What does that have to do with giving a player shit that is only going to make him worse not better? It takes less time and energy to get behind him than it does to give him the shit he gets. To me, it would have made more sense to support the player. Do I think Cleverley has a future at United? God no but if he was wearing a United shirt, I would support him.
Tom Cleverley | 2014/15 Performances (on loan at Aston Villa)
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Way too much (shit) was said about him. Yes he's not a very good footballer but let's move on. The morons who abused him all the time really made me feel sorry for the lad and that pisses me off
Honestly if booing was what it took to get rid of him then im glad it happened. However shit players should be offloaded before fans take matters in their hands
This is a highly earning but brutal job. Better players got criticized and rose to the occasion. If he cant handle the pressure then hes in the wrong sports. Jeez with such mentality no wonder why england do so badly in international tournaments
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Just because the club has kept him on their books or he hasn't found a move (we would all stay at United for more money) doesn't mean he should be abused.
Questions can rightfully be raised over his mental strength and other players have used it differently but in my opinion, it still doesn't excuse the poor treatment of fans.
We were happy to stick by him in 12/13 when we were winning when he played over 30 games probably. I know he has regressed since then but the point stands in my opinion that fans should get behind the players, especially the players that need it. It was such a strong trait of the club in previous years but is slowly deteriorating with the modern game. I don't know, maybe I'm too old school to be a football fan.
I think that british talent are over protected and overrated. This doesnt help them to develop the character needed to become the quality players they need to become at this level.
Criticism is part of the game and its unconcievable that a 30-50k player would be immune to criticism (as long it doesnt breach the law like for example racism). An italian/spanish player wouldnt come with this BS but would work hard to do well and reclaim his place. (Except balotelli)
Why would they mention that when it doesn't suit the agenda? Apparently he thinks he's Xavi, and the fact that he found an interview difficult is evidence that he's a shit footballer.
No doubt they deserve criticism, 100% they do. I never said anything suggesting they don't.
However, there is criticism and needless abuse that helps no one. It doesn't help Cleverley, it doesn't help the next young player coming through thinking he will get that treatment if he doesn't fix our midfield issues, it doesn't help the reputation of United fans. Criticise all you want, it's an important aspect of a players development but the pointless abuse, I'm sorry but I just didn't see a need for it or how it helped the situation.
We live in a very precious age were players can't receive warranted criticism, it seems. If I worked in a company well above my capabilities, was extremely well paid and got criticised; I would accept it.
I agree that the abuse some trolls give him is out of order. But so what? It's clowns on the Internet, that's what they do and always will do. He needs to grow up.
I agree that the abuse some trolls give him is out of order. But so what? It's clowns on the Internet, that's what they do and always will do. He needs to grow up.
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It's the modern way. The rise of social media has made it possible to actually speak your mind to players directly. Once the bandwagon has started it's exceptionally hard to stop it, nearly everyone jumps on it. It's like the moron who started the internet campaign to get Cleverly banned from the England team. He did an interview on Talk Sport and couldn't answer why he did it. He was just being a tw@t because he could. All he could say was "he didn't think Cleverly was good enough to play for England. When asked if he thought that was up to the manager to decide he just went back and said, "well yeah but Cleverly shouldn't play for England" The guy who started it is an absolute tool. Just because he can be. And he get's 10 mins of fame from it.
To be fair, some players thrive on this type of abuse and use it to their benefit. Beckham after the world cup came home to people burning effigies of him. He rose above it and came through it and proved everyone wrong. Ronaldo did the same and so has Rooney. Other players can't take it and it works the other way and destroys their confidence and they never really come back from it. Fellaini did similar recently when scoring after taking some of the nastiest abuse I have ever heard from a crowd at OT. Where they the same section of supporters that sang "Fergie Fergie sign him up" when fat Ronaldo scored 3 goals against United in the CL? I think not. That lot would have rather berated Uniteds players rather than recognise the genius of one individual in front of them.
Quite honestly, I think Cleverly would be best to just shut up, delete facebook and twitter or make them private to only friends and family and then just get on with his career. He really doesn't deserve the stick he has got, but unfortunately it's the way of the world where everyone wants their say and many want to be a keyboard warrior. It's really quite sad to be honest.
Everyone needs to comeback on earth here, as fans we shouldn't abuse him, and i don't think that outside Twitter or Facebook he received a lot of abuse, at least less than Young, Nani, Rooney or Fellaini, but he is the one putting himself in this situation.
He has a big head for such an average player (in term of performances, not potential), he is always talking about his achievements or how he is going to improve (and emulate the spanish players) but does nothing.
In 2012-2013 he wasn't good, he played a lot in the first part of the season but disappeared almost completely in the second part (he was good against Madrid and City).
Criticism affects everyone. They're footballers but they're people with feelings as well. And it isn't just English/British players who are affected by criticism (which is a stupid claim), so I'm not sure why you're trying to make out that it is.
Mario Gomez: ‘The recognition and appreciation is higher abroad than back home. They think I’m a very good player. I felt a lot of pressure before our first game against Portugal because of the criticism in Germany. I felt under observation and didn’t play as freely as I wanted.'
