Toni Kroos | Madridista

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I don't know if Kroos will want to move here. It's not as if he'll have a better spell here than he will at Bayern, right now, anyways.

We may offer him more wages, but he's still competing at the top level with Bayern, is playing for a top club in Bayern Munich, is playing under Pep and, thus, under a different system and philosophy, came through Bayern Munich since his mid teens, and is playing in a more familiar environment in Germany. As long as things remain interesting for him, there (which won't be that hard), he won't really move, at this point, especially to Man. Utd. at a time when we're going through changes.

Nope, he's as unlikely as Sneijder and Ozil were, back then.
 
mazhar13 said:
I don't know if Kroos will want to move here. It's not as if he'll have a better spell here than he will at Bayern, right now, anyways.

We may offer him more wages, but he's still competing at the top level with Bayern, is playing for a top club in Bayern Munich, is playing under Pep and, thus, under a different system and philosophy, came through Bayern Munich since his mid teens, and is playing in a more familiar environment in Germany. As long as things remain interesting for him, there (which won't be that hard), he won't really move, at this point, especially to Man. Utd. at a time when we're going through changes.

Nope, he's as unlikely as Sneijder and Ozil were, back then.
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You're severely underestimating the effect of trebling someone's wages.

He may have had no intention of leaving and was using us to get a better deal at Bayern. If there is any truth in what we are prepared to pay then we suddenly become a very attractive realistic option.

He isn't going to get that sort of money at Bayern - so he can either move this year, or next and get a huge payday.

We also have a new manager coming in along with other top players, as well as being on one of the most marketable leagues in the world. He could be a star player for arguably the worlds most marketable club. I can see how that could be attractive to him.
 
For this to happen, so many seemingly unlikely scenarios have to occur:

1. Kroos has to be fed up with Bayern or at the very least money hungry enough to want to move. Ok so the wages are a lot lwoer than Rooneys but I doubt he's sleeping rough.
2. Kroos has to be ok with not playing Champions League next year. With there being no international tournament after next season ends it might be one fo the few times he could afford to move like this
3. Bayern have to feel that it makes sense to sell now rather than rundown his contract (or work on convincing him to stay). They've picked up some Dortmund stars on free contracts so maybe they wont mind losing out on money for Kroos if it means they have midfield coverage for the year, giving them time to sign a replacement if they need it.
4. United have to hope that none of the other big teams (with CL football to offer) take an interest in hijacking the move. If Kroos only wants to treble his wages then there's plenty of clubs who could do that.

I really hope united's enthusiasm for the deal has more substance than the Thiago incident last year.
 
bucky said:
Yeah, me too. I'd rather see some other creative midfielders sign for us.
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Do we not have plenty creative players right now? We need players that will help us control games. And Kroos should be able to do that.
 
RedStarUnited said:
Do we not have plenty creative players right now? We need players that will help us control games. And Kroos should be able to do that.
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I think so, yes. Creative midfielder was just the first term that came to my mind. There's still quite a lof of midfielders I'd rather sign and that's just down to personal preference.
 
RedStarUnited said:
Do we not have plenty creative players right now? We need players that will help us control games. And Kroos should be able to do that.
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This. I think we're well stocked in the creativity department (though maybe not always used to the best of their potential), if we could have a central midfield pairing that aren't in danger of getting overrun then it would mean our AMs could focus on attack.
 
GBBQ said:
This. I think we're well stocked in the creativity department (though maybe not always used to the best of their potential), if we could have a central midfield pairing that aren't in danger of getting overrun then it would mean our AMs could focus on attack.
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Agree with that to be fair.

Where we are lacking is controlling midfield and providing a shield for the back for. We have plenty of attacking talent and with a solid base behind they could let the handbrake off.
 
I think the issues in midfield are several fold and we will need at least a couple of players to sort it out. It's got to the stage where we have five or six central midfield options but none that are exceptional at anything.

Firstly, we often get overrun and lack any real leadership and physical dominance in there. We also lack a holder, someone with a bit of positional awareness to sit deep, break up play and move the ball forward. Thirdly we have no real central midfield creator, someone to quickly and efficiently spread the play, pick out through balls and control the game's tempo.

It's amazing that we've let the midfield get to this stage as it's so bad at the moment that it spills over onto other positions on the pitch. Our centre backs are often exposed and full backs' forward runs not covered due to our lack of a holder. Our wingers have to resort to hopeless long range crosses because we aren't releasing them quickly into space. Our forwards just aren't getting anywhere near enough chances and our attacking midfielders aren't seeing enough of the ball without having to drop very deep.

These aren't necessarily issues that each need an individual player, but I do feel that with a couple of top players, it could completely transform the side.

