Toni Kroos | Madridista

[Bojan11]

I disagree with every thing you said, the sight of City and Chelsea and Newcastle makes me weep, you haven't been supporting United that long obviously, Our club is built around British Elite with a few foreigners to keep it special and interesting, The day we have 1 or 2 british players in our first 11 is a very sad day for English football and i hope we dont allow it to happen, I look forward to see Jones,Wilson,Lawrence,Powell,Keane and Shaw if we get him in our first 11 in the future, Maybe I am old fashioned but Im only 22, I just support keeping British football err British!

Been supporting them longer than you.

Time moves on. British players are overpriced and most of them are not good enough. You not going to find players like class of 92 around. And if you do then three or four clubs will be after them.

Stop standing still and supporting this bandwagon that we should stick with average British players just for the sake of tradition. We hired Moyes because of traditional look where that got us. Apart from Shaw and Barkley there aren't many British players I'd want.

 

[Trizy]

What ever about landing him but doing it for 20m.. we could sell him again in 6 months for 40m easily.. not that'd I would want to of course.

 

[Shark]

The Independent and Metro are now reporting the supposed done deal.

 

[kouroux]

Even fb is at it with this news

 

[Raees]

 

[mufcwarm92]

Not combined with a tough tackler in a midfield 3.

---------Kroos

Fabregas-----Carvalho

This would work, Kroos able to do his thing at the point of the 3. Carvalho would sit allowing Fabregas to operate around the middle while providing defensive cover to any counter attacks. Van Gaal has used this combo before, with two inside forwards operating either side of RVP, we would be a force. Allow me to muppet out a bit and add Hummels as our new CB along with the expected deal for shaw. It's clear that Louis would add Robben too if possible. We'd end up with one hell of a team.

You'd imagine about 120-150mil would secure this given the players want to move. All depends on how much we actually have to spend though. Eh, we can dream though

Why force a system where we drop two of our best players? Mata needs to start and I wouldn't be surprised if, on the rare occasion everyone is fit, Rooney, Mata and RVP all start. Moyes might not have made it work, but they're good enough players to make it work.

 

[RedRover]

Been supporting them longer than you.

Time moves on. British players are overpriced and most of them are not good enough. You not going to find players like class of 92 around. And if you do then three or four clubs will be after them.

Stop standing still and supporting this bandwagon that we should stick with average British players just for the sake of tradition. We hired Moyes because of traditional look where that got us. Apart from Shaw and Barkley there aren't many British players I'd want.

Spot on. This "home grown basis" is just a myth that following the Class of '92 which was an unprecedented influx of quality players which hadn't happened before or since. If we didnt have those players coming through the club would have bought talent in - foreign or otherwise.

Football has changed - and you're right, most English players are overpriced and not good enough. Its fine bringing in talent from teh UK when you can, they will settle more quickly and are probably less of a risk - but they have to be of sufficient quality.

 

[Gambit]

Even Scholes says we should sign him.

 

[Bojan11]

Of course nationality matters - we're a British team that has always had a good spine of Brits in the squad and it should stay that way. We don't want to join that set of teams who have put out sides without a single English player in them.

But then your username is Bojan, so perhaps there's a bit too much of a FM mentality going on.

Plus, Young and Cleverley? You know Rooney's English, right?

Times have changed, so maybe you should change.

So we should for the sake of being British put out an average British team. We should go for the best possible team rather than worrying about passports.

I'd rather stick to our most important tradition and that is playing good attractive football.

Fact is the English players besides Rooney we have at the club are nowhere near as good as some of the people here make out to be. Otherwise they'd walk into the England team.

 

[Cassidy]

Been supporting them longer than you.

Time moves on. British players are overpriced and most of them are not good enough. You not going to find players like class of 92 around. And if you do then three or four clubs will be after them.

Stop standing still and supporting this bandwagon that we should stick with average British players just for the sake of tradition. We hired Moyes because of traditional look where that got us. Apart from Shaw and Barkley there aren't many British players I'd want.

This is the point exactly, I believe that being an English club we should be supporting the growth of English/British football, however not at the expense of quality.

