Toni Kroos | Madridista

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Summit said:
Nope. I remember how hard it was landing Hargreaves from them, and he openly came out and admitted he wanted the move on more than one occasion. This is a transfer I never see happening at all. He'll re-sign with Bayern IMO.
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Yeah, the Germans here have said it, too, Bayern are like us and they'll gladly and defiantly hold a player they want until the end of their contract rather than bow to player power of any kind.

The only way we could get Kroos is if Bayern want to sell, and they won't.
 
Fortitude said:
Yeah, the Germans here have said it, too, Bayern are like us and they'll gladly and defiantly hold a player they want until the end of their contract rather than bow to player power of any kind.

The only way we could get Kroos is if Bayern want to sell, and they won't.
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Why are all the midfielders we want playing for clubs like Bayern or Bilbao?! :mad:
 
Btw. I think you guys really misjudge his defensive contribution and I wouldn't be surprised if he looked as lost as Kagawa with the way United plays at the moment. He's still heavily criticised by most users on the Bayern forum I read. All the 'looks lazy, doesn't impose himself, doesn't score enough for an AM, is too slow and doesn't work enough for a CM' stuff. He's a lot about connecting things and being smart in a well working team and less about individually changing things. Playing him next to Carrick in a 2 man midfield really isn't his best role.
 
Balu said:
Btw. I think you guys really misjudge his defensive contribution and I wouldn't be surprised if he looked as lost as Kagawa with the way United plays at the moment. He's still heavily criticised by most users on the Bayern forum I read. All the 'looks lazy, doesn't impose himself, doesn't score enough for an AM, is too slow and doesn't work enough for a CM' stuff. He's a lot about connecting things and being smart in a well working team and less about individually changing things. Playing him next to Carrick in a 2 man midfield really isn't his best role.
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Don't want then :lol:
 
Balu said:
Btw. I think you guys really misjudge his defensive contribution and I wouldn't be surprised if he looked as lost as Kagawa with the way United plays at the moment. He's still heavily criticised by most users on the Bayern forum I read. All the 'looks lazy, doesn't impose himself, doesn't score enough for an AM, is too slow and doesn't work enough for a CM' stuff. He's a lot about connecting things and being smart in a well working team and less about individually changing things. Playing him next to Carrick in a 2 man midfield really isn't his best role.
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I think he will be fine next to someone who covers a lot of ground in our setup with mata playing as an AM. I see him more like an upgrade over carrick rather than playing next to him, although even that can work against weaker teams.
 
Hellboy said:
Kroos is the closest player to Scholes out there, my muppet dream. Can you imagine Kroos and Gundogan behind Carrick. :drool:
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He'd get raped. Carrick has been a boss for us but I really think his time is coming to an end. Our future midfield has to be sans-Carrick !
 
MJJ said:
I think he will be fine next to someone who covers a lot of ground in our setup with mata playing as an AM. I see him more like an upgrade over carrick rather than playing next to him, although even that can work against weaker teams.
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As an upgrade over Carrick with the right partner next to him, maybe. As long as we dominated possession Kroos next to Schweinsteiger worked well, up against a high energy midfield, I'm not sure I would trust them.
 
How come Martinez isn't playing much this season? is he injured? i'd take him in a heartbeat if he's available.
 
As fantastic a player as Kroos is, I think we have enough AMs. With Mata signed, I'd rather us focus on the players behind the front 4. I'm sure Kroos is capable of playing CM, but he's at his best further forward.
 
He strikes the ball so utterly gracefully. I'd give my left and right nut to see him in a United shirt next season.
 
Someone said:
How come Martinez isn't playing much this season? is he injured? i'd take him in a heartbeat if he's available.
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Had surgery at the beginning of the season and was out for around 2 or 3 months. He's injured again at the moment, something with his ankle, no idea when he's fit to start again.

And no, he's not available :lol:.
 
Balu said:
Had surgery at the beginning of the season and was out for around 2 or 3 months. He's injured again at the moment, something with his ankle, no idea when he's fit to start again.

