Trump/Russia/SDNY investigation

sun_tzu said:
It does seem to be the convention though... Impeachment would seem the only real threat (depending how the mid terms go)
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I think Trump's main fear (and I think it's also the tactic of Mueller/SDNY/Avenatti) is that he will be impeached due to campaign violations or obstruction of justice before the Russia probe reaches it's conclusion.

At that point, he's a private citizen with no presidential pardon powers and the potential charges he faces are no small change either. Forgetting the shallow conspiracy charges that will relate to the Trump Tower meeting, it's what they will have on him before that. In huge debt to Russia with quid pro quo agreements in place, it'll be the equivalent of a murder charge compared to the manslaughter charge of "so we got offered some stuff and we said ok why not?". This is a long time in the planning and if he's nailed for it as a private citizen, he will be well and truly fecked. I'm not convinced that pardoning him at that stage would be a good move politically either as he'll essentially be proven to be a treasonous snake.
 
sun_tzu said:
He should quit now so trump can make Ivanka VP whilst he has the majority to get it approved
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Keep the presidency in the family in case he gets found out and gets locked up? She would definitely make a better job of being President than Trump.
 
Sultan said:
Some in the media should ask Mike Pence how he feels supporting the now openly accepted sins of Trump.
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Pretty sure Trump is still technically denying the affairs, while acknowledging that hush money was paid.
 
sun_tzu said:
It does seem to be the convention though... Impeachment would seem the only real threat (depending how the mid terms go)
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While I don't disagree that it may very well be legally correct, at this point it feels like the last hope of the damned. They've run out of everything else and it just all comes off more wishful than anything.
 
Raoul said:
They can get that from Pence as well.
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They Always could have. So why is it NOW its too far. When his comments and actions have been beneath the presidency for almost 2 years. I don't buy it.

On a side note why don't they try and get him out and get pence in. You would swear he was their wet dream of a president yet they are trying everything to not let trump lose office
 
Sultan said:
Some in the media should ask Mike Pence how he feels supporting the now openly accepted sins of Trump.
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You have to think what does Melania think of all this? The affair with Stormy Daniels happened a year after they got married.
 
Sigma said:
You have to think what does Melania think of all this? The affair with Stormy Daniels happened a year after they got married.
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The Stormy Daniels bit was just a one off quickie. Melania would be more concerned about Karen McDougal, who had a nearly year long affair with Trump while Melania was pregnant. In fact, he cheated on his cheat relationship with McDougal, by hooking up with Stormy Daniels.
 
I don't know if this goes here but it's connected with how yesterday's news was being sidetracked.

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Pexbo said:
I think Trump's main fear (and I think it's also the tactic of Mueller/SDNY/Avenatti) is that he will be impeached due to campaign violations or obstruction of justice before the Russia probe reaches it's conclusion.

At that point, he's a private citizen with no presidential pardon powers and the potential charges he faces are no small change either. Forgetting the shallow conspiracy charges that will relate to the Trump Tower meeting, it's what they will have on him before that. In huge debt to Russia with quid pro quo agreements in place, it'll be the equivalent of a murder charge compared to the manslaughter charge of "so we got offered some stuff and we said ok why not?". This is a long time in the planning and if he's nailed for it as a private citizen, he will be well and truly fecked. I'm not convinced that pardoning him at that stage would be a good move politically either as he'll essentially be proven to be a treasonous snake.
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A post-impeachment pardon from Pence (cf Ford, Nixon, Proclamation 4311) might be the only way to shut Trump up in those circumstances - he'll surely be the loosest of loose cannons if he thinks he's going to jail for ever.
 


If true, this is somewhat comforting to me. Knowing that finally lessons are being learned from the past and hopefully being used to ensure history cannot repeat itself.
 
There is a another thing that really tastes sour in my mouth. Presidential pardons and Trump promising to use them for people who stay loyal and keep their mouth shut.

How can the GOP look at this and think "this is fine, totally what it was intended for"? Doesn't this alone qualify as obstruction of justice because Trump is basically saying "don't corporate with the law, I just bail you out afterwards" there surely needs to be a check or a balance in place to prevent something like this?
 
Manafort juror reveals lone holdout prevented Mueller team from winning conviction on all counts

“Finding Mr. Manafort guilty was hard for me. I wanted him to be innocent, I really wanted him to be innocent, but he wasn’t,” Duncan said. “That’s the part of a juror, you have to have due diligence and deliberate and look at the evidence and come up with an informed and intelligent decision, which I did.”


“Every day when I drove, I had my Make America Great Again hat in the backseat,” said Duncan, who said she plans to vote for Trump again in 2020. “Just as a reminder.”
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Infra-red said:
A post-impeachment pardon from Pence (cf Ford, Nixon, Proclamation 4311) might be the only way to shut Trump up in those circumstances - he'll surely be the loosest of loose cannons if he thinks he's going to jail for ever.
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How Pelosi should approach the impeachment initiative - either we seek to impeach, or he resigns, with a guarantee of a pardon. If things are as black as they seem, he might go for it?
 
NoLogo said:
How can the GOP look at this and think "this is fine, totally what it was intended for"?
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Because he's been an incredible President for them so far. His achievement tally is rather impressive for just being 18 months in office.

- His "Tax Reform" not only made the richest even richer, it'll also create a real opening into axing social security/healthcare in few years, when the deficit becomes unbearable

- His SCOTUS picks will guarantee GOP right wing policies being the cornerstones of US politics for decades to come, regardless of who controls the WH and/or Congress.
Whatever fundamental legislation of the future is fancied by whomever, if the GOP opposes it, SCOTUS will be there to scuttle it. If he gets a 2nd term, which I think he will, there's a very good chance of him getting another pick to replace RBG.

- The unwinding of regulatory standards for the industry is making great progress, the EPA is eviscerated, Paris treaty commitments have been revoked.


Again, this is just his first 18 months. Imagine what could be accomplished in the remaining 6.5 yrs.
So, why in hell's name should the GOP not be fine? The only thing important is to get your agenda implemented. And he does just that. And if some help from Moscow was involved (and will be in future elections), so what?
Beats losing fair and square all the time...
 
2ndTouch said:
Because he's been an incredible President for them so far. His achievement tally is rather impressive for just being 18 months in office.

- His "Tax Reform" not only made the richest even richer, it'll also create a real opening into axing social security/healthcare in few years, when the deficit becomes unbearable

- His SCOTUS picks will guarantee GOP right wing policies being the cornerstones of US politics for decades to come, regardless of who controls the WH and/or Congress.
Whatever fundamental legislation of the future is fancied by whomever, if the GOP opposes it, SCOTUS will be there to scuttle it. If he gets a 2nd term, which I think he will, there's a very good chance of him getting another pick to replace RBG.

- The unwinding of regulatory standards for the industry is making great progress, the EPA is eviscerated, Paris treaty commitments have been revoked.


Again, this is just his first 18 months. Imagine what could be accomplished in the remaining 6.5 yrs.
So, why in hell's name should the GOP not be fine? The only thing important is to get your agenda implemented. And he does just that. And if some help from Moscow was involved (and will be in future elections), so what?
Beats losing fair and square all the time...
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Yeah I know I'm naive and still think politicians should have a spine. I'm stupidly idealistic this way but of course you are right concerning their agendas he has done well for them so far, if he now manages to make being gay illegal again they will probably not even oppose him being crowned god emperor.
 
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