What British players should be be signing?
We already seem to be spending an obscene amount of money to secure the services on an 18 year old British talent in Shaw.

Apart from Barkley I don't see any other British players who who we could buy to be honest, and Barkley I don't believe will leave Everton this summer (may be wrong about that), although if he does well in the world cup I fully expect an all out bidding war to break out for him between United, City & Chelsea

 

[Sassy Colin]

I'm afraid this was mentioned on Talkshite this morning, so the likelihood of it happening is fairly remote.

 

[PlayerOne]

@Anderson18 How old is that interview?

 

[reelworld]

I've read a few posts from our German poster saying that van Gaal doesn't fancy him when he was at Bayern. I fear that this could become a problem if he come. I hope van Gaal approved this transfer before

 

[Brightonian]

Times have changed, so maybe you should change.

So we should for the sake of being British put out an average British team. We should go for the best possible team rather than worrying about passports.

I'd rather stick to our most important tradition and that is playing good attractive football.

Fact is the English players besides Rooney we have at the club are nowhere near as good as some of the people here make out to be. Otherwise they'd walk into the England team.

That side I was criticising didn't even include Rooney. Or, for that matter, out record signing, Mata. Obviously I'm not saying we should put out an average side full of Brits. But that silly post had us buying Kroos, Fabregas, Robben, Hummels and Carvalho and leaving out half of our current best players. It's a Football Manager generation post and it's irritating.

 

[Anderson18]

@Anderson18 How old is that interview?

Today.

 

[Jaxa]

Been supporting them longer than you.

Time moves on. British players are overpriced and most of them are not good enough. You not going to find players like class of 92 around. And if you do then three or four clubs will be after them.

Stop standing still and supporting this bandwagon that we should stick with average British players just for the sake of tradition. We hired Moyes because of traditional look where that got us. Apart from Shaw and Barkley there aren't many British players I'd want.

Don't get me wrong, I agree British players are hideously overpriced and thats all our own doing but it's the same in Spain, Why pay 35m for a decent English player when you can get an even better one from South America for half that ?

But we need to give Academy more of a chance and promote our youngsters, not just stuff there positions with new players every season, promotion is key and when a talented british youngster such as Shaw comes along do everything we can to get them in our team, also Im not turning this into an argument by the way, just I fear that every team see's Man City's short success with foreign players and try's to replicate by doing the same, I am sure we wont and confident we have a manager who will give our youth a chance and keep our squad strong with a mixture of British and Foreign

 

[devilish]

The ball is in Bayern's court. They can easily increase Kroos salary and get him signed on long term. To be fair its easier said then done since that may trigger a series of events which would force Bayern to increase the salary of 4-5 key players. However that is how football works this day and you either pay up or else you risk losing players.

If Kroos does end up leaving Bayern then I think that with VG we've got a clear advantage on everyone. Kroos owes VG alot and he knows that he will not only be rated at United but will be paid for the WC player he is. VG will also be happy since he will get a player who already knows his system inside out.

 

[Bestie07]

My opinion on British players is simple. Try and promote from within, and if a player becomes available who will improve the first team then go all out for him, even if it meant paying over the odds like we did Rio and Rooney, failed with Bale and are trying to do with Shaw.

 

[PlayerOne]

Today.

Ah interesting, there seems be some change from Bayern.

 

[Cassidy]

The ball is in Bayern's court. They can easily increase Kroos salary and get him signed on long term. To be fair its easier said then done since that may trigger a series of events which would force Bayern to increase the salary of 4-5 key players. However that is how football works this day and you either pay up or else you risk losing players.

If Kroos does end up leaving Bayern then I think that with VG we've got a clear advantage on everyone. Kroos owes VG alot and he knows that he will not only be rated at United but will be paid for the WC player he is. VG will also be happy since he will get a player who already knows his system inside out.

Its quite clear Bayern will not pay him what he wants. They have already said so many times, So I think the ball is actually in Kroos's court tbh, will he take the offer they have already made him thats on the table or will he leave.