Kroos would be the perfect creator from deep - he can't tackle and isn't particularly mobile but is positionally aware and suits the modern deep lying playmaker role. His ability to control the tempo and pick a pass at any range is up there with the very best and would bring out the best from our attacking players. Kroos alone would be a bit of a disaster though - he's the sort who needs a strong tackler alongside him with the energy to cover him and give him the ball quickly - something we currently lack. Carvalho looks like a true holding player and combines the physical and tackling attributes with that simple but effective short range distribution. Better still, though Vidal might be unrealistic, someone in that mould would be perfect - essentially an all round box to box player who can run for days, is a good tackler, can move the ball quickly and makes forward runs himself. If Van Gaal wants a three man midfield, maybe three players are necessary - a holder, a creator and a box to boxer. Unlikely to find the requisite players in just a single window though.
 
Kroos is a tempo setter. That's somebody we've missed since Scholes in our midfield. Carrick has tried to be the main main, but let's be honest he can't seem to hack it against the very best out there.
 
RDCR07 said:
@Name Changed and @bucky What the hell are you guys talking about not wanting Kroos?
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I wanted Thiago last summer and if I had to choose from Bayern's squad this year , I'd rather see us sign Martinez. As I've already said, it's a matter of personal preference. Koke, Ander Herrera and Kovacic are others, I'd take over Kroos. We need more than one midfield signing anyway.
 
bucky said:
I wanted Thiago last summer and if I had to choose from Bayern's squad this year , I'd rather see us sign Martinez. As I've already said, it's a matter of personal preference. Koke, Ander Herrera and Kovacic are others, I'd take over Kroos. We need more than one midfield signing anyway.
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People tend to forget Kroos is only 24 and he can also still improve and become better. And Martinez isn't an option. They signed him for a lot of money and they aint letting him go. If I was to choose one player to sign I want us to sign Messi. It aint gonna happen. Kroos > Herrera easily. Koke and Kovacic have bags of potential but as of today Kroos is better than the both of them. And Koke already said he aint leaving AM or Spain. Inter are rebuilding and I doubt he wants to move. We can all dream but we have to be realistic with the options presented to us. Kroos is one of them and I would love it if we signed him.
 
RDCR07 said:
People tend to forget Kroos is only 24 and he can also still improve and become better. And Martinez isn't an option. They signed him for a lot of money and they aint letting him go. If I was to choose one player to sign I want us to sign Messi. It aint gonna happen. Kroos > Herrera easily. Koke and Kovacic have bags of potential but as of today Kroos is better than the both of them. And Koke already said he aint leaving AM or Spain. Inter are rebuilding and I doubt he wants to move. We can all dream but we have to be realistic with the options presented to us. Kroos is one of them and I would love it if we signed him.
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The reason I named those players is that I think Kroos is as realistic as they are. In my eyes he's just using us as leverage for his new contract. Furthermore I don't want us to pay 40m or more for someone, who has one year left on his contract. Kroos' agent has already come out and said that he is staying on until 2015, so if I'm as pragmatic as you've been, then my conclusion must be that he isn't coming.
 
RedStarUnited said:
Do we not have plenty creative players right now? We need players that will help us control games. And Kroos should be able to do that.
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Not at all. There's a huge difference between creative attacking midfielders like mata and kagawa, and then our deeper players. The proper midfielders, we have 3 slow, defensive midfielders pretty much and giggs being our only creative player, which is why he has occasionally put in our best midfield performances this season. We need a creative or more attack minded option in midfield. Kroos is more if the one to control games anyway, and he's not very mobile so I'm not sure if he'd suit is. Ideally we'd want to have a player who offers plenty of movement in midfield along with the ability on the ball, that's why I'm a bit hesitant with kroos. Rakitic or pjanic would be perfect for this role but neither are coming to united this summer or have even been linked. Gundogan as well but he recently renewed.
 
Red Dreams said:
would Kroos and Vidal be a good combination?
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Vidal would be a good combination with Gibson, he's just that sort of player. Short answer yes but I'd prefer Kroos in a midfield 3.
 
RDCR07 said:
People tend to forget Kroos is only 24 and he can also still improve and become better. And Martinez isn't an option. They signed him for a lot of money and they aint letting him go. If I was to choose one player to sign I want us to sign Messi. It aint gonna happen. Kroos > Herrera easily. Koke and Kovacic have bags of potential but as of today Kroos is better than the both of them. And Koke already said he aint leaving AM or Spain. Inter are rebuilding and I doubt he wants to move. We can all dream but we have to be realistic with the options presented to us. Kroos is one of them and I would love it if we signed him.
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Martinez is maybe even more realistic then kroos, he's a squad player at most for bayern under pep. Arsenal are rumoured to be going for him at £32million as well so it's not as unrealistic as you'd think after this season. Kroos is individually a better player yeah but the play style I think is what the other guy meant. Players who offer more movement, are more rounded players and quicker on the ball and offer a bit more penetration rather then controlling the game. It depends on how van gaal wants to play, I think kroos would be better for him but if it was a classic united team who wanted to play fast, counter attacking football, kroos wouldn't be suited to it at all.
 