And no, he's not available :lol:.
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Thought the same about mata ;)
 
adamwest said:
He'd get raped. Carrick has been a boss for us but I really think his time is coming to an end. Our future midfield has to be sans-Carrick !
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Yep, people were casting doubts on Carrick a couple years ago, and a couple years before that, and a couple years before that when we signed him, and Carrick proved them all wrong. If you're looking 4 or 5 years into the future I get your point (If we're looking 5 years into the future, why even sign Vidal?). But, if you put him next to the right player, he is still going to be important for United. He was instumental last year, he will be for the next couple of seasons or so. His style of play doesn't exactly decline rapidly with age. Players like him tend to age like a fine wine. Great positioning and vision don't fade like pace. He hasn't had the best year but I have no doubt he'll return to form
 
Wittmann45 said:
Yep, people were casting doubts on Carrick a couple years ago, and a couple years before that, and a couple years before that when we signed him, and Carrick proved them all wrong. If you're looking 4 or 5 years into the future I get your point (If we're looking 5 years into the future, why even sign Vidal?). But, if you put him next to the right player, he is still going to be important for United. He was instumental last year, he will be for the next couple of seasons or so. His style of play doesn't exactly decline rapidly with age. Players like him tend to age like a fine wine. Great positioning and vision don't fade like pace. He hasn't had the best year but I have no doubt he'll return to form
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I like Carrick but unless he's next to two all action players in midfield he will get overrun as he usually does. Give him time on the ball and he will punish you, but under pressure he absolutely crumbles. He is vastly overrated, especially on here. This is all my opinion of course.
 
Wittmann45 said:
Yep, people were casting doubts on Carrick a couple years ago, and a couple years before that, and a couple years before that when we signed him, and Carrick proved them all wrong. If you're looking 4 or 5 years into the future I get your point (If we're looking 5 years into the future, why even sign Vidal?). But, if you put him next to the right player, he is still going to be important for United. He was instumental last year, he will be for the next couple of seasons or so. His style of play doesn't exactly decline rapidly with age. Players like him tend to age like a fine wine. Great positioning and vision don't fade like pace. He hasn't had the best year but I have no doubt he'll return to form
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He'll be 33 next season. I agree that he's been class for us. But he's not Xavi - by which I mean he's not going to ooze class for the next 3-4 seasons. I think we'd do great to recruit 2 midfielders in the summer, using Carrick and Fellaini as squad players and getting rid of Cleverley...

Carrick probably has at least a good season after this one left in him, but I'd rather we start shaping a new team sooner rather than later
 
I've a hunch that a small part of the negotiations was an agreement whereby we don't compete with Bayern for Thiago last summer.
 
Mersault said:
He'll be 33 next season. I agree that he's been class for us. But he's not Xavi - by which I mean he's not going to ooze class for the next 3-4 seasons. I think we'd do great to recruit 2 midfielders in the summer, using Carrick and Fellaini as squad players and getting rid of Cleverley...

Carrick probably has at least a good season after this one left in him, but I'd rather we start shaping a new team sooner rather than later
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I agree, I said something similar in the United forum the other day myself. We need to move away from the notion that our next midfielder needs to be an ideal partner for Carrick in a midfield two. He is not the future.

At 33, he will be going into next season on the back of an injury plagued campaign, and an overall disappointing one for various reasons (so far). Life after Carrick is something our team needs to start strongly preparing for, as I'd give him next season at most as good enough to be a regular starter for us. To be honest, even at his very best, I've always said that ideally, Carrick was at a level where he should be our second best midfielder, as opposed to our best. So if he is still our best midfielder in his decline, I fear for the state of our midfield.
 
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Fortitude said:
Yeah, the Germans here have said it, too, Bayern are like us and they'll gladly and defiantly hold a player they want until the end of their contract rather than bow to player power of any kind.

The only way we could get Kroos is if Bayern want to sell, and they won't.
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I dont think that's neccessarily the case. Rooney - it looks like in any event - will sign a new deal. But you can be sure that if he wasn't the club would take the sesnisble option and cash in. They may not make it easy for a rival to sign him but if he had one year left on his deal, and no new contract was going to be agreed, then they'd sell him, rather than lose him for nothing.

This lad looks a very good player, so I'd be surprisied if Bayern didnt want to offer him a new deal. The question is, is he worth to them what he's worth to another team in terms of wages - and if not, is he happy to forego that in order to stay where he is.