 

[Anderson18]

The ball is in Bayern's court. They can easily increase Kroos salary and get him signed on long term. To be fair its easier said then done since that may trigger a series of events which would force Bayern to increase the salary of 4-5 key players. However that is how football works this day and you either pay up or else you risk losing players.

If Kroos does end up leaving Bayern then I think that with VG we've got a clear advantage on everyone. Kroos owes VG alot and he knows that he will not only be rated at United but will be paid for the WC player he is. VG will also be happy since he will get a player who already knows his system inside out.

Their president just said in an interview that as of now, they won't increase his offer. Kroos hasn't played much under VG, so he doesn't owe him really anything. But I think that he'd like to continue to work with him.

 

[Brightonian]

Why force a system where we drop two of our best players? Mata needs to start and I wouldn't be surprised if, on the rare occasion everyone is fit, Rooney, Mata and RVP all start. Moyes might not have made it work, but they're good enough players to make it work.

Yep, for sure. It would be mad not to start our three best players, and van Gaal will certainly be able to find the best way for them to play together. He's built a career out of solving that sort of tactical problem.

 

[Randall Flagg]

Who cares about nationality? Ok take out two of those players and put Young and Cleverley. Happy?

At the moment we need to build a great starting 11 and not focus too much on nationality.

To be honest even as an Irishman I care about that.


Utd is losing its identity. And I dont really like it

 

[saivet]

I disagree with every thing you said, the sight of City and Chelsea and Newcastle makes me weep, you haven't been supporting United that long obviously, Our club is built around British Elite with a few foreigners to keep it special and interesting, The day we have 1 or 2 british players in our first 11 is a very sad day for English football and i hope we dont allow it to happen, I look forward to seeing Jones,Wilson,Lawrence,Powell,Keane and Shaw if we get him in our first 11 in the future, Maybe I am old fashioned but Im only 22, I just support keeping British football err British!

Agreed on this. Purchasing the best homegrown talents is something we should be about. We see that happening with Bayern and to a lesser extent with Madrid (Isco & Illra). It's not about signing any old British player ala, Young but those with great talent such as Shaw should be a priority IMO.

Like with City and Chelsea I hope players from the academy get a chance. Even though I'm not fan of theirs it is a shame to see both clubs have excellent youth set ups but rarely any of there players get a chance.

 

[devilish]

Don't get me wrong, I agree British players are hideously overpriced and thats all our own doing but it's the same in Spain, Why pay 35m for a decent English player when you can get an even better one from South America for half that ?

But we need to give Academy more of a chance and promote our youngsters, not just stuff there positions with new players every season, promotion is key and when a talented british youngster such as Shaw comes along do everything we can to get them in our team, also Im not turning this into an argument by the way, just I fear that every team see's Man City's short success with foreign players and try's to replicate by doing the same, I am sure we wont and confident we have a manager who will give our youth a chance and keep our squad strong with a mixture of British and Foreign

Spanish talent is overpriced but its nowhere near to British talent. I mean look at the prices. Herrera 30m, Martinez 35m, Diego Costa 32m. These are players who would easily walk in any side in the EPL. We've paid 27m for fecking Fellaini while Carroll costed Liverpool 35m

If you ask me, the trouble is that mid/small EPL sides are usually richer then their Spanish rivals + a substantial number of British managers have little idea of what talent there is available outside Britain. Hence clubs like Everton and Newcastle can afford to stick to their guns and show the big club the middle finger. Things are changing though. I doubt that VG will ever spend 27m on a big EPL proven midfielder with funny hair

 

[Trigg]

Surely this is a case of player using Man Utd's name to get some more cash in his next contract with his current one expiring?

 

[FlawlessThaw]

Agreed on this. Purchasing the best homegrown talents is something we should be about. We see that happening with Bayern and to a lesser extent with Madrid (Isco & Illra). It's not about signing any old British player ala, Young but those with great talent such as Shaw should be a priority IMO.