AltiUn said:
Vidal would be a good combination with Gibson, he's just that sort of player. Short answer yes but I'd prefer Kroos in a midfield 3.
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with Mata infront it will be a great midfield 3.

Kroos-----Vidal
------Mata----

Dreamy indeed...
 
Red Dreams said:
would Kroos and Vidal be a good combination?
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We're keane and scholes a good partnership? Of course. They're similar players, and while kroos isn't as good, Vidal is better then Keane IMO, or around the same level. No chance we'll get both though.
 
Red Dreams said:
just going by recent speculation....looks like van Gaal wants Kroos and Vidal. the 3rd player being either Mata or Kagawa?
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Think it's more likely that Rooney is the #10 or third midfielder because he offers loads going both forward and defensively. As much as people dislike him for whatever reason on here, you can't deny that he's a very useful and complete player to play. It's more likely that mata and kagawa will be dropped then Rooney IMO, and that's not because of his status, it's because of Rooneys qualities.
 
bosnian_red said:
Think it's more likely that Rooney is the #10 or third midfielder because he offers loads going both forward and defensively. As much as people dislike him for whatever reason on here, you can't deny that he's a very useful and complete player to play. It's more likely that mata and kagawa will be dropped then Rooney IMO, and that's not because of his status, it's because of Rooneys qualities.
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...Rooney makes sense. but he does not want to be the player behind the forward...or van Persie. sure van Gaal will set him straight...;)
 
bosnian_red said:
Martinez is maybe even more realistic then kroos, he's a squad player at most for bayern under pep. Arsenal are rumoured to be going for him at £32million as well so it's not as unrealistic as you'd think after this season. Kroos is individually a better player yeah but the play style I think is what the other guy meant. Players who offer more movement, are more rounded players and quicker on the ball and offer a bit more penetration rather then controlling the game. It depends on how van gaal wants to play, I think kroos would be better for him but if it was a classic united team who wanted to play fast, counter attacking football, kroos wouldn't be suited to it at all.
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Even in an open market, i'd take Martinez over Kroos every single time.

Martinez and Vidal with any one of our attacking midfielders ahead of them would be the best midfield in the league and one of the best in Europe.

bosnian_red said:
We're keane and scholes a good partnership? Of course. They're similar players, and while kroos isn't as good, Vidal is better then Keane IMO, or around the same level. No chance we'll get both though.
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:eek:
 
Fortitude said:
Even in an open market, i'd take Martinez over Kroos every single time.

Martinez and Vidal with any one of our attacking midfielders ahead of them would be the best midfield in the league and one of the best in Europe.


:eek:
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Agreed.
And obviously that won't be a popular thing to say on here as it's a united forum, but Vidal is probably the most complete midfielder in the world, arguably the best one currently. Keane was world class but I would never rank him as that, don't expect many to agree, just personal opinion!
 
Roy's one of the best midfielders of his type of all-time. Not sure the same can be said of Vidal, yet.

He's very probably the best of his type in the world, but this isn't an era with any competition for him to take that title away, which is the stickler.

Just surprised to see Vidal being mentioned as someone like Keane's equal, really.
 
bosnian_red said:
Agreed.
And obviously that won't be a popular thing to say on here as it's a united forum, but Vidal is probably the most complete midfielder in the world, arguably the best one currently. Keane was world class but I would never rank him as that, don't expect many to agree, just personal opinion!
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?

Keane was easily the best in the world at his peak. Vidal scores more goals but then again he has more freedom to go bombing forward than Keane did.
 
Red Dreams said:
just going by recent speculation....looks like van Gaal wants Kroos and Vidal. the 3rd player being either Mata or Kagawa?
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The Vidal links are BS, they come from very unreliable sources. I have a feelings he wants Strootman.
 
Enigma_87 said:
with Mata infront it will be a great midfield 3.

Kroos-----Vidal
------Mata----

Dreamy indeed...
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Dreamy indeed man, but whats plan B if those two are injured, suspended, have a serious drop in form or that we have to make tactical substitutions during games?

Kroos & Vidal would just be mind-blowing, but we need a complete overhaul in CM. We only have Carrick & Fletch - Cleverley doesnt count, so thats our plan B.

We need a beast in CM like Carvalho to give us more options (for a defensive capacity, but the lad can play aswell) & i'd love us to sign "The Stroot" also. How sweet would our CM squad look then:

Kroos, Vidal, Strootman, Carvalho, Carrick & Fletch (if the latter two get back in the United groove)...

Folk who say "that'll never happen" - but why the hell not though? We've money to burn, so feckin spend it & we'll not have to worry about CM for atleast the next 5 years or more!
 
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