Sergio Ramos: "We respect the critics, but it hurts that a section of the fans criticise you after all that we've done."
It's natural, and probably more hurtful for Cleverley as he was here from a child and loved the club. He's not using it as an excuse for not playing well either, but his performances last season were no better or worse than some of our other players who get far less criticism because they aren't used as the scapegoat by large sections of our fans.
No, the fact he's shit at football is evidence that he's a shit footballer.
As if this thread is actually a discussion about his footballing qualities. It's far more important that he stuttered in an interview or started a brand for charity or has a shit haircut.
I have never said that it doesn't affect them, actually that is exactly what it should do. Nowadays players don't need the money. An average player like Cleverley is already settled for life. One of the very few ways left for a player to strive to get better is to be criticized and questioned whenever he's doing wrong. Ego is the only weak point that a young and famous millionaire has to do better.
You may not notice but the best midfielder in England in the past 30 years has been written off since he was 13, he moved to a position which wasn't his, he had to compete with one of the best midfielders in the world and even when he made it he was (unfairly) criticized and compared with two players who weren't even near to his level (Gerrard and Lampard). The best midfielder in the world (Diego Armando Maradona) was written off by Barcelona and allowed to go home when he picked a career threatening injury only for him to come back and become a legend. Zidane was constantly criticized for his inconsistency in Italy. Gattuso was laughed at during his first season at Milan and considered as a brute with little talent. These are the defying moments that change talented players into legends.
As I said, British players are overprotected. If they do something good they are called the white Pele and all sort of BS and every excuse are made to justify why they are not playing up to the required standard. That is not good. A player need to be constantly challenged to improve. He need to feel that every bad game at a top club may be his last. That's how players improve.
Returning to Clev. I was expecting him to come out and say that he wasn't happy with his performance with United but he can do better and will utilize his time at Villa to gain VG's trust so that he would give him another chance. That's what a person with the right attitude would do. Instead he criticized the fans 'who can't appreciate his style' and found time to praise his 'fairly good preseason'.
There are plenty of examples of players who may lacked the crystalline talent but who still made it at a top club. Gaz, Fletcher, Puyol, Gattuso, Sebastiano Rossi the list go on and on. However if a person lacks the attitude and the will to prove everyone wrong then he's pretty much fecked up at this level.
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At lot of what people think of players (generally people in the public eye) is how they're perceived/portrayed in public. How do you for instance know he's a coward? Because he kept his dignity despite torrent of abuse? And when he speaks out he's suddenly arrogant and thinks of himself highly? Which footballer doesn't? Also how you know he doesn't give his all on the pitch? Truth is, fans are frustrated at the team's bad play so in picking our scapegoats we pick on the players who are more reserved, because it's easy to.
As a player he acts like a coward, Cleverley "the person" is unknown to me, but the player is a coward, he refuses to take any risks on the field, he shy away when things gets complicated. And blamed everyone for his one performances. But in the same time he is proud to explain to us how he was instrumental in a title winning team (which is not true) and how he is a 12 time international.
But maybe i am in the wrong and he is a brave hard worker with a lot of character.
Your comments say more about yourself than they do about Cleverley.
BTW, he never said he was "instrumental" in a title winning team.
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Probably, and what did you learned ?
I learned you get basic facts wrong and then dream up dumb conclusions because of it.
If Cleverley scores against Liverpool this thread will go crazy with positive vibes/
After listening to that interview, I'm convinced he shouldn't do another one ever again.
"But in the same time he is proud to explain to us how he was instrumental in a title winning team (which is not true)"
You said this. He never said he was "instrumental"
Ah, my bad i didn't explained myself properly, he played half of the game that year and has been "ostracized" by Ferguson during a long period, he shouldn't talk about it or his 12 selections it's not a personal achievement.
I'm maybe wrong but i think that it was Berbatov who said that he wouldn't have considered himself as a CL champions in 2011 since he was in the stand.
But yeah you're right this sentence was wrong.
Cleverley to score a 25 yarder against the scum today, and celebrate by running up to Balotelli, lifting up his shirt, revealing 'why always us?'
Has there been anymore about his contract? Last i heard was Villa can sign him on a free in the summer or for 7m in january. 
Starts against the scousers.
Come on, tom!
Come on, tom!
Good luck Tom. Go rediscover yourself.
Looks a lot more further forward for me in the first 5 minutes or so. Is that tactical or is he trying to combat the issue of bravery he has been lambasted for?
I love cowards. They make the rest of us seem so much braver by comparison.
There is a certain irony of someone on a computer hidden from identification by an online nickname, referring to someone else as a coward
It's only true for the people who attacked him personally, i don't and i won't.
Indeed.
I'm happy for him. Hope he does well.
Playing like Iniesta reborn our Tom!
Seriously has had a decent game so far.
Seriously has had a decent game so far.
A typical Cleverley performance, passing the ball backwards and square to keep the ball. Nothing else to say
Looks efficient but as usual, pointless in building attacks.
Here is Tom's Villa initiation. Gotta love his dulcet tones.
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