To be honest it is easier to purchase big home grown players if you are Bayern or Madrid. Bayern are by far the richest club in the country and are able to poach players from the 2nd best team (at the time) which is something we would struggle to do. Madrid only have to compete with Barca when it comes to the top wages as well. The clubs they are purchasing players from also don't have as much money as the equivalent clubs here. All Premier League clubs are expected to get a massive windfall with the tv deal, something the likes of Real Valladolid can only dream about.

I wouldn't like us to go down the route of not having British players but they have to be good enough to play for us or else we are left with players of the calibre of Ashley Young.

 

[devilish]

Their president just said in an interview that as of now, they won't increase his offer. Kroos hasn't played much under VG, so he doesn't owe him really anything. But I think that he'd like to continue to work with him.

I am not a Bundersliga expert however if I remember well, VG was the man who gave Kroos the debut.

 

[Ruht]

I was going to post the interview but seems like I've been beaten to it. The board is not willing to budge so it all comes down to Kroos and whether he is willing to accept the offer they've given him or play his trade elsewhere. I'm not going to go into the discussion of whether it's all about the money as it may be all sorts of things.

My opinion is, if he does not accept the offer that we should sell him. I'd much rather lose him now and get some money in return than lose him on a free. Not to mention we don't know just how much would he give when he knows he'd be gone in an years time. The board have known about his demands for a long time and I'm certain that they have scouted possible replacements and have players in mind already.

At the end of the day I reckon your chances of signing him are good, but things change incredibly fast so I'd wait for an official confirmation.

 

[Jacob]

Surely this is a case of player using Man Utd's name to get some more cash in his next contract with his current one expiring?

Nah, I think the LVG factor makes it a lot more likely.

 

[Bojan11]

Agreed on this. Purchasing the best homegrown talents is something we should be about. We see that happening with Bayern and to a lesser extent with Madrid (Isco & Illra). It's not about signing any old British player ala, Young but those with great talent such as Shaw should be a priority IMO.

Like with City and Chelsea I hope players from the academy get a chance. Even though I'm not fan of theirs it is a shame to see both clubs have excellent youth set ups but rarely any of there players get a chance.

Nobody can compete with Bayern in Germany. And there's only one team who can compete with Madrid in Spain. It is not the same situation. Plus the teams there like it has been pointed out are poorer compared to mid level premier league teams.

Over here if we want a good British player, we'd have to beat Chelsea, Arsenal, City, Liverpool and even Spurs. Bayern have no competition if they go for a German player.

 

[devilish]

Its quite clear Bayern will not pay him what he wants. They have already said so many times, So I think the ball is actually in Kroos's court tbh, will he take the offer they have already made him thats on the table or will he leave.

I still think its at Bayern's court TBH. They are risking of losing a quality player for cheap/free either this or next season. Its basically the Rooney thing all over again. The club can either pay up or else they risk losing the player.

If I was Bayern's owner Id make him sign the contract only to sell him for ridiculous money few months later. There again, this tactic doesn't always work.

 

[Jaxa]

Spanish talent is overpriced but its nowhere near to British talent. I mean look at the prices. Herrera 30m, Martinez 35m, Diego Costa 32m. These are players who would easily walk in any side in the EPL. We've paid 27m for fecking Fellaini while Carroll costed Liverpool 35m

If you ask me, the trouble is that mid/small EPL sides are usually richer then their Spanish rivals + a substantial number of British managers have little idea of what talent there is available outside Britain. Hence clubs like Everton and Newcastle can afford to stick to their guns and show the big club the middle finger. Things are changing though. I doubt that VG will ever spend 27m on a big EPL proven midfielder with funny hair

Unfortunately yes, Our league is the Wealthiest in the world i think, in terms of TV Money and Sponsors etc, I told my Spanish friend that even promoted teams earn around 60-70m for promotion into the league and he was speechless, he supports Deportivo La Coruna and yes if they for example had a special player in there squad they cant afford to turn down even 5-10m for players from Madrid,Barca etc where as English clubs can, obviously I don't think it's a bafd thing either, if there was 3 big clubs just pinching all the lower clubs best players for peanuts it would be a sorry sight,

That's what Bayern do, that team is so far ahead than every club below them financially, even there biggest Rivals Dortmund and it damages the league IMO

 

[RedDF]

I am not a Bundersliga expert however if I remember well, VG was the man who gave Kroos the debut.

