some reason we aren’t.
We now finally have a period of about 5 days of actual training. Something we haven’t had under him yet. Let’s give it a few more games before apportioning him more of the blame.
If you don't turn on Rangnick now, don't bother turning on him later. We've already made our decision and you're not welcome in our clubhouse. You're either with us or against us, you either sit down or stand up, you either punch or you get punched.
All possibilities. Your point 5 strikes a chord.
We haven't found his power switch yet?
Well, this season is a write off already and he’s only here until the end of the season. Interesting to see how it pans out. I can imagine how it will pan out but we’ll see.
The players aren't behind him because he's not their best mate like Solskjaer was, he's actually there to be a boss, give them orders, and make them work hard. Many of our mentality weak and stupid players can't handle it. They'll throw him under the bus and many of the fans will fall for it again.