It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, happens. We've seemingly moved closer to the likes of Chelsea, City and Real madrid in terms of what we're preapred to spend and that will be attractive to a lot of players - added to the usual attractions a club like United holds.
 
RedRover said:
I dont think that's neccessarily the case. Rooney - it looks like in any event - will sign a new deal. But you can be sure that if he wasn't the club would take the sesnisble option and cash in. They may not make it easy for a rival to sign him but if he had one year left on his deal, and no new contract was going to be agreed, then they'd sell him, rather than lose him for nothing.

This lad looks a very good player, so I'd be surprisied if Bayern didnt want to offer him a new deal. The question is, is he worth to them what he's worth to another team in terms of wages - and if not, is he happy to forego that in order to stay where he is.

It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, happens. We've seemingly moved closer to the likes of Chelsea, City and Real madrid in terms of what we're preapred to spend and that will be attractive to a lot of players - added to the usual attractions a club like United holds.
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I'm personally not convinced anymore about the Rooney bit. I believe the club would strongly consider keeping him until next summer if he didn't agree a new deal.
 
RedRover said:
I dont think that's neccessarily the case. Rooney - it looks like in any event - will sign a new deal. But you can be sure that if he wasn't the club would take the sesnisble option and cash in. They may not make it easy for a rival to sign him but if he had one year left on his deal, and no new contract was going to be agreed, then they'd sell him, rather than lose him for nothing.

This lad looks a very good player, so I'd be surprisied if Bayern didnt want to offer him a new deal. The question is, is he worth to them what he's worth to another team in terms of wages - and if not, is he happy to forego that in order to stay where he is.

It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, happens. We've seemingly moved closer to the likes of Chelsea, City and Real madrid in terms of what we're preapred to spend and that will be attractive to a lot of players - added to the usual attractions a club like United holds.
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Bayern are very probably the most obstinate club in the world, and once it becomes a matter of wills, it becomes a matter of principle for them to show who they are and what they're about. I don't know myself, but I would be seriously surprised if they have ever bowed to player power. Balu?

I also really don't believe we'd sell a player we wanted to keep rather than run his contract down or have him buy himself out, and if we would, it would only be for an absolutely preposterous amount of cash.
 
Fortitude said:
Bayern are very probably the most obstinate club in the world, and once it becomes a matter of wills, it becomes a matter of principle for them to show who they are and what they're about. I don't know myself, but I would be seriously surprised if they have ever bowed to player power. Balu?

I also really don't believe we'd sell a player we wanted to keep rather than run his contract down or have him buy himself out, and if we would, it would only be for an absolutely preposterous amount of cash.
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If in the summer he doesn't want to sign a new deal you will sell him. Whether there is hard ball or not he will be gone.
 
Rozay said:
I'm personally not convinced anymore about the Rooney bit. I believe the club would strongly consider keeping him until next summer if he didn't agree a new deal.
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And allow him to move for free to Chelsea, Arsenal, City or whomever decided they wanted him? I dont believe they would. They'd try to get the best possible price, and probably try to convince him to move abroad.
 
Fortitude said:
Bayern are very probably the most obstinate club in the world, and once it becomes a matter of wills, it becomes a matter of principle for them to show who they are and what they're about. I don't know myself, but I would be seriously surprised if they have ever bowed to player power. Balu?

I also really don't believe we'd sell a player we wanted to keep rather than run his contract down or have him buy himself out, and if we would, it would only be for an absolutely preposterous amount of cash.
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Football is a business at the end of the day. You can talk about how "obstintate" you percieve that a club would be. If it came down getting £30 million for a player who was determined to go, or pay him for another 12 months and lose him for free, then its a no brainer. As good a player as he may be, they could replace him.

Football has changed - money is the bottom line and players are assets. Clubs can bang on about what they would and wouldn't do - we've seen that it s not the case. Arsenal sold RVP - and to a rival, in just this situation because the fee was a massive amount of money.

If anything, given how sensible Bayern and German football tends to be financially, I'd say they were more likely than some clubs to sell a player is a scenario where he was going to move for free.
 
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