Trump/Russia/SDNY investigation

The reason it's an interesting development for me is just how close they are getting to Trump. Not so much that it's a linear process of working up the line, just that by interviewing Sessions, they are beginning to show their cards to someone who will report straight back to Trump and his lawyers. Same goes for Kushner obviously.
 
The Kremlin troll factory did a impressive job a couple of nights ago spreading the #releasethememo news. Last time i saw something on that scale was during the election with the stuff about Wikileaks and the emails.
 
Tom Van Persie said:
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I wonder if Mueller hopes to bring obstruction of justice charges first in the hope it will lead to impeachment. It would make sense, despite his stature and experience, I bet he’s incredibly nervous about the evidence he’s sitting on and the implications that carries.
 
Sessions was questioned for hours? Bless the souls that had to listen to his fecking voice. I cant even stand 2 minute videos of him talking.
 
Pexbo said:
I wonder if Mueller hopes to bring obstruction of justice charges first in the hope it will lead to impeachment. It would make sense, despite his stature and experience, I bet he’s incredibly nervous about the evidence he’s sitting on and the implications that carries.
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How did this whole not letting Trump sit down for an interview or only give a short interview work? Cant Mueller interview him for how ever long he wants?
 
Anyone know if the Counsel can oblige Trump to do an in-person interview only?
 
RDCR07 said:
How did this whole not letting Trump sit down for an interview or only give a short interview work? Cant Mueller interview him for how ever long he wants?
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SteveJ said:
Anyone know if the Counsel can oblige Trump to do an in-person interview only?
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He’s the President, they can’t force him to do anything without the House and Senate backing with the threat of impeachment should he refuse.
 
Christ, what a ridiculous situation.
 
Looks like we're getting to the final stages of the obstruction of justice probe. Comey and Sessions have been interviewed and Mueller wants to speak to Trump about the firing of Comey & Flynn.
 
Pexbo said:
He’s the President, they can’t force him to do anything without the House and Senate backing with the threat of impeachment should he refuse.
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Crazy how America treat their President like a monarch. The fecker could literally shoot someone and the police still couldn't arrest him. But yeah, all men are created equal..
 
Kentonio said:
Crazy how America treat their President like a monarch. The fecker could literally shoot someone and the police still couldn't arrest him. But yeah, all men are created equal..
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I actually understand the thought process behind it. The President has to make any number of decisions over the course of their term and not every decision is morally binary. If they were liable for every difficult decision they made, they wouldn’t be able to efficiently do their job.

The trouble here is that Trump is abusing that power and he’s being facilitated by his own morally bankrupt party controlling both the house and senate. That’s something of a loophole in the constitution with regards to “how the constitution protects against a corrupt leader of the state”.
 
Pexbo said:
I actually understand the thought process behind it. The President has to make any number of decisions over the course of their term and not every decision is morally binary. If they were liable for every difficult decision they made, they wouldn’t be able to efficiently do their job.

The trouble here is that Trump is abusing that power and he’s being facilitated by his own morally bankrupt party controlling both the house and senate. That’s something of a loophole in the constitution with regards to “how the constitution protects against a corrupt leader of the state”.
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I think its a flawed setup that does nothing to seperate 'acts carried out as part of Presidential duties' from 'Anything the President does is protected'. It was also almost certainly never intended to be that way, as if I recall correctly Ulysses S. Grant was arrested for driving his carriage too fast and it wasn't considered that he should be above the law. The policeman took Grant to the police station and booked him for the offense.

Other countries also have no issues with this kind of thing, its just considered parliamentary privilege if it's something that is part of their duties.

Wiki said:
Parliamentary privilege is a legal immunity enjoyed by members of certain legislatures, in which legislators are granted protection against civil or criminal liability for actions done or statements made in the course of their legislative duties. It is common in countries whose constitutions are based on the Westminster system. A similar mechanism is known as parliamentary immunity.
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Raoul said:
Damn...how did I miss this one. Very interesting.

I'm guessing Mueller is going full steam ahead on obstruction of justice.
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The more I think about it the more I think what I said yesterday might be true. Mueller hopes to get an obstruction of justice charge against Trump with a view to getting him impeached. His reason: He's got a feck load of criminal charges to follow and it's best if they are brought on an impeached President rather than a sitting one.

Whereas Nixon cut a deal to step down and avoid impeachment, Mueller know's that won't be an option with Trump and that the Republicans are going to be very difficult to persuade to impeach him. If Mueller gives them two choices; to impeach him before the serious charges drop or to have the serious charges drop on a sitting Republican President, I think they will choose the former.
 
Raoul said:
Damn...how did I miss this one. Very interesting.

I'm guessing Mueller is going full steam ahead on obstruction of justice.
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I think that is provable already. In terms of motive, the most obvious reason for them to act like as they did is to cover up shady financial dealings with Russians and others that likely violated US law. That's going to be the pressure point that Mueller focuses on I'm sure.

The question of did they simply goad Russia to continue on with the efforts because it was in their best interests or did they organize a criminal conspiracy to help steal the election is much harder to answer and might not be something we'll ever know for sure. In the end it won't matter I hope because there's more than enough dirt as it is.
 
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Pexbo said:
The more I think about it the more I think what I said yesterday might be true. Mueller hopes to get an obstruction of justice charge against Trump with a view to getting him impeached. His reason: He's got a feck load of criminal charges to follow and it's best if they are brought on an impeached President rather than a sitting one.

Whereas Nixon cut a deal to step down and avoid impeachment, Mueller know's that won't be an option with Trump and that the Republicans are going to be very difficult to persuade to impeach him. If Mueller gives them two choices; to impeach him before the serious charges drop or to have the serious charges drop on a sitting Republican President, I think they will choose the former.
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Yep. I think Mueller is interviewing a lot of people in the administration from Sessions to Pompeo and others to see if he can prove "corrupt intent" - whether Trump's firing of Comey displayed a consistent behavioral pattern of him attempting to interfere with investigations that might adversely affect him.
 
shabadu84 said:
I think that is provable already. In terms of motive, the most obvious reason for them to act like as they did is to cover up shady financial dealings with Russians and others that likely violated US law. That's going to be the pressure point that Mueller focuses on I'm sure.

The question of did they simply goad Russia to continue on with the efforts because it was in their best efforts or did they organize a criminal conspiracy to help steal the election is much harder to answer and might not be something we'll ever know for sure. In the end it won't matter I hope because there's more than enough dirt as it is.
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I agree its provable now with Comey's testimony alone. But in Mueller's case, he will want to have a solid foundation of corroborating testimony to make this a slam dunk. The last piece of course will be getting Trump to testify under oath.
 
sun_tzu said:
Or trump just fires Mueller ?
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Think it will bring serious heat if he fires Mueller than if we agrees to sit down for an interview? He is also dumb enough to let something slip during the interview. So is he willing to take that chance?
 
Raoul said:
I thought Mueller would already have access to it. If not, then he definitely should.
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Does he have any subpoena powers over it or do they have privileges in the senate?
 
Pexbo said:
Does he have any subpoena powers over it or do they have privileges in the senate?
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I would imagine they have the ability to share information in certain situations. If the likes of Schiff or Warner find something relevant, I'm sure there's a mechanism to share it with Mueller.
 
This looks like its wrapping up and Mueller is setting the ultimate trap for Trump.

Testify under oath and tell the Truth = Obstruction of Justice

Testify under oath and lie = Perjury
 
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