That's true... Which makes it more likely he'd join

 

[saivet]

To be honest it is easier to purchase big home grown players if you are Bayern or Madrid. Bayern are by far the richest club in the country and are able to poach players from the 2nd best team (at the time) which is something we would struggle to do. Madrid only have to compete with Barca when it comes to the top wages as well. The clubs they are purchasing players from also don't have as much money as the equivalent clubs here. All Premier League clubs are expected to get a massive windfall with the tv deal, something the likes of Real Valladolid can only dream about.

I wouldn't like us to go down the route of not having British players but they have to be good enough to play for us or else we are left with players of the calibre of Ashley Young.

The structure is certainly different however I think we should try and pursue going for the top British talents. If we can't pull it off then so be it but seeing a squad full of purchased foreigners.

In England anyway the good talents that we have missed on haven't even gone to Chelsea or City, it's mainly been Arsenal. I may miss some names out but in recent times, the only British first team players they have bought have been Milner, Lescott, Rodwell and Cahill.

 

[Trigg]

Nah, I think the LVG factor makes it a lot more likely.

But these whispers started before van Gaal didn't they?

I dunno, I'm not sure there's anything in this one, seems he's after a contract that Bayern don't want to give and he's trying to twist their arm with talk of leaving.

 

[devilish]

To be honest it is easier to purchase big home grown players if you are Bayern or Madrid. Bayern are by far the richest club in the country and are able to poach players from the 2nd best team (at the time) which is something we would struggle to do. Madrid only have to compete with Barca when it comes to the top wages as well. The clubs they are purchasing players from also don't have as much money as the equivalent clubs here. All Premier League clubs are expected to get a massive windfall with the tv deal, something the likes of Real Valladolid can only dream about.

I wouldn't like us to go down the route of not having British players but they have to be good enough to play for us or else we are left with players of the calibre of Ashley Young.

If you ask me United should

a) produce their own British players. For example there's nothing stopping us from selling Hernandez in 1-2 seasons time and allow Wilson to take his place (especially if he goes on loan and does well). Ample effort should be spent in buying/getting the top British players within the 15-18 bracket. In that way we can mould them to continental football.

b) we only buy British proven players if they are truly special. Im referring to the likes of Luke Shaw and Wayne Rooney's level. The EPL proven thing is bollocks

c) Apart from that, we should spent the money abroad. Players are cheaper there, players tend to be more used to continental football and more emphasis is made on ball retention, control and technique then in Britain.

 

[Cassidy]

But these whispers started before van Gaal didn't they?

I dunno, I'm not sure there's anything in this one, seems he's after a contract that Bayern don't want to give and he's trying to twist their arm with talk of leaving.

The thing is what happens if Bayern do not budge?

 

[Cassidy]

If you ask me United should

a) produce their own British players. For example there's nothing stopping us from selling Hernandez in 1-2 seasons time and allow Wilson to take his place (especially if he goes on loan and does well).

b) we only buy British proven players if they are truly special. Im referring to the likes of Luke Shaw and Wayne Rooney's level. The EPL proven thing is bollocks

c) Apart from that, we should spent the money abroad.

I think this is what we have always done and will continue to do tbh.

 

[FlawlessThaw]

The structure is certainly different however I think we should try and pursue going for the top British talents. If we can't pull it off then so be it but seeing a squad full of purchased foreigners.

In England anyway the good talents that we have missed on haven't even gone to Chelsea or City, it's mainly been Arsenal. I may miss some names out but in recent times, the only British first team players they have bought have been Milner, Lescott, Rodwell and Cahill.

I think we should try and pursue top British talents as well but we shouldn't overspend on them for the sake of them being British. I also wouldn't use recent history as too much of an indicator as the squad rules make having British players even more of a valued commodity. Both Chelsea and City have spent a lot in purchasing young British players for their youth teams and that would be the route I would go under.